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I hope Warwick doesn't get the Yorick treatment

MorgManBasher··45 votes·4,008 views

Right now Warwick is pretty popular but I am sure a lot of people are realizing his weaknesses, especially people in higher ELO and well, he feels like he still needs work to be a solid pick rather than just a pick you made for the sake of fun.

Yorick was played quite a bit after his release as well and well, now almost no one plays him anymore except for very dedicated OneTricks. I feel like these 2 are in about the same spot of viability. They aren't absolutely terrible but they are so mediocre that there really isn't even a reason to pick them unless you just enjoy playing them.

Look at yorick's winrate outside of low ELO, it's absolutely terrible but people defend his viability despite no one playing him while also sporting a bad winrate outside of low ELO, even the yorrick one trick "InvertedComposer" gave up on the champion after the rework. He played the champion for years and now he feels the champ is just so worthless that he switched to Corki mid. FeelsBadMan.

Please keep at Warwick and go back and give some love to Yorick as well Riot. I want these characters to be great. I don't want "OP", I just want them to be solid picks like they deserve to be.

64 Comments

ModCaptainMårvelous22 votes

Now to be absolutely fair, Riot released a rework splitpush god....riiiiiiiiight after they nerfed splitpushing/lane swaps.

500000000000000020 votes

I think Riot said before that they're okay with releasing niche picks, so long as they actually have a niche. Yorick is in that place right now. I'm not sure how Warwick would do in this regard, but if he ends up being niche, I think that's not that bad.

MorgManBasher31 votes

I don't know, I don't feel he even properly achieves the goal of being a niche pick. He just feels rather bad and easily punished which is saddening because I like the overall design of the new yorick.

I want to like him, but I feel like I am handicapping myself by doing so. There are just a lot of things he suffers from: Bad Ghoul AI Ghouls straight up not even attacking when you hit your e His ult cooldown is WAY too long or should start going down as soon as you summon your ult. Yorick is so ultimate dependent, but meanwhile his ultimate has a RIDICULOUSLY long cooldown. Just buffing this alone would be a nice buff even with the bad ghoul AI. Any smart player you lane against will punish yorick every time he Q's a minion knowing his only damaging skill is on cooldown since you have to last hit with Q to get your ghouls. Meanwhile you aren't even really rewarded when you did get your ghouls up because their AI is so bad.

Does sirchez even play yorick anymore? Pretty sure he stopped playing the champ as well.

WarWork5 votes

Does sirchez even play yorick anymore?

Nope, he said what's the point where u can play a champ that actually wins lane

Gnart Even Close1 votes

if they fix the AI, then maybe Yorick can be viable as a tanky splitpushing monster

Glory ln Death2 votes

Having his ult cool down while the maiden is out really isn't a good idea. Imagine, you kill his maiden in the middle of a fight.

"Haha!" You think. "Now I have the advantage!"

Nope. He just summons another maiden right there.

I could see it working if it could only cool down to 50% of the base cooldown, though.

Spoofghoul2 votes

but he had to keep maiden alive for a long time to be able to do that

considering its current ai

i would argue it would be well deserved for yorick

Raven Redeemed1 votes

I recently brought Yorick up to mastery 5 and I agree his win condition is pretty situational. Like you said he needs to Q minions but that's his only solo damage spell, maybe his E should pack more of a punch? I also dislike how easily his ghouls are countered by aoe (item 3077 and Poppy's W in particular), they should take reduced aoe damage. His ult cd is super long, I was thinking maybe he could recast his ult when next to the maiden to toggle her push vs follow modes so she doesn't get slaughtered when you notice a gank coming right after you ulted in lane (or whatever).

Spoofghoul1 votes

It's not just all that, the ghouls and maiden die too easy these would me my changes

There are a couple of things they should change

Make the ghouls and maidens ai actually function first and foremost they shouldn't be as suicidal as they are now especially maiden nor should they freeze or stop attacking

And then make them scale with yoricks armor/mr 15% just like the hp scaling right now 1 aoe juts kills them off i always pick sion into him and rush thornmail and i get free health & gold all day long . . . it's just sad

And then make maiden not die when yorick dies to further cement his split push niche, right now you can just go after yorick since he is weak without maiden and you can take them both out by getting rid of yorick

Then i also like you want the ult cooldown to start ticking down upon summoning maiden. In return they can increase it's cooldown slightly

Rocnation981 votes

I think Warwick would be a niche pick, in the sense of, your enemy jungler picked someone who has very very poor clears like teemo or ekko and you want to camp them cause they'll always be very low hp in the jg.

