[LORE DISCUSSION] The Lunari

ModCaptainMårvelous·10/17/2014, 11:55:23 PM·17 votes·25,221 views

Lore Discussion Omni-Post

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Happy friday everyone and welcome to Lore Discussion. Tomorrow's Worlds so I don't blame you if story is the last thing on your mind, but today's topic is a bit of an interesting one. In fact, it's something I've discussed and thought of before. I speak, of course, of an entire race-slash-religion that existed on the lonely mountain we know as Targon several millenia ago. Yes, today we'll be discussing... http://i.imgur.com/KSHjANW.jpg #The Lunari


http://i.imgur.com/pWzM0fI.jpg?1 #What we know

The Lunari are fascinating because almost everything about them has been wiped from the Targon record books. In fact, the Lunari were essentially never meant to be seen in-game (At least if the Solari got their way). Thanks to the efforts of Diana however, we can now see the lore about these people. While it's rather limited what we know off the bat, let's mention what we currently know:

  • The Lunari were once as prevalent as the Solari
  • The Lunari were eradicated or exterminated by the Solari
  • It can be inferred that Lunari-blood still exists in the Solari culture/people.

This knowledge also persists into the future, as Diana revealing the Lunari temple and artifacts brought about bloodshed that killed the Solari elders. This points to the idea that the Solari indeed knew about the Lunari and did their best to keep them hidden from viewpoint...which leads to the question of what truly happened to the Lunari.


http://i.imgur.com/HEnafuh.jpg #The Fall: The Extinction of the Lunari

In my mind (And as previously stated, a basic theory I have that holds no weight), the Lunari and Solari were always sort of at odds with each other. They respected each other, but it was a sort of uneasy tension always kept between the two. However, in my theory, one key fact kept one from attacking the other to the point of destruction: The Radiant Dawn and The Luminescent Dusk. We already know the Radiant Dawn as the paragon of Solari society, the living embodiment of the sun. The Luminescent Dusk, however, would be the antithesis: The very embodiment of the moon.

With this idea in mind, some things come to light. Let's take for example Diana's armor and weapon. For one thing, like Leona's, it would be considered one of a kind and the purest form of the moon's power. Diana finding this was no mere accident: The Luminescent Dusk bloodline runs in her veins, making her the descendents of those who took up the mantle beforehand. Likewise, I also believe Diana's weapon (at one time) had a matching shield comparative to Leona's. As opposed to a normal sword and tower shield, however, the Luminescent Dusk had a smaller shield. Perhaps a buckler or a more offensive-minded sword-and-board fighting style.

Now, what the absence means is that thousands of years ago, the then-current Radiant Dawn murdered or defeated the Luminescent Dusk, taking the shield as proof of his/her demise and destroying it as a symbol of the Lunari's defeat. Thus, with no guardian or avatar to protect them, the Solari systematically slaughtered those of the Lunari. Much like history, however, numerous families and people went into hiding within Solari society. Babies were said to be twins, loved ones hid in attics, those pregnant with Lunari children lied about the parentage, etc. Essentially, the Lunari's young ones were kept alive while the elders and those who could carry the traditions were murdered.

As time passed, the Lunari became history. History became legend, legend became myth and myth eventually became nothingness. When Diana reappeared, she was not a protector of the Lunari that the Luminescent Dusk had been. Rather, she was the Scorn of the Moon. The fury of a lost religion turned human.


http://i.imgur.com/KGrepoa.jpg?1 #Today: Two Paths?

What's so fascinating about the Leona/Diana rivalry is that in a sense, both are not the last arbiters of their respective beliefs. With the Solari council slain (or at least most of them), Leona may be the only woman who remains that knows deeply of the Solari customs. Diana knows bits and pieces, but she's still the only remaining Lunari that exists. What's tragic is that so much of these two cultures has been lost simply by in-fighting.

However, one key player has not been revealed: The Eclipse. Yes, there hasn't been mention of any sort of Eclipse (Solar -or- Lunar) in the Solari/Lunari traditions, which begs the question of what DOES happen when the sun eclipses the moon. In one champion concept I did ages ago, the Eclipse was the ultimate heretic that made Diana's Lunari ways look like the most devout Solari. In fact, out of all the things that COULD happen, would an eclipse not be the most unholy and heretical thing that both races could envision? The overshadowing of one or the other to create a horrific blackness that swallows all of Mount Targon?

