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Speculation: Lunari and Solari

GenoXx··5 votes·4,954 views

As of a recent debate I've decided its time to discuss this. The Mysterious Lunari and the Proud Solari

The Solari are a higher up community of the Rakkor of Mount Targon. I would believe they handle the politics and such for mount targon. But it seems they are the head of things there.http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140705073440/leagueoflegends/images/b/b9/Iron_Solari_Crest.jpg I suppose these are also the guys who decides who use relic weapons or are given to. And apparently the top of them are elders. They revere the sun. Created by a warrior who could call down sunbeams. It seems that this tribe has been around for centuries. And the Champion Leona is the spotlight for this tribe. She bears the relic weapons of the said warrior. Although there was one woman who was born in the Solari, who became curious about the moon. She felt connected to it more than the Sun. When Diana, tried to theorize with the elders about the possibility of revering the moon, she only received punishment. How ever, her relentless research brought her to an anciet temple in a hidden Valley. This temple was evidence that peole revered the moon also. She wanted acceptance from the elders when she showed them a suit of armor and a blade found there. Much to their shock, the elders didn't like this one bit. She instead received execution. That's when she gained power from the moon and slaughtered the elders. Speculation theory: http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120726045155/leagueoflegends/images/1/11/Diana_Teaser.jpg Now with this, I has come to a conclusion that the Lunari were killed off by the Solari. 2 reasons why. The elders did not want any type of talk about the moon or its reverence. And gave harsh punishment when it did happen. That's reason 1. Reason 2 is that Diana found an old temple of the Lunari that had anciet relics and evidence that there was once a Society for them. And when she showed proof to the elders that there was people who revered the moon, they wanted her dead. This shows the Solari is guilty of something relating to the Lunari. The only possibilities can be that-as I said before A) The Lunari was killed off by the Solari; and wanted to hide it's existence B) the Lunari was killed off by some out side pact: and the Solari wanted to hide it's existence. As Argent Heretic said, there is doubt that anyone would want to invade Rakkor. So it could only been an inside job. I would think the reason why they were killed off would be religious beliefs, which is a pretty common concept. Again as AH said, they had ties to Nami's people; every hundred years they would give them a moonstone and receive a pearl in exchange. So it isn't like they were evil as people would think. The fact that they have been gone for some time and that the Solari wanted their existence buried helps this theory. Deduction: The Lunari were killed off by the Solari. I would believe that Diana was born to reveal its Existence again. Because she never felt right with the Sun. She could be a descendant of this tribe. What do you guys think? Everyone's opinion is acceptable. After all, its a discussion and they always lead to debates.

46 Comments

Dreamspitter3 votes

Dark is not always Evil. Light is not always good. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LightIsNotGood http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DarkIsNotEvil

REMEMBER the Marai depend on Moonstones to keep their civilization safe from the terror of the deep.

Things that should not be, things kept in check by the moonstones light.

But if the Solari killed off the Lunari to stop this exchange...it could mean the Marai being destroyed, like Fizz' civilization and maybe...others when what lies beneath makes land fall.

http://i.imgur.com/Hs9BgFf.jpg

Argomecha Perdix3 votes

** Things that should not be, things kept in check by the moonstones light.**

But if the Solari killed off the Lunari to stop this exchange...it could mean the Marai being destroyed, like Fizz' civilization and maybe...others when what lies beneath makes land fall.

Duuuude, this could be the answer the question of Nautilius' transformation. What if the Moonstone was to protect the Marai specificalyfrom the black ooze in which Nautilus was trapped?

I personally want more lore development on our only 3 sea creatures: Fizz Nami and Nautilus .

Dreamspitter2 votes

> > Things that should not be, things kept in check by the moonstones light.

But if the Solari killed off the Lunari to stop this exchange...it could mean the Marai being destroyed, like Fizz' civilization and maybe...others when what lies beneath makes land fall.

Duuuude, this could be the answer the question of Nautilius' transformation. What if the Moonstone was to protect the Marai specificalyfrom the black ooze in which Nautilus was trapped?

I personally want more lore development on our only 3 sea creatures: Fizz Nami and Nautilus .