Xonra1 votes

Yorick doesn't really have a Niche to the extent that he should then. If he is "split push guy" then they need to give him either more of that power or some of it back. It is a very easy to stop niche unlike say, Tryndamere or Jax who can do it far faster and get out safer/faster if they get caught.

I'm not disagreeing with you, just saying that if that is his niche (cause I don't know what else it would be) it needs a bit more love. It doesn't do much good to have a niche when others do it far better in most aspects.

Glory ln Death1 votes

Yorick's niche is as the "I'm freaking everywhere, pushing two lanes at the same time and beating your face in with a shovel over in dragon pit" guy.

Aptest17 votes

Yorick :

global win rate > 50% plat+win rate >50% Champion Enthusiasts diamond and above have 55-60% win rate.

I don't see that he is in a weak state.

Zenthon Prime3 votes

He isn't. He's balanced and has a low pick rate. Apparently that means he's unplayable garbage around here.

Aptest1 votes

I disagree with you. what are the numbers that support your idea?

(just kidding)

Scoroct3 votes

I love crushing a Darius with Yorick and being told my champ is busted and needs gutting (tbf Yorick counters Darius, something I only learned after that game actually).

iPooUnicorns1 votes

Probably due to the fact that the majority of the time he's picked in plat+ ranked, he's picked to counter another champ and does his job.

Wyrmblade8 votes

Every aspect of Yorick is built to be fair for the enemy. This is good design if he had good stats like Sion or unfair champions didn't exist.

WarWork3 votes

But that's what I don't understand they do "fair" champs with self nerfs (Kled when dismounted, cant cancel or control ult, can e over walls and yoricks uncontrollable ghouls) then they release champs that are powerful and overloaded like Ryze and Camille

Sraeg20131 votes

Ryze is viable for two weeks after a rework at which point he gets nerfs and becomes average to bad again.

Xonra3 votes

Yeah, that's why he is one of the strongest mages, and one of the most played mages at high elo and the pro level.

Sraeg20131 votes

I don't give a flying crap about the "pro" level and his high elo stats are far from satisfactionary. I mean, shit, even in Diamond he has a 45% winrate.

One of the strongest mages? Dayum. The definition of OP.

Xonra2 votes

You are clearly clueless or a troll. Facts are facts. You can down vote me and continue to be clueless all you want. I'm still right.

Sraeg20132 votes

You are clearly clueless or a troll.

Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?

Facts are facts.

Indeed they are. But you know what? Opinions aren't facts.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one and most of them stink.

You can down vote me and continue to be clueless all you want. I'm still right.

Ironic. I'm downvoting you, because you are the one clueless here.

I do not look at champions through the prism of LCS, because it is irrelevant to 99.9% of cases champions are used.

I look at what they are capable of, what are their strengths and weaknesses, how do they fare compared to other champions and how others manage to deal with them, while checking multiple credible sources.

And what do you do?

Call me a troll, because I disagree with your "rightest" right.

Xonra1 votes

This is my only issue with new Yorick. They were so obsessed with his old kit being "unfun to play against" (as someone who loved old Yorick, it was and I don't argue that point), that they put too much effort I think into that aspect alone with his new one.

The problem is (in my opinion), I personally don't enjoy playing AS Yorick now, and don't mind playing against him, because his playstyle is so binary it is obvious what he will do in all cases outside of player specific interactions, but unlike old Yorick, it makes it very easy to counter.

Wind Whistler1 votes

{quoted}

Every aspect of Yorick is built to be fair for the enemy. This is good design if he had good stats like Sion or unfair champions didn't exist.

