Why do people say Azir is underpowered?

Weathered·Mar 14, 2016·19 votes·4,250 views

This is an honest question. I've seen people be frustrated or even a little angry that Azir is "not viable" currently. Most of what they are saying is that Azir is only good in very high level play, especially in team play.

I disagree. Now, this is probably not a valid opinion since I literally bought Azir yesterday, but from the fact that I got a pentakill my fourth game while in solo silver ELO makes me doubt what people are saying. I feel like Azir is fantastic. People (in this ELO) don't know how to trade accurately with wave movements, and will often get either too close to the wave or stay too far away and miss CS. This is perfect for Azir's kit for lane harass, and to be honest I have never had mana problems with Azir if I pick up a second dorans along with the first part of my Nashor's.

On top of this, people group up too often and position terribly. I've never really had trouble with mechanical champions, so Azir's W+Q+E+R is the most fun thing to do. Hitting his ult is actually fairly easy because teams will get too close trying to start a fight.

So ya. Thoughts on title?

79 Comments

AstôlfoMar 14, 201610 votes

Azir is very good and strong, and deals a lot of damage, but has one of the arguably highest skill floors, and a huge skill roof.

WeatheredMar 14, 20162 votes

Again, people say this, but I was doing the Shurima Shuffle and the banana juke behind baron pit after two games :/

I don't feel like Azir has that much mechanical difficulties. I think it depends more on if the champion clicks for you, and you feel comfortable with the motions.

BoulderoxMar 14, 20164 votes

yea i agree, it is like any champ, if they naturally fit your style, go for it. I won't call my self the best azir or even a main really... but he has a lot of potential power, that has the idea to encumber the enemy. towers, jukes, poke, harass, item 3116 existance.... The irony is i feel he lost a LOT of his skillful play when they changed his passive and tacked the AS on the w. Now i see him as a glorified SLOW bot that wasnt to have LOTS of AS and THEN raw ap, instead of the other way around that makes sense. and have seen first hand how opressive an azir with just a item 3116 can be in a teamfight. you can't run

OyddAWqJ5rMar 14, 20161 votes

I know the banana juke but what's the Shurima Shuffle? Haha.

Also since you're starting out a tip for his build: save Nashors for later. But you need attack speed so build Stinger but just sit on it (Stinger is insanely cost effective). Rylais is so much more important than finishing Nashors and the stats gained from finishing the Codex side of Nashors and Nashors itself are negligable compared to getting Rylais twice as quickly. And I'm not even talking opinion-based! It's numerically just as strong to build the Rylais components as it is to finish Nashors.

Nashors (w/out Stinger) = 80 ap + 10% cdr for 1800g

NLR + Amp Tome = 80 ap for 1625g plus faster access to Rylais!

After Rylais you can choose to finish or build other items. In my opinion I'd save Nashors for last since it's purely a stat increase whereas Void, Zhonya, Ludens all provide additional benefits.

Anywho, hope this helps and best of luck on the rift!

Vistha KaiMar 14, 20161 votes

Shurima Shuffle is that one in which you dash behind/into the enemy team and ult them toward yours.

BurritoJamboreeMay 26, 20161 votes

Nashor rush is a great way to build and often a solid build; However, its not optimized. if you sacrifice 3 magic pen reds for atk speed, ap quints, and cdr blues. you can actually build Rod of Ages, then into Nashor. This makes your mid game only slightly weaker since you compensated with runes, but gives you a massive power spike relatively soon after. I finished a game last night at 16 2 10 with a 14 kill streak with that simple item change up.

Auz the RipperMar 14, 20161 votes

Strategically intensive is probably better term for Azir.

Good Positioning of both Azir and each of his soldiers is more critical than with almost all other champions and most people find micromanagement of that level to be difficult.

La BarbotteMar 14, 20169 votes

the mechanical difficultie dont all rest in drifting, yes it require some skill but the biggest part of his kit his micro managing soldiers to kinda predict teh flow of the teamfight, hence his high skillfloor and infinite skillroof, because you arent forced to use all your soldiers to attack, you can spawn peel, mobility, defensive, offensive, zoning soldiers etc etc the possibilities and angles of attack he offers are immense, and he definitely is a good champion, his biggest flaw right now rest in the AP items being expensive, but thats about it (considering you got the mechanics)

EmExMar 15, 20161 votes

so he is the hardest champ in LoL?

