Has anybody ever been hard stuck at silver 3, and eventually broke out of that and ranked up?

iPrawn··4 votes·5,916 views

I'm curious to know if anyone has ever been hard stuck at around mid silver, and then by some kind of stroke of self improvement, were able to break out of that and ranked up, and then kept the new higher rank... and didn't eventually get sent into a huge and long lose streak which forced them back down to silver 3 again?

Even though I don't believe the match maker is rigged, my ranked career has sure felt rigged at certain moments.

I've been hard stuck at silver 3 for about 3 years (which is how long I've been playing league), on multiple accounts. I main jungle. And I've tried just about every possible area of improvement, all of which has given me a lot of feeling of improvement at the game, but none of it has had even the slightly affect on my rank.

I started silver 3 when I first began to play league. And now, after an absolutely incredible amount of improvement at the game, I find it awfully shocking that despite so much improvement, and so much more game knowledge than I had when I first started, yet am I still exactly the same rank as I was when I first began. This is a really contradictory feeling, to feel like I'm so much better at the game, and yet not rank up, is really unpleasant especially when it continues like this for such a long time.

This has led me to wonder if there is some kind of rigging going on, and maybe the elo you settle into after your first 1000 games, becomes the elo you will never, ever, break free from, no matter how much you improve. I know, it sounds ridiculous, but rather than just downvote me for even thinking such a thing, I'd rather someone just answer my question.

So I'll repeat the question. Has anyone ever started their career at silver 3, and then they were hard stuck silver 3 for their first thousand ranked games, and then after improving at the game, they were suddenly able to break out of being hard stuck and were able to rank up to a much higher elo, and then kept that higher elo and didn't get forced back down by a huge lose streak? I'd really like to know.

I'd prefer a more recent example. I mean, if you were hard stuck once upon a time in season 1, that's great but that's a long time ago... and they could have added new algorithms to the matchmaker since then. I'd like to hear an example of someone breaking out of a hard stuck, within the last few years.

28 Comments

Tahminatrix 2 votes

I literally just sat down and did a long ranked session today, starting at the bottom of silver 3 and made it up to silver 1

People called me hardstuck despite only playing about 20 ranked games this season total so I honestly don't even know what hardstuck means anymore.

But yes even just those 20 ranked games were horrible, my best advice is to do your best to skew the odds in your team`s favor,

Its not enough for you to land your skillshot slow onto the enemy adc, your ezreal will STILL miss his q, its not enough to save your fiddle from certain doom, he will still run back in with less than 100 hp and die to an auto attack.

Your team will do baron at the worst time while you scream bloody murder for them to stop while the enemy team closes in with their ults ready.

You need to utilize atleast 1 of the 3 holy trinities to skew the odds in your favor. (most champions can do atleast 1 of these 3)

Waveclear is incredibly useful to have when your team decides to run it down one at a time and you manage to back off when things go south, not only does it stall the game out for any late game champs you have, it also gives your team another chance at group fighting which they probably didn't deserve in the first place.

Objective control.....is not just neutral monsters and enemy towers, sometimes you have to focus the champion that your team just doesn't know what to do against, that enemy champion becomes a win condition for you unless your team is actually really bad / far behind.

Being scary...………...nope that's really just it, ive won group fights just by standing between 1-2 carries on the enemy team and the group fight that they are trying to be apart of.

Just remember, sometimes there are going to be games where nothing you do will ever have an impact on the outcome.

iPrawn1 votes

Your opgg shows S6 gold, S7 gold, S8 gold... so I see no indication that you've ever been hard stuck in silver, so even if there was a such thing as rigging going on, it would not be affecting you until you are out of silver. Thanks for the advice though but, I too have a list of things I'm focusing on to try to win. My list is much bigger than yours, but then again, I main jungle which is a much more complicated role probably than top, since I have to deal with the entire map and a much broader list of problems and opportunities that can occur. But if all you have to do is focus on those three simple things to win rank out of silver playing top... well that must be very relaxing.

Meteor Driz2 votes

You could break out in the previous seasons. Now, I really don't think so.

I was plat for 3 years and I can't even get out of silver now after more than 500 games this season.

