Unless I'm reading this wrong, Ultimore is a hilariously bad idea

THE RlVER KlNG··99 votes·4,800 views

Gain 5% cooldown reduction and maximum cooldown reduction on your ultimate. This increases by 1.5% each time you cast your ultimate. Stacks up to 10 times.

What?? The whole point of the ULTIMATE ability is that for 95% of the roster (excluding transform champs and such) it's your most powerful ability with big impact and a long cooldown to offset that. Dozens of champions are designed almost explicitly around how often their ultimate is up.

Riot will freak out and gut global ults on champs like Shen, Galio, and GP, but now introduce a keystone that lets them get their CDs on 55% of the cooldown immediately at level 6?? And then allow them to stack up to 15% more CDR for potential ultimate CD that is less than half of the base CD.

Imagine this on any number of champs that have super annoying ultimates that let them snowball a lane easily, like Zed or Fizz or Trundle or Syndra. Unless I'm somehow misreading the tooltip this is easily the most broken keystone Riot has thus unveiled. "Hur dur damage tradeoff" isn't shit. Getting 45% CDR on your ult at level 6 is just utter nonsense. There's no reason not to take this on a vast majority of the roster. It vastly improves your ability and puts an opponent without the ability at a disadvantage. Think you're cute playing Vel'Koz with Thunderlord's? Nope, Ahri has Ultimore and is using her ult every 30 seconds. This rune is a huge 'go fuck yourself' to the people that are too dumb not to take it.

Champions are fucking BALANCED around their ultimates. Think it's toxic for Malz or Vi to come into your lane and click on you for a nigh-guaranteed kill? Sucks to suck, now they do it 60% more. This is such an absurd and flawed idea and I implore Riot to not release any iteration of this nonsense.

EDIT: Yes, they clarified, its 5% initially then 10% as you stack. The rune was poorly worded and could lead to different interpretations. Thank you for clarifying Riot and others.

205 Comments

CaptainSeto28 votes

Karthus : "Hey, my ult is finally less than 180 seconds at max rank...... oh, it now does 20% less damage because it's too strong with this new rune... shit."

P.S. I'm a Karthus player. This rune would be awesome, but it'd make his ult get nerfed because of this optional rune.

THE RlVER KlNG53 votes

Literally the only thing that will come from this is a blanket nerf to ultimates on certain champions and just make them even more dependent on this rune, then they will nerf the rune itself and it will be cinderhulk all over again

Critmaster Garen22 votes

[{quoted}](name=THE RlVER KlNG,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=417hVAki,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2017-08-31T04:52:02.396+0000)

Literally the only thing that will come from this is a blanket nerf to ultimates on certain champions and just make them even more dependent on this rune, the name they will nerf the rune itself and it will be cinderhulk all over again

the thing with long duration global ults is, that this rune is going to do the least for these champions.

you need to stack the cdr by using the ult. when you have an ult on a 3 minute timer and get the opportunity to use it maybe twice in 10 minutes, the game is over by the time you have it maybe 1/3 stacked.

its going to be most effective for champions with short/medium ult cooldowns who can stack up fast.

Lux Chogath Yasuo Malphite LeeSin

edit.: Darius is also an interesting case, since he may be able to stack the cdr off the resets.

WacingTheFind5 votes

I doubt it will be that effective on Yasuo, the rune alone gives 20% ult CDR, meaning that his ult will get a 6s CD reduction only. Not to mention that Yasuo doesn't build CDR at all, so he can't stack this rune with normal CDR. Not to mention that depending on the runes, he may lose on damage to get this.

Limrick2 votes

Question: Why doesn't Yasuo build Black Cleaver? Surely it gives basically everything he wants after his core crit items.

Frightning2 votes

Other than his R and W, CDR doesn't do much for him. Both of those abilities are long enough CDs that you generally only get them once in a fight (barring a prolonged skirmish->extended teamfight scenario). So the stat is basically useless on him, and the 20% CDR of cleaver is a non-trivial part of its gold value. Also, Phage MS passive isn't valuable on a champion with a spammable dash. In short, it's not cost efficient on him.

