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I think the best example of a Demacian villain.

Ralanr··24 votes·3,712 views

Is someone who abuses the system for personal gain.

AKA: the corrupt Politician/Noble.

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/akamegakill/images/0/06/Honest_main.png/revision/latest?cb=20140930084451

Some of you anime lovers might recognize this chap as Prime Minister Honest (I don't know the Japanese name. Spoilers: his name is ironic). To give a brief summary of his character, he's pretty much the devil on the child emperor's shoulder that's disguised as an angel. He "helps" decide much of the actions that the empire he's in takes place, many of these being incredibly cruel actions to not just other countries (including messengers) but also actions that cause suffering in the general populace (increased taxes and such).

While the world is starving and people steal to feed their children, he'll show up to a trial eating a cake. An actual cake. He's a bit of a slob.

Why does he do this? Does he have a goal? Nope (at least last I checked). He just wants to keep his position and will kill anyone who threatens that (and have a lovely visit with their loved ones after). He doesn't want to rule, he's practically already doing it without any of the responsibilities.

Now I don't believe we should directly copy hear, but I feel this may be the best route for a Demacian villain to go. The other option is one of extremism, but we already have Kayle for that and her lore is meant to be morally ambiguous like Morgana.

We need someone who stands in the light of Demacia but shines only by the reflection of their status, who only cares about how Demacia benefits him/her. Somewhat of an opposite of Leblanc, Noxus's goto villain who hides in the shadows.

That's my idea anyway.

52 Comments

Doctor Jarvis9 votes

So...Lawful Evil? You want a Lawful Evil Demacian. That seems surprisingly do-able. People don't really think about how terrifying Lawful Evil can be. The guy that stays well within the letter of the law and just uses and abuses it to their own personal gain is way worse than some short-sighted asshole with an ax.

Ralanr1 votes

Yes. Lawful evil in a nutshell.

DragonShea1 votes

{quoted}

Yes. Lawful evil in a nutshell.

Yeah and I get the impression they are also tautological Templar as well. Jarvan 4 seems like he wise but at the same time, I think that he may been too much of a Demacian nationalist to use his wisdom well.

Big Lincoln6 votes

I think a Demacian higher-up who has a hyper-nationalistic point of view would be pretty nice. Not corrupt, but dangerous still. Has an interest in only the best fate for Demacia and nothing else; even the individual citizens are expendable to him if it means the country will prosper.

Funny Valentine would be a good example

Melledoneus1 votes

"Filthy Acts at a Reasonable Price."

Ralanr1 votes

Is that the non copyright name? Cause I thought it was "Dirty Deeds done cheap"?

Melledoneus1 votes

I love some of the non-copyright stand names.

Hierophant Emerald, Shining Diamond, Deadly Queen, Reverb, World 21, Show off, and the infamous Worse Company.

PermabannedGaren5 votes

Well I mean, Prime Minister Honest is probably the most textbook example of a mustache-swirling cartoon villain I can think of.

He has three character traits: being fat, being evil, and being unexpectedly competent (be it in matters of strategy or combat).

He is a very shallow character, and though a corrupt Demacian noble is a fine concept, I'd hope there would be more depth to them than that.

Ralanr2 votes

You're right that there is a lack of depth. I try not to create depth for a character archetype because then I'd be disappointed if Riot actually went through with the concept but didn't go close what I imagined.

It's more a focus on an archetype (corrupt position of power) like how Sion is just undead warrior in archetypes.

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

You're right that there is a lack of depth. I try not to create depth for a character archetype because then I'd be disappointed if Riot actually went through with the concept but didn't go close what I imagined.

It's more a focus on an archetype (corrupt position of power) like how Sion is just undead warrior in archetypes.

Which is fair enough. I'd like to see an evil Demacian character or two. I'd also like to see some good Noxians. Darius should not be the best example of a heroic Noxian we have, lol.

Ralanr1 votes

Riven and Kled are probably our best examples of "good" noxians with the current lore (and Cassiopeia actually).

Kled is more Chaotic neutral but I consider him "good" because he's being a better Noxian than most noxians.