Syndra1ShotJFK2 votes

No. Why? Because I climbed from Bronze 1 to Gold 2 in 4 months. This is my first season in ranked. Of course, I've played a little over a 1000 games, but slowly but surely, I've steadily climbed. I was placed into Bronze 1 at the beginning of the season. Took me about 200 games to get to Silver 2, and was 'soft-stuck' between silver 2 - gold 4 for another 600, but eventually got past being "hard-stuck" and eventually got to Gold 1 55lp. Due to severe lag in my previous games, I literally inted my last couple games, now I'm Gold 2 85 lp. But I'm pretty sure I can reach plat 2 by the end of the year at this rate, possible even Diamond. Been playing this game for 2 years, with absolutely no moba experience.

Not to sound like an asshole, but this post shouldn't even be in gameplay. It should be in rant, because there's no actual gameplay discussion in your post. You don't discuss how you'd like to improve or tips or tricks, but this post lowkey sounds like one of the coinflip posts that currently plague the forums.

Everyone in ranked has an equal chance to climb. You cannot say this game is rigged even if it FEELS rigged. If it's rigged for you, its rigged for everyone. Therefore, the game is not rigged. And therefore, everyone is playing on equal ground. Some people have been playing thousands of games, and are hardstuck because they'll stick to the same habits time after time again. Likewise, someone who's been working at a company for 20 years, does not have 20 years experience. They have 1 year experience 20 times. Think of someone working, doing the same thing over the course of his lifetime, never experiencing new things, vs someone actively trying to trying to improve himself and learn as much as he can. Like someone job hopping and literally doubling his salary in the span of 3-4 years. This can be said of anyone hardstuck, whether diamond or silver. If you continue to stick to old ways of playing, play "systematically' and not critically, you will not climb.

This game is about decision making. But most people just read some Diamond post online and say "This must be the way to play!" "I should ALWAYS do Y in X situation." My last 500 games or so were filled with junglers from the enemy team and my team alike saying 'mid-difference' because they got invaded and asked why I didn't rotate to help, but didn't realize I was also fighting the enemy mid laner. Or sometimes they don't realize we lose a 2v2 at Lvl 2. Or they just don't realize that they DON'T need to contest scuttle every fucking game. Or that you DON'T ALWAYS need to push out waves before doing because the whole enemy team just died. Or that, you DON'T ALWAYS have to come mid when you take win lane and take down first turret. Of course, I'm not complaining that my teammates are bad, but I think I can differentiate myself from other players, because I think I can make mistakes but can improve upon them, while someone of the opposite nature would just blame the system or his team, or just play the same game every game. You can't climb with this mentality.

I was just played a game as Cassiopeia vs Malzahar, and he played his lane very well, it was difficult for me to follow his roams because he could just ult me and Lee sin could instagibb me with him. This guy even got a 3 level advantage over me, he was lvl 18 I was lvl 15. By the last fight, my team had broken the top and mid inhib and for some reason this malzahar SYSTEMATICALLY pushes mid up to my inner turret when he was the only one fed on his team ( and should've been fighting with his team) against my team 4v4 in their base. I cover mid so he doesn't take the turret, and although I lost the fight against him 20% to 90% hp, I baited him long enough to stay mid so that my team could win that 4v4. After another teamfight, even when the enemy had baron, we won the game.

You also got to realize that every year, people get better at the game. If anyone plays Maplestory, especially on a v62 private server, almost every assassin HP washes so that they can properly boss in the late game. Anyone who played old school maplestory didn't give 2 shits about HP washing, they played for fun. Likewise in League of Legends, there are more guides than ever, there are more standardized ways to play than ever, the general public gets better every year. Plat standards 4 years ago could be silver 5 standards today. People complaining about being a higher rank in previous seasons don't realize that's irrelevant.

They could be hard-stuck or a lower rank because:

  1. They did better, but so did the general public, so they stay the same rank.

  2. They don't improve, but actually end up demoting and demoting because well, the general public always improves, and they didn't.

So, not my opinion, but a FACT, this game is fair grounds for almost EVERYONE.