La BarbotteMar 15, 20161 votes

not THE hardest, but one of them as long as high skill cap goes those ones are pretty solid champs to improve on

Azir Ekko LeeSin Leblanc Zed Yasuo Thresh

even if some of those are fairly easy to use (looking at them Yasuo Leblanc Zed ), the difference between a regular, good and master on the champion is enormous as they offer so many possibilities and mechanical plays, i would say those are my personal choice for ''best'' champions in the game

Only Play DariusMar 14, 20162 votes

Some people have an easier time learning Azir than others. If you grew up on champs like Orianna Yasuo Zed Cassiopeia Elise (you said you love mechanically intensive champs) then his combos become second nature after a couple of games. For others, Azir is intimidating to the point that it feels like it's not worth learning him

WeatheredMar 14, 20162 votes

I actually don't mid lane. Shaco Kha Elise and Gragas are my main champs. I like spell weaving champions.

megagnuraMar 14, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Again, people say this, but I was doing the Shurima Shuffle and the banana juke behind baron pit after two games :/

The shuffle is significantly easier to do since the change where you stop at the final destination of a moving soldier than when you stopped the moment your model touched the soldier.

TotalJerkMar 14, 20162 votes

Anyone can just DO a Shurima shuffle, and quite frankly anyone can do an Insec. The actual challenge is consistently doing them under pressure the instant the perfect opportunity presents itself. Like yeah, anyone can shoot a three pointer in basketball on an empty court, but try doing a dozen of them against actual players

Lord AzırMar 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Again, people say this, but I was doing the Shurima Shuffle and the banana juke behind baron pit after two games :/

I don't feel like Azir has that much mechanical difficulties. I think it depends more on if the champion clicks for you, and you feel comfortable with the motions.

The shuffle and jukes aren't what make him hard to play. It's all about the team fights. You have to constantly kite throughout a team fight, while also being a mage with 0 sustain and next to no burst damage. You have to learn where are the best positions to put your soldiers to get off the most damage, which targets you should be going after, all while being aware of your soldier locations at all time and not tunneling on the target you're attacking too much because then a champion like Zed Talon Diana can easily just burst you while you aren't paying enough attention.

WadeWilson1337Mar 14, 20165 votes

Azir was nerfed quite heavily due to his kit. His kit is the absolute epitome of disgusting sieging capabilities. If Azir had strong numbers, he would be a pick/ban in poke comp teams in LCS due to the fact he can harras the living hell out of the enemy in a very frustrating manner, and as soon as he gets a tower, he can use his passive to make flanking his team impossible as he sieges for the next. As if that wasnt enough, hes obnoxious in lane, and his ultimate is one of the strongest engage/disengages in the game. Long story short, he is overnerfed and his utility just doesnt justify his extreme skillcap and weak numbers.

WeatheredMar 14, 20161 votes

Can you link his patch history? I don't know where to find it. Over seasons I've really only noticed the immense bug fixes to him since I don't mid lane often.

DEmperor95Mar 14, 20162 votes

http://lol.gamepedia.com/Azir_-_The_Emperor_of_the_Sands#Patch_History

Handin Out NapsMar 14, 20164 votes

Same reason people say Viktor's nerfs killed him. They suck.

morris1Mar 14, 20163 votes

He's just really intensive mechanically, and some people get used to his strange gameplay more than others. Unfortunately most of the people playing Azir put him in a bad light by butchering combos and feeding heavily, it's not easy after all and I feel as if 30k points with him teached me nothing about his gameplay.

blfUvZ8YbuMar 14, 20163 votes

Azir is weak.Now meta is tank meta but he didn't pick.

Also Rylai is strong, Azir isn't strong.

You learn this.

Teamfight champion but no pick pro scene? Is it sensible? NO!

Because he is weak.

