Oh hey, Rageblade is getting 25% attack speed

Rebonack··24 votes·2,036 views

Might actually be sort of okay as a first item for OnHit/Hybrid champs now.

35 Comments

Erockandroll9 votes

At least, you won't be be losing stats when building the full item.

I'm still a bit skeptical that Riot can actually keep the item in a good place. (I.E. not getting abused by certain champions.) But let's me hopeful, that his item can actually be reasonable in the meta.

Rebonack4 votes

{quoted}

At least, you won't be be losing stats when building the full item.

I'm still a bit skeptical that Riot can actually keep the item in a good place. (I.E. not getting abused by certain champions.) But let's me hopeful, that his item can actually be reasonable in the meta.

It'll always be more powerful on champs with strong OnHit effects in their kits and the ability to use all that stats it provides. I'm okay with it being niche because OnHit champs are quite a bit more specialized than Crit champs are. With Fervor becoming flat AD Rageblade will in turn require more investment on the user's part to be attractive.

Personally, I feel like Riot should try balancing the thing around having the Phantom Hit effect active at all times. Needing to ramp up for eight attacks is a pretty big deal. Imagine if Infinity Edge didn't kick in until you crit four times.

Erockandroll3 votes

{quoted}

It'll always be more powerful on champs with strong OnHit effects in their kits and the ability to use all that stats it provides. I'm okay with it being niche because OnHit champs are quite a bit more specialized than Crit champs are. With Fervor becoming flat AD Rageblade will in turn require more investment on the user's part to be attractive.

Personally, I feel like Riot should try balancing the thing around having the Phantom Hit effect active at all times. Needing to ramp up for eight attacks is a pretty big deal. Imagine if Infinity Edge didn't kick in until you crit four times.

six time, It use to be 8 stacks, but melee got 2 per hit. (That was actually on the old rendition) Which kinda shows that Riot still needs to relegate the difference between melee and ranged champions. If they had to, riot could change the phantom hit to like it was when it was on Devourer.

I think the ramp up time is needed to ensure it works as DPS and doesn't become incredibly bursty. (Just about any champ with an AA reset, would be to get it's on hit effects on 3 times in a short window.) But if that became a hindrance, we could change how the stacks fall off. (They could fall off one at a time, they could fall off faster for ranged, the possibilities are endless.)

Rebonack2 votes

{quoted}

six time, It use to be 8 stacks, but melee got 2 per hit. (That was actually on the old rendition) Which kinda shows that Riot still needs to relegate the difference between melee and ranged champions. If they had to, riot could change the phantom hit to like it was when it was on Devourer.

I think the ramp up time is needed to ensure it works as DPS and doesn't become incredibly bursty. (Just about any champ with an AA reset, would be to get it's on hit effects on 3 times in a short window.) But if that became a hindrance, we could change how the stacks fall off. (They could fall off one at a time, they could fall off faster for ranged, the possibilities are endless.)

Having the stacks fall off one at a time for melee would make it soooo much more attractive to a wider range of champions. Dropping off all at once is fine for Ranged since they're, y'know, Ranged.

kile1471 votes

I still remember building devourer on Vi because it immediately sped up your W procs. Gave her about as much burst as Warriors, but with obscene DPS.

Sightless664 votes

I kind of doubt it will be. Before this patch, the vast majority of on-hit champions looking to take it would also take Fervor. That gave a certain amount of increased value to the rageblade purchase that you couldn't get from other items. Despite that, rageblade was bad. Now that Fervor is switched to AD and Rageblade no longer benefits from having it, I think it's actually an even weaker early item than it was before. The attack speed doesn't seem nearly as important as the lost keystone synergy.

I think it's still complete trash on anyone who isn't a ranged, hybrid, on-hit champion without better options (read: Kayle). I'm not seeing how it could work out.

DeathBurst2 votes

It's funny how we were complaining about it just 2 days ago, and suddenly it's on PBE. Same thing for Garen :)

I'm a happy dude.

Sire Hippington2 votes

For ranged atleast. For melees it remains a pure splitpush-snowball option as they still have a really hard time getting/keeping stacks up outside of 1v1s, and alot of the items power still comes from the phantom hit at full stacks.

Rebonack7 votes

[{quoted}](name=Don Cingulum,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=27nFaEjA,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-11-09T18:14:21.593+0000)

For ranged atleast. For melees it remains a pure splitpush-snowball option as they still have a really hard time getting/keeping stacks up outside of 1v1s, and alot of the items power still comes from the phantom hit at full stacks.

