It's the same cancerous champs over and over

Purpl3Jungl3··31 votes·4,029 views

Riven LeeSin Darius Khazix Rengar Shaco

these are fine examples of what I mean. They continue to pop up in every game, just to prove they're broken; all while given the royal treatment by riot. For example, we asked for riven nerfs. what do we get? Lethality, so riven can melt us even faster now, hooray.

They're balancing the game around pro plays & popular picks.

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

EDIT: LMAO k removed fiora and illaoi from that list because people are missing the point of this post.

79 Comments

Baby Ghoul17 votes

The only one I have a huge problem with is LeeSin . I cannot stand seeing him in my games and he's in almost all of them. He's such an annoying champion and I'm sick of seeing him. Does everyone constantly have to play him? Same with Jhin .

Khazix with item 3814 is almost as frustrating, but I think that has more to do with the item than him. There is no counterplay involved when he completes that item.

Riven Fiora and Illaoi are very dependent on the situation in my opinion. I would never ban them since I don't feel like their pick rate is high enough. I've seen more than my fair share fall flat on their faces in ranked as well. However when one does get fed it feels hopeless, especially if you don't have many escapes yourself.

If a slightly fed Riven is charging in, you just have to pray you have flash up. This is especially true for most ADCs and Supports. If you don't, then you're just dead before a teammate can do anything.

Velzard of Koz6 votes

LeeSin I cannot stand seeing him in my games

Well at least he can't see you :^) Wait, wrong boards...

AgeOfTheMage5 votes

and fiora.... well...... True, she can be strong, but thats ahead, she does take skill though.

Awesomedude88882 votes

Does everyone constantly have to play him? Same with Jhin.

Well if Riot can make Crit/AA-based ADCs viable again then he would not be in every single game.

Snowplosion5 votes

Jhin has a hard time not being viable because his kit allows him to be so universal. Even if Crit ADC's made a comeback he will still be popular and strong.

Awesomedude88882 votes

Sure, he'll always be viable, but when he gets outclassed by crit ADCs you won't be seeing him every game. He might still see some play, that I'll agree with you, but OP is complaining about Jhin being played in every single game, which wouldn't be the case if he gets outclassed.

GayFluffyUnicorn2 votes

Yeah no. I'd rather have three seasons of jhin only than undodgeable 2k crits through the entire team. Hi twitch, jinx.

ExcusemeFellows2 votes

{quoted}

Yeah no. I'd rather have three seasons of jhin only than undodgeable 2k crits through the entire team. Hi twitch, jinx.

Hi Jhin(yes he can build crit).

Awesomedude88881 votes

Since when does either Twitch or Jinx actually crit for 2k? The only ADs that I've known that can crit for 2k are Cait, (maybe) Draven, and Jhin.

mintymentos11 votes

those champions just tend to pop off in the right person's hand in low elo but they can be easily beaten as well in low elo.

Dude i'm in low elo and enemy top could be playing sona and they pop off. Each game you enter, it's against you. That's how all games are, it's either you put the team on your back or lose. Even if some games aren't like that, that's how you should think.

The issue is riot doesn't balance around bad players. I'm looking at your match history. I see that one game you popped off with diana but a 42 min game with only 165cs? You got 20 kills so i imagine you secured kills. Looking at the rest of the match history you never broke even 200cs and a good portion of your games are running into the 40 min mark. and some of your rune choices aren't very optimal either why do you run 6ap seals? If you're against an ap mid go health if you're against an ad mid go armor seals. If you want extra juice then go per level ap glyphs but never sacrifice your defensive seals for laning.

The issue isn't these meta champions you're complaining about, it's you my dude. You need to work to improve your cs, your item build choices, your rune choices and even possibly your masteries. Do you read masteries? Sometimes I won't go off a build i read but will switch them up depending on the lane im against or if i know that I am better than the other person. Always look at your own skill level, league is a game about knowledge and how you improve a set of skills to close games out anre based on your kdas, item builds, mastery choices, runes, cs (especially cs) you aren't good. Ultimately it's all game knowledge. shit even kills isn't important in league. point of the game is to push lanes to take turrets then inhibs to eventually reach nexus. Everything else is a tool for that.

Dessem5 votes

shit even kills isn't important in league

Yeah, this. As long as you break the Nexus, you could be 20/0/10 or 2/2/1, but if you broke all the towers and Nexus, you win. Kills are only valuable in terms of the window they offer to take objectives.