"But more wonderful than the lore of old men and the lore of books is the secret lore of ocean."-HP Lovecraft

"Lost and forgotten." -Nautilus

"Ocean is more ancient than the mountains, and freighted with the memories and the dreams of Time."-HP Lovecraft

"Beware the depths." --Nautilus

"Blue, green, grey, white, or black; smooth, ruffled, or mountainous; that ocean is not silent." -HP Lovecraft

"Do you hear them...calling?" -Nautilus

"The process of delving into the black abyss is to me the keenest form of fascination." -HP Lovecraft

"Peer into the darkness." -Nautilus

Diana x Me2 votes

Ah, finally someone sees my train of thought. I have invested a lot of time researching this so, i take joy in seeing my efforts put to use. Not sure why but, many seem to deny, push aside and evade the facts presented to them. I always see arguments presented in the form of we don't exactly know because they have not told us ( point taken but, riot is known for leaving out details for a reason and its to make us think and come up with our own theories) or the Lunari were killed off because they were evil, natural disaster, they started the war ( Even if they did their was no reason to kill all of them and destroy everything they could find dealing with them and their existence. No good peace loving people would commit such an atrocity), an even more interesting one they were killed by the void. Human's are naturally good at problem solving it has kept us alive for millennia, so it is easy to put 2 and 2 together through deductive reasoning. Their are just too many convenient factual variables laying around to not draw a probable conclusion.

Also @Dreamspitter

The Moon greatly effects the Ocean. It controls the tides, effects temperature, its light is what allows certain species to survive. If you removed the moon from the earths orbit the consequences would be disastrous. Which is why i came to the conclusion that the bearer of the moonstone had to be the Lunari.

GenoXx2 votes

Figuring out mysteries and puzzle is what I love doing. Riot is famous for leaving out clues, like braum in winter lulu-the mustached poro. So I take facts and put them together, and make the most logical results. I want to take on what ever mystery riot has in store for us. I am still currently figuring out the Shadow Isles.- my fav

Dreamspitter2 votes

Also @Dreamspitter

The Moon greatly effects the Ocean. It controls the tides, effects temperature, its light is what allows certain species to survive. If you removed the moon from the earths orbit the consequences would be disastrous. Which is why i came to the conclusion that the bearer of the moonstone had to be the Lunari.

Well it's the only "moon" thing we know about in game so I and others too made a similar connection. However the moon stone lasts 100 Years. That means the fall of the Lunari faith and tradition of exchanging one for an Abyssal Pearl had to be erased in the last century.

MEMEME6701 votes

Your conclusions don't follow from your premise.

Religious people killing people for dumb things is normal, it even happens in some religious countries today. They wanted Diana dead simply because she was against them. If someone did the same with a church of the grass, they'd execute them too.

GenoXx1 votes

She went against them many times, only the last time had evidence. And her final punishment was death. It was more than one time she presented the idea of revering the moon

MEMEME6701 votes

My point stands. It seems much more likely they were just acting normally, and would act the same for any heresy (eg church of the grass) than that they specifically hate the moon

GenoXx1 votes

But that's not the point I am trying to make here. I am proving that the lunari in fact was killed by the solari

MEMEME6701 votes

But you have literally zero evidence for that.

Yes, they likely co-existed at one time. And yes, now one exists and the other doesn't.

But that in no way means that one killed the other. Correlation does not imply causation.

GenoXx2 votes

Dude, if you look at the second image i have, That tells all and covers what i said. Also, I look at facts. FActs are evidence....All you have to do is Deduce. Which is what alot of people arent doing here. Or actually thinking about what i have said or is saying.

MEMEME6701 votes

I missed that picture somehow, my bad.

With that, it does seem pretty obvious the solari killed the lunari.

Diana x Me1 votes

Your conclusions don't follow from your premise.

Religious people killing people for dumb things is normal, it even happens in some religious countries today. They wanted Diana dead simply because she was against them. If someone did the same with a church of the grass, they'd execute them too.

This may be so but, different religions have existed at the same time with out violence being taken place before. Evidence suggests they co-existed due to the fact that Lunari structures were established on Mt.Targon and their was necessity of a moonstone in order for nami's people and or other races to live.

It also does not change the fact that they killed all of them. That which was provided above only further cemented the theory that the Solari are the perpetrators. Regardless if it was because they did it out of spite or another reason.

MEMEME6701 votes

But you have literally zero evidence for that.

Yes, they likely co-existed at one time. And yes, now one exists and the other doesn't.

But that in no way means that one killed the other. Correlation does not imply causation.