If Riot balanced it around having Phantom Hit active at all times rather than requiring stacks I suspect it would make the thing far less awkward to balance. At that point you're just figuring out how much you have to nerf the stacking stats by.

Spoofghoul2 votes

They could simply make the phantom hit on every other attack for melee and every third for ranged

As an example, the amount of available phantom hits whether its every 2/3/5/100 attacks can be adjusted as they please really

in fact they should just make a new item out of it with flat stats and no stacking and immediate access to the phantom hit and possibly a more defensive approach to the stats so the melee on hit champs can better survive going balls deep But can't rely on just grabbing this item and gaining a ton of damage, it would need other items to scale with

Then turn rageblade into something else entirely

in fact rename it to raging hydra give it the cleave passive,

Unique passive cleave: apply on hit effects in cone which increases in size with every attack cone starts at 300 range and gains 50 range per stack max 8 stacks, stacks fall off at 1 a time every 1,5 seconds and drop twice as fast out of combat. (melee only)

69469238DEL11 votes

Where did you see this? Can I get a link fam?

Erockandroll1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Hunted Horror,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=27nFaEjA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-11-09T17:23:28.497+0000)

Where did you see this? Can I get a link fam?

http://www.surrenderat20.net/2016/11/118-pbe-update.html

Keep in mind, this is the PBE and not set in stone.

Meep Man1 votes

48% + 25% = 73%

That's the most attack speed in the game. Nice...

The Space Cowboy1 votes

item 3124 + item 3153 + item 1419 + item 3091 Warwick Shyvana Jax. I really missed sated devourer, not!

Rebonack2 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Space Cowboy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=27nFaEjA,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-11-09T19:35:48.684+0000)

item 3124 + item 3153 + item 1419 + item 3091 Warwick Shyvana Jax. I really missed sated devourer, not!

Yeah, I hate it when bad champions are good, too.

Troll for Trump1 votes

MasterYi

Mordepool1 votes

Does the passive work with Mordekaisers Empowered Q. No ??? Well I still won't buy it

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

no morde Q i believe is a one time auto buff which doesn't interact with it. he has low attack speed and he isn't an on hit champion. move on

SlashStriker1 votes

72% attack speed (i think that was the stacked number on the item) might be problem. Should get less AS on hit

Rebonack1 votes

{quoted}

72% attack speed (i think that was the stacked number on the item) might be problem. Should get less AS on hit

Why would that be a problem?

SlashStriker1 votes

{quoted}

Why would that be a problem?

because it goes from state of being underpowered to state that being overpowered and the passive bonus is actually quite alot the missing attack speed as base stat was the problem so they now need to nerf the stackable attack speed

its like going from one extreme to another

GULAG 4 U1 votes

Still shit.

I'm not going to wait for 6 attacks, i'd be better off going bruiser with raw damage.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

exactly. people don't understand. the thing is. the on hit damage on the item. is pathetic. 15. fucking 15 what the item costs 3.6K gold and you give us 15 on hit damage. there is no reason to buy this garbo. the only way am buying it if its less expensie and gives 2 stacks for melee

GULAG 4 U1 votes

It's funny how people think 15 onhit damage does shit lol, it's inexistent

Dolasaur1 votes

First item? It seems sort of expensive and sort of "eh". Early S6 Rageblade was cheap and was strong on its own. But with the new one, you're paying 800g for 10 AD, 5 on-hit, and the double-hit passive. So if you were going to rush it anyway because your stat synergy and on-hit are that good (Kayle), then it's a nice buff. But I think most are still going to want something else for a safer power spike (TF) or additional on-hits (BotRK) to make the combine cost worth it.

JVlasterQuinn1 votes

item 3153 Get buffed on PBE back to 8% Current health on-hit damage/ 40% attack speed item 3124 Get a bonus 25% attack speed base stat, making stacked attack speed at 73% attack speed caped. Do second on-hit effect every 2nd attack at 6 stacks and do basic 15 magic damage bonus . item 1419 Get a 20% damage reduction, combined with vision of the target, and a 4% of max health as physical damage/50% attack speed item 3091 Deal bonus 40 magic damage on-hit and steal 5 magic resist caped at 25, to a bonus of 50 Magic resist to the user/ 40% attack speed Include boots of whatever fit the best for your opponent, and 1 tanky Item. It result in a boost of 203% Bonus attack speed. It's huge when it come to on-hit effect. You deal 8% current heal+40 magic damage +15 magic damage+4% max health on first hit and 16% of current health+80 magic damage+30 magic damage + 8% of max health on second hit... It get a huge spike of damage in a short amount of time. Yes hard crowd control negate this, but on a team of low elo and people either burn their CC or have none( Happen frequently) This is a huge damage spike against squishy and even tankier one.