CubedJusticeMar 14, 20162 votes

He got picked in the pro scene. Hush yourself.

blfUvZ8YbuMar 14, 20161 votes

{quoted}

He got picked in the pro scene. Hush yourself.

No pick for NA.You're blind.I'm sure.

You follow pro scene or shut up.

Mai Waifu IreliaMar 14, 20163 votes

He gets picked in LCK sometimes (mainly by BDD) And given Korea > NA I wouldn't be so quick with the rudeness

CubedJusticeMar 15, 20162 votes

He was actually picked and banned in EU this week.

Guy Fox TeemoMar 14, 20163 votes

Getting a penta kill doesn't mean anything, at all. 80% of the time you were just really fed or you got lucky on all the last hits.

Also the combo is w+e+q+r, or else you would just be going forward and couldn't do the shuffle mechanics...

AngelFrost00Mar 14, 20162 votes

If his caught most likely hes dead.

GlockHammerMar 14, 20161 votes

{quoted}

If his caught most likely hes dead.

That applies to just about any champ in the game nowadays even tanks, the only champs that have a chance to get away when caught are those with unbearable ammounts of mobility and panic button denial, like Riven or Lee etc.

WeatheredMar 14, 20161 votes

I don't have trouble with this. In team fights I can use his ult to corral the front line dive champions back, allowing peel for the adc and I, and when I'm alone his W+Q+E is about the distance of a Kha upgraded E. He's actually really mobile with a good amount of CDR.

GlockHammerMar 14, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I don't have trouble with this. In team fights I can use his ult to corral the front line dive champions back, allowing peel for the adc and I, and when I'm alone his W+Q+E is about the distance of a Kha upgraded E. He's actually really mobile with a good amount of CDR.

I'm glad you see his strenghts, people forget Azir is a midgame/lategame champ with a very versatile kit, he won't have the easiest time streamrolling people from the start but that lategame is just wow.

People are just mad because they wanna play him like Kata, dive in and instaburst everything. But he is no Kata, Azir might be the best mage in the game at extended fights given he doesn't die, because unlike pretty much ever other mage, his dps practically never drops.

This proves even silver players can have more maturity and less biased opinions than higher elo players, something tells me you wont be silver for long though, not while mastering a champ like Azir. Enjoy the climb bro.

junglerboy16Mar 14, 20162 votes

Getting pentakills is almost always about luck (and being the guy who last hits champs), not champion strength. Katarina gets pentakills all the time but is generally considered balanced to a little weak right now. Pentakills+teamfight strength =/= overall OPness.

Also:

I've never really had trouble with mechanical champions,

This is what people mean when they say he's only good in high elo. What they mean is he's only good if you are a skilled or at the very least competent player. They're just too inarticulate to say what they really mean and use the quantifier of elo to generalize what they are trying to say.

LauchmelderMar 14, 20162 votes

I think it has to do with the overall performance of our Azirs in the games we played. You are either a god at him or you suck. There barely is anything inbetween.

DatalessMar 14, 20162 votes

Also Corki mid lane is ruining a lot of mages days.

TengrichanMar 14, 20162 votes

I have played 100+ games in ranked + normals overall and here are my views on him:

He is actually hard to play against people who know how he works.Sure you may have won against silvers easily but the higher you go in ELO that harder it becomes to win trades,farm and survive in laning phase.
His early manacosts are simply too high for the damage output and farming capabilities he has.Other AP mids can clear a wave way faster,more efficiently with less mana.With Azir you have to auto attack several times use Q.Then you have to actually wait seconds before you can attack because you risk losing CS with the low attack speed early on.
His utility has been reduced severely over patches and i would say other control mages are just plain better.
His zoning ability is tied to his Q to reposition the soldiers however using it for trading pushes the lane which will eventually result in a pushed lane and a lot of mana consumption.
He does little to none burst damage.Which can be detrimental for an AP mage especially for a control one.
The learning curve of where to aim with Q to place soldiers is exrtemely high.You have to pretty much predict in which direction will the teamfight go. Later on this becomes less important given the CDR but even then a missed Q can easily make or break a teamfight.
You have to have not only micro but macro skills to correctly use the passive and interrupt an enemy push or siege near a turret.
He is slow as hell which makes him vulnerable to pretty much anything which i don't agree with(with the slow ms) since his E has a long enough cooldown and its usually used for defensive purposes rather than going toward the enemy.
He still feels clunky to play despite the numerous bugfixes.The latest bugfix did help a lot however his overall gameplay still doesn't feel smooth enough.Trying to do a QUICK W+Q+E combo or W+E+Q combo takes a relatively long time and often results in deaths or missed kills which are especially important with the current meta.