Steelflame3 votes

Not only that, but the arpen on cleaver has a very weak synergy with his ult because his ult grants so much bonus arpen to him. This means that he is only really getting cleaver for the AD (There are better AD items) and HP (Better HP/defensive items) and CDR for Wind Wall.

Poske3 votes

It would be bad on karthus

You would use your ultimate 3 times before 20 mins

Steelflame2 votes

Terrible rune on Karthus actually. Ult CD is too long to charge it viably. By the time he has it charged up anyway, you are already at the stage of the game where a teamfight results in several people having longer death timers than the ult CD anyway, and your CD will be back up for the next team fight if you got that rune.

As other people have said, the people who get the most from this rune are people who have very short ult CDs, and can afford to use them on CD. People like Lux or Ziggs will get far far more from Ultimore than Karthus ever would.

Ok sure but why28 votes

NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF THE SCOUT'S CODE!!!!!!

ItzEvonix2 votes

oh god LMAO

Ok sure but why22 votes

but srs

We've called nearly every one of those new keystone things "Stupidly op."

And you know what Incrediboy said from the Incredibles, "And when everyone's super, heh heh heh... no one will be."

Baka Red12 votes

Thing is, that isn't even Keystone, but some more common rune type. "Moving this rune out of the keystone slot let us provide the ultimate-only cooldown effect at a more reasonable power level that everyone can still get excited about."

Maybe that is reasonable, maybe it isn't. Hopefully Riot at least reconsiders it's reasonability. Some of those ult cooldowns get quite short and the rune not being keystone might result in it being a must-have-rune, which isn't nice thing for the game.

Edit: I didn't realize some people actually understood it as the rune would give maximum CDR for ult immediately. Don't worry. That is just bad/relaxed english skills of the person in Riot who wrote the description. The most likely correct form is on multple locations of this thread.

Erockandroll3 votes

[{quoted}](name=JZ Jora,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=417hVAki,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2017-08-31T05:35:04.323+0000)

but srs

We've called nearly every one of those new keystone things "Stupidly op."

And you know what Incrediboy said from the Incredibles, "And when everyone's super, heh heh heh... no one will be."

That's kinda the trick, It sounds OP but we really don't have any context into what the opportunity cost actually is. (Even though Riot has been steadily revealing runes, we haven't seen them side by side.) At a minimum, we know that we're limited to picking 2 of 5 different rune trees.

At the least, this rune should favor anyone who's up time on their ult, is more important than the damage/shield/whatever that comes from said ult. (In short, all utility ults) A Vanguard or Diver may want this for increased dive potential, but the opportunity cost would be less damage/defense, that you would get form casting said ult.

Dengeden12 votes

You're reading it wrong. What kind of champion gets 40% when they hit level 6. Casting your ult 10 times is a gigantic amount of time.

1011001110008 votes

Teemo Akali

Already two cancer interactions I can think of off the top of my head. These two can get ten stacks in less than 5 minutes.

parrot663212 votes

its 5% more at level 6

it takes 10 ultimate casts to stack it up to 20%

thats not happening at level 6 unless your ultimate has an insanely short cooldown

stop exaggerating with your 55% cooldown at level 6

Baron Barian11 votes

Must be nuts for someone like Kog'maw and Kassadin.

YumaS2Astral14 votes

[{quoted}](name=Baron Barian,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=417hVAki,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-08-31T05:01:36.290+0000)

Must be nuts for someone like Kog'maw and Kassadin.

I am more worried about Malzahar to be honest

His ult's cooldown can already get low enough to have a lower cooldown than item 3140's active with enough CDR, though you have a short window of time to ult them before they regain their QSS.

With this rune however, Malzahar will have a much higher window of time to use his ult before you can be able to use your only counter to it.

The same applies to Zed and item 3157

Ralanr11 votes

Honestly I don't see why. Their cooldowns are already very short, so it'd be better to get something else.

SUPERX4PANDA2 votes

I'll certainly be interested to play with it on Kassadin. The only issue with having such a tremendously short cooldown on his ult is that you will eat your mana ridiculously fast.

HeimerLmao1 votes

RoA, Lich Bane, Seraphs, Morello and yer good.

DuskDaUmbreon5 votes

And don't forget selling boots for Frozen Heart and Iceborn Gauntlet.