Veltox1 votes

Calm down Satan.

ArnoldSchwarzens1 votes

I think it only becomes really good once you already have stacked some on-hit for the phantom hit and attack speed from other items to stack it better.

On KogMaw for example you could get Tri-Force, the buffed BotRK and a Guinsoo's to top it off. With Zerker's you know have practically capped attack speed and you are an on-hit machine.

ArnoldSchwarzens1 votes

Also interesting to see if Guinsoo's on-hit Vayne that maxes her W will be able to outclass the current crit Q max version of her.

Rebonack1 votes

{quoted}

Also interesting to see if Guinsoo's on-hit Vayne that maxes her W will be able to outclass the current crit Q max version of her.

I really can't see this happening. Vayne doesn't care about the AP at all.

And really, when you can literally one-shot soft targets with Q while R is active then I don't think a 50% damage increase on her W after stacking Rageblade amounts to much.

Gosh Darn1 votes

Except the fervor changes are straight up nerfs for the champions who benefit from on-hit. Rageblade might be a decent buy but the champions who buy it were all nerfed pretty hard.

Rebonack1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Poopybunghole,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=27nFaEjA,comment-id=000d,timestamp=2016-11-10T05:28:34.426+0000)

Except the fervor changes are straight up nerfs for the champions who benefit from on-hit. Rageblade might be a decent buy but the champions who buy it were all nerfed pretty hard.

Probably why Riot is buffing Bork's OnHit and giving Rageblade an extra 25% attack speed. Two pretty major OnHit items are getting quite the leg up to make up for Fevor getting kicked in the nads. Not a terrible idea. If there isn't an OnHit Keystone then the OnHit items need to pick up the slack.

Gosh Darn1 votes

Yes but it's still a flat nerf. Rageblade and botrk were SO BAD that nobody was buying them, not even Vayne or Twitch. Rageblade and bork are still outshined by other strong items such as TF, nashors, and wits end.

All this change does is give us more item options while nerfing the hell out of on-hit champions.

Rebonack1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Poopybunghole,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=27nFaEjA,comment-id=000d00000000,timestamp=2016-11-10T17:11:16.350+0000)

Yes but it's still a flat nerf. Rageblade and botrk were SO BAD that nobody was buying them, not even Vayne or Twitch. Rageblade and bork are still outshined by other strong items such as TF, nashors, and wits end.

All this change does is give us more item options while nerfing the hell out of on-hit champions.

Part of the problem, I think, is that Riot doesn't seem to be very clear on what they want OnHit itemization to do. It's all over the place. Nashor's has a pretty obvious niche 'I'm an AP champ who wants my basic attacks to hurt more'. Okay, that's fine. What about everything else?

Wit's and Titanic Hydra both say 'I want to be a tanky auto-attacker'. BorK likewise is more suitable to mid-game domination since it doesn't really scale with anything. Hurricane has some OnHit interaction, but OnHit effects don't interact with crit at all so that seems like a weird match. And then of course there's Rageblade.

Personally, I feel like Wit's, Titanic, and BorK are the best identity for OnHit items. Mid-game powerhouse gear that provides sustained damage and defense for the user. OnHit damage shouldn't deal more DPS than Crit/AD does, but if Riot pushed OnHit gear toward bruiser itemization I think that would be a solid place for it.

Another issue is that most OnHit damage is physical and then we have Wit's eating MR. If all OnHit damage were magic that would drastically increase the usefulness of Wit's.

Bardful1 votes

I am actually a little sad about this. I liked how a level 2 item had different stats than it predecessor. It was a cool idea that could of been taken to other items. Maybe even help give a niche to a future item that would give a user the want to keep it level 2 and then transition it to 3 after more items. Hextech Revolver was similar but the ones it builds into all have activatables still, it is different than what it produces. Another one I was hoping for is negative stats like -20% attack speed for some reward.

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