I think the appearance of an "Eclipse" could actually serve as a way to fix the bonds broken. Well, not fix completely but go a long way in the way of fixing some of the problems that both religions had. If there was a threat that forced both sun and moon to unite against it, it might help break some of the tension. Would these two ever be friends? No, there is no going back from what either has done (Lunari literally, Solari speculatively). Still, it's entirely possible that a threat both had to take care of would end up serving as a tool to acknowledge and respect their ways just as it had been done centuries ago...

So what do you think? Is there weight to this story or perhaps there was some history that's missing? Could these two ever come to respect each other again or will this conflict only end when Leona's light has faded or Diana's moon has been eclipsed? And, as always, be sure to vote for what discussion you want to see next!

80 Comments

RiotIronStylus10/20/2014, 7:54:30 AM20 votes

I like this thread..

OuttaControl5610/18/2014, 4:54:47 AM8 votes

Honestly, I prefer to think that the Lunari might have started the conflict themselves, but it ultimately doesn't matter who cast the first stone.

It ends up that the Solari take the fight WAY too far, which is why they completely wipe the records. They realize that they've eviscerated an entire group and as a result they just try and cover their tails instead of owning up to it.

Think of this:

Why the heck did a Lunari temple remain? It was a battleground, obviously, yet the Solari didn't have the arrogance or warlike gusto to tear the entire temple down? Why could they have left the darn thing standing if they were so hateful of the Lunari? If victors write the history books, why didn't the Solari boast of this victory in their records and cement themselves as the one true path? Why try and get rid of the entire Lunari religion all together, wipe it from memory? What threat is a dead religion, an empty temple?

Answer: The Temple is hollowed ground. It was not a battle, it was a mistake. Something went wrong between the Lunari and the Solari that, for whatever reason, led to a slaughter without any thought, without any moment of pause. When the dust settled and realization dawned, the Solari didn't want to address the enormous deed that they had done but instead banished it from its records. They did not emerge victorious, they only survived whatever had occurred. What exactly they survived is up to debate, but my headcanon below goes into detail.

Why else would Diana be executed for revealing the Lunari? Not out of anger or discrimination, but out of fear, fear of retribution and skeletons coming out of the closet. Fear that their past would have to be revisited, old sins exhumed. If they were victors, people would just laugh at her and mock her. But no. Apparently one woman preaching about the moon shook them to the very core not because it is their worst enemy, but rather a reminder of their darkest hour. (Darkest? Get it? Solari's Darkest Hour? AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHSHOWMETHEDOORHAHAHAHAHA)

-----------------Now enter the headcanon:------------

Lets think to the Rakkor and their tendency to go where the battle is, and join whichever side is outnumbered. Kinda like the Darkin, right? What if, crazy thought, the Rakkor/Darkin might have been involved in this war between the Lunari and Solari? What if they were the instigators to fuel their taste of bloodshed? Darkin have the ability to drive people mad with the thought of bloodshed, it would make perfect sense that the Solari were somehow controlled by the Darkin during their assault on the temple grounds, leading to the slaughter. Maybe the Luminescent Disk ended the fight by putting an end to the Darkin leader (Possibly the first "Pantheon"), and by then the damage had already been done.

Hell, wouldn't that explain why the Rakkor obey the Solari? Is it punishment for past transgressions?

-------------Headcanon time over-----------------------

Caustic Crusader10/18/2014, 9:57:37 PM5 votes

/rantmodeengaged

It always pisses me off when people say Diana's evil and Leona's good. Leona basically represents everything the Solari stand for, which obviously includes the whole "extermination based on beliefs" things that they did to the Lunari. Diana's just kinda curious about the history from how it's shown in her lore, so of course the rational response to discovering genocide is execution without trial. And so, because she survives a lifetime of persecution and attempted murder because she finds out stuff about the Lunari, she's evil. Makes a shitload of sense, dudes. Even that mural in Diana's teaser implies pretty heavily that the Solari were the aggressors. So, okay, the hero is the one who is basically the beacon of everything a genocidal revisionist sect stands for, and the villain is the one who simply stumbles upon evidence regarding the fact that there were once Lunari and the Solari killed them ALL, and everyone tries to kill her because of it.