All in all you have to know the champion and its matchups extremely well to have a chance and even then you have to play near perfectly because if you die in lane you lose the lane most of the time. I am only g3 but even here people will chain gank me if i am not careful then i'll just become a deadwieight with little to none damage. AP itemization changes didn't help either also you have to pretty much buy certain items on him to reach his power spikes which are an indication of a "bad" design in my opinion.

V1CTISMar 14, 20162 votes

You're in normals....

MoonshadeMar 14, 20162 votes

He's not useless its just that with Corki, Ezreal, Zed and Talon dominating the mid lane he's just not in a good spot right now, I still use him (he's my highest mastery champ) and I still love using him its just meta wise he's not in the best of places, plus many teams don't get that u need people to help keep enemies on your soldiers to maximize your DPS. In addition he's a hyper carry, his early game is good because of his zoning and harass but if someone goes all in on you chances are they'll win and kill you. Once u get your Rylai's Nashor's spike you become a terror especially with Q and W maxed out but until then you're just good for harass. In lane you win because you can shove waves super fast and harass people to the point that engages become suicide. Late game you play like a cross between an ADC and Orianna, putting soldiers in good positions to stab people to death with your AAs, while your ult can be used to peel, or to trap/insec people.

Mechanically he's super complex since u need to learn how to best position soldiers, how to animation cancel soldier AAs with Q so you can get a triple hit off super quick, how to sweep targets with ult and E (W>Q soldier out, wait for Q CD, E to solider R enemies back and before u hit your soldier Q back the way you came so you can divide enemy teams and not get trapped on the wrong side of your R), how to play teamfights so you're not stuck with no soldiers in a bad situation, how to avoid getting blocked while using E, etc...

HoseeMar 14, 20162 votes

As an Azir main on a gold and a plat account, it's not that he's bad, it's just if you invest that much time into learning him, you probably could carry harder and climb faster on a different champion.

Titanium70Mar 15, 20162 votes

The thing about Azir besides his difficulty:

Azir is a Lategame AP-Hypercarry.

We dont have Lategames right now and AP is worse than AD and we have a Snowball-Meta. Against a Snowball you cant carry (if you've not snowballed as well, hard to do without Powerspikes).

Right now it's just totally NOT the time to play Azir. x'D

StoppedDig79605Mar 15, 20161 votes

i was going to say the exact same thing lol but then I saw your comment you hit it right on the nose, i main azir and i like to say im pretty good at him (still need to pratice tho lol) and I can get snowballing early if i play my lane correct and If the enemy is retarded. But I would like to add onto your "Late game" comment Azir has a terrable early game and in this meta early game champs are kings /queens. I wouldnt nesseserly say AP is worse than AD but thats a debate for a differnt thread lol. Azir is a case of feast or famine in this meta ether he is a god and is opressive and unbearable to play agains or he is terrable and cant do anything.

BeldairMar 15, 20162 votes

So true...i had a match where i could've done a lot better as Azir (my whole team actually could've done better) and it was a famine type situation where Zed kept me from truely farming with some help from their jungler. But even with that, i was still able to get a few double kills. (we still loat though).

So yea, Azir is definitely a late game beast with a horrible early.

Troll for TrumpMar 14, 20161 votes

He's not weak or UP, he just fell off meta.

blfUvZ8YbuMar 14, 20162 votes

{quoted}

He's not weak or UP, he just fell off meta.

Because overnerfs and weak.

