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Miss Fortune vs The World/Corki/Kog'Maw/Ezreal.

Destaice··5 votes·1,190 views

Let's just start off to getting to the heart of this particular discussion. Miss Fortune's awkward kid. The way it works in scaling in damage type and why it just isn't very good. Where as she might be compared to champions who also share magic damage strong kits who are good.

Why is it that Miss Fortune's kit just doesn't work? It's due to it lacking 2 things that the others have. Burst damage and poke damage.

Take a look at any of the other 3 champions (Corki, Kog'Maw, Ezreal). They build AD and their magic damage components can be used to poke down their opponents. Or if they get fed can still be used as burst. And if they build AP they trade that auto attack damage for incredible burst damage.

But why doesn't Miss Fortune have this?

Her only real poke is in her Q. Which is such an awkward ability and low in range. Corki and Kog'Maw can poke you with their ults at incredibly safe differences. Ezreal's long range Q/W leave him poking for days. And Corki/Ezreal have those escapes to boot. Miss Fortune's Q range is just 100 above her already low auto attack range. Leaving her unable to safely poke.

What about Make It Rain for AP Miss Fortune? It would work, except for three things. It has a long cooldown. It does damage over time. And it requires your opponent to stand within a specific area. This plays back into burst damage.

Miss Fortune's only real burst is her R or her E/R combo in Mage Fortune. But then lays the problem that once again, your enemy has to be standing in this one specific area for it to work. Unless your team is made out of lockdown your "burst" can be canceled simply by the presence of mobility creep.

AP Ezreal and Kog'Maw have made some fame for their burst and even Corki can be nasty to deal with once he's got his build going. They instantly burst their enemies down, not pray their enemy stands still for 3 seconds. It overall leads to a weak and gimmicky build for both AD and AP Miss Fortune.

And lastly, I want to talk about her W. This "building on magic damage." Let's just get one thing straight. This is useless on AP MF. It has no base amount anymore. Simply 6% of your AD per stack. While you do have magic pen it wont actually do any damage to matter. And while it seems nice for mixed damage on AD MF. Once your enemy gets magic resist this damage becomes completely ignorable.

But what about Kog'Maw? His W is fairly similar, yet incredibly better. First, it scales off AP. So regardless of build path this is going to be good. Secondly, it does health percentage damage. So even if your opponent does get magic resist they're still going to be feeling some effect. And lastly, it increases his range. Kog'Maw increases his attack range allows him to get off consistent damage at a safer distance. Where as Miss Fortune has to get into engage range of her enemies just to land a single auto.

Miss Fortune is simply outclassed. Her mediocre kit and illogical scalings leave her as a sham of a champion. She doesn't have the scaling of an AD carry and she doesn't have the poke or burst damage of an AP carry. She's overall weak.

I can't wait to see what changes they have in store for her. No more gimmicks Riot. It's time to face the wrath of the bounty hunter. Not the tickle of the Inconsistent Damages.

14 Comments

A Miss Fortune2 votes

Miss Fortune having low damage? She actually has one of the highest damage outputs for all ADCs, including versus Kalista and Vayne if I remember correctly. Her entire kit besides her passive is just damage.

Take a look at any of the other 3 champions (Corki, Kog'Maw, Ezreal). They build AD and their magic damage components can be used to poke down their opponents. Or if they get fed can still be used as burst. And if they build AP they trade that auto attack damage for incredible burst damage.

Miss Fortune isn't a bursty champion, and I wouldn't really say that Corki, Kog, or Ezreal are either. Kog is a late game hypercarry, and Ezreal and Corki are poke/mid game champs. They don't have any more burst than MF does.

All of these champions build AD to have Magic damage, but I don't see the issue with Miss Fortune being apart of them? People complain about her mixed scaling/damage, yet Kog'Maw can have only one AD ratio which is outmatched by It's AP ratio on his entire kit, which ALL does magic damage aside from his passive. Oh and Corki does so much magic damage that Sorcerer's is the most bought boots on him too. I see no issue with MF having mixed scaling/damage.

Her only real poke is in her Q. Which is such an awkward ability and low in range. Corki and Kog'Maw can poke you with their ults at incredibly safe differences. Ezreal's long range Q/W leave him poking for days. And Corki/Ezreal have those escapes to boot. Miss Fortune's Q range is just 100 above her already low auto attack range. Leaving her unable to safely poke

Her Q outranges almost all ADCs, chunks people for 1/3 of their health with nothing but a BF sword on an extremely low cooldown and non-existent mana cost, AND also is an auto attack reset. Also I don't see the comparison with Kog and Corki. Kog's poke is pretty garbage early game with a really high mana cost, and Corki doesn't even have his poke until some time into the game since It's his "ultimate".