It's BUILT to be fair for the enemy, but it sure as hell isn't. All you have to is trap them and slow them/slow them then trap them, then summon ghouls, and they fuck the top laner in the ass. Unlike before, you don't even have to do anything. You can just fucking walk away while they're being hammered to death. You don't even have to fight alongside your ghouls anymore. It just feels so fucking lazy... Not to mention, he's shit outside of lane, and his late game is pretty bad. He's exactly what people claimed the Old Yorick to be like.

Sexy Jack Rabbit5 votes

Yorick is in the same boat as Yi. He's not actually that strong, it's just that he absolutely DESTROYS lower elo play. As a result I'm not too sure there is much room for solid buffs that wouldn't just push him back in pure domination.

Flemman1 votes

the only buff he need imo is to get passive stack from champ minion (heimer tower, zyra plants, malz voidling) to make use of is Q less terrible when he face them

jama6553 votes

i used to play that champ i even got my mastery up.... but now i his name.... i cant even remember

DarkRitual2 votes

He doesn't fit the toplane engage tank meta right now. He's definately more of a niche pick. He doesn't offer enough against the current meta, but I could see his stock picking up in a meta shift or two.

Pommel Knight2 votes

https://eune.op.gg/summoner/userName=PitchBlack4

He seems pretty strong to me. He is really strong if you know what you are doing and have the highest 2vs1 potential.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

I played Yorick once on Ascension and he was having like only 1 spell there - his Q. The trap is hard to land, because the enemy can walk out of the location, before it goes off. There are no graves on the map, so no minions. The ultimate has super long cd...

Morticianjohn6 votes

He certainly isn't meant for Ascension. He relies on killing minions then raising them back up, with that said his slow is pretty effective and his W can be amazing in Ascension although proper time and placement for it is not just going to happen.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

{quoted}

He certainly isn't meant for Ascension. He relies on killing minions then raising them back up, with that said his slow is pretty effective and his W can be amazing in Ascension although proper time and placement for it is not just going to happen.

You can catch only other immobile champions... The main point of these spells should be the catching of champions with spammable mobility, not the easy to kite characters.

Scoroct1 votes

He's a juggernaut, not a tank. Otherwise I would agree certainly.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

The only reason why yorick doesn't fare well outside low elo is because anyone with a brain knows to not fight him with his ghouls- Kill them first.

Pommel Knight1 votes

Yea, no. Diamonds keep fighting you despite your ghouls. They aren't used to such a disengage heavy play style and most people want action and not to run every time ghouls are up.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

I'm assuming diamonds have brains you know. After all you're diamond.

JoeMG1 votes

I was just thinking today about how I miss old Yorick :(

Anyway, I think the issue with new Yorick is that his gameplay revolves around his ghouls and his ult, but they are just not that easily accessible. It's like Zyra and her plants except she can spawn new plants very easily and has other damage outside of them while Yorick has his Q for damage. It might make him overpowered but I think they should either spawn a ghoul with like 2 less nearby minion deaths or decrease the number of minion deaths needed scaling with level, because everyone loves some ghoul on ghoul action ;)

As far as Warwick , I think he's a solid jungler but unfortunately in this meta Khazix Vi Rengar Hecarim LeeSin Zac are outclassing every other jungler. If Riot could balance out those top tier junglers I think WW would be a strong pick in certain team comps.

My Waifu Vanilla1 votes

Even if they nerfed those junglers he wouldn't be able to be "top tier" or remotely close in the current jungle layout. The current jungle is terrible for power farm or item reliant junglers due to the extremely long cooldown on camps to respawn. If you cannot efficiently gank before level 6 and after every half clear or so you are simply not a good jungler this year.

As long as they keep the jungle the same it doesn't matter how much they nerf gank based junglers because they will STILL outperform champions like Warwick, Yi, Shyvana, etc. by design alone.

Also, Warwick used to have more......meaningful ganks after level 6 if he did farm because they were CONSISTENT. His poor early game was made up for the fact his level 6 almost always resulted in a kill or flash EVERY gank. That doesn't happen anymore since his ult can now miss and still has roughly the same range. I say roughly the same range because pre-rework has more influence on the range of his ganks with flash+R actually covering a lot more reliable distance than anything new Warwick can do at 6 (flash into miss ult being a huge possibility now and low rank W activation doesn't even increase ult range by that much).

gottrjr1 votes

{quoted}

Right now Warwick is pretty popular but I am sure a lot of people are realizing his weaknesses, especially people in higher ELO and well, he feels like he still needs work to be a solid pick rather than just a pick you made for the sake of fun.

