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[Blitzcrank and Morgana] Your thoughts on his grab and her stun/snare? Discussion and serious topic.

Nikushimi Zero··1 votes·1,143 views

ATTENTION! This is a discussion. While I think these are all very strong and overly OP I am not condemning them to the point I say change them (though I do suggest it). I am wanting to hear from the community on what they think about these two skills and champions and what their thoughts are on these two topics. Perhaps riot can even get in on these discussions. So, share with me your thoughts! Let the discussion begin!

In almost every game I play with a Blitz the grab is his main focus. The range. The damage (on AP builds). Everything. It is his focus for the players I see play him.

Seeing as this is his main feature it is suppose to be good, but is it too good? I have seen ADC's have their health shredded by an AP grab from a Blitz going from full health to 25% almost in one grab.

I have seen Blitz's pull champions out of turrets to way behind enemy lines. The range coupled with the damage and stun is deadly. His range 925. This range is almost as big as Caitlyn's E, and she is meant to have such a huge range. So, my question is why does this tanky behemoth have such a huge range when he is a tank and fighter? From my recollection no tank/fighter has a huge range move like that with ratios of 100% with the highest base damage being 300.

Is it because he's supposed to build tanky and ignore AP? You can build tank with AP. This makes him really strong and practically a mage rather than a pure tank. In ARAM especially. Being able to pull from BEHIND his turret AND grab someone outside the turrets range on the other side of the turret is ridiculous for a tank AND dealing upwards of 800-1000 on a hit (I've seen it done) makes it ridiculous.

Tell me your thoughts. Should they nerf it and reduce the range and damage, or just the range, or just the damage? Should they NOT nerf it and leave it as is? Tell me your thoughts on why. Thank you!

Morgana. We all know her best for her stun. Why? Because that thing is annoying when it hits you. Being unable to move while being assaulted by range and the enemy team is no fun. Usually, stuns and snares don't last too long unless they are ults....3s is the max of Morgana's stun. 3s is an Ashe ult. This, coupled with the high AP damage over time from her Tormented Soil and add onto that the damage from her team? Ouch.

Her stun (I call it that because you can't move. It is a snare cause you can attack, but you might as well be stunned for all the good that does you) deals 300 (+90% AP), bear in mind this is just 10% less than Blitzcranks grab, and she's a mage. He has a stronger ability than someone who uses AP. That's silly. Also bear in mind that this stun is weaker than her ult damage wise.

So tell me. Do you think her stun/snare is too long and should be nerfed or kept as it is? Please tell me your thoughts!

10 Comments

Abyssphere2 votes

Can we not say Morg has a "stun/snare". It's a snare, that's it. You clearly know it's a snare so why entertain the notion that it's "sort of a stun"?

Nikushimi Zero1 votes

Because a stun stops movement completely. A snare also stops movement, but allows attack. So it IS sorta of a stun. You can't move. Melee champions can't do anything to Morgana which is exactly why I consider it a stun anyways because the majority of champions who are hit by this can't even get close to Morgana.

So, to me anything that stops you in place is a stun. You can't move or do much of anything. Plus, it's easier to say stun or CC.

Getting upset over the technicality of it being a snare and not a stun because you can attack is mute to my point.

I had another person say it's a snare when I said stun. Stun is just so much easier to say and it stops you in place, unable to move. Might as well be a stun, but I digress. It's not that big of a deal, though for clarifications sake it is I guess. Shrugs

Abyssphere1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nikushimi Zero,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0yRkmvxZ,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-08-17T05:20:46.311+0000)

Because a stun stops movement completely. A snare also stops movement, but allows attack. So it IS sorta of a stun. You can't move. Melee champions can't do anything to Morgana which is exactly why I consider it a stun anyways because the majority of champions who are hit by this can't even get close to Morgana.

So, to me anything that stops you in place is a stun. You can't move or do much of anything. Plus, it's easier to say stun or CC.

Getting upset over the technicality of it being a snare and not a stun because you can attack is mute to my point.

I had another person say it's a snare when I said stun. Stun is just so much easier to say and it stops you in place, unable to move. Might as well be a stun, but I digress. It's not that big of a deal, though for clarifications sake it is I guess. Shrugs

"Because a stun stops movement completely. A snare also stops movement, but allows attack. So it IS sorta of a stun". This is backwards. A snare is sort of a stun in the same sense that a rocket is kind of a car, because rockets allow movement just like cars do. A stun snares you and silences you, a snare doesn't stun you. It snares you.

It's not a mute point because a lot of people are like you and genuinely muddle up whether Dark Binding is a stun or a snare, and a stun is a LOT more powerful than a snare so if you want to talk balance, people thinking Morg is a lot stronger than she really is will skew discussion massively.

Nikushimi Zero1 votes

It still is sort of a stun even if it isn't completely a stun, but that's just to me because you can't move.

I'll use snare, but getting upset over it won't get this discussion anywhere either.

Out of all the snares it is the strongest and most deadly of the snares. It has very high base damage and AP ratios as well as one of the longest durations in the game. This, coupled with tormented soil, NOT being able to move, AND getting attacked by an entire team or gank while only able to do one thing: attack.

You can use abilities, but those that require movement can't be used so you might as well just be silenced too and call it a stun. You can't use Yi's Q or R (Well you can, but it's useless), Irelia's abilities besides her W and R which she needs to be close to anyone to use her W, Jarvan's E->Q combo and his R, any champion dash and the summoner spell flash, Rek'Sai's tunneling to move, or anything to be able to move and counter the on coming attacks from her and the enemies on her team. You can't counter it within a 3s period of time, and will most likely end up dead if you're outnumbered.

