seriously you'll always have someone who literally is playing ranked for their first/second time and chances are they might've not even finished their runes yet
i'm not calling new players inexperienced/bad at the game but like cmon they aren't skilled enough to be at silver 4 - bronze 2.
PhantomGG18 votesHonestly it's that point of the year where even if you go 3 and 10 in your provisionals, riot will give you silver, and it's making ranked games EXTREMELY difficult. I am regurly getting ADCS who legit have no fucking clue how to play the game. It's a hole in the system that really needs to be fixed.
Pierce The Veal1 votesHonestly it's that point of the year where even if you go 3 and 10 in your provisionals, riot will give you silver, and it's making ranked games EXTREMELY difficult. I am regurly getting ADCS who legit have no fucking clue how to play the game. It's a hole in the system that really needs to be fixed.
And then you're low gold or high silver last season, do your provisionals, and you get silver 5 at best or more likely, bronze 3-1
MyRivenAccount5 votesmaybe because the average new player is just as good as bronze 2-silver 4?
DrCyanide8 votesIt takes only a few games playing with brand new players to know that's not the case.
EndlessSorcerer6 votesSince we are talking about players new to ranked, we don't know how experienced at the game they actually are.
For all we know, they could have been playing for months before they decided to queue for ranked games.
DrCyanide3 votesWhile that certainly is a possibility, it isn't the case for all players. Some see a new queue unlock and jump at it the same way they jumped at PvP when it opened.
I feel like when you first queue up for a new queue it should look at your MMR from your other queues to guess where you'd fit in. It won't be perfect certainly, but if someone has crazy high Normal MMR then they're probably going to do decent in Ranked. If someone has been struggling with Normals, assume they'll struggle with Ranked.
6obETSj7H71 votesSince we are talking about players new to ranked, we don't know how experienced at the game they actually are.
For all we know, they could have been playing for months before they decided to queue for ranked games.
They'll climb if that's the case, won't them?
Anhartamin2 votes[deleted]
DrCyanide1 votesThere are Silver players not much better than Bronze, that's absolutely true, but how much of that is due to being placed too high?
EndlessSorcerer5 votesSilver 4 is roughly the average of the entire playerbase.
New players begin at the average and rise/fall according to their performance.
BabyNaix2 votesNew players shouldn't be average though. Players usually get better the more they play. New players should be at the bottom of skill level. When I just started ranked, there were gold and silver players on both teams. I got stomped super hard. It was not fun at all.
EndlessSorcerer1 votesThey are players new to ranked, not necessarily the game in general.
Personally, I was playing with primarily Platinum/Diamond players in normal games before I even bothered starting ranked.
Warning Shot2 votesThey are players new to ranked, not necessarily the game in general.
Personally, I was playing with primarily Platinum/Diamond players in normal games before I even bothered starting ranked.
I hear this all the time " i play against golds in normals and i do fine" in normal games do you really think people are playing 100%? that theyre playing their main roles? their main champions? that theyre giving the game 100% attention? not very likely.
EndlessSorcerer1 votesEven if they aren't taking the game completely seriously, you don't exactly forget mechanics or decision-making.
A semi-attentive Platinum player will generally crush a Silver regardless.
It only took me 100 games to reach Platinum after starting ranked, so I'd say I had a pretty good handle on the game at that point.
Warning Shot1 votesEven if they aren't taking the game completely seriously, you don't exactly forget mechanics or decision-making.
A semi-attentive Platinum player will generally crush a Silver regardless.
It only took me 100 games to reach Platinum after starting ranked, so I'd say I had a pretty good handle on the game at that point.
why would they have mechanics or decision making ( match up knowledge) on a champion / role they dont play? that doesn't make any sense
EndlessSorcerer2 votesBasic game knowledge (i.e. objective priority/control, wave management, rotations, farming, trading, champion kits) doesn't really change that much per role.
If you have even the basic mechanics of the game down, it isn't that hard to hit Gold at minimum.
Xion The XIV2 votesI have to agree with you there. I am Silver 1 and have played against Plats and Diamonds in Normals and have stomped them, but then when you look at their ranked they are not even doing their main roles or any characters they actually play. Trying to say Normal = Rank is complete garbage. Normals I fuck around with my main role in JG such as trying new champions JG/One Punch Blitz/Alistar.
