What stops you from muting toxic players?

Hexs Fortune·Jul 5, 2017·6 votes·721 views

I'm seeing alot of players get banned for engaging in toxic back and forth. Whats stopping you from just muting them with intent to report at end of game?

21 Comments

TrulyBlandJul 5, 201710 votes

Short version? https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png

RainXBladeJul 6, 20171 votes

Apparently, this is why I keep going back to the LoL boards and Reddit; to see if someone is wrong about something in the game and that I want to correct them; either in a shit-talk kind of way or be merciful about it.

ElezzroJul 6, 20171 votes

I see xkcd, I upvote.

FioraWillCarryJul 5, 20176 votes

Human beings have an instinct for retaliation. When someone calls you a retard, it triggers an intense desire to retaliate. It takes a lot of self awareness to realize you're succumbing to automatic responses to certain stimuli.

BeatzBoyFTWJul 5, 20172 votes

"Damn, my team is damn terrible at the game!

Maybe if I shit-talk at them as much as I can, it would magically win us the game!"

That's what I would think in their perspective.

RainXBladeJul 6, 20171 votes

It's either that or they just need to protect their ego by putting the blame at someone else.

scazzmanJul 6, 20172 votes

For me. Im often afraid to mute, because in low elo, if a toxic player figures out you've muted them, they will often resort to gameplay trolling. And negative chat and possible afk farming/not helping is easier to carry then someone running down mid. also lets say you've said something "mildly" negative in chat, you actually do need to defend yourself if they start lying about the extent of your chat . Example lets say you said "oh shit " earlier in the game. But now a player is saying you're spamming racial slurs. A "hate speech" report might be treated more seriously by the ban bot then one of the "lesser" chat reports. And might be more likely to hit you with a chat restriction If it detects trigger words

So now you're forced to leave that player off mute. Because you need to be able to let the enemy team know they're lying.

I know people will say "that's not how it works" and it's probably true. But riot has a tendency to go back on their word or pussyfoot on things. ESPECIALLY regarding player behavior. So anything they say is taken with a grain of salt regarding the report system

Examples include

The tribunal : has been unofficially abandoned for 3 years now

Hidden report weight: made people afraid to report for gameplay trolling. Because the Ifs cant detect it, so reports for anything other than chat makes your reports gradually more worthless And then all of a sudden Tantram says that it was eliminated when the IFS was first introduced. 3 years after the fact.

Manual reports via support ticket They never say whether this actually does anything. Or if you need to actually make it to the postgame screen

The distrust of riot is especially true for punished players. Many of whom had no issues until they switched to an automated system. "Myself included"

For all we know the bot doesnt review anything at all and simply counts how often you get reported for each category and then punishes you based on what you got reported for.

zPOOPzJul 6, 20172 votes

With the 1 report = 9 reports policy, it honestly matters so very little if someone is lying to the opposing team. If the troll reported you, having the other 5 enemy team reported you on top does literally nothing since the troll's report alone would have trigger the IFS scan anyway.

As someone who often have the enemy team flame their teammate and having the enemy teammate try to justify the flame, I simply do not care what's going on with their team because there is no way i can judge for myself based on either of their story.

Don't worry if the troll tried to lie to the enemy team about you. It doesn't do anything if the troll himself already reported you. Do not involved the enemy team into your All Chat battle.

Just mute the troll and keep him muted.

I consider anyone dragging their team's "baggage" into All Chat a toxic person (I may or may not report that person) whether you are the flamer or someone who's trying to defend himself. It is your team's problem. Don't drag the other 5 opposing players into it. They are not involved and should not be involved.

scazzmanJul 6, 20172 votes

{quoted}

With the 1 report = 9 reports policy, it honestly matters so very little if someone is lying to the opposing team. If the troll reported you, having the other 5 enemy team reported you on top does literally nothing since the troll's report alone would have trigger the IFS scan anyway.

As someone who often have the enemy team flame their teammate and having the enemy teammate try to justify the flame, I simply do not care what's going on with their team because there is no way i can judge for myself based on either of their story.