Morgana alone is not much of a threat. I agree with this. However, if you're up against a Morgana in a team fight or a gank you are pretty much screwed if you're on the wrong end of that snare. Being unable to move as melee champion or squishy is harsh, and for it being as long as most ultimates is insane.

Varus's R is a root, the same as Morgana, and his is 1s shorter than her regular ability.

Most roots/snares take time to even take effect (Swains root) and only have 2s of duration on them.

Her instant hit 3s snare is stronger than any other root/snare in league. It is a skillshot, but one with a pretty decent hit box and a pretty low cooldown. This allows Morgana players to cast it, and even if they miss, just cast it again a short while later. I once saw a Morgana cast her snare/root within about 3s of casting the first. That's almost like saying "Hey, you just got out of my snare. Be snared again."

You can't deny how powerful and strong that snare is. I don't think the damage is bad (Like Blitzcranks grab which is still, imo, insane). I just think the duration needs to be reduced to at the most, 2s max, and at the least 1.5s. 3s changes a game real quick. Even being able to attack, if you're not in range of her or don't have the items/abilities you're going to be getting smashed hard while unable to move.

Mimy1 votes

As much as I hate blitzcranks...

I can't say they really need nerfs.. You can use morg to counter blitzcrank. I'm not sure who counter's morg? Oh yea.. most AD people... xD so perhaps supports who can make their carries do more for their money can counter a morg? Idk.. I don't see Morg too often.

Nikushimi Zero1 votes

Without getting fed or having the items Morg, with just her stun and almost little to no items, can turn an entire fight.

I once saw a morg just stun people left and right in an ARAM match once and only died like once. That means she only bought items...twice. At the start and when she died.

Being able to stun and turn the tide so easily is insane. Her stun duration is ultimate level. At the most it should stun for 2s. Not 3. 3s means 5 enemy teammates beating your face in while you TRY to out damage them and if you're teammates are competent....come in to save you before you die.

To me, I see no counters to the grab once grabbed nor to the stun once stunned. Sorry "Snared" for those who want to be technical.

PeachsProperty1 votes

AD blitz has no tankyness to survive poke if he misses the grab.

morgs stun? that is her R

her Q is a snare its powerful because its a skillshot. same with blitz. if u snag em with it, it hurts.

if irecall reading a post they think morg is in a good spot but may or may not change her passive.

Nikushimi Zero1 votes

Her passive isn't even that bad compared to her Q. Yes, I call it a stun/snare because while you can still attack you cannot move. I consider that being stunned.

In league logic a snare means you can't move, but can attack. Stun however means you can't move (from my perspective) and that is what it does to me.

They may be skillshots, yes, but they are incredibly powerful skillshots compared to other champions.

Blitz is a fighter and a tank. No one but teams without a tank, builds Blitz tanky anymore. They want to monopolize on that ratio and damage of the Q. Add that into a team fight and it's instant death for whoever you pull and almost a guaranteed death if the one you grabbed isn't a tank with high MR and health. No other fight has such a move except ultimates which Jarvan has his barricade which can be ulted out of, Malphite has his charge which he has to dive THEM, and as far as I know no other fighter/tank has such a strong ratio to their attacks such as Blitz does. Even Naut who has a pull like Blitz has it pull him towards the champion as well as the champion to him. This allows some counter play because Naut is pulled too.

Blitz is awesome. I like blitz....when he's on my side. His pull is strong and you can't deny that. Also, I've been grabbed when I have been outside its animation. Its hitbox is bigger than you might thing. Blitz's grab is his trademark and I don't think it needs to be removed, but simply tweaked. At the very least reduce his range to 700 at the least. Maybe even 650. Blitz current has no risk with his Grab. None. He either misses and nothing happens, or he grabs someone and pulls them to death either behind a turret or into his allies. Even a non tanky Blitz with no armor or magic resist may not be able to take much damage, BUT the damage he deals far outweighs that negative.

Out of all the champions with pulls his is by far the strongest and most deadly. Skill shots, if hit, should hurt, but out of all the skills shots (Besides ultimates) this hurts out of I'd say all of them. Varus's Q is second, but can easily be countered by many minions and tanky champions plus health and armor. Blitz can even rip through MR health tanks (My malphite with about 4000 health and about 100-200 MR got hit by an AP blitz grab and was dealt fair chunk, about 1/5th, of his health as damage. That hurts.). Couple that with his other skills and blitz hurts.

Now, Blitz is nowhere near OP. Never thought that. His grab is the only thing OP about him. Just a few tweaks is all I'm saying. At least make the ratio on that grab less because he IS supposed to be a fighter/tank. Not an AP bruiser, or am I wrong? If I am, I apologize.

I do appreciate the talking though! Thanks! ^_^

Crossette1 votes

3 seconds on Morgana's snare is stupid considering the range, width and hitbox.

rito pls

Nikushimi Zero1 votes

3s stun (Sorry "snare") on Morg is like an ashe ult. It's like a Varus ult, but stronger. Morg has the longest "Snare" out of any champion, and it's so powerful because of her Tormented Soil which does insane DPS with high AP.

Rito, both Morg and Blitz need to have these looked at.

The Ratio and range on blitz and duration on Morg.

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