And I don't believe for a second that Leona could just be unaware of the history. If the elders know about it in depth, Leona will too, she's too important a figurehead to be kept in the dark. She can have a personal objection to killing, but that's exclusive to her experiences alone, and she's still basically the most important representation of the organization that condones widescale killing, as well as a cover-up of that very same thing, so she's in no way innocent.

Anti-hero and anti-villain labels are more appropriate to me, though I feel like it would be the opposite of what most would. Leona's an anti-villain since she's virtually a living embodiment of a genocidal, cult-like people. Though she's obviously honorable and opposed to some of their practices on a personal level, she doesn't actually do anything about it. Diana's the anti-hero because yeah she kills, but Jesus, she's trying to dismantle the Solari, which as I've explained, is pretty clear-cut evil depending on how you interpret the way it's told. Remember that history is written by the victors, so it's pretty obvious that they've wanted to cover something up as significant as the eradication of the Lunari, and pretend it's something they've never done. So when it's actually discovered that, shit, they DID do this, their response is an execution without any warning whatsoever. Remember that at that point, Diana hadn't done anything wrong aside from just being interested in the moon, which is already something that everybody hated her for. Then she stumbles upon some armor, and they try to kill her basically right away.

/endrant

Tengrichan10/20/2014, 6:02:58 PM3 votes

Literally doing riot's work.

SchaakaKon10/18/2014, 4:48:34 AM3 votes

I feel that among the 'human' city states, Mount Targon is in the most need of a lore lovin'.

Creating a third faction or just a super boss named 'Eclipse' isnt a good route for Mount Targon. Diana and Leona being at ends with each other is not bad so I do not see a need to get them together.

I would love to see Mount Targon hit the Greek roots hard. Have the designers working on it read Homers Odyssey. Where the world was young, not a whole lot made sense around everyone so they justified unknown science with religion. Why does winter happen? Because Persephone ate six pomegranate seeds which contractually forces her to stay with Hades in the Underworld for six months each year at which makes Demeter sad and as the Goddess of agriculture she is too distraught that her daughter is taken away from her so the world becomes cold and infertile. But after those six months Demeter gets her daughter back and she makes the earth bloom and grow beautifully which is the time of year we know as Spring and Summer.

I like stories like these, it is sometimes fun that things dont make sense. I get tired of all these 'Logical and bland' stories.

GenoXx10/18/2014, 1:29:00 AM3 votes

Hmmm, this discussion looks...so familiar

junglerboy1610/18/2014, 12:07:39 AM2 votes

Really insightful stuff, I think it would be great to have an event when they possibly add an Eclipse themed nemesis to both the Solari and Lunari, then we could get a look at some sort of possible reconciliation between them. I think they could do some amazing lore based on some of the concept images they have , like the ones you added above, especially the symbol that appears to be a crescent moon and the sun/full moon eclipsing the sun. Riot really should develop the lore around Mount Targon a lot more, not necessarily just the Solari and Lunari, maybe the Rakkor as well.

Shadow Isles should be next, it just feels like it is a good time to cover it with the Harrowing and all.

Tyvani10/18/2014, 9:36:10 PM2 votes

Ahah This is my kind of thread. I actually have spent a lot of time thinking about the story surrounding Diana and the Lunari and have come up with a few ideas in my brainstorming. Also, gotta say, I love the Lunari Champion's title, The Luminescent Dusk.