Athenes Lulu1 votes

It's only normal for religious people to kill anyone not in their religion. Take Catholics, who executes anyone who isn't a Catholic, even though is still Christian, and the "minorities" have 2 choices: die into extinction or run away. The Lunari had to face the primer.

And then there's the Jews. Just think about the Holocaust just because of different beliefs...

So there's no need for Solari wanting to keep their existence, it's been around for generations.

GenoXx1 votes

But, again as I said, I made this to prove they killed the lunari, not why really

Diana x Me1 votes

But, again as I said, I made this to prove they killed the lunari, not why really

I do not get why this is so difficult to understand.

Also @ SadisticLulu

The jews have been picked on for thousands of years, fortunately they are like the energizer bunny. Yes, religious groups kill each other off. But, as I said before they co-existed for some time. Look at the mural, do you see the symbol where one half is the Solari symbol and the other half is the Lunari? What caused everything to go downhill?

One more thing. @ Dreamspitter

I don't like tvtropes they are known for labeling something as a fact when in reality it is just a rumor or an opinion, so i have never viewed it as a credible source.

SecretLore1 votes

Actually the ties to Namis people have become rather questionable,since the shopkeeper from howling abyss mentions that they are fresh out of moonstones,which implies that the moonstones are from the freljord,not from targon.

And we have already seen with Azir that there can be independent groups to have a connection to the sun,the same can be true for the moon.

Diana x Me1 votes

Actually the ties to Namis people have become rather questionable,since the shopkeeper from howling abyss mentions that they are fresh out of moonstones,which implies that the moonstones are from the freljord,not from targon.

And we have already seen with Azir that there can be independent groups to have a connection to the sun,the same can be true for the moon.

I expected someone to say this. I truly believe the shopkeeper ( lyte) said that as a sarcastic remark. People will say something like this to you if you are shopping/looking for something deemed under the title of unobtanium. As in you are not going to find it, good luck. It's a joke. A line of playful banter. And yes Azir affiliates himself and shurima with the Sun, so what. However, it's not what they are all about. They are not like the Solari whom devote their lives to its worship. It would be stupid to give something like a Sunstone to Shurima when the Solari are a superior candidate for its possession. Besides the relation to rakkor the Lunari have no outside relations with the world. Why would they purposely just leave them so bland and unconnected to anything? Freljord is already rich in lore and has it own background and storyline. Their is no reason for them to have something like a moonstone. You are over thinking it.

SecretLore1 votes

It is actually gregor,not Lyte, who says this,the guy lives there for centuries. The marai need a moonstone every century,which means that he was alive(or well a ghost) during the several times the moonstone was needed.

Also they gave Shurima the sun disc,then it is possible that freljord gets the moonstones.

Overall I am not saying that the Lunari didn't have the moonstones,but that it is simply uncertain if they ever had it or not. People shouldn't just talk about these things like they are facts,that is only causing misconceptions about the lore.

Diana x Me1 votes

It is actually gregor,not Lyte, who says this,the guy lives there for centuries. The marai need a moonstone every century,which means that he was alive(or well a ghost) during the several times the moonstone was needed.

Also they gave Shurima the sun disc,then it is possible that freljord gets the moonstones.

Overall I am not saying that the Lunari didn't have the moonstones,but that it is simply uncertain if they ever had it or not. People shouldn't just talk about these things like they are facts,that is only causing misconceptions about the lore.

Dude. you just don't get it. You do this all the time. Its so simple. Seriously use your head. I really do not understand why you do this to yourself. Riot will not make something more complicated than it needs to be. Remember they are about simplicity and that goes with their story lines as well. Time and time again its been proven that they do this. Its the reason they are so popular because Its easy to get into. Who cares about the sun disc. Shurima is all about the desert which incorporates the sun. Like i said before, they are not all about the sun that's the Solari's domain. Its not like the poro people or trolls or frozen watchers have the moonstone and travel to the beach every 100 years to give a moonstone to the marai. They live in subzero temperatures. That would be so stupid. It would be such a disappointment. Why would they even consider doing that. I mean i get what you are saying. But, seriously it makes no logical sense that anyone else could have it.

SecretLore1 votes

You seriously ask why the Freljordians would go every 100 years to the beach to give them the moonstone?The same could be asked about the lunari.Why would they do it?Why would anyone do this in the first place?

The Marai are searching for moonstones,they are the ones going to wherever they are and try to get the moonstone(probably in exchange for something or through force)

you say leagues story is simple and that is true,but I don't see how it is that difficult to establish: Solari all about the sun sun disc has nothing to do with them lunari all about the moon moonstones have nothing to do with them.