Cevrad2 votes

No, am currently doing smurf 7 and 8 right now. One on NA, one on EUW. The idea that matchmaking is the problem is a joke.

5050BS4 votes

You ARE the problem. Smurfs Ruin all Ranks lower then the skill of the player. The accounts you are playing on are in a sense the same as your top account.

Every match you are in with any of those accounts is 9 lower ranks and your team has a Smurf so guess what team wins?

Did the enemy team play badly? Maybe not. If you were not on your team and a REAL lower ELO player was their would your team have won? maybe not.

You are boosting your team and ruining the enemies teams MMR. This is why Ranked in Low ELO is such shit.

Mavëríck2 votes

{quoted}

You ARE the problem. Smurfs Ruin all Ranks lower then the skill of the player. The accounts you are playing on are in a sense the same as your top account.

Every match you are in with any of those accounts is 9 lower ranks and your team has a Smurf so guess what team wins?

Did the enemy team play badly? Maybe not. If you were not on your team and a REAL lower ELO player was their would your team have won? maybe not.

You are boosting your team and ruining the enemies teams MMR. This is why Ranked in Low ELO is such shit.

Fucking. THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MiracleMorg942 votes

Yup that's me. I don't remember what number in Silver I started this season, I think around mid silver but I could be wrong. But since January, I have been promoted to silver 2 and demoted back to silver 3 AT LEAST TEN TIMES if not more. The most recent was this week where it took me THREE PROMOS SERIES to finally get back into silver 2.

I certainly feel it's rigged because of the shit I've gone through the past couple months. It's been a shit show.

5050BS1 votes

Im in the same Boat

Illabethe2 votes

-People improve around you, meaning your skill must improve faster. -Matchmaking isn't necessarily "rigged"

What may make matchmaking seem rigged:

-Your disposition going into them. Some of these players are so "soft" that just talking in champ select tilts them. If you attempt to build a team that will win, most teammates will have an opposition view, question your credentials, and this is all timed, so it results in a lot of team problems before the game even begins.

-Your disposition in the game. If you are playing with average players within their own elo, and you are better than them, generally you will lose more games simply by critiquing and crying and typing, than the choices you make that are mechanically correct. Most "average" players will generally begin making choices to inherently force a loss to punish you, because they already know they aren't going anywhere.

-Expecting smurfs at every corner. Some games do indeed have smurfs, but they generally average out as 50% on your team and 50% on the other. However, the SIGNIFICANT effect smurfs have on climbing is a Placebo; If a low elo player sees a good play that happens fast, and calculated by someone consistently snowballing, they begin seeing that person as a smurf. In reality..... they're usually a one trick whose win rate reflects the win rate of their 1 champion, rather than a well rounded player. Players losing to a one trick or smurf, generally give up games far more often than if they felt they were even keeled with the other team. Learn to be the person who wins versus smurfs, one tricks, and then focus their team around them.

-Never learning the important lesson that the game is more about objectives than kills.

Simplest terms: If you never split push during a drake, or during a 4 man wipe, or apply pressure when your team died when playing a champ that can do so, recall instead trying to save something, you're wasting time, probably not accomplishing your goal, and you gave up pressure. You will win less games than your expected average.


Ways that are NOT your fault that you cannot climb:

-50% Win Rate MMR in reality is due to your most RECENT MMR. If you were 70%, but then went on a 30% streak, that drove you down to 50%, In reality your MMR may reflect a win rate like 40%, because your most recent games are more important than your first several games at 70%.

-Riot repeatedly tries to change ranked every season. At least three seasons have resulted in MMR/Rank displacement that permanently scarred accounts that didn't play within certain parameters those seasons.

Dynamic Queue Season 6: They actually reset everything 3 weeks into the season, and adopted a placement MMR counter which was more harsh, and people who were Gold III in many cases dropped to Silver II, got horrible players in their second placements, and lost 3 weeks off their season of progress.

Runes Reworked Season 8: Many runes got through in an initial form that were biased in power and only rewarded players playing them. They heavily skewed from tankiness, and players who played tanks, or some mages actually had their champ balance thrown into losing territory overnight due to balance, not skill.

