the aatrox problem

53436278DEL1··10 votes·1,052 views

high risk very low reward.

aatrox has one gap closer on a 12 second cool down 1 slow on a 9 second cool down both of which are skill shots and he doesn't get rewarded for hitting it at all and is extremely vulnerable during the casting times of his Q and E

compare to Diana Akali Maokai XinZhao Vi Tryndamere Nocturne Hecarim Fiora Poppy all champions with either a point and click gap closer and speed up or a instant cast blink

Jax MasterYi also included

14 Comments

yukumari3 votes

I disagree with him being high risk. His passive lets him revive for free periodically, which gives him a massive boost in safety. His gap closer doubles as an escape that can get him over any wall in the game (from my understanding). And he has built in bonus damage, that doubles as lifesteal if he gets into trouble.

thats not to say that he isn't in a good spot right now or a bad spot right now. But I don't think he's all that risky to play.

Smithney1 votes

I also disagree that Aatrox is high risk: not because of the long-cooldown passive, but because of the free lifesteal he gets. It's just that his abilities are so underwhelming they almost never feel rewarding when used (with the exception of his ult, of course). His Q does almost nothing, aside from being a gapcloser with the disappointing knockup. The W toggle is not interesting aside from introducing the cancerous sustain. And the E being nothing more than a measly, semi-spammable poke. The problem is that if his abilities were buffed, he would turn into an unbeatable sustain monster. Stonewall explains this really well in his video.

53436278DEL11 votes

{quoted}

I also disagree that Aatrox is high risk: not because of the long-cooldown passive, but because of the free lifesteal he gets. It's just that his abilities are so underwhelming they almost never feel rewarding when used (with the exception of his ult, of course). His Q does almost nothing, aside from being a gapcloser with the disappointing knockup. The W toggle is not interesting aside from introducing the cancerous sustain. And the E being nothing more than a measly, semi-spammable poke. The problem is that if his abilities were buffed, he would turn into an unbeatable sustain monster. Stonewall explains this really well in his video.

he doesn't get free lifesteal tho contrary to the belief.. miss his q and e and watch what happens to you

Smithney1 votes

Aatrox is kept from his powerful source of sustain deliberately, to prevent him from ruining others' games. If his Q and E were more reliable, he would have no problems abusing his cooldown-less, indirectly AS-scaling heal. He is not healthy for the game atm, which is why he is held underpowered.

ninjaIRL 1 votes

It's his general kit that doesn't really work well with his playstyle. You dive in with Q, and throw E, landing that you get a number of autoattacks against a melee. If they are a ranged opponent you get kited and probably aren't going to land your E. His Q shouldn't have such a revealing indicator for how difficult it is to pull off.

You don't get any benefits for landing your Q on it's outer circle. You get some damage and they get to run away. It should slow like all other abilities of its type. His E needs a projectile speed buff and maybe even a range because you can't land it if they're running away directly away from you because Aatrox stand still while he's casting it. His ultimate deals a lot of damage and give him much needed Attack Speed and range, Aatrox needs some form of CC negation while this is active so that he doesn't get kited so easily. Something like a 15% Tenacity.

His passive is really bad because he has zero CC to keep people off him once he gets out. He's not a Zac that can easily get out with a Q or and ult and heal tremenously while casting and moving. Aatrox needs to autoattack to heal and it doesn't work because if he builds tanky he deals no damage for the heal to even be viable. if he builds damage then he's not lifestealing enough to stay alive because of his squishiness.

His passive should give him something like: Bonus 2/2.5/3.5% health per second and 5/6/7% decaying attack speed for 1.5/2/2.5 seconds for every enemy champion around him. This counter acts burst in team fights and this also means he isn't going to be OP in early 1v1s. This allows him to tank for a few seconds after reviving and actually keeps him an impact.