Thats rather simple. On the other hand it is rather confusing to give a shopkeeper a line that implies that he DID have that item at a certain point in the past,just to make a joke?Especially since Gregor has many lines that actually do give us some information about the lore. That would be just complicated.

Diana x Me1 votes

You seriously ask why the Freljordians would go every 100 years to the beach to give them the moonstone?The same could be asked about the lunari.Why would they do it?Why would anyone do this in the first place?

The Marai are searching for moonstones,they are the ones going to wherever they are and try to get the moonstone(probably in exchange for something or through force)

you say leagues story is simple and that is true,but I don't see how it is that difficult to establish: Solari all about the sun sun disc has nothing to do with them lunari all about the moon moonstones have nothing to do with them.

Thats rather simple. On the other hand it is rather confusing to give a shopkeeper a line that implies that he DID have that item at a certain point in the past,just to make a joke?Especially since Gregor has many lines that actually do give us some information about the lore. That would be just complicated.

Ok, fair point for the last one. Why would they do this?

The landwalker of the Marai trades an Abyssal pearl for a Moonstone. The chosen Marai is to obtain the Abyssal pearl from somewhere in the ocean. A few questions why would the shop keeper just have tons of moonstones laying around at one point in time? Who else could possibly be taking all the moonstones from the shopkeeper? What could they possibly need them for and why would the shopkeeper or anyone from the Freljord have any need for an item called an abyssal pearl? Just the name Abyssal pearl sounds like it would be outside the main theme of the Freljord.

Abyssal means of the dark depths and or pertaining to a region of the ocean that of which is below 2000 meters. Keywords Ocean and dark. At this level of depth many sea creatures are bio-luminescent and have very large light sensitive eyes or they are blind and use other senses because it is so dark, ex Angler fish. Their is little to no plant life due to the lack of sunlight which means basically all the life down there survives by catching prey. They use the dim light source they produce as a lure to attract this prey. Which normally indicates that the illuminated source is in fact a predator. So the bigger the light source ,the bigger the predator which would keep predators on the lower end of the food chain away because they use that very same tactic. Keywords lack of sunlight and Dim light source

In LoL the Ocean has this evil dark fluid like substance that transformed Nautalis into the titan that he is now.

The Moon greatly effects the Ocean which means strong correlation between the two. On a full moon it produces a brightness on the apparent magnitude scale of basically -13 its maximum( all though scientist believe at one point in time it could have been as bright as -15) compared to the sun that of which is at a rounded -27. That would most likely mean that the moon stone will be extremely bright in a dark place. Something like that would give the Marai the light they need at the bottom of the ocean to stay safe while keeping the evil substance at bay. No one will have a stronger connection to the Moon than the Lunari so their is no possible reason as to why another group could have the moonstone over them. It would basically make the Lunari's existence besides being the enemy of the Solari completely meaningless.

And as i said before the Freljordians are already rich with lore( The three sisters history. the war between Sejuani, Ashe and Lissandra, Aatrox and Tryndamere's rivalry, Olaf and the tribe of Lokfar which we know nothing about really, brand , the barbarian pacification campaign involving noxus, Nunu/Willump and the yeti tribe which we also know little about, Volibear and the Ursi, Trundle and the trolls, Anivia etc. They have sooo much already compared to Targon or the Ocean peoples. Giving the Freljordians the moonstone would just be overwhelming. At that point just make LoL all about the Freljord because thats what it is turning into. That would be hyper focus, Riot would not do that.

SecretLore1 votes

It is likely that the moonstones have magical powers aside from just glowing in the dark(and even if that were their only power,then they'd be more useful in the freljord,were the weather is most likely rather harsh and rarely sunny compared to other places),I mean I wouldn't count on a giant lamp protecting me from the horrors of the deep sea. Gregor might have had several moonstones prepared for the marai and sold them to the respective chosen ones,but eventually he sold every last of them(since he is a ghost,it'd be hard for him to get new ones),or there are other people interested in the moonstones(either because they may need them for some kind of magic,or because they might be simply very valuable)

It is also possible that the Freljord is simply not the only nation who has(or had) moonstones,or that they got them only through import.