Quepha2 votes

cdr doesn't affect the duration of the mana cost debuffs which are what actually restricts those abilities.

Titanium7010 votes

People are freaking out a little more than they should considering Ultimore.

First of all - globals:

Neat but wont be affected as much as you think - you cant even stack it until the avarage game ends! How often does a Shen Ult in a game? 5 times?

Assassins:

Neat again, but let's be honest - once again in the phase of the game where the CD really matters it wont be stacked at all - and in late the Ult is Up for any Fight anyway. They'll take what ever DMG-Rune available.

There are only a FEW champions in the game that will draw some actual advantage out of this rune and even than we'll have to wait what OTHER options those will have.

Cho comes to my mind - more Ult = more stacks, great and all - but since Cho usually doesnt build CDR a pure CDR rune what ever those will look like weill do the job as well! And running 2 CDR runes when you really need Tankiness and DMG to contribute anything to your Team before minute 30! I don't think so.

OFC at FIRST you think YEAH I run it on every Champ, but that wont be the case at all.

KoKoboto8 votes

How often you gonna use all those ultimates though?

PrismalDawn2 votes

Whenever I get mid lane for whatever reason and I am not and objective sieging mofo like a jungler or roaming support, I pick Lux.

After laning phase is over and everyone goes full retard ARAM mode in Summoners Rift, I just ult the wave.

Minions finally coming so they can siege? Press R. Someone on my team gets caught out and the enemy team can only push mid because full retard ARAM mode is on? Press R. I need to back to buy items? Press R. 30 minutes and my tower is still more than half HP up? I press R. Her ult is 65 seconds long at rank 2. 60% of that for you math illiterates is 39 seconds. Imagine that, rank 2, 21 second lux cooldown. Minion waves spawn every 30 seconds.

KoKoboto2 votes

If you've had to use your ults just to do all that, by 30 minutes, I'm pretty sure you lost the game already.

PrismalDawn3 votes

No, I usually win lane, it's my team that feeds. So how do you stop an underfed team from losing the game within 5 minutes after laning phase? You clear the waves and wait until everyone is full build so early game doesnt matter.

KoKoboto2 votes

Okay. Ziggs, Anivia, Xerath, Vel'Koz, other mages, already do that with normal abilities.

Lux uses her ultimate so...

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

Champs often have their ult CDs nerfed because otherwise they'd be too powerful. This is just giving them a free 45% CDR on their ult off the bat for nothing and then increased to 60% as well. It's a massive blanket stat buff for everyone who takes it and will completely fuck over the meta.

'Oh but when are you going to use it'...as often as possible to bully my opponent and win lane/roam/take objectives? There is no logic in this statement.

Jorencice9 votes

Are you being willfully ignorant to further your narritive?

It's 5% cdr stacking up to 20%.

People have said that like 40 times in this thread.

It's NOT 45% cdr from a single rune. It's 20% after casting your ult TEN TIMES.

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

....it literally says gain maximum CDR on your ultimate.

Are we reading the same thing? You're the one being willfully ignorant.

Hellpyre5 votes

It means it increases the CDR cap. That's what the maximum means there. It does not grant 40% and then add the bonus, it increases your current, and your upper limit of, CDR for your champion's ultimate ability.

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

If that's the case then it's horribly worded. There's nothing in their about the cap, it just says gain maximum CDR.

Jorencice8 votes

Wait you honestly though the rune was just.

"Gain 60% CDR"

Seriously?

DuskDaUmbreon8 votes

I've looked, and, yes, you did misread it. You gain 5% CDR and max CDR on your ultimate automatically, and then 1.5% every time you cast, up to 10 stacks (15%). That's 20% increased CDR and max CDR.

It does not mean you automatically gain all 40% on it. The initial part is almost identical to the Intelligence mastery (left-most mastery, row 5, cunning tree). Max CDR does not mean you automatically hit the cap, it means you're increasing the cap.

Aimléss7 votes

It's not 45% at level 60, it's 5% at level 6 and maybe an additional 10% if you got an item that gives cdr by lvl 6. At most, someone will have 15% cdr on their ultimate at level 6. What makes it good is that as the game continues the cap increases to 55%, so if you get 40% worth of items, this rune will allow you to reach an additional 15% cdr on your ultimate late game, which is pretty damn fair, maybe even too fair.