53436278DEL11 votes

[{quoted}](name=ninjaIRL ,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3zpaUFdJ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-22T14:00:13.753+0000)

It's his general kit that doesn't really work well with his playstyle. You dive in with Q, and throw E, landing that you get a number of autoattacks against a melee. If they are a ranged opponent you get kited and probably aren't going to land your E. His Q shouldn't have such a revealing indicator for how difficult it is to pull off.

You don't get any benefits for landing your Q on it's outer circle. You get some damage and they get to run away. It should slow like all other abilities of its type. His E needs a projectile speed buff and maybe even a range because you can't land it if they're running away directly away from you because Aatrox stand still while he's casting it. His ultimate deals a lot of damage and give him much needed Attack Speed and range, Aatrox needs some form of CC negation while this is active so that he doesn't get kited so easily. Something like a 15% Tenacity.

His passive is really bad because he has zero CC to keep people off him once he gets out. He's not a Zac that can easily get out with a Q or and ult and heal tremenously while casting and moving. Aatrox needs to autoattack to heal and it doesn't work because if he builds tanky he deals no damage for the heal to even be viable. if he builds damage then he's not lifestealing enough to stay alive because of his squishiness.

His passive should give him something like: Bonus 2/2.5/3.5% health per second and 5/6/7% decaying attack speed for 1.5/2/2.5 seconds for every enemy champion around him. This counter acts burst in team fights and this also means he isn't going to be OP in early 1v1s. This allows him to tank for a few seconds after reviving and actually keeps him an impact.

his e is really useless imo

ninjaIRL 1 votes

How about. It becomes a hold key power button like a Varus Q or Vi Q? You can autoattack at a 80% to 50% reduced speed during cast time. Max cast time is 1.5 seconds. You gradually move at a reduced movement speed. Initial range starts at 550 max range is 1500. Projectile speed increases from 1400-ish to 2100. Slow lasts for an extra 0.5 seconds for every 0.5 that you cast it with. Casting does not cancel movement or attack commands.

Smithney1 votes

The charge-for-range effect would be interesting, but considering Aatrox derives most of his survivability from lifesteal, it would also make the ability counterproductive. I think his current Q works fine, but the rest of his kit is problematic. We are trying to solve it here, you guys may join us and share your opinions and/or ideas with us. ;)

AdanChristo1 votes

aatrox does kinda suck, but he's not undepowered, i think your solution is skill and timing

Numot1 votes

I don't find him to be that bad, for me he still does really high dmg and rips towers out in seconds, but then I typically build him for dmg/lifesteal, I see no point in going tank on him. And remember unlike every other champion in the game you have to kill Aatrox twice just to kill him once, he will always get back up, unlike Zac who is still dead if you kill his 4 blobs on Anivia if you kill her egg.

wri5t4ack1 votes

I actually think he is low risk. Then again i feel confident with his W usage that i know how and when to use it well. Most OP or under powered things/champs/abilities/items in this game are only so because how each individual is proficient or under skilled in using the said item/ability/etc. I personally say that its cheating to be able to aa twice then use the damaging W for an aa nuke at W lvl 1 and then walk away.

also to survive agasint a fed or semifed aatrox you build armor right?? wrong, you just sit there and die cuz his ranged poke/slow is magic damage :D

53436278DEL11 votes

{quoted}

I actually think he is low risk. Then again i feel confident with his W usage that i know how and when to use it well. Most OP or under powered things/champs/abilities/items in this game are only so because how each individual is proficient or under skilled in using the said item/ability/etc. I personally say that its cheating to be able to aa twice then use the damaging W for an aa nuke at W lvl 1 and then walk away.

also to survive agasint a fed or semifed aatrox you build armor right?? wrong, you just sit there and die cuz his ranged poke/slow is magic damage :D

wrong

TheDevice1 votes

I love aatrox' Q. I really do. The reason its on such a high cooldown is because unlike those other champs you described, it hits multiple enemies and can even knock several up.

What, i think, Aatrox needs is mostly described here. During teamfights he needs some added mobility to evade certain champs cc. He also could use that change on his passive so it makes more sense and reward him for reaching full gauge in a teamfight or having it ready for a duel.

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