Overall all I am saying is that we shouldn't take things for granted. I myself believe that the Lunari were the ones who gave the marai the moonstone,but we simply don't know if that is the case,because in the end there is always the possibility,that the Lunari were just a red herring,or that riot never considered this during the development of namis story(with dianas and Namis release being so close together and no mentioned connection between them upon release,its not out of question,that their stories were developed independent from each other and there wasn't that much lore about the freljord at that point too)

GenoXx2 votes

SecretLore, It seems that you are still bouncing around the idea that " we don't know until Riot tell's us." It would not make ANY sense for any freljordian to have a moonstone. The name moonstone, how would you even say it would fit with the freljordians better than the Lunari. "Lunar"i. They are the only ones who are have a deep connection with the moon. Absolutely no one in Freljord would have a reason to have anything related to the moon in the frist place. Not saying people there couldn't. But, if I hermit says, "Sorry, fresh out of moonestones" on the Howling Abyss on the one lane map, it's likely its a joke/ easter egg in case he ever saw nami. I haven't heard this line yet, or maybe didn't pay attention to it. But seriously, the term moonstone wouldn't fit in the Freljord, it's more fitted for people who revere the moon better. If you all talking about possibilities, then you should state any other place other then Freljord. That place seems to be Narrative's favorite. I'm sure who ever created nami's lore, had the Lunari in mind.

SecretLore1 votes

Then what about the SUN disc who has absolutely nothing to do with the Solari? There was nothing that indicated any kind of sun-worship from the shurima-guys until Azir suddenly happened.

However we already have 2 instances that connect the freljord with the moon. First of all we have gregor who mentions the moonstones Then we have Udyrs tribe whose chosen one is born under the blood moon(and since udyr got lost in the wild,it would explain why the moonstone wasn't delivered).

Also while the shopkeepers are doing a lot of jokes/eastereggs,they are never saying something wrong. Lyte mentions that Ezreal seems to be dating Lux,how VI has a sister. Both also mention Lissandra being the seeker of avarosas tribe and hint at her betrayal. There is simply not a single line that is misleading here. http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Howling_Abyss/Quotes

Diana x Me1 votes

Then what about the SUN disc who has absolutely nothing to do with the Solari? There was nothing that indicated any kind of sun-worship from the shurima-guys until Azir suddenly happened.

However we already have 2 instances that connect the freljord with the moon. First of all we have gregor who mentions the moonstones Then we have Udyrs tribe whose chosen one is born under the blood moon(and since udyr got lost in the wild,it would explain why the moonstone wasn't delivered).

Also while the shopkeepers are doing a lot of jokes/eastereggs,they are never saying something wrong. Lyte mentions that Ezreal seems to be dating Lux,how VI has a sister. Both also mention Lissandra being the seeker of avarosas tribe and hint at her betrayal. There is simply not a single line that is misleading here. http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Howling_Abyss/Quotes

I think you take things to literally for what they are. Next maybe the Solari gave the people of shurima the sun disc. They are xenophobic and have been around for probably just as long as shurima if not more.

Next, Udyr is from Ionia which is where the blood moon is celebrated, look at the JoJ. Ionia had pretty much nothing to do with the continent of Valoran for most of its existence. If you know anything about udyr you would know he is like the "native american wildman" he got lost in the woods to find his inner spirit but, instead he found mulitple. By your logic because the kinkou also celebrated the blood moon they must of also had a hand in it. The Freljord has nothing to do with it except a dinky joke line by a shopkeeper which you seem to insist that he happens to have them for whatever reason. i dont know why you are so stuck on the shopkeeper. They say easter eggs etc. so what. Their is nothing misleading or wrong with playful banter. Its more or less a note to people that they have not forgotten about nami and have something planned.

SecretLore1 votes

I am just saying that there are simply mulitple possibilities(also you should read udyrs new lore,he was lost as a child in the wild until lee sin found him),because you and genocider X seem to be fixated that there is only the option you are thinking of.

GenoXx2 votes

It's not that I am fixated, I looked at many possibilities, It's the more possible one. Or Logical

Diana x Me1 votes

It's not that I am fixated, I looked at many possibilities, It's the more possible one. Or Logical

Admittedly I may be slightly biased but, I have been trying to put that aside as best as I can.

Again I get the whole "we don't know until they tell us ordeal" but, 99% of stories you can for the majority figure out the plot line, events to come and everything in between by yourself. Process of elimination, trial and error and deductive reasoning normally brings you to a conclusion.