But then again some people have played THOUSANDS of games of Normals before they play Ranked. It just Normals is so much more fun then Ranked. When someone on your team dies twice within a the span of 2 minutes they throw a tantrum like a child and rage quit. Least in Normals I don't have to worry about loosing LP, because baby didn't get it's bottle.
Silverjust1 votesdo you really want to put them into b5? I agree that they often get placed to high, but when they get placed to low, like b5, it will be hard for them to improve and might even quit the game
BabyNaix2 votesI think it's more encouraging to win some games. I has a 30-40% win rate last season and I kept on dropping from where I was placed. I was dead so often that I can't even understand what I was doing wrong. I knew I was going to fall further down because I wasn't at the skill level that the people I was playing with were at. I think it's more motivating to see the progress you make than dropping elo.
Warning Shot2 votesdo you really want to put them into b5? I agree that they often get placed to high, but when they get placed to low, like b5, it will be hard for them to improve and might even quit the game
that gives them a chance to win. whats more fun winning some games in a lower elo or getting stomped every. single. game. in a higher elo. id wager winning some games.
Silverjust1 votesyou learn from the elo you play in, do you want them to learn from b5?
Moosh5 votesIf you deserve a higher rank you will move up. If you deserve lower rank you will move down. There is a higher chance of a new player getting in the enemy team so stop blaming you being bad on new players.
Slythion4 votesi'm not calling new players inexperienced
isn't that exactly what a "new player" is? :3
But the point being is that the average skill for league players is about Silver 3, and so it makes sense that most new players will fall below that line. You have to remember that a 10 game placement is not really a lot of games to judge a person's skill unfortunately
Morticianjohn4 votesMy brother and I started playing ranked together. We got placed into Bronze 2 and promptly dropped to bronze 5. After spending a few months in bronze 4-5 we started to climb. The point is basically the game spit us out much higher rank than we deserved going 2/8 in promos and basically feeding our way to bronze 5. It wasn't fair to our team mates nor to us IMO.
DemainaNyx1 votesThank you for being honest and for offering this perspective. Most of the perspective are from the people who believe they belong higher, seeing these newer players ruining things when in reality they just don't know the game as well yet.
Being placed vs higher skilled teammates isn't fun if you don't know the game that well. Same with being placed with lower skilled teammates. Yeah, you learn playing against higher skilled people, but only so much if you don't have the basic knowledge down. Most new people need to learn the basics first before learning the champion specific knowledge. I don't even know all the basics that well and I'm a consistent Silver 1 elo, I can't imagine what I would've been if I had done ranked straight from level 30.
Miror B2 votesI'm under the impression it's because rito doesn't want these newer players to be scared of ranked and avoid it. Instead of pairing them up with low-bronze "scum" (which has a habit of not only being ridiculously bad when it comes to skill, but can also be unbelievably toxic), they put them with players who are at least semi-competent with the hopes that they'll fit into that. While I do agree that they shouldn't be forced into mid-silver at the start, changing the ranked requirement from just being lv30 plus (I think it's this but not 100% certain) 11 owned characters to making at least 5 of those characters m5+ could at the very least allow these newer players to go into ranked with some form of comfort pick/"safe role".
Karfuss2 votesAll the more reason to have a rank below Bronze, or far more divisions.
There is FAR too much diversity in Bronze. Pigeon-holing that many players into a mere 5 divisions is absurd. With the increased chances of toxicity, AFKers, ragequitters, trolls, ints etcetera, it's little wonder why many of them give up climbing altogether.
The more divisions, the more places the sediment can fall.
Quepha2 votesbronze 2 - silver 4 are pretty terrible players on average, what are you talking about?
6obETSj7H72 votesIt's kind of ridiculous that it took me longer to climb silver to gold than plat to diamond on the same season.
Sometimes in silver you just autolose because you've got a teammate who farms 16 cs in 10 minutes and has legit no clue about how to build, then says "1st ranked sorry" as you vote surrender.
Hexs Fortune2 votesI remember as a newbie they tossed me into silver 5. I thought karthus ult was the game celebrating me with glorious light lol
FantasySniper2 votesI honestly think provisionals should last longer. 10 games is not enough to properly place people, and it shows because the system has a heavy bias towards low silver when people are obviously better or worse than that ranking implies. It results in this "dumping ground hell" where the teams always feel uneven and you're just waiting for the luck to climb out.