Miss Fortune is simply outclassed. Her mediocre kit and illogical scalings leave her as a sham of a champion. She doesn't have the scaling of an AD carry and she doesn't have the poke or burst damage of an AP carry. She's overall weak.

Kind of funny because I think her ult has the highest AD ratio in the game and she has significantly higher AD ratios on her abilities in comparison to every champion you compared her too.

Destaice2 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Miss Fortune,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2jZvHH6Q,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-07T01:13:59.664+0000)

Miss Fortune having low damage? She actually has one of the highest damage outputs for all ADCs, including versus Kalista and Vayne if I remember correctly. Her entire kit besides her passive is just damage.

Damage only matters if you get it where it counts. Champions that have a lot of AoE or in lane poke tend to get the highest damage per game. But that doesn't actually mean they dealt damage when it needed to happen.

Miss Fortune isn't a bursty champion, and I wouldn't really say that Corki, Kog, or Ezreal are either. Kog is a late game hypercarry, and Ezreal and Corki are poke/mid game champs. They don't have any more burst than MF does.

Missed the point here by a landslide. I said they get burst damage when building AP. And that they can viably built as either mages or AD carries. Miss Fortune lacks that.

All of these champions build AD to have Magic damage, but I don't see the issue with Miss Fortune being apart of them? People complain about her mixed scaling/damage, yet Kog'Maw can have only one AD ratio which is outmatched by It's AP ratio on his entire kit, which ALL does magic damage aside from his passive. Oh and Corki does so much magic damage that Sorcerer's is the most bought boots on him too. I see no issue with MF having mixed scaling/damage.

They have GOOD magic damage abilities. Kog'Maw has 3 burst tools, 2 being AoE. Ezreal has long ranged poke and instakill potential. Corki has constant rocket poke and good AoE damage on his Q. Kog'Maw's Q lowers resistances of his enemies allowed him to deal even more damage. His W does health percentage damage instead of a small amount of magic damage per hit.

Her Q outranges almost all ADCs, chunks people for 1/3 of their health with nothing but a BF sword on an extremely low cooldown and non-existent mana cost, AND also is an auto attack reset. Also I don't see the comparison with Kog and Corki. Kog's poke is pretty garbage early game with a really high mana cost, and Corki doesn't even have his poke until some time into the game since It's his "ultimate".

The first hit is 610. And it's the second hit that does damage. But the ability is consistent and RNGed. It doesn't even prioritize champions. Have you to hope your enemy is within a small cone behind your first target and then pray it hits them. If you just his them with the first Q then it does just regular auto attack damage. AD Kog'Maw's poke is in his auto attacks from his W. And "some time into the game" is about 5-6 minutes in. And even then Corki can still outpoke miss fortune with his Q alone.

Kind of funny because I think her ult has the highest AD ratio in the game and she has significantly higher AD ratios on her abilities in comparison to every champion you compared her too.

Her ult doesn't even scale off AD. It scales off magic damage but does physical. Kind of funny that you're arguing for a champion but don't really know much of anything about her kit.

Fiveofswords2 votes

dude...you are wrong. first off her ult scales 48% ad plus 20% ap. its a mix. kog maws ult is also like that. its scales more off ad than ap, and does physical damage (which means last whisper counts) second, both hits in her q do damage. the second jsut does a bit more. corki and kog pawn do have better poke damage, but if you want a poke damage champion you should be playing something like lux and forget all about adc. thats not the job of adc.

Bondage Bunnyboy1 votes

{quoted}

dude...you are wrong. first off her ult scales 48% ad plus 20% ap. its a mix. kog maws ult is also like that. its scales more off ad than ap, and does physical damage (which means last whisper counts) second, both hits in her q do damage. the second jsut does a bit more. corki and kog pawn do have better poke damage, but if you want a poke damage champion you should be playing something like lux and forget all about adc. thats not the job of adc.

Her ult scales off attack damage and ability power, but only the magic damage is increased by her attack damage stat. Last whisper does not penetrate beyond the base damage, and is therefore made ineffective for her ult.

And yes, I know exactly how her Q works.

ADCs need specific advantages throughout the game over each other or they will end up becoming either too strong or too weak all the time, like Lucian, Graves and Miss Fortune.

Ashe/Sivir have their ults. Frozen Mallet and a global stun, Talisman and Banshee's Veil.

Jinx has everything an ADC could want except reliable self defense and is not too strong early on except in certain matchups.