GenoXx2 votes

But SecretLore, Why would a Marai go to the coast of freljord to look for a moonstone, versus going near mount targon and go to a place that have someone with a mooncult? I would think the Marai would know where to go looking for a moonstone. Give me your honest opinion. Who would fit the bearer of the moonstone better.... Udyr's Tribe A random guy from freljord Or The Lunari? Edit: About the Sun Disc, I'm sure that originated in Shurima..so I wouldn't think that the Solari gave them that lol

SecretLore1 votes

Obviously the lunari,but being the best choice doesn't mean that they will be the ones who actually have it.

I mean if the sun disc would have been mentioned before,but without a specific location,then where do you think would it fit better?The Solari?Or Shurima? The answer would have been the solari,but riot still decided that it is ok for another group of sun-worshippers to exist,so what would prevent them from doing the same with the moon? Thats really all I am saying.

What I just want to achieve here is that you simply make clear in the opening post that it is not confirmed that this is the case.Because you state this like it is a fact,when it is still uncofirmed. Something like "they had most likely ties with the marai" or something like that.

GenoXx1 votes

I see what you mean, I don't even think Freljord or Targon is near guardian seahttp://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100821100306/leagueoflegends/images/c/cd/MapofValoran.jpg

GenoXx1 votes

I'm sure that was an easter egg related to nami's search for one.

NeoJusteBelmont1 votes

I once discussed this with Argent Heretic, and we came to an agreement about our differing views. So I suppose I shall drop in my opinion here.

While it can be inferred that Solari did something of a genocide... the truth is still VERY blurry. We do not know exactly why the Lunari was wiped out, we just judged based on how the Solari elders acted, but it doesn't speak of the whole picture, there may even be a third party that destroyed the Lunari, and even if the Solari was the one behind it, their reason may be even deeper than "We just want to dominate the worshipping sect!". There is a possibility that the Lunari really presents a real calamity that if it came out to public, it will threaten the world, so once they are destroyed, regardless of the means, the Solari chose to bury them from history in order to prevent such calamity to be unleashed.

Why calamity?

Look at how Leona and Diana received their power and the aftermath.

Leona grew up being considered a problem child of Rakkor because she thinks that strength wasn't meant to bully other people, but to protect others. Her only friend is Pantheon, but that meant nothing when she refused to kill her opponent during the Ritual of Kor. The elders of Rakkor set her for execution and Pantheon was included as one of her executors. The sun saved her. And afterwards, Leona remained the same as she was before, and even probably got the approval of the Rakkor once the Solari took her in. The proof? She's still mutual friends with Pantheon, looks like they made amends each other afterwards.

Diana... well, I think we've stated that too many. But when the Moon gave her power... it turned her into a ruthless, murderous fanatic that made it her mission is to approach someone and ask them: "Do you accept the Moon as your savior and your object of worship?" And if they answer no, she'll kill them.

This shows a conflict on the whole 'Lunari is the Woobie race and woe betide anyone who bully them'. I mean, if the Lunari was that kind, how was it that people blessed by their power turn into a megalomaniac? While Leona, who received similar traumatic awakening, retained her kind personality by the sun?

Let's close it with this: All I've stated are possibilities of what actually happened, with 'Solari obliterated the Lunari because they want domination' being one of the possibilities, you can believe that if you want to. Until we get a Targon arc to reveal what actually happened, these theories of what actually happened will be available to consider. But as for me, I personally think it is too early to just condemn the sun as a straight example of Light Is Not Good.

Bonus: Yeah, I have a hunch that Diana was a descendant of the Lunari that was leftover from the massacre. I thought the Solari elders thought she could be converted into a Solari worshipper if they indoctrinated her with their teachings, so they let her be adopted and raised as a Solari acolyte rather than killing her, but it looks like they failed.

GenoXx2 votes

The reason why Diana was so cold and ruthless came from her frustration and anger. That was the elders fault for that. The moon did not make her like that. I think it's a bit too much to kill someone "Else" if they don't accept the moon. But again, it all came from lies that were told to her. This makes up her cold demeanor. As for them dominating, it's pretty clear that's the case. And when i say descendant, it's not like they were wiped out 50 yrs ago. I mean They are all Rakkor, but Diana could have the same desire as her ancestors did, because it's the Current Solari's too. And yeah, nothing is confirmed until they do bring something for the Rakkor. But, i wanted to make it pretty clear that they were killed by their own kind. If it was anything else, it would have been taught to current Solari, instead of being hidden from them.