RavenMagus1 votesBecause there has to be an average somewhere, and it would make sense that new players start at the average.
SnakDatSmilesBak2 votesWhy not make them start at the bottom?
Fear the Kayn1 votesWhy not make them start at the bottom?
That would only work if the ranking system was based on your champion skill level (grades S-C). I would much prefer this system over the current system, and would make the ranking system more based around YOUR preformance, rather than your teammates. If you constantly get bad grades on your games, you stay at the lower level. If you get high grades on games, you rise.
Warning Shot1 votes[{quoted}](name=Why So Fishy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6Mzqz16d,comment-id=000a00000000,timestamp=2017-07-03T16:53:23.804+0000)
That would only work if the ranking system was based on your champion skill level (grades S-C). I would much prefer this system over the current system, and would make the ranking system more based around YOUR preformance, rather than your teammates. If you constantly get bad grades on your games, you stay at the lower level. If you get high grades on games, you rise.
unfortunately that would lead to even more " im not gonna help you" attitude than we have now, people letting team mates die to guarantee thaey get a wave or 2 of cs to up their scores etc.
Warning Shot2 votesWhy not make them start at the bottom?
Because it would be a reality check of how bad some people are. :P
Sun Wu Ryuumoku1 votesi'm not calling new players inexperienced/bad at the game but like cmon they aren't skilled enough to be at silver 4 - bronze 2.
lmao.... i don't agree with this statement. Silver is a begginer level. When i started ranked i already have low gold level (silver was too low even for my first ranked year).
U just overestimate ur level and ur elo level.
SenzaRespiro892 votesYeah i don't get it either. I started this game without even getting into bronze. Then my first real season started, got placed in S5 and in a few games i reached gold 5. Every season so far minimum gold 5 in a few games after playing some more got to plat 4 and dropped back due to playing inconsistent. Last season first tryhard got to dia 5 (solo btw not with a team in dyna Q) and this season i got placed in p5 after going 2-8 in placements and got back to dia in 50-60 games with a 65% winrate.
LightIsMyPath1 votesOr maybe you were simply better than the average new player .. Not saying people in silver are good but the ones who literally have no idea how to play the game ( I've seen stuff like people literally standing still to Cs autoattacking the same minion hoping to somehow kill it.. It happens to be at this level if they leveled up playing vs bots) should not be in silver...
Sun Wu Ryuumoku1 votesOr maybe you were simply better than the average new player ..
possible too ^^
( I've seen stuff like people literally standing still to Cs autoattacking the same minion hoping to somehow kill it.. It happens to be at this level if they leveled up playing vs bots) should not be in silver...
remind me of bronze V of Euw video. Yeah i agree. But anyway, time make his work, if they deserve their elo they'll stay, if not they climb or fall.
LightIsMyPath2 votesI Know.. Thing is climbing elo is fun , dropping elo because you get smashed is not.. The statement is true either way so I think "forcing a climb" would be better than"forcing a drop". I remember my 1st season of ranked being placed silver 3 and I was getting smashed so hard.. It was even worse because having a safe playstyle and playing mostly utility champions I wasn't that heavy to get carried so I was dropping very slowly but games were unfun for the most part as I felt useless. I think my real skill level was around b3/b2, for the end of the season I was still silver 5. In fact when the new one began I sat for around 2 months between b3 and b1 and eventually climbed to silver as I got better.
Fear the Kayn1 votesI got placed in Bronze 1 this season, which is fine because I took a huge break for university, and recently came back to the game about a month ago. I'm noticeably more skilled than most of the players in my games, and am still on a TWELVE GAME LOSING STREAK because of feeders, clueless players, and 'surrender or I just stay in base'-ers. I was at 99 LP, about to get to Silver, and now I'm down to 40 LP Bronze 2. Really starting to consider quitting again because these horrible players that are dragging me down is pissing me off.