Render the opponent unwilling or incapable of defending their turrets and base.

xelaker1 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, this. As long as you break the Nexus, you could be 20/0/10 or 2/2/1, but if you broke all the towers and Nexus, you win. Kills are only valuable in terms of the window they offer to take objectives.

Render the opponent unwilling or incapable of defending their turrets and base.

but the 20/0 is gonna stop the 2/2 lol

Big Lincoln8 votes

lol, illaoi is OP now? xd

3TWarrior5 votes

well, she can do almost 3000 damage in just one rotation of her kit at level 18 without items

Joxcab2 votes

No, she can't. And if you died to her, you are bad.

3TWarrior2 votes

I didn't say most players won't avoid her, I said it's possible, especially if she can surprise her opponents.

here are her numbers

up to 45% max hp if one E lands, you can then summon 2 tentacles against one champ using ult 350 from ult W, auto (or inverse as it has been a while since I have been able to play), 290 + 8% of target's max hp 2 tentacle attacks possible at twice normals swing speed, 795 if both tentacles hit Q for 397

this is the 2nd worst possible setup for an experienced illaoi and the total is 1542 + 8% max hp(2000 = 160) + 45% of all damage done to the spirit (which if the target does not run exclusively can be the same done to the target), this comes to 1542 * 1.45 = 2235

potentially 2395 damage from a situation she was not designed for, now lets see what happens when she hits all 5 opponents

up to 45% max hp 350 from ult auto attacks for 290 + 8% of target's hp 6 tentacles (potential for 7 if one is already spawned) for 2382 or 2779 if there are 7 Q for 397

this comes to 3579 to 3976 + up to 45% max hp

by the way, this is ONE...I REPEAT, ONE ROTATION

you can add in truckloads more with her W being on low cooldown, Q coming off cooldown, sunfire cape, auto attacks thrown in with iceborne gauntlet, dead man's plate, additional tentacles spawned by the player becoming a vessel, sterak's gauge raising her base AD, even titanic hydra if you want

by adding in those, you come to 100 from dead man's plate, 344 from sunfire cape, a 25% increase to base AD from sterak's that can increase to 50% if she takes at least 400 damage(i'll factor that in when finished with the rest), all base AD from icebourne ( so 181 to 217), titanic hydra adding at least 160 + 10% of illaoi's max health)

not to mention the stupidly large bonus she gets from her W being off cooldown

in that 8 seconds, if handled perfectly and not stunlocked, she can do up to depending upon whether you get cooldown reduction boots or not as well as other factors

that's 12,275 damage to a single target and about 1000 to 2000 less to other opponents without the keystone mastery and without factoring in sterak's completely(it would actually be much higher if I added its number into everything but I chose to just use it in the auto attacks) and without any pure AD items

I'd say a minimal value of 2395 damage on a single target in a fairly inexperienced player's hands is pretty good and if her opponents make the wrong mistake, a flash ult engage from the bush can completely end a teamfight or baron push or dragon...etc etc

there are variables depending upon which tentacles strike the other team members, but she has the highest base damage capability in the game

Joxcab1 votes

They're all bad and deserve to die if they stay in that short of a range and don't just walk out of her range or CC her or kite her or use percent armor pen or Grievous Wounds (Executioner's or Morello's).

Those scenarios are unrealistic. She also has no way to keep anyone inside her zone so it doesn't matter. And armor never magically disappears. It reduces all of her damage.

Her E is also from current health, not max health. The only way it'd be 45% max is if they were full health. Only her W is max health, and that's only up to 5% base.

It doesn't matter if she surprises a group. It's laughably easy to just walk out.

Also, tentacles do less damage if they hit on recently hit targets.

3TWarrior1 votes

oh, yes, thank you for reminding me of the last part but the damage is still quite respectable for no offensive items

Joxcab1 votes

Yes because they're a juggernaut with no mobility meant to build tanky and still output large damage in AoE to anyone dumb enough to stay in their extremely short range.

Big Lincoln3 votes

and she has 3 spells with long cast animations to do it

possibly the most telegraphed champion in the game that isn't volibear or garen, they shouldn't do a lot of damage? xd

CasterGilgamesh1 votes

is that counting armor on tanks or is she doing true damage now :D

GayFluffyUnicorn2 votes

She's the same cancerous design as every juggernaut. Counterplay is "don't fight them". Though illaoi is more fair because she atleast needs to hit her E. Other than that give her one or two kills and you will need to 1v4 her to kill her.

