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Should Yorick summon zombies instead of ghouls?

GreenLore··18 votes·2,696 views

So yeah Yorick is going to get a pretty update eventually and while I think that his necromancer/grave-digger identity is going to stay,I ask myself if he should keep his ghouls or summon zombies instead. I mean Necromancers usually swarm the battlefield with undeads(and I guess that this is going to stay to some extent in yoricks kit) and zombies are pretty much THE undead creature known for attacking in large groups,so it would definetly fit with yoricks thematic.Sure Skeletons are also a popular choice,but we know that this isn't gonna happen because it would go against the chinese culture.

Also zombies are such mindless creatures,I doubt there'll be ever a zombie-themed champion(aside from skins obviously) and Yoricks rework is pretty much the best chance to include zombies as part of a champion. Ghouls on the other hand are sometimes depicted more intelligent and I think they could actually offer some potential for a champion(unstoppable need to eat flesh,monstrous claws and ability to eat the corpses)

So what do you think? http://orig02.deviantart.net/c563/f/2011/321/d/e/yorick_on_duty_by_woocushwashi-d4ggqs9.jpg

29 Comments

Cetri4 votes

Ghouls do make sense as things that would follow around a gravedigger. After all, once he finishes a job they have a "fresh" meal waiting on them. I imagine over the years they'd build some kind of symbiotic relationship, the ghouls using Yorick for food and Yorick using the ghouls as guards.

GreenLore2 votes

That is actually a cool arguement,but then again,wouldn't they dig up the corpses again to eat them? I mean ghouls eat corpses,so there wouldn't be much left to bury.

junglerboy163 votes

Ghouls are incorporeal evil spirits, so they don't have to physically dig up the body to consume it.

GreenLore1 votes

Depends on the version of ghouls. In the original myths the ghoul might have typically inhabited graveyards,but was actually known to feast on the living. They could also shapeshift into hyenas and humans. Ghouls were described as some sort of jinn,but it wasn't specified how incorporal they really are.

More modern versions of the ghoul depict them mostly as undead corpse eaters,usually slightly monstrous looking and this also applies to Yoricks ghouls.

Shénzhì2 votes

{quoted}

[ORIGINAL POST]

Yorick's rework could begin a new Role archetype that focuses on siege tactics sending waves of zombies with lane minions or even reanimate dead lane minions.

  1. Juggernaut
  1. Tank
  2. Fighter
  3. Assassin
  4. Mage
  5. Support
  6. Marksman
  7. Summoner

Who would be a Summoner?

  • the Serpent Caller: (replace Fizz) Why not? The Black Market Brawler minions are already set to be summoned by a Serpent Caller. Makes sense - can happen.
  • Zha'Kroth: (champion concept) The essence of the Void. Mutates and evolves minions and monsters, maybe.

Who else would become Summoners?

  • Annie: (may be kept as a Mage)
  • Azir: Summons his ... immortal slaves.
  • Heimerdinger: Summons his stationary turrets. (does this already!)
  • Zyra: Summon enchanted wildlife, stationary or mobile.
  • Malhazar: Summon Voidborn to besiege the corporeal world.
  • Fiddlesticks: A repurposed demon Fiddlesticks may sweep lanes with terror.
  • Yorick: A repurposed Yorick could raise zombies and sweep lanes with the Harrowing.

Remind yourselves that you cannot win a match without reaching and destroying the Nexus. This new archetype boasts lane-pushing. Their completely new playstyle may actually be the one major thing missing from this game! Consequent item changes would include re-purposing lane-control items against enemy Summoners and AoE damage items for teams without strong lane-pushing.

#"playstyle missing from this game!"

Ebonmaw Dragon1 votes

{quoted}

  • Azir: Summons his ... immortal slaves.

Actually, he shapes the sand in order to give it form of a soldier of Shurima, he doesn't summons anything.

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

Azir NONSENSE. THE ORDER IS GIVEN

Meep Man1 votes

I think it would be cool if they reworked the minion systems of a lot of the older minions when the Yorick update went out, like Annie Tibbers and Malzahar Voidling and Shaco Boxes.

ArticFever1 votes

ghouls are basically rampped up zombies and zombies traditional are not that fast which if the ghouls were slow they wouldn't be that effective

Sharjo1 votes

Why not have a best of both worlds go at it and have Yorick dig up different kinds of undead? With this in mind the thing he brings up could have different behaviors and actions they adhere to. He could summon ghouls, zombies, spectres, wights and other nasties. We don't know a lot about how becoming an undead works in Runeterra and the necromantic sorcery that surrounds it, and I feel like Yorick could be a window through which to explore this subject.

Rebonack1 votes

I mean Necromancers usually swarm the battlefield with undeads(and I guess that this is going to stay to some extent in yoricks kit) and zombies are pretty much THE undead creature known for attacking in large groups,so it would definetly fit with yoricks thematic.

The flesh eating sort? Nah, those are ghouls.

Zombies are mindless undead with no hunger for flesh pretty much by definition.

GreenLore1 votes

The differentiation between zombies and ghouls is usually up to the author,but zombies are usually the ones who hunger for living flesh(there is a whole genre about zombies like that).

Ghouls on the other hand are usually more corpse eaters,more savage,sometimes more intelligent too(and sometimes they are pretty much identical to regular zombies).

I mean sure,zombies weren't like that in the original myths,but the same goes for ghouls too.

Rebonack1 votes

{quoted}

The differentiation between zombies and ghouls is usually up to the author,but zombies are usually the ones who hunger for living flesh(there is a whole genre about zombies like that).

