What is garens ACTUAL weakness

WrÆth·Mar 18, 2017·8 votes·3,841 views

First off, im not saying garen is op, i just want to know what his ACTUAL weakness is. Everyone says he can be "easily kited" but thats kind of bullshit as he can easily run up and you with his q then no more kiting since you cant use abilities. Even if you do have a speed up, garen can usually catch up to you and is too tanky to kill just kiting, even with LDR. If he gets on you, your as good as dead, so i dont know what im supposed to do.

EDIT: I was playing Miss Fortune. Keep that in mind.

DOUBLE EDIT: Part of the reason im asking this is because i just threw a game real hard but im not sure how. One second Garen was like 2/5 and the next he was this tanky bruiser who was the literal embodiment of sanic (who seemed to always have flash up just to kill me). He always one shot me and I literally could do nothing but take it, as I did no damage back, even with LDR and black cleaver.

70 Comments

PainWoLoveMar 18, 20173 votes

He can be kited.

AlienPrimateMar 18, 20173 votes

The easiest way to beat Garen is to group up early. Unless his opponent feeds him in lane, he isn't very good at team fighting against a competent team. The only thing he can do is bum rush the enemy which simply doesn't work as an engage. As soon as he bum rushes he is easy to pick off because he isn't a true engager like Amumu or Sejuani.

WrÆthMar 18, 20171 votes

I mean, do you focus him though? cause if you dont hes probably going to take out at least one carry

AlienPrimateMar 18, 20173 votes

It depends on who your team is. If you have a high damage team lacking a tank then you need to focus him down. If you have a high cc tank then you put that tank on him to CC him while the rest of your team focuses on Garen's carries. What I typically see Garen do is run ahead of his team with his 600+ movement speed creating a momentary 1vs5. He is easy to focus down during this time before his team gets there.

SnowplosionMar 18, 20171 votes

If he is the biggest threat to you at the moment, then yes. People tell ADC's to never attack the tanks, but that logic is flawed and stupid. If the tank is currently the biggest threat, go ahead and attack it. (I know Garen is a juggernaut, but he still builds defensive. Pls no flame me.)

Only Play DariusMar 18, 20173 votes

Is this post real?

SnowplosionMar 18, 20174 votes

It's a bit stupid, but I think it might just be an inexperienced player asking for help on the boards.

WrÆthMar 19, 20173 votes

Why does the boards have to be like this. Can I not ask a question without condescending passive aggressive comments? Maybe instead of writing a 4 word reply to farm likes, actually contribute to the discussion. Sure maybe I'm not diamond, but how else am I supposed to ever learn? How is anyone supposed to learn if they are scared to ask a damn question because they think it's "stupid". Or am I now not allowed to ask questions? I'm sorry that I'm not as prodigious as you dear sir. If someone has a question they have a right to ask it without having to deal with this shit. If this were an opinion thread about a champion being too Op or whatever, id be fine with you disagreeing with me, but these comments that add nothing to discussion and are passive aggressive are just pointless. I can't see anyone else sticking up for me as a very kind boards member did long ago so I must stick up for myself. So to answer your question, yes, this post is very much real.

OurLestradeMar 18, 20172 votes

Beats me, he's always been one of my problem champions that I can never work around.

Handy Sandy Mar 18, 20172 votes

If you're a squishy melee that isn't Yasuo , you shouldn't be fighting a juggernaut in the first place. Since when does an assassin be able to win a fight against Hecarim Chogath Darius Maokai Nautilus

item 3036 item 3033 item 3116 item 3151

Troy242621Mar 18, 20177 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chroma Spell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5sAqZN8c,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-03-18T20:59:16.325+0000)

If you're a squishy melee that isn't , you shouldn't be fighting a juggernaut in the first place

That's the type of meaningful, healthy interaction that I personally play League for.

"Never interact with them or it's a mistake."

Big LincolnMar 18, 20172 votes

"don't face-tank the class that's built to beat you at a certain stage of the game if you play to their strengths"

damn, so hard to do

ArakadiaMar 18, 20172 votes

I mean the first guy literally said counterpick is countperlay.

Big LincolnMar 18, 20171 votes

he isn't right, either

fiora, tryndamere, riven can all lane against most juggernauts easily if not being a direct counter to them

the only one that really gets fucked hard out of top lane melee carries is Yasuo

the only players who complain about juggernauts are the ones who can't play correctly vs them

ArakadiaMar 18, 20171 votes

Okay lol

CancerBasedGodMar 18, 20173 votes

Characters are supposed to have strengths and weaknesses. . . It's a strategy game. . .

Troy242621Mar 18, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Characters are supposed to have strengths and weaknesses. . . It's a strategy game. . .

They're also intended to be a design that has counterplay outside of counterpicking.

In this case, the counterplay (while effective) is also incredibly annoying because it amounts to "farm and outscale. Unless you're ranged, then Garen is the miserable one."

CancerBasedGodMar 18, 20171 votes

Well you might be able to bait a spin and punish. Garen is a pretty two dimensional character, but it's not that bad.

A Vel Koz MainMar 18, 20175 votes

Yasuo Ekko Darius Jayce Riven you know whats common between all of these champions?

There is no weaknesses or counter champions

It just depends on whether they mess up their attacks

CancerBasedGodMar 18, 20176 votes

No, there are counters. That's just a lie.

Poppy Vs. Riven is one of the hardest counters in the game because Poppy W will shut down Riven's combo and her dash with the shield. Riven pretty much cannot hit poppy whenever she W's, generally gets lane bullied all day, and either winds up dying or losing a ton of CS because she cannot stay in lane with Poppy.