PermabannedGaren1 votes

{quoted}

Riven and Kled are probably our best examples of "good" noxians with the current lore (and Cassiopeia actually).

Kled is more Chaotic neutral but I consider him "good" because he's being a better Noxian than most noxians.

Riven is only a Noxian by birth, she isn't aligned to it anymore and is in fact disgusted with it, which only reinforces the "Noxus is evil" belief which is frankly very well-justified.

Kled? Kled is an insane cannibalistic monster who butchers anyone he feels like, feeds them to his lizard and eats them, and also has apparently killed Noxians as well. He's one of the more evil Noxians.

Ralanr1 votes

Kled doesn't mess with you if you don't go into his property.

Though yeah, Noxus doesn't have many "good" people considering how their morals work.

PermabannedGaren3 votes

{quoted}

Kled doesn't mess with you if you don't go into his property.

Though yeah, Noxus doesn't have many "good" people considering how their morals work.

"There ain't no land that ain't mine. Just land I ain't got around to claiming."

He views the world as his property. He will murder your entire family for the crime of living out your life in a far-away nation he's never been to.

DragonShea2 votes

{quoted}

Kled doesn't mess with you if you don't go into his property.

Though yeah, Noxus doesn't have many "good" people considering how their morals work.

From my prepective, its more like Noxians have alien morals compared to the norm while Demacia are less than honest about their own lack it but play it up like they walk the talk in regards to being righteous.

EbonyBladeJ881 votes

It's very true that Noxus doesn't really have any "Good" people right now, but, perhaps, when Noxus and (presumably) Demacia get their big Lore update, we might see new characters come out. Perhaps a "Lawful Evil" Demacian as you've shown with your post, and more "Good" (I won't put a specific alignment because Noxus is meant to really be morally grey more than anything else) Noxians.

Anu3isII1 votes

What's your opinion about Morgana? I know she isn't Noxian by birth, but in her old lore, she chose to live in Noxus, so she may be aligned to their society.

DragonShea2 votes

{quoted}

Riven and Kled are probably our best examples of "good" noxians with the current lore (and Cassiopeia actually).

Kled is more Chaotic neutral but I consider him "good" because he's being a better Noxian than most noxians.

In that regard i'd say Darius is the closes to good in noxian terms as well, more so if he was a little more heroic, just a tiny bit because he could go have a corny ass turn to "good". Darius is a more stable example of being a good noxian as he respects strength and at least had the heart to raise his own brother

When you look at it. Some Noxians are calm and chill while others are hammy as fuck.

And as for Riven, She is more a joke, she doesn't really understand what the noxian philosophy is all about and yet she tries to seek it out. the problem is, that unless we get more lore info about her, then she is gonna be seen as a emo solider that is trying to understand something that is lie/corruption of the noxian way by the high command, which ironically isn't her fault.

Asayake 5150glow2 votes

{quoted}

In that regard i'd say Darius is the closes to good in noxian terms as well, more so if he was a little more heroic, just a tiny bit because he could go have a corny ass turn to "good". Darius is a more stable example of being a good noxian as he respects strength and at least had the heart to raise his own brother

When you look at it. Some Noxians are calm and chill while others are hammy as fuck.

And as for Riven, She is more a joke, she doesn't really understand what the noxian philosophy is all about and yet she tries to seek it out. the problem is, that unless we get more lore info about her, then she is gonna be seen as a emo solider that is trying to understand something that is lie/corruption of the noxian way by the high command, which ironically isn't her fault.

Riven doesn't interpret Noxian philosophy the same way as everyone else, so she left.

Nothing funny there.

GreenLore2 votes

Speaking of prime minister honest,I also noticed that LoL kinda doesn't have a real scumbag among the champions. I mean don't get me wrong I know that there are plenty of evil champs,with some of them doing quite despicable things,but I feel like none of them really apply to the "evil is petty"-trope as a whole. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EvilIsPetty The closest examples would likely be Jhin,who deals out some pretty low-blow insults with his taunts and is said to want to kill yi and sona out of envy(which was only said by the developers,but not shown in the actual lore). Tahm is also rather close to this,but we don't have that much lore about him,so its hard to say.