Don't worry if the troll tried to lie to the enemy team about you. It doesn't do anything if the troll himself already reported you. Do not involved the enemy team into your All Chat battle.

Just mute the troll and keep him muted.

I consider anyone dragging their team's "baggage" into All Chat a toxic person (I may or may not report that person) whether you are the flamer or someone who's trying to defend himself. It is your team's problem. Don't drag the other 5 opposing players into it. They are not involved and should not be involved.

Except if you read my entire post. You will see that i don't believe a word riot says regarding player behavior.

KartagiaJul 6, 20171 votes

I have case which proved no humans are involved.

4 players bullied me whole game. After game I got chat log of that game with 14 days suspension 2 seconds after game. And Riot support refused to review it as "behavior of other players does not mattar":

TrulyBlandJul 6, 20172 votes

A) There were no humans involved in the actual punishment.

B) There obviously was a human involved the moment you contacted the support, which is the failsafe for a system like this.

C) Behaviour of the other players does not matter. This is possibly the one part of Riot's rules that they are extremely explicit about.

D) Did they state that they didn't review it, or are you just assuming they didn't because they didn't come to the conclusion you expected?

Look, if you think you didn't deserve the punishment, just share your logs in this thread or another. Because from the little information that you gave away, I am almost 100% certain that you simply misjudge how the community views your actions. Maybe getting other peoples' perspective on your logs might help.

KartagiaJul 6, 20171 votes

{quoted}

A) There were no humans involved in the actual punishment.

B) There obviously was a human involved the moment you contacted the support, which is the failsafe for a system like this.

That human said "I will not investigate". Thus there was no human involved. You can say there was human involved as bunch of griefers reporting me.

C) Behaviour of the other players does not matter. This is possibly the one part of Riot's rules that they are extremely explicit about.

RIot support has said to me "behavior of other players does not matter" as I told him review chat of other players. I got him to admit support staff cannot see chat of other players. ONly moment when chat of other players is checked is cases in which Riot staff does the checking. And that does mean Riot developers, not support personnel. Thus your "alternate facts" contradicts with my experience with EUNE support staff.

D) Did they state that they didn't review it, or are you just assuming they didn't because they didn't come to the conclusion you expected?

They refused to review it. THey refused to comment talk of other players. That was after I got through 3 automatic replies from support with support staff not even reading the description of report.

Should I start posting those support messages here?

Look, if you think you didn't deserve the punishment, just share your logs in this thread or another. Because from the little information that you gave away, I am almost 100% certain that you simply misjudge how the community views your actions. Maybe getting other peoples' perspective on your logs might help.

My logs was not the case but chat of other players. And how they joined together total bashing of me, and how my report did nothing. I did also use that proof that there cannot be any Riot staff personnel involved due time frame of 2 seconds after game with chat log of that game. You totally ignore it as I did break your facts. THat is normal for your kind of Riot fanboys.

TrulyBlandJul 6, 20171 votes

All of this text to essentially admit your own misleading phrasing:

After game I got chat log of that game with 14 days suspension 2 seconds after game. And Riot support refused to review it as "behavior of other players does not mattar":

They did not refuse to review your chat logs. They refused to review the other players' logs, which makes sense because once again: One of the few rules that Riot is absolutely explicit about is that retaliating is not okay. Other players' behaviour does not excuse your own.

And once again Riot doesn't hide the fact that there is no human involvement in the actual punishment being dished out. That doesn't mean there is no human involvement in maintaining the system, sampling cases and, most importantly, support.

IF a punishment was issued in error, support will fix it. Yours simply was not an error. You broke the rules (which include not retaliating when subjected to other peoples' toxicity) and got punished for breaking the rules.

Final note: How do you know your report didn't do anything?

KartagiaJul 8, 20171 votes

You are again ignoring my point, which was to prove there is no human on RIot side involved in process. Support does not do reviewing of reports. The system is totally automatic based on number of reports, and thus 4 people reporting does have higher weight than 1 report.

And how do I know my report did nothing? Because those 4 people intentionally feeding and saying kys are still not banned on EUNE. The 4 players who reported me in that game did not get any punishment at all. Thus that contradicts the way RIot says that KYS is dealed with.