Draven's a mega snowballer, pretty unstoppable if he abuses his early game and gets ahead enough (but is still fairly vulnerable to assassins).

Vayne needs to get off her 550 range damage before taking any, which may or may not be easy depending on the comps.

Miss Fortune doesn't have something specific that she excels in. She just has too many weaknesses and isn't compensated enough like Jinx is.

A Miss Fortune1 votes

Miss Fortune is most likely considered bad because she doesn't have an identity aside from her early game. Miss Fortune can do a lot but she doesn't do it the best, while she can do it, she's usually outclassed while doing it. Such as her dueling, she can duel better than Twitch for example, but she will never outduel Vayne. She can teamfight significantly better than Vayne, but she probably won't have a stronger teamfight than Twitch. She just does so much and none of it really is the best. I think It's interesting to have an ADC as versatile as her's but I think most people don't like her in this state since she doesn't have a really defined strength aside from her powerful early game, which all ADC lane bullies including Miss Fortune have had nerfs throughout the history and they've clearly fallen out of power anyways.

I'm pretty sure Miss Fortune has two identities. Her early game easily being the strongest of all ADCs. Not only does she have the ability to very easily poke you down, but unlike Caitlyn she can easily all in you since unlike Caitlyn she has real auto attack steroids. Her Q active, W passive, and her W active lets her outtrade pretty much anybody early game. Miss Fortune also has good follow up on ganks with her E and It's high range. I will say that Caitlyn is significantly more safe than Miss Fortune, but Miss Fortune will never lose lane if you play her correctly.

A Miss Fortune1 votes

Missed the point here by a landslide. I said they get burst damage when building AP. And that they can viably built as either mages or AD carries. Miss Fortune lacks that.

I don't think It's an issue that AP Miss Fortune is bad. AP Yasuo is bad, but it doesn't mean he should have AP ratios on his entire kit? AP MF is a fun off meta thing

They have GOOD magic damage abilities. Kog'Maw has 3 burst tools, 2 being AoE. Ezreal has long ranged poke and instakill potential. Corki has constant rocket poke and good AoE damage on his Q. Kog'Maw's Q lowers resistances of his enemies allowed him to deal even more damage. His W does health percentage damage instead of a small amount of magic damage per hit

You know I'm just gonna take a guess here, and it might be due to them all being caster ADCs who are all viale as APCs. Miss Fortune isn't. Her ultimate damage is amplified as a reward for auto attacking someone more, with her W passive, and her Q is an auto attack reset.

The first hit is 610. And it's the second hit that does damage. But the ability is consistent and RNGed. It doesn't even prioritize champions. Have you to hope your enemy is within a small cone behind your first target and then pray it hits them. If you just his them with the first Q then it does just regular auto attack damage. AD Kog'Maw's poke is in his auto attacks from his W. And "some time into the game" is about 5-6 minutes in. And even then Corki can still outpoke miss fortune with his Q alone.

I believe Miss Fortune's W passive allows it to prioritize champions. Even then It's so easy to hit it in lane. The enemy ADC either has really high auto attack range, or you just zone them off from farm and chunk their health under tower. Sure It's not the most reliable ability, but the damage it can do is insane for a point and click ability with pretty high range for most ADCs. Even if you do miss a lot of her Q's, It's on such a low cooldown and mana cost that it doesn't matter.

Her ult doesn't even scale off AD. It scales off magic damage but does physical. Kind of funny that you're arguing for a champion but don't really know much of anything about her kit.

Her ult scales off her W passive that scales off AD. I believe it can scale off 216% of her AD on top of it having a 1,000 base damage. Miss Fortune's ult does a lot of magic damage since before Miss Fortune could just rush an armor penetration build and blow up your entire team.

Well guys, Miss Fortune sucks because her point-and-click poke because It's too unreliable. Better buff it since it only does 400 damage, 8 minutes into the game with a 3 second cooldown. Oh and she's a terrible APC so we're now giving all champions AP ratios to make them viable. Welcome to League of Mages AP Yi.

Fiveofswords2 votes

so...miss fortune doesnt poke. so what? poke isnt always important. burst isnt supposed to be the point of adc. chasing isnt supposed to be the point of adc.She isnt outclassed. How many adc have a built in heal debuff? but thats irrelevant anyway. Ive played many adc including mf and i see absolutely nothing wrong with her. in fact i like how streamlined her kit is...no gimmicks. ultimately the adc is jsut about autoattacks...in late game if you arent autoattackign then you are simply doing less damage than you could. and mf does autoattacks splendid...decent range and with 2 of her abilities boosting her autoattacks (doubleup can be done between autoattacks which basically gives you a nice rapid succession of 3). What i do NOT see is how she has early laning pressure like the stereotype seems to pretend. thats not really true. lucian or caitlyn have much more early laning pressure. Shes great in late game, especially with a team that can do the cc and chase and stuff....if all you want is good autoattacks which is the main job of adc its difficult to imagine something better than mf.