NeoJusteBelmont1 votes

It may be just me, but I think there could be other reasons than why the Solari hid records of the Lunari other than the former wiped the latter off.

I mean, it's just a possibility, it's okay if you want to believe that they're the one who wiped them out.

Descendant stuff: Other way to say it if the time gap is too long: Lunari wiped out, but there's a couple that survived. They live in hiding, until they gave birth to Diana, but then they perished, either by other causes or the Solari caught up and killed them. Baby Diana is found by the Solari, they think they'll try to convert her beliefs to finally erase the existence of Lunari. We all know how it turned out.

GenoXx1 votes

I mean, Diana was born Solari, but gained the same desire's as her Ancestors. This is why she is called a herectic.

Diana x Me1 votes

I once discussed this with Argent Heretic, and we came to an agreement about our differing views. So I suppose I shall drop in my opinion here.

While it can be inferred that Solari did something of a genocide... the truth is still VERY blurry. We do not know exactly why the Lunari was wiped out, we just judged based on how the Solari elders acted, but it doesn't speak of the whole picture, there may even be a third party that destroyed the Lunari, and even if the Solari was the one behind it, their reason may be even deeper than "We just want to dominate the worshipping sect!". There is a possibility that the Lunari really presents a real calamity that if it came out to public, it will threaten the world, so once they are destroyed, regardless of the means, the Solari chose to bury them from history in order to prevent such calamity to be unleashed.

Why calamity?

Look at how Leona and Diana received their power and the aftermath.

Leona grew up being considered a problem child of Rakkor because she thinks that strength wasn't meant to bully other people, but to protect others. Her only friend is Pantheon, but that meant nothing when she refused to kill her opponent during the Ritual of Kor. The elders of Rakkor set her for execution and Pantheon was included as one of her executors. The sun saved her. And afterwards, Leona remained the same as she was before, and even probably got the approval of the Rakkor once the Solari took her in. The proof? She's still mutual friends with Pantheon, looks like they made amends each other afterwards.

Diana... well, I think we've stated that too many. But when the Moon gave her power... it turned her into a ruthless, murderous fanatic that made it her mission is to approach someone and ask them: "Do you accept the Moon as your savior and your object of worship?" And if they answer no, she'll kill them.

This shows a conflict on the whole 'Lunari is the Woobie race and woe betide anyone who bully them'. I mean, if the Lunari was that kind, how was it that people blessed by their power turn into a megalomaniac? While Leona, who received similar traumatic awakening, retained her kind personality by the sun?

The Lunari and Solari had co-existed peacefully for a time. Look at the mural and you will see an insignia that is half Solari and half Lunari. That mural shows the Solari acknowledged their existence and saw them as equals at one point. So something or someone changed it all. They could have pulled a Cain and Able or the Solari decided to end them because a disagreement came up that neither would compromise on.

The only outside source i would consider capable of doing any harm is the Darkin.

I don't think it was the blessing that caused it. Remember she looked up to Leona as a role model, she wanted to be just like her. Leona was everything she wanted to be. Leona was accepted, had power and fame. as she was the figure head of the Solari, their idol. Diana turned into what she is now because she suffered all her life because of different beliefs. They probably treated her very badly and was punished more often than not. That's abuse and you don't forget the suffering. You learn to become cold because its keeps people away, you don't want to experience the suffering again. You become angry and hateful, you want those that wronged you to suffer as you did.

She endured the abuse because she believed all her work would pay off in the end. Fast forward a bit and they were going to execute her. That was when she couldn't take it anymore, it all back fired and she was going to die for her efforts. She was done trying to be a part of them, they would not accept her. She tried to reason with them, but they would not listen. Her only way out was to kill them.

But, it also states in her lore that she only gives the convert or die ultimatum to her enemies. I would guess that would only include the Solari considering unlikely that she had contact with any other groups of people besides those on Targon.

NeoJusteBelmont1 votes

Eh... not to be condescending or something, but IIRC, I brought up the Darkin in the past discussions and then you kind of dismissed them. Something changed your mind?

The rest are solid reasonings I have no rebuttals for. But still, I think that the only black mark of the Solari are those pretentious, grumpy elders, not everyone in Solari was bad, they probably don't even know the Lunari existence and might be horrified when they learned about its genocide, even Leona herself. So... I still personally believe that slapping Light Is Not Good to the Solari is kind of pulling out.