Positional Ranking Season 9: Gave option to play MMR differently depending on if you played one role or played fill. Rounded players both progressed slower, and began ranking five different roles as different ranks. Unfortunately, the fine print on this season gave Riot the right to suspend Positional Ranking, they did, and they did so without considering how they had punished "Fill" players through their rank consolidation.

For example, even though I was Silver II on this account in 3 roles, I was only B I in 2 roles I didn't play much. With a 52% Win rate overall (65%+ in my 3 main roles) I was suddenly vaulted from a Silver I/Gold V MMR in my 3 main roles, way back to a Bronze I MMR. This meant the difference between my Rank and my MMR was automatically 4 ranks difference.

[img]https://i.imgur.com/jqFxp98.png[/img]

No Joke.

I went from earning 21 LP for a win as "Fill" and -17 for a Loss, to gaining 9-10 LP for a win, and -23 LP for a loss.

In other words, to prevent demoting, I suddenly had to maintain a 70% Win Rate! I couldn't, and I'm still struggling to recover that MMR, and my teams have gotten worse over time, as they have all tilted for various reasons (some because of this positional change). I Actually slipped from a 70% Win account to a 49% Win Account because of this Positional Ranking change.

[img]https://i.imgur.com/s63jwJ9.png[/img]

I'm back to 50% after switching to two trick Jungling, but omfg..... even after 454 games, (About double what I had before the revert) I'm barely getting 14-15 LP for a win, and -20 LP for a loss. At Silver.

All because Riot took away the system they themselves championed.


I Was 70% Win rate in my first 140 games. If I had just played one role, I would have been easily high Gold. But because I played fill, all my games got erased, and my MMR was murdered.

When I was 52%, I had a friend who literally caused 3 of my losses via disconnect/bugsplat/business calls, who was 51%, getting friggin 32 LP a win, because unlike me, He only played 95% Jungle, and 5% Adc. Guess what? He stopped playing ranked after he got back to Gold V.

Jedidiah0072 votes

I think you'll find easy improvement if you turn on your monitor.

Kai Guy1 votes

I have been stuck in Bronze, Silver, Gold, Plat.

Nice Yasuo1 votes

I started playing the game in season 3, for the first 4 I was stuck in silver and couldn't break out of the silver plated hell with every thought in my head that I didn't deserve to be there. Until season 7 came around and I blasted off from hardstuck silver to plat. If you think you've improved to an extent that you shouldn't be silver, but you're not climbing, then you havent improved as much as you've personally thought. The game takes a lot of time to master and learn, you'll never stop learning new things about it. Partially because it's always changing. If you're really dedicated to getting better, watch replays of your lost games, or the ones you've won even. Play the troubleshooter role and decide what you're doing wrong and work on improvement. Strategize, learn, improve.

Pandemic Punch1 votes

Play more games. Play more Amumu and Rammus. Dont pick other champions.

I fell from gold 1 and fell to silver 4 last season. Before bringing it back up to platinum. I was plat on 2 accounts last season and one of the accounts was rammus jungle. The other account was brand support.

Rammus and amumu are incredibly more viable right now than last season. Both of them are S+ tier with amumu being viable in Top 5 challenger. I see you had a decent win rate on amumu last season. Play it and play ranked. Not normals :)

5050BS1 votes

So in all of those games your team was getting boosted by a Plat player.

GG Riot for allowing Smurfs

DeathBurst1 votes

The first time I climbed from Silver to Gold, it was roughly a yeah and a half after starting League, I had been Silver for ~5 months without playing Ranked much and I decided to start grinding LP seriously. It took me a few months, but it was a relatively steady climb to Gold5 (at the time), and then I spent the rest of the season hovering at Gold5 ~50LP (played much less once I reached Gold, though, didn't really try to grind anymore).

Since then, I've never been stuck exactly, but I've tried learning new champs in Ranked at the start of a new season, and tanked my MMR quite a lot, to the point where I was winning +18 LP for a win, losing -21 for a loss, in Silver3. When I started playing my main again, I climbed back up to Gold very quickly.