I definitely think there's a lot of the story that's missing, and rightfully so. The Solari wiped much of the Lunari's slate clean. Of course, the Solari would have to have a reason for doing so, which can greatly vary due to the vast amount of information missing. But a possibility for their origins is that the Sun, perhaps for a similar reason as Leona, suddenly chose an avatar to wield its power. Worshipers naturally flock to people such as this and this Chosen of the Sun found themselves with more than enough followers to handle. So they got to work building the temple at Mt. Targon's peak to house these followers and let them worship in peace. Eventually, the Radiant Dawn found themselves in need of assistance in governing how the people acted and enlisted the help of a council of Elders, people who seemed wise and experienced in government. Eventually, the moon may have found reason to choose an avatar of its own and, suddenly, these Solari found themselves perhaps losing followers to this new Chosen of the Moon. The Solari would have been gaining quite a bit of a power over the mountain, and perhaps they liked this power they held over everyone, especially the Elders. That power extended generations, though, as evidenced by how the Rakkor so easily allowed the Solari to take Leona and how the Rakkor don't attempt to take food from the Solari when they've struggled for so long. But having a new culture spring up around the Radiant Dawn's antithesis, well... it's not easy to say they intially saw these new Lunari as a threat, but they were different and new and there was a very real chance these people could take this power from them.

Either way, I do think the two cultures did coexist at one time based on a quote from Diana's AMA (“The Solari and the moon-worshipping culture once coexisted. For a time, neither advocated the destruction of the other, but something went wrong. I don't want to go into a lot of detail as to exactly what happened between them, but the mural in Diana's teaser image does give some clues.”). You could see in the teaser, alone, that the Lunari had their own temple, perhaps once as grand as the Solari's, to live in and possibly flourish in. What could have driven the two cultures apart could have been based around the moonstone from Nami's lore. Perhaps the Lunari somehow made a connection with the Marai and were the ones who traded the moonstone for the abyssal pearl. This trade would have to benefit both of them, though I don't know how, but it could have granted the Lunari more power over the Solari, which is something the Solari could have seen as a threat.

I could continue sharing my brainstorms if anyone is interested.

cHAncEman129210/20/2014, 5:17:01 PM1 votes

I always thought of the Solari has this sort of cult that sought to seek a means to subjugate the Rakkor through religious dogma. Taking one of their champions as a "paragon of the sun" seems most fitting.

Also recall... that by birth Diana was part of the Solari Cult and Leona was part of the Rakkor Clan. An important point that I think needs to emphasized is that** Leona was taken from the Rakkor by the Solari to be their paragon. **

WHAT TRULY MAKES THIS TRAGIC...is both Diana and Leona don't know what they are fighting for. Diana is much more so lashing out because a lifetime of oppression instead of for the history of a lost people (Lunari) . Leona is a bastion for a religious cult whom's intentions aren't fully known to her. Even a Rioter has said that Leona probably didn't know the full extent of how the Council treated Diana.

Diana x Me10/23/2014, 12:31:01 AM1 votes

I'm trying to figure out why Diana was allowed to bypass all the rakkorian laws. Just because you were born to parents that were apart of the Solari at the time doesn't mean you should just be exempt from everything. Solari are rakkorian warriors who have chosen to take up the mantle to worship the Sun after their retirement. Are they not still considered Rakkorian citizens? She should have been forced into training. Is it the fact that being a Solari means you have greater authority? Something does not seem right.

dialMARK4acti0n10/23/2014, 1:31:14 PM1 votes

I gotta say Captain! I love your discussions.

I honestly don't think the Solari and the Lunari can ever reconcile. One of them is the complete opposite of the other. Moon, Sun. Dark, Light. Even if they did achieve peace, I don't think it would last. It'd probably end just like it did all those years ago...

NeoJusteBelmont11/19/2014, 12:12:30 AM1 votes

Like I stated on the above, the Solari elders are dual-faced. They present themselves as total goody-two-shoes to Leona and they never reveal about the abuses they did on Diana. So when Diana killed them, in Leona's eyes, it's equal to someone killing a beloved master and a revered figurehead.

That was just one reason she's out to make Diana pay. The other one, well, after the elders' death, she's next in line of Solari leadership. Knowing her personality, the protective types, she is obliged to protect her people, in which if Diana wants main targets, it'd be the Solari people, her people. IronStylus' words still holds true that all these put a strain on Leona because she loved Diana. But yeah, the only thing she can do right now is to act like a leader of the Solari.

Well, maybe until someone reveals to Leona that the Solari elders are dual-faced, making Diana's rage justified.

Sheesh, it's making me wish Riot would include a survivor of Diana's slaughter that still held the belief of the elders to become a champion. Someone that's like encouraging Leona to just kill off Diana rather than mending their relationship.

Champion Reveal Solari Elder #6.

Riot, plz!