Tanky Jungle Bummer

Stankbroker··2 votes·1,134 views

I really am not sure what can be done about this, but tanky junglers just don't seem to work very well in the new jungle. I play Lee Sin pretty exclusively this season because of his jungle sustain being exceptional when you use his kit well. One game, he got banned, J4 got picked by the other team, and I got forced into the jungle with my third jungle pick, Sejuani. There seems to be a common problem with picking a tanky jungler in solo queue... You're useless. If you get a lane thats having a bit of trouble from a bad matchup, maybe you can make a difference, but if your team is really struggling, and get 2 people to 30%, good luck getting those kills. On lee or J4 it would be no problem because they have some burst built in, but even WITH the recent buffs, sejuani, along with some of her other jungling tank friends, just feel so worthless if there's not somebody there to mop up off their plays. Now I don't know if I would have won this game on another champ, but tanky junglers I believe are WAY TOO DEPENDENT on teammates to function properly as damage carries, which isn't always going to happen. At least on Lee or J4 I can pick people off when they're low and get out. Sejuani has a great kit for getting out and helping other people get kills, but it seems like she, and many of the other tanky junglers just struggle too hard when people aren't taking advantage of your big plays. With one of the stated goals of the new jungle to make tanky junglers more viable, I think something things should be re-tuned in their favor. It would be nice if you could have that tanky teamfighting advantage AND also make some decent plays if your team is struggling, so YOU can get fed and carry, instead of having to rely almost entirely on teammates to bring the heat. I just see no reason to go sustain tank in solo queue. In ranked you must carry HARD, on 70% of your games to increase your rank. I find this virtually impossible without playing somebody who can mop up kills, and if needed, build tanky for the lategame to also fulfill that role decently. I do actually really like the new jungle, it's MUCH more interesting, but it seems like the same junglers that succeeded before continue to do so.

12 Comments

AikidoLawnNinja2 votes
  1. Your keyboard has an "ENTER" key which will create new paragraphs and generally make your posts easier to read. You should use it.

  2. You're complaining that it's too hard to do damage with tank junglers. Well, tank junglers are meant to be tanks, not damage dealers. If you want to deal damage, play a damage jungler.

Stankbroker3 votes

Man, could you turn the internet snark up any higher? You're logic is failing me here. Both lee and J4 are 'fighter' junglers, who can be tanks if they get fed and itemize as such. Both have the same play making potential as sejuani, but also can land kills for themselves. You're basically saying, well you're saying your hungry, the choices are pizza or lugnuts, eat pizza. The lugnuts are there for if you want to choke to death trying to eat, but there's no reason to question their existence. I'd take the time to paragraph out my sentences for you but I don't think you really care at all, you're just looking to feel good about yourself.

TehNACHO2 votes

I want to say it's largely because Juggernaut doesn't even help tanky Junglers much.

It does nothing to improve clear speed, it's a bad power spike item compared to Magus or Warrior and it's a bad scaling upgrade compared to Devourer, Tenacity helps fighters more than tanks (who also, coincidentally, don't tend to care about the last two problems I noted), it doesn't significantly improve sustain, and finally it doesn't bring any (proper) tank based utility anyway.

Magus, Warrior, and Devourer do all of this for their respective classes in at least some sort of way, while Juggernaut doesn't do any of this in any meaningful way.

Honestly, I miss the old (new?) Spirit of the Ancient Golem, especially the barbs thing. That helped clear speed and sustain in a way other classes couldn't abuse. The health stat was a scaling upgrade, meaning it can't be obnoxious early game (read: tower dive early game because tankiness lol), but it was stupendously useful late. And while you can argue that wards help everybody, at least (in my opinion) it actually brought that utility that tanks can utilize well, whereas Tenacity is an upgrade you'd more likely see on fighters than anybody else.

Stankbroker1 votes

I totally agree with you here! Great observations.

WooBeeWoo1 votes

I agree the updated Golem item was awesome and it did a lot for different champs. I was jungling Nasus when it came out (im actually not sure if this is true but) I think it scaled with his ult meaning I had strong ganks after only that item and like 60-80 stacks because I was hard to kill. It felt good to tank in that meta a little more but right now juggernaut is a joke.

Seth Lightheart1 votes

Meta shifts, it happens.

Stankbroker2 votes

And I'm allowed to point out shortfalls where I see them, thanks for taking the time to say something inane that doesn't lead to any viable conversation.

Seth Lightheart1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Don Keipunsch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=10WWcUlT,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2014-12-23T21:00:06.741+0000)

And I'm allowed to point out shortfalls where I see them, thanks for taking the time to say something inane that doesn't lead to any viable conversation.

Saying you are allowed to point out "shortfalls" in this conversation is like saying your height and weight... it has nothing to do with anything and does not make your argument any more valid.

Tank jungles are not strong not because of damage or clear times. They are not strong because the meta shifted away more away from assassins and to more of carries.

Edit: You get more tanky and they start to pump out WAY more damage.

Stankbroker1 votes

The meta shifting away from tanks and jungles is an abstract way of saying that you don't find them strong, while also choosing to disagree with my statement in favor of something ephemeral. Riot has stated that one of the new goals with the jungle was to make tanky junglers more viable, and I think for the short term they have failed. There's really nothing here to argue with, you just can't agree and I can't debate you because you and I are not making dissimilar arguments. But if you want to be contrary in a way that I can't really dispute, due to lack of content, that's fine, but I'm done hearing you out.

Seth Lightheart1 votes

That's fine, i'm not a huge fan of trying to discus League with silvers anyways.

Season 3 and 4 I was a Maokai and Nautilus main, so I know tank, and if they worked I would happily play them again. This is the bottom line, tanks are not weak. They are just as strong as they have ever been. The issue is rock, paper, scissors. Just because everyone is playing paper doesn't mean Riot needs to buff rock.

WooBeeWoo1 votes

A good post tanks especially in the jungle are totally worthless.

zliplus1 votes

Tanks are more about protecting your own carries than blowing up/diving/cleaning up enemies. That's why they're tanks and not fighters. Sejuani can peel for your own team longer and more persistently than Lee sin or J4. Yes, this means that you're a more support role and you depend on your team's carries to do the damage, but that's just how tanks work. Sejuani can also build AP and do pretty significant damage.

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