Not stuck exactly either, but in Season 6 and 7, I finished my placements in low Silver, and climbed back up to Gold relatively easily too.

So, to sum up, I have never been really stuck in Silver3, but I legitimately (no feeding/losing on purpose) ended up at this rank many times for various reasons, and always managed to climb up from there.


And no, I never was "suddenly able to break", but I've seen constant progress over the years, from High Bronze in Season4, to Gold1 100LP at the end of Season8, so 10 divisions in 4 seasons, a bit more than 2 divisions every season. ~Bronze 1 - Silver 3 - Gold 5 - Gold 3 - Gold 1.

There is no miracle, no sudden moment where you become able to climb. If you think you get better and still don't climb up, I can see 2 possibilities: 1) You do get better, but you tilt too often and aren't consistent over the long term, over a large number of games; or 2) You only improve on certain points but you still have a big weakness somewhere that cost you a lot of games and prevent you from climbing.

If it's 1), then stop worrying about your skills, be confident, and start working on your attitude. If it's 2), try to find someone noticeably better than you (not just 1 or 2 divisions), and ask them to look at your replays and point what they think is your biggest weakness, and try to do that with 3 or 4 different people and see if they agree.

(Oh, and BTW, everyone started Silver3. That did not mean you actually had the skills of a Silver3 player, that was just the starting point of the old algorithm (now it starts people in Iron4). A better indication of your starting point is where you finished your placements for your second season. For instance in my case, I finished my first placements in Silver3 like you, but I finished my second placements in Bronze2. So maybe you DID improve over the years, just not enough to pass beyond Silver3.)

Illabethe1 votes

On the last point: No. You didn't. Many people used to PLACE Gold V - Gold III. Many placed Bronze II as well.

The variance in MMR bases and rewards during placements used to be large, and set their start point based on your Normal game performance at the first ranked game you played. In other words, if you were a 70% Norms player with significant talent, and placed 9/10 in placements, You used to be able to start Gold. If you were a 45% Norms player with a 7/10 placement, You'd probably start low Silver/Bronze.

DeathBurst1 votes

Do you have any red source confirming that? It sounds highly doubtful to me.

Illabethe1 votes

Dude..... I've had 6 accounts.

Account 1; Made in 2014; Placed Bronze I Account 2; Made in June 2015; Placed Gold IV Account 3; Made in December 2015; Placed Gold V Account 4; Made in September 2016; Placed Gold V Account 5; Made in February 2017: Placed Silver I Account 6; Made in December 2018; Placed Silver II

I know from first hand experience.

DeathBurst1 votes

That doesn't prove they look at your Normals winrate. Starting at the median MMR of the player-base (roughly equivalent to Silver3) and having increased rate of change for your first 10 games can easily put you 3 or 4 divisions away from Silver3 at the end of your Placements.

So OK, what I wrote in that first post was a bit ambiguous, I didn't mean everyone actually finished their placements in Silver3, I meant that everyone started their placement with a Silver3 MMR. But still, your first hand experience doesn't show anything.

Illabethe1 votes

At this point, presenting evidence is almost pointless and only anecdotal. However, I can assure you that the BASE starting point on every account was different, according to both the people LolKing/OP.GG tracked as being in my games, and by the very estimate of MMR they give.

Game 1 in ranked on all those accounts drastically varied, and the only explanation I and other high rankers could come up with was that our Norms performance had an impact. There's no justifiable reason other than that, that a Season 5 account's first game in ranked would be versus Gold V and Game 1 in Season 6 would be Plat V players, and some others yet started at Silver I players.

What we DID know: as your placements progressed, your record in those placements did affect your passive LP position gain, and what players you played against. If you began at Gold V players, won 5, your 6th game would be riddled with Plat V players. If you lost 5, your game 6 players would be Silver I and II.

This is how a lot of high rankers have literally bypassed tiers. 10/10 placements brought them up 1 -1.5 entire tiers from their base play.

In Season 4-7, You literally could see people gain Diamond on a fresh account in 37 games, if they won most of them.

DeathBurst1 votes

At this point, presenting evidence is almost pointless and only anecdotal.