Big Lincoln2 votes

the counterplay is to dodge her ridiculously telegraphed abilities and use displacements to cancel her E and W

stop whining about the fairest class in the game

Joxcab7 votes

Why is Illaoi in that list?

GULAG 4 U3 votes

Op is b5 lol

What do you think

THE RlVER KlNG6 votes

Illaoi isn't broken just unfun to play against, otherwise, yes

Touch My Box5 votes

Shaco isn't a riot favorite?

He is constantly nerfed. I think he has received one proper buff in his lifetime, and most junglers received the same buff. He has constantly had issues with his kit and/or extensions.. TLD most recently, but the clone/box AI is fucking garbage.

macromite5 votes

welcome to league of legends, a game where instead of quickly dealing with the mobility and damage issue by reducing it, they let it fester into a problem that you couldn't even amputate at this point, even though clearly riot has no problem cutting anything that they don't like. like old poppy. and aatrox. and old yorick. and the concept of buffing auras.

Thilmer1 votes

{quoted}

welcome to league of legends, a game where instead of quickly dealing with the mobility and damage issue by reducing it, they let it fester into a problem that you couldn't even amputate at this point, even though clearly riot has no problem cutting anything that they don't like. like old poppy. and aatrox. and old yorick. and the concept of buffing auras.

Mobility is probably the strongest thing in a champions skillset, yet we see champions with 3 dashes and incredibly high damage (and many of them are not even assasins) while other champs have 0 mobility (and some of them are almost unplayable, or so difficult and underpowered tan even mastering them is not worth the effort).

Champions like Lee Sin, Yasuo, Riven or Camille will be a problem forever because of this.

LordSirChipmunk4 votes

I honestly think that Fiora doesn't belong on the list. As a person who has played a fair amount of her, there's a heck of a lot of counterplay that you can use to outplay her. A good portion of the time, fighting against her is a skill matchup. The trick to playing against her is baiting her Riposte out early and utilizing the vital resets. Also, there are certain champions who go up against her pretty well early on in the early game.

Vesemir5 votes

Shhh you are not allowed to use brain in forums. These are the people who walks up to Fiora with their vital facing her over and over again and come here crying about it.

3TWarrior4 votes

yeah, but then again, the only counterplay advice most people can give is to stick to a wall of any sort, whether it's turret or in-game wall. If you give the fiora any opportunity (which happens a lot in top lane), she can pop two vitals then flash auto Q to pop all 4 for a pretty much guaranteed kill

Aptest1 votes

question to you, dear sir,

how do I, as another player who is not necessarily playing a skirmisher, make you, as a fiora player, to burn riposte incorrectly ?

is it something that I can force out of you, or is it you making an error?

LordSirChipmunk2 votes

Baiting out the Riposte is something that anybody with crowd control can do by simply walking up as if you're going to attack. Indeed, it is an error on the part of the Fiora playing it. Like I said before, Fiora is entirely a skill matchup between the two players almost all of the time.

Anags2 votes

Fiora is really only held back by their own skill. Most of her counterplay involves being able to disengage her. Her using riposte at the wrong time isn't counterplay.

You are basically just waiting for her to make a mistake and then you have to capitalize on that mistake.

Not saying she is broken. Just that she has more options and potential for outplay than a lot of other champs.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

{quoted}

Fiora is really only held back by their own skill. Most of her counterplay involves being able to disengage her. Her using riposte at the wrong time isn't counterplay.

You are basically just waiting for her to make a mistake and then you have to capitalize on that mistake.

Not saying she is broken. Just that she has more options and potential for outplay than a lot of other champs.

Mind games are 100% counterplay, no idea what you're talking about. You can easily force the mistake or simply hit her with something nearly instantaneous. Example, Pantheon.

Vesemir4 votes

Lol... Fiora and Illaoi sure are cancerous right? I bet you are an adc main who tries to 1v1 those champs and come here crying about it. Never seen a problematic Fiora, Illaoi or Shaco. Not to mention their pick rates are low. And requires to know what you are doing to be effective. Those champs you mention only shine in right hands.

Dusk Mane Rengar3 votes

For example, we asked for riven nerfs. what do we get? Lethality, so riven can melt us even faster now, hooray.

They're balancing the game around pro plays & popular picks.

Game should balanced around Diamond/Challenger elo not around boards elo.