TrulyBlandJul 6, 20171 votes

But then what is your point? If you're not going to believe Riot in how the system works anyway, then how could they possibly improve it for you? Assuming for a second that they are lying, presuming that the problems you are describing are a thing... then what exactly would Riot have to change for you to believe that they have actually fixed them? Because evidently you will believe that these problems exist regardless of whether or not they do.

Why discuss a system, where you will always believe that it functions exactly the way you believe it functions, regardless of the facts, regardless of information you receive by Riot and regardless of changes that are made to it? This is as pointless as discussing religious belief.

As for your previous statement:

The distrust of riot is especially true for punished players. Many of whom had no issues until they switched to an automated system. "Myself included"

That's because the previous system was pretty fucking horrible. One of the biggest problems used to be that people wouldn't even know that their behaviour is unacceptable because they got away with it all the time.

KartagiaJul 6, 20172 votes

Muting them would not prevent their agitation of other players against the victim. By muting the flamer, you just gave him free reign to get whole team against you. And when they get this, you get 4 reports. Riot try to tell us those reports are false while everything we observe prove otherwise. The punishment system seems to be totally based on the number and weight of reports without any human involvement. And Riot has ensured that Support does not review the reports, as they can do nothing in case of false report. Thus for support staff reviewing report is just waste of time.

You cannot tell team that the flaming person is wrong. And tell why the flaming person is wrong. But Riot has made it policy that "you cannot teach people if they do not want to be taught!" which is absurdly STUPID.

RookPusherJul 6, 20171 votes

Uh, not really. If someone is consistently saying "Person X is trash" at a certain point you just think "Dude, enough, we get it." The guy saying nothing - in my experience - is rarely reported.

Also, it doesn't matter because 1 report (from the flammer) = 9 reports (from all others). There's no difference.

TrulyBlandJul 6, 20172 votes

Riot try to tell us those reports are false while everything we observe prove otherwise.

What proves otherwise? Be precise please.

The punishment system seems to be totally based on the number and weight of reports without any human involvement.

There is very low human involvement; zero involvement in fact for dishing out the punishment. That doesn't mean it's based on the number and weight of reports. Again: Why does it "seem" to work this way.

And Riot has ensured that Support does not review the reports, as they can do nothing in case of false report. Thus for support staff reviewing report is just waste of time.

And their money, which strongly suggests you are wrong about this. This is quite the claim you make here, but at least a very precise one. And precise claims can be proven with little effort, just go ahead and show a few cases where this actually happened, instead of just using handwaving arguments used to make people irrationally afraid.

zPOOPzJul 6, 20171 votes

So what if the flammer get "free reign" over the other 8 people? It is very likely the flammer going to report you (false or not), so the other 8 reports do not matter. 1 false report = 9 false report. If you refuse to mute the flammer, you are much more likely to response to the flammer (and this is where the "victim" goes from clean to toxic), which will turns that "false report" into a "punishable report".

In all honesty, if I have a flammer on the team that constantly flammed someone and the other guy did not respond at all, I am more than likely to report the flammer than the other guy because the flammer annoyed me more than someone who did not say a thing. That goes doubly so for the enemy team because i don't want to see that crap on All Chat. Keep your team's problem to your team.

McsquzzyJul 5, 20171 votes

I'm playing norms and don't care. In rank I mute on sight of toxicity since I generally tilt when I listen to them.

The Fuzzy 0neJul 6, 20171 votes

I don't re-engage, but I don't mute either. Most of the toxic stuff directed at me in game is not important and so I can just shrug it off, say nothing, and report at the end of the game. I don't mute cuz I want to see if there's more I can report them for. Chat is also very easy to ignore especially if you minimize it in your HUD.

The most I've done is ping muting because to me, that's more tilting than actual chat toxicity since you train yourself to listen for pings while playing rather than ignore them. The toxic players I've seen (especially if they've been chat banned) will actually ping spam more than actually saying mean words. I'm just thankful I can ping mute now