Indeed, which is why my original question was "do you have a red source".

What we DID know: as your placements progressed, [...] This is how a lot of high rankers have literally bypassed tiers. 10/10 placements brought them up 1 -1.5 entire tiers from their base play.

Of course. That's what I said myself.

In Season 4-7, You literally could see people gain Diamond on a fresh account in 37 games, if they won most of them.

Not relevant. Even now where you can actually see they start you in Iron4, you can probably do it under 60 games or so, if you're good enough.

Game 1 in ranked on all those accounts drastically varied,

THAT is the point I'm doubtful about. The fact that Game 1 isn't the same for every account. Of course your performance during the 10 placements games can move you a lot, but why the starting point would be different? If it's true you were in a Plat5 game on game 1 (and I have no reason to believe you're lying), then that's a good sign they do look at Normals and that Game 1 isn't the same for everyone. Still not a proof, but a good evidence. As it currently stands, that's not enough yet to convince me, but it's interesting.

Craft Zeppelin1 votes

Are you "only" laning and jungling? You need a game plan and objective to win constantly. Learn stratagems and gambits not "mechanics". This is a RTS in a sense

nm10101 votes

I've never been stuck when I've actually tried to climb.

Kanyoupipu1 votes

{quoted}

I'm curious to know if anyone has ever been hard stuck at around mid silver, and then by some kind of stroke of self improvement, were able to break out of that and ranked up, and then kept the new higher rank... and didn't eventually get sent into a huge and long lose streak which forced them back down to silver 3 again?

My opinion is that silver is the hardest low ELO to rank out of, it has one of the larger skill disparities between people in the game and that makes it more random.... meaning individual performance matters even less.

Win streaks are possible to get out, but if you are saying you played 1000+ I have no idea what to tell you. That is already a lot of dice-rolling to not break out of silver.

5050BS1 votes

Im there in S2. Last Season it was S1

Every Promo is a stacked shitfest of bad players on my team and good on the enemies team. EVERY time.

Stray Kat1 votes

I was mid silver for many seasons in a row(S3 or 4 onward, on this account at least) and just last season decided I was tired of it, and was going to climb a bit - Managed to climb right up to gold and have been there ever since, can reliably get fresh accounts to gold, etc.

Dr Endeavor1 votes

I was stuck in bronze when I first started as a support main, broke out using Leona.

Was silver for a really long time, switched to jungle because I enjoyed the freedom of the role. Didn’t play many ranked games though, mainly because I hated the atmosphere of the games.

This year about a week or so ago I got to gold. Biggest reasons?

  1. Turned off chat, for everyone, period. Probably the biggest distraction that ever existed in any competitive game. No one is saying anything useful, at least not at this ELO. My gameplay improved almost exponentially.

  2. Your team is going to suck, every game and hard. You can’t control that... so what can you control? CS, dragons, herald, towers, vision... and probably the most important... how much you die. Seriously, stop dying... even if that means letting other people reap what they sow.

  3. Screw wards. Use scanner, kill the enemy vision and use pinks way more. My team more or less never wards, it’s horrible. So rather than try to make up for it, I started denying the enemy theirs and use a ton more pinks to make up for not having any. I am able to ambush big targets way more often and use the momentum to close out games.

  4. Start using champs that impact the game using YOUR style. Pros are right, meta is important.... in challenger. You know who isn’t challenger? People in silver that are not challenger smurfs. I got to gold using Chogath jungle. Why did it work? He has no mobility, his main cc is tricky, a lot of his power requires smart use of his ult, and building AP generally just gets you blown up. It worked because I played to my style and Chogaths strengths. I didn’t go into the enemy’s fights, I waited til I could fight on my terms (example: hitting 3+ people with a knock up and silence just ends most fights). Then I waddle to drag/herald/baron and start it.... enemy show up? So what. If early game my R does 1000+ true damage + smite.... generally at 1500 hp they are mine. Late game I can have anywhere from 5000 to 7000 hp, my E will rip you to pieces before you even sneeze at dragon. Stop playing Your junglers the way your TEAM wants and play them to their strengths.

There is a bunch more, but this is getting long so hope this helps.

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