Yasuo is also countered fairly well by Poppy, as her W screws up his dash, and the fact that she can easily build an early item 3143 helps her deal with his crits.

That's two of you "uncouterable champions" countered by one character. . .

Ekko is countered by most lane bullies, as he will have trouble CSing when faced with them.

Darrius hates anyone who can dodge his W well. . .

Jayce I have trouble with, but I believe Quinn and Riven will counter him, I don't play either of them though and I'm not sure.

PennsMar 18, 20171 votes

Poppy W only blocks 1 dash, so... Id say its easier for Riven than Jayce or some shit lol

CancerBasedGodMar 18, 20171 votes

Poppy W blocks the 3rd hit of the combo and her other dash with the shield. It makes it impossible for Riven to chase and close out kills on poppy.

Poppy honestly will solve most the problems people have with "cancer champions" in this game. Don't like Lee? Play Poppy! Don't like Riven? Play Poppy! Don't like Yas? Play Poppy!

HäßlichMar 18, 20171 votes

I've actually been playing more Nautilus support for this reason. I consistently shit on Yasuo and Lee players.

Im Taylor SwiftMar 18, 20172 votes

Quinn does well vs jayce as she can poke him as i believe she has higher auto attack range and if you use your E well against him when he uses his Q in melee form you stop his dash and then you will be placed far from his melee range

Brain Errör 404Mar 18, 20171 votes

Quinn? Maybe. Riven? Perfect Jayce > Perfect Riven.

HäßlichMar 18, 20171 votes

Garen counters Riven super hard except at high elo, but then it's still usually the case.

CancerBasedGodMar 18, 20171 votes

Hmm. . . Well I don't Riven to know. Nice to know Quinn does, was thinking about learning her soon.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20172 votes

those things dont counter anything those are the closest things to a counter that exist but they dont counter the champion

CancerBasedGodMar 24, 20171 votes

No, Poppy Vs. Riven is a massive counter for the reasons I mentioned, but thanks for responding with no evidence or reason.

LordGeovanniMar 25, 20171 votes

like some one else said that is just plain untrue becuase poppys's w only stops one dash and is on a superlong cooldown it does no damage to punish anyone for useing their dash and riven just absorbs the anti dash with her sheild

chipndip1Mar 18, 20171 votes

Any skirmisher can eventually 1v1 a juggernaut, save Jayce, honestly.

Dominick DestineMar 18, 20171 votes

Incredibly easy to kite.

No gap closer.

Mediocre scaling.

Shit version of Darius.

HäßlichMar 18, 20172 votes

Harder to kite than Darius.

Gets to cleanse slows with his Q and gets damage reduction on W.

E scales really well with Black Cleaver and any crit you build.

Shit version of Darius.

Big LincolnMar 18, 20173 votes

Harder to kite than Darius.

very debatable, Darius's 2 slows and a pull are far better sticking power than Garen's MS boost

you could argue that Garen has an easier time getting to someone but when it comes to actually staying in once you're there Darius blows Garen out of the water

HäßlichMar 18, 20171 votes

I've found that Darius is more dangerous if he does catch you, but the lack of CC removal and move speed, Garen sticks on harder because he can get to you easier.

Just using a very simple, but common example, Ezreal with IBG will easily get away from Darius while he won't get away from Garen so easily.

Against, say, Braum, Darius will be far more dangerous than Garen because neither will really struggle to get to him, but Darius will keep you near him.

SnowplosionMar 18, 20171 votes

You can kite him rather easily if you have some for of CC. MF is not the best against Garen or juggernauts in general, so that might be why you had a problem.

HäßlichMar 18, 20171 votes

I think MF could maybe build a Frozen Mallet, even if it's a sup-par item on her normally. The constant slow (even if it's not very strong on ranged) will help kite him out, and the extra health makes it harder for his ult to execute you (he has to get through more hp before you are below the execute threshold).

SnowplosionMar 18, 20171 votes

If you really wanted to get away from Garen go for it. I usually don't have that problem, but some might.

WrÆthMar 19, 20171 votes

Garen got so huge late that I actually build black cleaver, LDR and was even considering buying a BoTRK. Would this be better over frozen mallet?

CC MustangMar 18, 20171 votes

Vayne

rG ThundragMar 18, 20171 votes

Garen has quite a bad early game against almost the entire top lane roster atm

TyrekGoldenspearMar 19, 20171 votes

Survive his combo (or not be the villain) and he just stands around Autoing you until his cooldowns come back around.

HäßlichMar 19, 20171 votes

Which won't be long, because he can get 20% from Black Cleaver, 10% from Youmuu's, and rune the last 10%.

item 3071 item 3068 item 3065 item 3742 item 3142 item 1001 (often Swiftness) is a really common build to see.

Irelia BotMar 19, 20171 votes

I think the answer is Redheads

https://cdna.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/004/769/198/large/sebastien-minatchy-katarina.jpg?1486122306

RequiemsfireMar 19, 20171 votes

As an ADC item 3153 is a great option.

MetalGearTeemuMar 24, 20171 votes

any mobility character not playing on authentic Brazilian internet can react to Garens Q silence on reaction, he should never be able to stick to you in any case.

if you want a hard counter to garen pick Fiora. With more then plant speed reflexes you can riposte his Q or his R on reaction. he literally has no play options against you unless you massively fuck up, and since you win the right click fight without him being able to silence or ult you even without using your own ult, you have no excuse to lose that lane.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20171 votes

Garen's 'Weakness' is assuming that you only play ranged champions and that he blows his q before you use your slow.