Bondage Bunnyboy1 votes

{quoted}

so...miss fortune doesnt poke. so what? poke isnt always important. burst isnt supposed to be the point of adc. chasing isnt supposed to be the point of adc.She isnt outclassed. How many adc have a built in heal debuff? but thats irrelevant anyway. Ive played many adc including mf and i see absolutely nothing wrong with her. in fact i like how streamlined her kit is...no gimmicks. ultimately the adc is jsut about autoattacks...in late game if you arent autoattackign then you are simply doing less damage than you could. and mf does autoattacks splendid...decent range and with 2 of her abilities boosting her autoattacks (doubleup can be done between autoattacks which basically gives you a nice rapid succession of 3). What i do NOT see is how she has early laning pressure like the stereotype seems to pretend. thats not really true. lucian or caitlyn have much more early laning pressure. Shes great in late game, especially with a team that can do the cc and chase and stuff....if all you want is good autoattacks which is the main job of adc its difficult to imagine something better than mf.

I'm sorry but you haven't played her recently. She doesn't have a heal debuff.

She's not really better than someone like Jinx, Caitlyn, or even Draven in lategame because they have huge steroids and better ways to deal with assassins. Their autoattacks are stronger, whether from range or from pure damage boosts that DO benefit from the penetration ADCs build.

And Jinx/Draven have better ults. Fire and forget while consistently doing better damage. Not some bullshit ''stand here, hope they don't move for a while and you'll deal about as much as a Jinx rocket that landed on a half health target''.

If they're going to stick with the magic damage on her ult, it needs either a huge boost overall, or faster ramping up, or just change it to % health damage per W stack. Unless of course they decide to increase the base damage a ton so that she's rewarded all the time for using it well whether she's behind or not.

Fiveofswords2 votes

omg they did get rid of the heal debuff...wtf why would they do that? she used to be such a clever counterpick for a soraka support duo

NapaIm2 votes

Well, on the bright side, Riot is actually doing something to her ult to make it not fall off.

Honestly, MF's kit is kind of clunky, but my only complaints come from these 2 things.

Make it Rain is so trash and has only saved me...never. It has made sure I get away, but in a sitatiion where i need something to help me, it does no-thing. Remove the cast time please.

  1. Bullet Time does pretty much no late damage. Early game that shit hurts. Mid game it hurts. Late game it is used for safe waveclear when the opponent is pushing, assuming they have no Braum or Yasuo.

They are doing somehting about the latter, and for Make it Rain I want the cast time gone, and it to apply impure shots. The W stacks are actually pretty nice mid to late game. MF's autos always seem to feel like they deal more damage, and I think its the constant ramping magic damage.

I have no complaint with double up, other than it should be more consistant. I have played enough new MF to get the feel for it. All you need is one or 2 double ups post BF sword to win lane. It hurts that much.

Hexs Fortune1 votes

MF trying to kite: 325 base MS after any contact including minions MF in fed state: No real catch or dash or hard CC= requires help to get kills vs skilled opponents MF ult: Damage completely backloaded, roots her in place and falls off very hard

MF strength in laning is often marginalized due to the enemy support, enemy jungle ganks or fed enemy mid/ tops who are simply stronger at that phase of the game

I love MF and main her. But she feels very unrewarding compared to what other, more popular adc's are bringing to the table.

Baseball3b1 votes

I agree that her kit is very lacking, but I do like her abilities for the most part. She just needs the numbers and scalings changed. I'd like to see her passive changed so it's actually helpful, and see them zone in on making her E useful, and her R a viable late game spell (easiest way is to just give it an AD ratio that does magic damage).

Bondage Bunnyboy1 votes

{quoted}

I agree that her kit is very lacking, but I do like her abilities for the most part. She just needs the numbers and scalings changed. I'd like to see her passive changed so it's actually helpful, and see them zone in on making her E useful, and her R a viable late game spell (easiest way is to just give it an AD ratio that does magic damage).

It already has an AD ratio that gives it magic damage... >.<

It doesn't matter right now though. We just need to wait a few months until we can see what they're doing to her ult, and hopefully they'll take our feedback.

Baseball3b1 votes

Sorry, wrote that late last night. What I meant was that her R is very lacking once mid/late game comes around and could do with higher scalings

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