Sure I understand the reason for this,as petty villains can easily turn into hate sinks and having a hate sink as a main character is rather risky,but it can simply provide some rather great villains in a story.

Ralanr2 votes

You're right, we do lack scumbags. Closest we have is Draven.

Mr Noggenfogger1 votes

Not Draven, Draaaavennn. Also, draven may think highly of himself, but what he's doing is good. He's helping Noxians by turning something sad like executions into a sport. He's also giving the prisoners a chance at living, instead of 100% death. It also probably helps the government if people have to pay to get in

MrNhbdy1 votes

Ok lets try this....

A old Demacian soldier gains fame, wealth, and eventually nobility through his servitude to the Military. Now a noble he gets a wife and has a son, years later the son has become bratty, manipulative, and a general A-hole. Despite his flaws, his father's influence has given him a role in the military which he actively abuses with his family fortune and stature.

Off Meta Evan2 votes

that IS a good idea for a villain, the only issue is that i think he'd be rather boring to be. like Jhin is a villain no doubt, but he's likeable through how bat shit crazy he is. a politically corrupt asshole does not sound fun to play as. like Sion as he is, he's supposed to be this murderous juggernaut which is fucked up but you feel powerful and strong for it. Xerath feeds my the players possible god complex. but being a holier than thou asshole sounds unpleasant to play as. GRANTED its probably because i fucking hate characters like this in most media with a burning passion for just how unlikable they usually are. (judge frolo from hunchback of notre dame being a great example.)

Ralanr1 votes

True, it'd be difficult to make a corrupted politician fun to play as. Personally I would see him as overly hammy, but you'd need to explain why he could fight.

I think a former Demacian general could work. That way he has combat experience.

TheGreatRasputin2 votes

This kind of sounds like President Snow from the Hunger Games.

Mirkhail2 votes

I don't think we need a "Evil villain" from demacia, what we need are more grey demacia charcters. Showing the extreme military doctrine Garen , the excessive pride of demacia JarvanIV, how demacian society can lead to extreme situation like Fiora how intolerant and how demacian will kill everyone they think is evil Vayne .

Off Meta Evan2 votes

the issue is that lines like "WE FIGHT FOR THOSE WHO CANNOT!" "COME BROTHERS AND SISTERS!" show that they're not grey at all and are EXTREMELY OBVIOUSLY characterized as good guys because in the old lore, noxus was totally the bad guys and Demacia was defiantly the good guys. Now i have been told that the new lore is trying to go into a more grey area between them, but if thats the case they're gonna have remove the lines of certain champions. like the clear cut difference in morality is shown just from the yordles representing their nations. Poppy: a young little grill who just wants to do the right thing and find the hero. Kled: a drunken, paranoid, redneck who would kill anything he could get his hands on. ONE of these things is very clearly NOT the good guy.

Warlord Dienekes2 votes

I was actually thinking to make a somewhat unique Demacian style villain it might be beneficial to look at something like Red Son of Watchmen for comic readers.

Spoilers for Watchmen if anyone hasn't read it yet.

The main villain, is one of the best well intentioned extremists in fiction. One who still has people arguing if their actions were justified or if all his actions were based on his own delusions of grandeur and hubris.

But whatever you think, he is very close to the core aspects of Demacia, strong, athletic, with an unshakeable moral compass, lawful, with the belief his morals are the true morals, and goals to save the world. But he is also unquestionably the villain of the story.

Ralanr2 votes

My only issue with that is it comes close to Kayle's territory and I don't believe Riot could pull that off for Kayle if they decided to fully embrace that route with her.

Warlord Dienekes2 votes

The difference as I see it, is Kayle is a "hero" and regardless of who you side with in the Morgana / Kayle divide Kayle is still a hero just maybe in the wrong. And if Riot tries too hard to turn Kayle into a villain it's basically slapping her fans in the face.

But a new hero that is unquestionably the villain could work.