QuickenedBlade3 votes

Jhin Varus MissFortune Thresh Janna for the bottom lane Quinn Pantheon RivenMaokai Fiora for top lane Leblanc Talon Zed Ekko for mid lane Khazix Rengar Hecarim LeeSinShaco for the jungle

much variety such wow

Thilmer1 votes

{quoted}

Jhin Varus MissFortune Thresh Janna for the bottom lane Quinn Pantheon RivenMaokai Fiora for top lane Leblanc Talon Zed Ekko for mid lane Khazix Rengar Hecarim LeeSinShaco for the jungle

much variety such wow

I swear there are less than 30 champs in the meta rigth now. Less variety metagame I have seen.

WoonStruck3 votes

######Notice how every one is AD

Crimzyn2 votes

The problem with trying to balance 150+ champs is that there will never really be a true balance. If you think of it this way, there will always be a level of power or range from the bottom of the 150 list to the top...

No way they can all be equal... sadly... however the diversity is what Riot is going for which is great! I know this also means that there will be top picks, which is your point, I get that... but no matter what game you play this will always be the case. Also there are so many factors that come into play when deciding if a champ are broken or cancer including how their abilities are played/abused and what match ups there are in the game.

MuffledGarbage1 votes

There would be a way that everyone could be VIABLE though

and that appears to be what the OP is talking about.

Of course LeeSin will always be a better jungler than Ivern because he has too many tools. When riot reworks LeeSin then that's when Ivern by comparison becomes better.

And riot now all the tank junglersAmumu Chogath Maokai Skarner Zac have (in comparison to LeeSin ) extremely slow clears.

However whenLeeSin's rework comes out those junglers will be "better" because of lee being (possibly) worse

EDIT:

I forgot to say what all that meant in retrospect.

So in retrospect that means that until we can give all the tank junglers a way to keep up with the super fast clearing junglers then there is almost no way to keep tank junglers as VIABLE as the bruiser junglers(Vi Hecarim Pantheon LeeSin Graves Fiora Evelynn Jax Kled )

ExcusemeFellows1 votes

{quoted} When riot reworks LeeSin then that's when Ivern by comparison becomes better.

Your first mistake was thinking that Riot will hit Lee with a rework, your second mistake was that thinking that the rework(if they do choose to rework Lee)(how do I do the soonTM thing?) will make Lee bad...

MuffledGarbage1 votes

Riot has talked about reworking lee in the future. Sometime after the irelia rework is what rioters stated.

I didn't say that the rework would make him bad, I said the rework will make him POSSIBLY worse. That infers that he will be worse than what he is now but still viable to use in all levels of play.

Remember that I talked about making all champs VIABLE...so in my ideal scenario every champion is viable to use in most levels of play.

Take for example MasterYi versus Jax in the jungle...

If yi gains the buffs to become as viable in LCS play then he'll be almost unstoppable in your average run-of-the-mill game.

However if Jax were to receive buffs making him viable in the LCS then, due to the 20-minute game meta we are in, the buff would be more widely accepted .

ExcusemeFellows2 votes

{quoted}

Riot has talked about reworking lee in the future. Sometime after the irelia rework is what rioters stated.

I didn't say that the rework would make him bad, I said the rework will make him POSSIBLY worse. That infers that he will be worse than what he is now but still viable to use in all levels of play.

Remember that I talked about making all champs VIABLE...so in my ideal scenario every champion is viable to use in most levels of play.

Take for example MasterYi versus Jax in the jungle...

If yi gains the buffs to become as viable in LCS play then he'll be almost unstoppable in your average run-of-the-mill game.

However if Jax were to receive buffs making him viable in the LCS then, due to the 20-minute game meta we are in, the buff would be more widely accepted .

I see, fair enough.

JhamSleaz2 votes

Kinda annoying to see Shaco. He actually had to play quite safe being so squishy. Going full dmg shaco is dumb anyway. You have to actually think about things ahead of time with his boxes. None of the other champs listed actually out play their opponents.

Bouncemaster Zac2 votes

I agree with the sentiment but a couple of champs on the list I don't agree with. Shaco was right and proper broken right after his changes... and he got hard nerfed the next patch and now I hardly see him anymore. Illaoi is stupid but nobody plays her for some reason.

meowwow72 votes

the only thing cancerous about illaoi is your brain if you are trying to fight her under her ult

The Ecdysiast1 votes

You mean if you didn't get lucky and pick after her so you could actually pick someone fast enough to leave it. If the Illoai isn't a complete idiot.

More from Gameplay

More by Purpl3Jungl3