Where did you read 40% cdr at level 6?

PureSilvrr6 votes

Lux can get an8.75 sec ult if she gets a kill with this

OMGSoAnnoying5 votes

You are indeed misreading it.

You gain 5% CDR immediately upon reaching level 6, and only for your ult.

Assuming you somehow BUILT 40% CDR by the time you hit level 6, you now have 45% CDR on it, just like what you can get now. For each of the first ten casts of your ult, you get a bit more CDR, and it would max at 60% CDR for your ult after the 10th cast. For most champions, this is a waste simply because you have to get 10 ult casts off. For ults like Karthus and Soraka that have very long early CDs, it'd take nearly 25 minutes of game time to get these casts in, assuming you did it right away and didn't use your ult strategically.

Champions that already have low cooldown ults such as Lux and Teemo would benefit greatly from this rune, as they'll get it to stack up. Similarly, champions that REALLY love their ults might want this -- Vi Amumu MasterYi, some others.

Meep Man4 votes

I expected this thread to happen, but not with someone complaining about how this would impact the laning phase. You guys do realize that someone has to use their ultimate 10 times to get 20% right? And there is already a stronger Mastery than this just for the base 5% that applies to all abilities.

BakedLotion4 votes

How are u getting 60% more ults?

If I'm reading this correctly, you gain 5% cdr on your ult. Then 15 from stacks.

So it's only 20% more. Which gives you a total of 60% cdr on your ult

And nobody has 40% cdr at level 6.. And they need to stack it.

THE RlVER KlNG1 votes

the way the rune description is worded, you gain 40% CDR on your ult only

then you can stack 15% more through using your ult

that totals to 55% CDR once fully stacked

if the bonus 5% also stacks, then you gain 60% CD on your ult

Please read

BakedLotion1 votes

[{quoted}](name=THE RlVER KlNG,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=417hVAki,comment-id=003c0000,timestamp=2017-09-01T02:12:15.994+0000)

the way the rune description is worded, you gain 40% CDR on your ult only

then you can stack 15% more through using your ult

that totals to 55% CDR once fully stacked

if the bonus 5% also stacks, then you gain 60% CD on your ult

Please read

Gain 5% cooldown reduction and maximum cooldown reduction on your ultimate. This increases by 1.5% each time you cast your ultimate. Stacks up to 10 times.

Where are you getting the "40% on ult only"

You get a flat 5%. Then you get 1.5% per stack. 10 max.

So 40% from items, 20 from the rune. 60% total.

You don't even know if the maximum CDR stacks, which would cap you at 45% from all sources anyway.

Don't tell people to read when u have the reading comprehension of a 5 year old.

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

Don't be rude?

The description is horribly worded and implies you get full (40%) CDR on your ultimate.

People coming on here acting like complete tools when no Rioter has corrected me yet.

Helmight3 votes

Remember that it scales with game time, so it's not like Karthus gets a 20-second cooldown on Requiem right as he hits level 6.

I'd also be incredibly surprised if Riot didn't nerf Ultimore first. They know that the new runes are exploring a lot of weird, potentially dangerous design space and would be first looking to change them instead of champions.

Weedlayer3 votes

Ctrl+f "karma" 0 results

Seriously? She can stack it from level 1, at rank 4 the cooldown on mantra goes down to a minimum of 14.4 (13.6 with intelligence) with the cooldown reduced by 3 seconds every time you hit an enemy with an ability (1.5 seconds on AA). Let's say you manta Q. That hits 2-3 people, and 1-2 people are in the detonation radius when it explodes. Your mantra is off cooldown, immediately. You'll be Mantra+Q-ing every 3 seconds. Of course you can mantra any of your other abilities too, the ult has basically no cooldown so why not?

I think it's being massively overrated on most champions, but karma specifically synergizes with this way too much.

IcyPepper3 votes

but now introduce a keystone that lets them get their CDs on 55% of the cooldown immediately at level 6??

Immediately?

Is that what we're calling stacks now?

Emelie Cauchemar1 votes

Kayle can press R 4 times a single fight now. Ecksdee.

Jorencice12 votes

Team fights last 36 seconds? What fucking elo are you in?

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