So far Diana is listed to have no friends at all, so we are not sure if she's trying to make any. But this is why I always had an idea of a new Targon champion who serves as the Pantheon to Diana's Leona, something like a Targon/Rakkor outcast that despised Pantheon, being his eventual rival, but then Diana swept in like a savior, and then he converts to a moon worshipper, acting as her extra hand. Could say more, but that goes more to 'Champion Concept', and I could only think of the background story. So I'll stop at that.

Diana x Me1 votes

Eh... not to be condescending or something, but IIRC, I brought up the Darkin in the past discussions and then you kind of dismissed them. Something changed your mind?

The rest are solid reasoning's I have no rebuttals for. But still, I think that the only black mark of the Solari are those pretentious, grumpy elders, not everyone in Solari was bad, they probably don't even know the Lunari existence and might be horrified when they learned about its genocide, even Leona herself. So... I still personally believe that slapping Light Is Not Good to the Solari is kind of pulling out.

So far Diana is listed to have no friends at all, so we are not sure if she's trying to make any. But this is why I always had an idea of a new Targon champion who serves as the Pantheon to Diana's Leona, something like a Targon/Rakkor outcast that despised Pantheon, being his eventual rival, but then Diana swept in like a savior, and then he converts to a moon worshiper, acting as her extra hand. Could say more, but that goes more to 'Champion Concept', and I could only think of the background story. So I'll stop at that.

No offense taken. I did some more research on the Darkin. They ( or at least aatrox) can cause people to basically go into such blood-lust that they don't realize what they are doing and then they eventually snap out of it and find out that they have committed terrible atrocities. So my thought was a possible minor skirmish or dispute broke out, Darkin appeared and influenced them, before you know it they have killed everyone, they are ashamed of it so they swept as much as they could underneath the rug and tried to keep it a secret.

This is just an alternative theory that i believe could be possible but, not as likely. I'm still iffy on this because i do not exactly know the extent of the Darkin's power which could be like the ascended. It would be suicide for anyone else to try and attack Targon.

I will agree to disagree on why records were hidden.

My issue with the rest of the Solari not knowing about the Lunari is again the fact that they were killed within the current 100 year period of the Marai's centennial meet for the moonstone. It only makes sense that the Lunari were the ones giving them the moonstones. I dont exactly know how long the average people's life spans are in their world. It could be as low as like 50 to as high as like 500. Assuming that the lunari were killed just after they gave the marai the last moonstone and peoples lives are really that short than yes its possible that the current people have no idea about it assuming they cut off all loose ends to perfection. I mean i would call it unusual for a civilization of people to not remember the things they have done and or accomplished. Someone had to of written stuff down that they were involved in ------. I hate going back to the Nazi's but, even just recently( within the last few years i believe) Germany's chancellor had gone to the Jews and apologized for what the German people have done. Even if their is basically very few alive that were involved in it. the newer generations still feel responsible because their ancestors did the damage. Point is..people remember..they will not forget something like that regardless of how much time has passed. People tell stories and pass on knowledge even if they are not supposed to talk about it and end up being a whistle blower.

I'm not saying its impossible, i'm just saying i don't find it very likely that they do not know about it. Again agree to disagree. Im just talking out loud here.

Also your champion concept sounds pretty interesting. Are you entering it into the contest that riot has?

NeoJusteBelmont1 votes

Well yeah, that is a very open and probable possibility out of the reasonings. Again, I'll agree that it's only a possibility, chances of being shot down is always open.

In regards of Nazi, I think the comparison here was much lighter so I can take it better. But in this regards, my mind goes like this: Before THAT chancellor apologized to Jews, does the previous Germany people bothered to apologize? I'm saying that the Solari elders might be the same as Germany before that chancellor. It's possible that someone from the Solari could act like that chancellor eventually, but that person hasn't come. But I'm pretty sure that maybe Leona would be that kind of chancellor if she's given sufficient information. But that'll be for the future arc, I suppose.

... Dude, are you kidding me? All I can give is just the raw backstory draft, I don't think I could come up with skill set, play style, or even the artwork to qualify for the contest. I don't think there's a way for me to enter the contest with just that bare information. But I'll admit that I do wish that kind of champion with such background get introduced. I mean, it's only fair that Diana have friends.

Diana x Me1 votes

II would be willing to mark it as "fact till proven otherwise or "most accepted theory".

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