Ralanr2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Dienekes,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=uAJQFiqX,comment-id=001000000000,timestamp=2016-12-23T00:44:17.638+0000)

The difference as I see it, is Kayle is a "hero" and regardless of who you side with in the Morgana / Kayle divide Kayle is still a hero just maybe in the wrong. And if Riot tries too hard to turn Kayle into a villain it's basically slapping her fans in the face.

But a new hero that is unquestionably the villain could work.

Which is the intention. I feel that having a villain that either abuses or overuses what Demacia stands for is the best type of villain for Demacia.

Warlord Dienekes1 votes

Aye in that I agree. It's only what we think best fits that. For you it's someone that abuses the laws, which makes total sense. For me it's instead a dark reflection of the hero archetype. Both would work. And if either get in the game it would be nice. I'm just iffy about another evil government.

Ralanr2 votes

Oh I get that. Another evil government would be kinda well...lame. Though a government with good intentions but run by not so good people could be a more realistic approach.

Kled Man Walking1 votes

you could also explore the concept of isolationism, as it's rather recently been stated that demacia is rich in pretty much everything except magic. so, they have pretty good reason to not interact with anyone, ever. you could definitely expand that to an evil character

some degenerate1 votes

Aren't Leblanc and Vladimir basically that?

Ralanr3 votes

Yeah but they're noxians.

Valeckserai1 votes

http://i.gyazo.com/08d8d6571698506b3ec850943ef4d105.png

I think anyone that read the manga and knows the context behind this picture can agree that was one of the more disturbing scenes in there.

Ralanr1 votes

I didn't get that far. What happens?

Valeckserai1 votes

Lubbock and Tatsumi were captured by the empire. Tatsumi was taken away by Esdeath because she had the hots for him still. Lubbock was locked in the dungeons and was constantly tortured by Shura, the Prime Minister's son, for information, which he refuses to give him even though he goes through some really nasty shit. Lubbock manages to escape and has an epic duel with Shura, where he kills him (thank God, that little shit had that coming for so long). But he was unfortunately killed immediately after. This picture is from when Honest was told about the death of his son. He grieves for about ten seconds and then all of a sudden that picture popped up on the next page, after his 10 seconds of sorrow he ceases to give a shit. He then continued on with saying how he would just raise another son from scratch and make sure that this other one wouldn't be a complete failure.

Ralanr1 votes

Oh it's that scene (I read about it on tv tropes).

GreenLore4 votes

While its kinda disturbing,it is also quite hilarious xD

6FlagsFunnelCake1 votes

Another kind of "Demacian Villain" I'd like to see would be a sort of Anti-Villain, something to show an example of Demacia's cruel punishment. For instance, an escaped prisoner of sorts, one who was probably even framed for a crime he didn't do. Just something darker to contrast from all the Honor-Bound Light feel that the rest of Demacia has, other than people like Shyvana & XinZhao

Beyond Legends1 votes

Honestly I don't like the idea of the kind evil you describe here. It's simply too DnD ish in term of morals and DnD morality system is shit when it comes to character design. Quite frankly the system you described seems to be very lazy way to paint Demacia Evil. There simply better ways to make Demacia grey rather than what yoy described.

Ralanr1 votes

There definitely are. This is more bringing up an archetype.

Beyond Legends1 votes

Honestly the evil noble archetype is one of the most lazily used ones in writing. Often then not it always the evil is almost unrealistically evil or rotten for no aparent reasons.

Baron Perenolde1 votes

I was so happy to see him get his just desserts in the anime, and I'm hoping the manga does him even dirtier.

Meep Man1 votes

I have decent belief that Jarvan would be considered very dictatorish. I mean, Demacia is the old fashioned "King Rules" kind of kingdom.

Mogarl1 votes

I feel that the multi-house set up in Demacia might make this hard to be believable, because such a character would have to be ignored by the other nobles. you also have the issue of the dueling culture in Demacia would mean that if one noble thought another was doing something unjust, evil, or impure they could just challenge them to a duel. I don't think that the fellow you used as an example would be able to function in Demacia. A lawful Evil character could work but they would have to be very very subtle in what they gained from it.

l Helios l1 votes

Yay! Someone else who watched this anime!

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