Making Zoe Less Frustrating

iiGazeii··10 votes·4,302 views

Regardless of her current power level, Zoe is frustrating to play against, more so than other similar champions like Ahri. To me, Zoe feels like she could use a few buffs, but if the "fun police" or "cancer" aspects of her kit isn't addressed, then she can't really get meaningful buffs in the areas that she needs it. Zoe is my go-to midlaner, but even I can admit that she causes issues.

  1. Sleepy Trouble Bubble sniping people through walls, even if Zoe misses.

The first thing I'd like to address is Sleepy Trouble Bubble. Most immobile midlane mages have a form of CC for catching enemies out, and Zoe's even has a delay on it. The frustrating aspect of it is the extreme range it has that allows her to attack people unexpectedly and set up a kill, sometimes not even for herself. Zoe can even "miss" the skillshot, leaving a trap on the ground a screen away that applies the full effect to an enemy who steps on it. Even if they dodge the skillshot, they can get hit by the splat of it and get punished hard by Zoe.

To solve the first issue, give the Sleepy Trouble Bubble a sparkle effect on the terrain at its point of exit, similar to Kayn's Shadow Step. This change wouldn't reduce the range of Sleepy Trouble Bubble, but it would give enemies warning that its going to appear out of a wall so they have the opportunity to dodge it. Giving people the chance to interact with the ability more puts them more in control, so they can think "I should have noticed that spot on the wall sooner" rather than "Damn you CertainlyT for creating a champ with no counterplay".

To solve the second issue, **change the trap of Sleepy Trouble Bubble to be an AoE slowing zone **, rather than triggering the full effect. This is similar to the proposed (and scrapped) changes that were proposed a while back, but doesn't remove any cool particle effects from Zoe's kit. If Zoe does not land the skillshot directly, she doesn't get the sleep, period. She can't hurl it over walls and create a zone enemies can't walk through or get stunned. Instead, it would create a zone on the ground that slows everybody inside it, making it easier for Zoe to land Paddle Stars on enemies in the circle, to slow an enemy's engage through a choke point, or keep enemies from escaping her range.

  1. Spell Thief has problems. A lucky balloon lets her stomp her lane with a free Redemption or Ignite and she can spam out every summoner spell used in a teamfight with impunity.

I'm not gonna sugarcoat this one; Spell Thief is bull****. Against Zoe, it feels like you aren't allowed to use your Summoners or Zoe will use it right back. Playing as Zoe, it feels like so much power is tied up into the RNG drop from minions and sometimes, you don't get the right spell for what you need.

To fix it, make the drop table from balloons depend on level. What types of spells she gets from minions should depend either on the rank of Spell Thief or Zoe's overall level. Prevent Zoe from getting offensive choices like Ignite or Protobelt early on, but guarantee she gets defensive options like Barrier or Heal. This would help smooth out her terrible laning phase with more defensive options while still letting her make plays with balloons in the later game,

For the other issue, allow enemies to stand on Spell Shards to destroy them, similar to Zyra's seeds or Bard's shrines. This would allow people to prevent Zoe from picking up a shard by clicking on it and standing there. This would make her far less oppressive to lane against and give enemies a way to deny her from powerful spells. On the flip side, this would also allow Zoe to use Spell Shards as bait. Just like Draven telegraphs his position, a powerful Spell Shard would tempt the enemy to stand there, letting her line up a potentially deadly skillshot. She would have the power to zone enemies away from her Shards, just like enemies could zone her away from them.

These are not the only changes I want to see to Zoe. If just these changes went through, Zoe would overall be nerfed, and that's not what she needs. These nerfs tackle how frustrating it is to play against her, but should be compensated with buffs to the parts of her kit that feel fair, such as a buff to her Sleepy Trouble Bubble damage, a buff to her Paddle Star damage, or allowing Tear to stack off both casts of Q.

14 Comments

mack91127 votes

She has an appropriate amount of counter play in my opinion .

iiGazeii2 votes

I agree. However, that doesn't mean she isn't frustrating to play against. I would rather there be more counterplay for the most frustrating aspects of her kit (Sleepy Trouble Bubble snipes, RNG Ignites/Redemptions and multi-Flash plays) in exchange for more power in the parts of her kit that are fun to use, like Paddle Star and Portal Jump.

mack91123 votes

{quoted}

I agree. However, that doesn't mean she isn't frustrating to play against. I would rather there be more counterplay for the most frustrating aspects of her kit (Sleepy Trouble Bubble snipes, RNG Ignites/Redemptions and multi-Flash plays) in exchange for more power in the parts of her kit that are fun to use, like Paddle Star and Portal Jump.

I believe they where looking into removing the ground effect of the bubble which I support personally.

Spell this is Definitely a frustrating ability but I feel is kinda iconic of her kit but I feel it shouldnt drop redemptions.

iiGazeii1 votes

They were looking at that, yeah, but those changes were nowhere near ready and I think they scrapped them. A lot of people were butthurt about losing the particle effect on the ground. That's why in the changes I suggested above, the effect stays on the ground, but not as a trap, just a slowing zone.

Anyway, major changes to Zoe are on the backburner until after preseason.

TheSingularity3 votes

Remove summoner spells from her w. Easy fix. She still gets item actives so she still has plenty of tools

Rathar Dashing3 votes

Oh boy I sure would like getting Protobelt from every minion drop :3

TheSingularity1 votes

Still better giving you a flash when I flash. Some of these may be dead wrong so forgive me, but you could get one of item 3153 item 3814 item 3030 item 3146 item 3139 item 3190 item 2056 item 3143 item 3074 item 3107 item 3800 item 3048 item 3162 item 3905 item 3142 before you every lay your hands on a protobelt

PhantomSpirit1014 votes

Uhhhh as far as my experience goes on playing Zoe, you can only get item 3030 item 3152 item 3107 from the items you listed on minion drops.

vgamedude2 votes

The only thing thats frustrating is trying to play a champion as garbage as zoe.

Rathar Dashing2 votes

She's honestly not that bad after the recent buff. You just have to focus on landing skillshots instead of passive procs.

Hammermancer2 votes

What you dont love that sound effect every like.. 5 seconds? With the little song

DodooododoDoDo

DM For Rat Facts2 votes

My only issue with her W is that it does too much. Go ahead and read her W and then go back and read somebody like Garen's W. The difference is astonishing.

Anyways Zoe isn't too frustrating, it's not that hard to beat her in lane, there's a lot more oppressive mid picks out there.

DeracadaVenom1 votes

I agree with most of this, but the only thing i dont like is the making her trap a slow instead. Maybe make the sleep do 3/4ths more damage rather than double damage? Or make it do double damage but not true?

Spekkıo1 votes

The indicator suggestion for Bubble is mint. I can't think of a single reason why this shouldn't be implemented, actually brilliant.

As for the stun or the slow, people can debate over this for hours. I will say that having an AoE slow would probably be far more beneficial for wave clear later.

Regarding Spell, I think implementing the ability to destroy the shards is enough, at least to start with. I don't like the idea of making multiple changes to the same skill in the same patch because it almost always results in wild swings between oppressive and useless.

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