Ghouls on the other hand are usually more corpse eaters,more savage,sometimes more intelligent too(and sometimes they are pretty much identical to regular zombies).

I mean sure,zombies weren't like that in the original myths,but the same goes for ghouls too.

They're explicitly called ghouls in the original Night of the Living Dead, which sorta defined the genre.

As with any fantasy thing, of course it comes down to what the author decides to do. But if we're talking the folklore basis of both, zombies are magcially enthralled people (who don't hunger for flesh) while ghouls are cannibalistic desert spirits that eat people whether they happen to be alive or dead. Of the two, the latter is a bit closer to the modern depiction of 'zombie'.

Obviously things have changed a bit over the years. Words evolve. Popular depictions of folklore alter along with society. 'Zombie' has come to mean any mindless animated sorta-dead thing. In some cases it even gets used with monsters that are actually intelligent.

It probably doesn't matter a great deal, but I for one prefer lesser used folklore (undead or not) getting some time in the lime-light rather than everything just being vampires and zombies all the time. There are tons of really neat concepts out there that could see use. Heck, I think it would be great if Yorick could summon four totally different types of undead rather than having three ghouls and a fetch.

GreenLore1 votes

While the mythological ghoul was more similar to the modern zombie in terms of behavior,their abilities/beings vary much more(ghouls were shapeshifting jinn,which is pretty different from zombies,but zombies were always rather mindless)

Yorick being able to summon different kinds of undeads also sounds like a cool idea,but I'm pretty sure he is going to keep one "swarm" spell,because that is pretty iconic for necromancers.

Stars Shaper1 votes

I think Ghouls fit more because Zombies (aka, dead humans) would be made inhabitants of the SI and turned into ghost giving Morde priority over them. Ghouls on the other hand seem less human-like.

GreenLore1 votes

The ghouls that he currently uses also seem to be dead humans. Malformed dead humans,but still dead humans...

Stars Shaper1 votes

If I remember correctly ghouls are usually humans too in origin deprived of free will and a sort of more vigil but more beastly zombies. While zombies have a more strict canon in terms of what they are, ghouls are subject to more interpretations. This can make them usable for Yorick if they are a sort of "bad mud golems with dead/corrupted/decomposed stuff added" rather thana ctual human beings with their souls added or not.

GreenLore1 votes

While that is a possibility,I kinda doubt it. One of Yoricks core themes that is most likely going to stay is his identity as a necromancer,him summoning some sort of mud golems instead of actual dead bodies would seem rather off for that.

Stars Shaper1 votes

I used the term "mud golems" but I really meant dead things without soul attached so that still applies as necromancy. I feel like Yorick is still midway between a gravedigger and a necromancer, probably the rework will state how much close/far from them he is.

GreenLore1 votes

well zombies aren't necessarily with a soul either.

Stars Shaper1 votes

Usually zombie apocalypse tales don't go into that detail xD

Meep Man1 votes

I kind of want a hybrid. Like, not very human, yet undead looking beings. Nothing ghosty looking, but not human.

Levik1 votes

Personally, I think that nothing in Yorick's kit tells the story of a Gravedigger. I would like any kit changes to properly convey Yorick's core identity, similar to how Darius/Garen/Skarner's changes have told a portion of their fantasy. Darius tears you apart through your weakness, Skarner protects things, and Garen = justice. Currently, Yorick's kit tells the story of a necromancer as opposed to an undead gravedigger from the Shadow Isles.

Squidsmastah1 votes

I'd have to say keep the ghouls. I mean think about it. If you are a necromancer, which would you choose? A mindless, stupid, slow, weak zombie that only cares about eating everyone's flesh. Or a fast, strong, and relatively smart ghoul that actually knows it's fighting by your side as a soldier and will protect you at all costs. So really, I would pick ghouls over zombies.

FYI: We also have enough fucking zombie relatated things when it comes to undead and horror.

GreenLore1 votes

Well it is always a question what is avaliable to your powers.

We don't know if yorick has the option to choose if he wants to revive zombies or ghouls. Not to mention that yoricks current ghouls also don't seem more intelligent than zombies.

DeloricVI1 votes

Also zombies are such mindless creatures,I doubt there'll be ever a zombie-themed champion(aside from skins obviously)

Sion

GreenLore1 votes

He doesn't really strike me as a zombie. He is undead sure,but there are many kinds of undeads.

With zombies you associate more something like zombie brand.

DeloricVI1 votes

Well, Sion is slow (limps along the battlefield at regular movement speed) and has a hunger for battle like a normal zombie has a hunger for... human brains or something. He's not able to freely think for himself, with his reworked lore, and he is pretty hard to put down... even after you kill him once... he fits the bill quite well, in my opinion. His new mechanics don't fit so well, but when do they these days? Have you seen Ekko's kit compared to the teaser?

I'd argue close enough... but it's your opinion so don't let me tell you different, lol.

GreenLore1 votes

Yeah in the end it boils down to how you define a zombie.

I had recently an arguement with someone about wether or not frankensteins monster could be considered a zombie or not and we agreed on the monster being similar to a zombie,but still different,like how Gorillas and chimpanzees are both apes,yet different species. I'd say Sions case is a bit like that,he has similarities to zombies,but is still too different to be one(he doesn't hunger for flesh,he still can think to some extent and he is by no means slow when using his ult)

But in the end we are talking about ficitonal species here,so its not like there is a clear definition of zombies.

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