Warning Shot1 votes[{quoted}](name=Why So Fishy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6Mzqz16d,comment-id=0011,timestamp=2017-07-03T16:10:27.002+0000)
I got placed in Bronze 1 this season, which is fine because I took a huge break for university, and recently came back to the game about a month ago. I'm noticeably more skilled than most of the players in my games, and am still on a TWELVE GAME LOSING STREAK because of feeders, clueless players, and 'surrender or I just stay in base'-ers. I was at 99 LP, about to get to Silver, and now I'm down to 40 LP Bronze 2. Really starting to consider quitting again because these horrible players that are dragging me down is pissing me off.
https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=why+so+fishy
you have low cs, terrible kdas, and youv eplayed 19 champions in about 50 games. blame yourself not your team mates.
youre playing top nearly every game with ignite so youre never helping team mates with tps.
you have under 30% kill participation in a LOT of games again leaning toward not helping people.
anything else? oh 38 minute game played with 3 whole wards placed.
Fear the Kayn1 votes[{quoted}](name=Glo Stix,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6Mzqz16d,comment-id=00110000,timestamp=2017-07-03T17:05:17.339+0000)
https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=why+so+fishy
you have low cs, terrible kdas, and youv eplayed 19 champions in about 50 games. blame yourself not your team mates.
youre playing top nearly every game with ignite so youre never helping team mates with tps.
you have under 30% kill participation in a LOT of games again leaning toward not helping people.
anything else? oh 38 minute game played with 3 whole wards placed.
Can't help much with my KDA when my teammates feed the Yasuo to 29/2, now can I? I mostly win my lanes, and dont feed much in lane. I don't run TP because I much prefer the early power from ignite over the map presence. Yes, my cs isn't the best, which is something I'm actively trying to improve upon.
ZephyrDrake2 votes[{quoted}](name=Why So Fishy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6Mzqz16d,comment-id=001100000000,timestamp=2017-07-03T17:31:33.349+0000)
Can't help much with my KDA when my teammates feed the Yasuo to 29/2, now can I? I mostly win my lanes, and dont feed much in lane. I don't run TP because I much prefer the early power from ignite over the map presence. Yes, my cs isn't the best, which is something I'm actively trying to improve upon.
yes you can, i have seen games where even though the entire team has over 8 deaths the one guy actually has a respectable KDA. Saying "X champion was fed that's why i have bad KDA" is just wrong. You are not against a disgustingly fed champion every single game, no matter how much you want to believe it. You overextending and dying to a fed champion wouldn't change the fact that you died because you were overextending. Winning lane is pointless and i highly doubt it since well you have terrible CS even on long games where you are playing champions that shouldn't have much issues CSing. It's like you have no idea how to do anything but fight the enemy constantly and if that doesn't work out and your team didn't won you the game then it's over. It's fine if you prefer ignite over TP but you clearly aren't getting anything for it. You cannot complain about your teammates being destroyed when you refuse to do anything to help them. The enemy top laner can just take TP and then TP mid/bot and either get a kill or assist, possibly a turret or dragon and all you get is maybe some turret damage? since you clearly aren't getting much in the way of CS
SenzaRespiro891 votesLoL telling him to take TP in bronze is one of the worst advices. You are not going to get out of bronze if you rely on your teammates.
Automated Riven1 votesI have stomped many an enemy because they don't have any idea how to pressure and they took ignite. In bronze taking ignite is super bad because unless you get a kill with it you lost lane. The enemy just recalls and tps back without losing exp and now has an item advantage and gets to shove you in and force a back or even kill you in response. And a stacked wave in toplane against a jungle who doesn't look at the map and a toplane who is diveable just means first tower blood. I never take ignite because it's too high of a risk for high silver players to play around not having tp. Plus I have to bail out botlane every 5th game anyway.
King of Demons1 votesEven a Bronze 5 person can win a game if he has enough gold. You take TP, this guy gets more gold thus becomes a bigger statstick (because he totally isn't a mechanical genius and just wins through superior stats) and even in a worst case scenario you win because you helped your team get strong.
King of Demons1 votesBecause that is where most players are?
You put them there because it's the spot where they can "normalize" their MMR to wherever they belong. If you're really bad you will get placed really low. And it's a fact that a large majority of the playerbase simply isn't very "good"
DemainaNyx1 votesI'd be happy if they were always in low Silver or high Bronze. Normally I see them in my high Silver or low Gold games. I lost a few promo games cause my ADC literally could've been replaced by a bot and the game wouldn't change.