Troll for TrumpMar 15, 20161 votes

Not really Shyvana Is an overnerf Sejuani is an overnerf Fiddlesticks is weak Yorick is weak

Azir is still viable, and one of the mages in a better state. The mages with issues are Fiddlesticks Cassiopeia Xerath Ziggs . Those are way worse than him

blfUvZ8YbuMar 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Not really Is an overnerf is an overnerf is weak is weak

Azir is still viable, and one of the mages in a better state. The mages with issues are . Those are way worse than him

51% win rate Seju and overnerf? Loool

Also Shyvana is op.Fiddle is fine.Yorick maybe.

Azir is weak.They destroyed Azir.

Also Cass, Xerath are better than Azir.

Troll for TrumpMar 15, 20161 votes

WTF? No, both Xer and cass are way worse. Sej is overnerf. Almost everyone thought that she had been overnerfed during cinderhulk meta. Those nerfs have remained intact even after cinderhulk nerf, and only now is she getting compensation.

Do you even see the posts complaining about shyv nerfs? They are halving her damage. She won't be Op

Azir has 49.7%WR in plat+ranked That's basically 50/50. Cass has a 45%WR.

Yorick maybe. "Maybe". When was the last time you saw him? How about Galio ? Nunu's winrate is abysmal. Rumble, Viktor... and so on. WW is low, but he's linear, so Plat+ players should be able to outplay him Azir is 108th out of the 193 champ+positions listed on champion.gg. That's average. Stop complaining

blfUvZ8YbuMar 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

WTF? No, both Xer and cass are way worse. Sej is overnerf. Almost everyone thought that she had been overnerfed during cinderhulk meta. Those nerfs have remained intact even after cinderhulk nerf, and only now is she getting compensation.

Do you even see the posts complaining about shyv nerfs? They are halving her damage. She won't be Op

Azir has 49.7%WR in plat+ranked That's basically 50/50. Cass has a 45%WR.

Yorick maybe. "Maybe". When was the last time you saw him? How about ? Nunu's winrate is abysmal. Rumble, Viktor... and so on. WW is low, but he's linear, so Plat+ players should be able to outplay him Azir is 108th out of the 193 champ+positions listed on champion.gg. That's average. Stop complaining

No.Seju is strong now.Sej didn't take overnerf.Also Azir had lowest win rate two months ago.

Because Azir buggy.So 49.7 win rate.

You follow news.

Seju 51% win rate and overnerf?

Hahahaha.Go away!

Troll for TrumpMar 15, 20161 votes

Seju isn't strong now. Sej got overnerfed. She had the lowest winrate at (insert time) here. Almost every champ had a low winrate at sometime. Yesterday(or 2 days ago) Lee Sin was in the bottom 5 winrates. It's an anomaly.

Proof of Azir having lowest WR? Yes Azir is buggy. That doesn't mean he sucks, and Riot is fixing them. He's fine. The bugs don't make his winrate randomly suck, or everything with bugs in it would suck. Like the Rengar bugs a while back. He had them but he wasn't crp.

git gud.

Hahahahahahaha you didn't address any of my points. Go away.

blfUvZ8YbuMar 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Seju isn't strong now. Sej got overnerfed. She had the lowest winrate at (insert time) here. Almost every champ had a low winrate at sometime. Yesterday(or 2 days ago) Lee Sin was in the bottom 5 winrates. It's an anomaly.

Proof of Azir having lowest WR? Yes Azir is buggy. That doesn't mean he sucks, and Riot is fixing them. He's fine. The bugs don't make his winrate randomly suck, or everything with bugs in it would suck. Like the Rengar bugs a while back. He had them but he wasn't crp.

git gud.

Hahahahahahaha you didn't address any of my points. Go away.

You're crying and salty.Because you don't have op champion, free elo champion.

Hahaha.Even 52% win rate.Very high.

Troll for TrumpMar 15, 20161 votes

Im saying Azir isn't underpowered, not saying he's OVERpowered. so... that doesn't make sense.

Please don't type in broken english.

52% winrate isn't very high.

blfUvZ8YbuMar 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Im saying Azir isn't underpowered, not saying he's OVERpowered. so... that doesn't make sense.

Please don't type in broken english.

52% winrate isn't very high.

But Seju is op.Am I right?

52% win rate is very high.Especially for Seju.