Yorick was played quite a bit after his release as well and well, now almost no one plays him anymore except for very dedicated OneTricks. I feel like these 2 are in about the same spot of viability. They aren't absolutely terrible but they are so mediocre that there really isn't even a reason to pick them unless you just enjoy playing them.

Look at yorick's winrate outside of low ELO, it's absolutely terrible but people defend his viability despite no one playing him while also sporting a bad winrate outside of low ELO, even the yorrick one trick "InvertedComposer" gave up on the champion after the rework. He played the champion for years and now he feels the champ is just so worthless that he switched to Corki mid. FeelsBadMan.

Please keep at Warwick and go back and give some love to Yorick as well Riot. I want these characters to be great. I don't want "OP", I just want them to be solid picks like they deserve to be.

I played a ton of old WW, because I am a noob, and have recently tried the new WW. I have to say that the new WW feels a bit more clunky than the old WW. I think the idea to give him more to do in team fights was a good idea but missed the target. He still doesn't feel useful in team fights and is actually less useful than he used to be. He used to be able to point and click ult the backline and now he cannot even do that. My guess is that he will get another rework at some point in time.

RexSaur1 votes

WW E is pretty broken, it needs a nerf then he'll be ok.

Also his Q shouldnt ignore CC.

SkyBlade791 votes

I've been one tricking warwick and climbing ranks like crazy (and by climbing ranks, I mean that I finally made it out of Bronze 5 XD)

What really are his weaknesses? I've only done bad on one game with him, but I have no idea what happened that game. I feel like it was indeed my fault but I don't know how.

N3mO061 votes

http://champion.gg/champion/Yorick this is the win rate of Yorick Platinum + ranked, it's over 50%, so it isn't low. Yorick rework was very poor, his counterplay is: ' don't stay close to him ' and I don't like it. He can have only this type of gameplay for the lack of cc, out of item 3025 item 3022 . He is pretty binary and this is sh**t, but he will have tons of damage at all stage of the game. He can solo baron lv 14, 3 items, if you know what I mean..

midnight oil241 votes

Even if he goes the path of underplayed champs, that just means I get more time with my new main doggo.

Atreus Jones1 votes

While I agree Yorick seems to have disappeared off the face of the earth, I still choose him when i'm bored playing D Cane up top.

One of the things I feel is lacking from his kit, is an empowered auto that affects turrets.

Where a lot of the splitpushing gods have empowered autos that affect turrets, Yorick doesn't, removing a slightly important part, of what I feel, makes a splitpush champ a splitpush champ. While I personally haven't had an issue with the Ghoul AI, I feel a problem is that if your ghouls attack a champ while you're hitting turret, the turret begins to aggro you. This is some coding I feel should be fixed.

Besides that, I haven't had much of a problem with yorick and who he is

Stephenizgod1 votes

Warwick won't be like Yorick because their kits are different. Yorick relies heavily on his R and his E to be effective and they are fairly easy to play around. I mean Maiden is just incredibly buggy, half the time she will just run under turret and die immediately and the other half the time she won't move at all until a new minion wave comes... its kind of infuriating sometimes. I love new Yorick, he is my main, but the issue is he has a lot of bad match-ups due to his lack of mobility, he isn't very effective in teamfights unless he is already ahead, and his main goal of split-pushing isn't always the best strategy.

Warwick is a jungler, so his usefulness will depend on how much pressure he can create, in the current seasons meta early pressure bot lane is the meta. If he can reliably do that at the levels of Vi and Lee, he will be strong.

420 grams1 votes

Keep in mind there 130+ champions and only about 20 or so are meta, which is all high level people spam. Saying warwick is weak at high elo is like saying nasus is weak at high elo; we know.

Wind Whistler1 votes

He already didn't get the Yorick treatment. Warwick is still in the game, Yorick isn't. It doesn't even matter if he's meta or not- I'm just so incredibly fucking thrilled that you can still play as the champion known as Warwick.

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