I really want to Honor replaced with something like Dawngate's Karma system

Fisherman Fizz·10/29/2015, 7:14:34 AM·50 votes·3,930 views

Among the several things that game did right, this was probably one of their best features. I have yet to see a game with a better system for rewarding players than this one. For those that aren't familiar with their Karma system, here's how it worked: every time you finished a game, before you got to the post-game lobby, you were shown all the players in the game and had the option to give them "Karma" if they had a positive impact on your game.

http://www.cheatmasters.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/dawngate_04.png

Once the timer ran out, you would get to essentially roll a dice for your end of game rewards. However, your roll was also heavily influenced by whether or not you won, how long the game was, and even more heavily by how many of the players in the game gave you Karma. In order to get the best tier of rewards, which could include their game's version of runes, or even new playable characters and skins if you were lucky, you HAD to get a good Karma rating in your game.

http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/adam/df164621162241cc20a1703e2768edc3/dawngate_endgame.gif

Now, here's why I think this system was amazing and why something similar would be awesome for this game:

  • It actually prompts you to choose people. It has you give Karma first thing after the game ends, and you cannot just X out of the screen; you had to wait until the timer finished to be able to leave the lobby. This gave you incentive to actually choose people to give Karma to, as opposed to our current equivalent, Honor, where you have a small button in the end-game lobby that is extremely easy to forget about or ignore. This also fixes the issue the current Honor system has, where people in bot games tend to give out Honor several times more often than anyone else.
  • The effect of getting Karma is instant. Literally the instant you finish giving out Karma, you get to your roll for your end of game rewards and can see how much of a bonus you got from Karma last game. For any sort of reinforcement or punishment contingency, the delay to your reward plays a huge role in how effective those rewards are, and you can't get any better in this regard than instant.
  • Everyone gets Karma. Unlike with Honor, where a small fraction of players ever get even a single reward out of it, literally every player will get Karma at some point, if not in every single game. With Honor, a ton of players feel like it doesn't matter because they never get anything out of it, ever, and neither does the vast majority of other players.
  • The rewards are actually meaningful. Currently, Honor only gives you one reward: a little banner on your loading screen and in champ select. This is a pretty small reward, and to a lot of people it's not something they could even remotely care about having. On the other hand, Karma was tied directly into how much in-game currency you got, and gave you the chance at getting a huge reward tier that could have things like entire characters unlocked. How awesome would it be if you got bonus IP literally EVERY GAME for being a positive player, and could even get free champs or skins out of it? Back when Dawngate was around, my main character, Dibs, was unlocked for me for free this way.

So yeah, this system kicked ass and something similar would be really cool to see in this game too.

49 Comments

ModWuks10/29/2015, 9:10:15 AM18 votes

I could definitely stand by this idea. I think it would definitely encourage not only honoring for positive behavior, but also positive behavior itself. But maybe I'm a bit biased because I'm still missing the IP to buy about 30 more champions and several runes and rune pages :P

For Carthage10/29/2015, 7:10:35 PM5 votes

I'm gonna be honest...

I just want Dawngate back.

Norscout10/29/2015, 8:28:48 AM5 votes

Dawn gate was truly a gem. I liked their in game vision and role systems too.

KING OF MASKS10/29/2015, 8:18:47 PM2 votes

DID SOMEBODY SAY... DAWNGATE!?!

But yes, this feature was just as brilliant as the rest of the game.

Jubbinaut10/29/2015, 2:28:16 PM2 votes

Personally, I'm a little wary of any system that forces you to use it. Additionally, I think Daen's got a very valid concern there regarding Karma-trading - once a system offers incentives that large, it needs validation.

Keep in mind, though, that the honor system isn't really done yet. There's up-coming integration with the new Tribunal (once that's out) to offer both validation of the honors given as well as more meaningful rewards.

Odinakos10/29/2015, 2:10:08 PM2 votes

My consern is that people will give karma to the player with best score thought his behavour was terrible. Instead of the kind, good person. Happens a lot now.

But it is a nice consept.

kaltenashes10/29/2015, 8:48:42 PM1 votes

Seens Wayyyyyyy Better than the actual honor system, i'd vote for it and maybe like getting 30 more ip or sorta depending on your honor is better than that icon on load screen

Okain10/29/2015, 10:03:45 PM1 votes

I think league should use some more features like these, they promote good behavior and people who have a history of negative behavior might consider turning over a new leaf if systems like these were implemented.

RisenDarkKnight10/29/2015, 11:28:47 PM1 votes

RIP Dawngate. That game did sooo many things right. Like being able to surrender suuuuuper early if you had an afk or the enemy team was up more than 10 kills, etc. And having champions not constrained by mana, supports getting more gold income, and a bunch of shapers with cool kits.

Reapuer10/30/2015, 1:41:29 AM1 votes

I love this! Even if it just determined the amount of IP you got or was used for punishment I think it would be good.

Maratsune10/30/2015, 3:35:02 AM1 votes

I love this kind of thing. The honor system should be fun and rewarding, but it's just forgotten about as is.

Blue Mystified10/30/2015, 4:02:08 AM1 votes

This is actually... really cool. I feel like honors needs to be more noticed or easier to access. I find myself saying frequently in games things like "wow this thresh is landing godlike hooks, I should give him teamwork!" and by the victory screen i forgot about honoring him and it's too lat ebecause i simply press play again to play more with my two friends. Maybe not make it mandatory, but certainly make it easier to access or remember or quicker to use. I don't think riot would ever give away free skins and champions for having good behavior (I mean, they have in the past, but not widescale like this is suggesting- this would be a new champ or skin free every week.) but IP boost i think would be nice. Even if it's just like 50 IP boost for getting like 3 karmas. It's a shame riot doesn't usually notice stuff like this, because this is a really neat idea that i'd love to see implemented.

FakeGravity10/30/2015, 5:23:32 AM1 votes

The real issue will be those that refuse to give you karma because they never get it themselves

Rather have a system to reward ppl for giving honor to ppl that actually deserve it (if you give to someone that have show already to be good you get more reward than if you give to someone with a toxic record)

BeastOG10/30/2015, 6:01:48 AM1 votes

Dammit, now I'm all weepy for remembering Dawngate. I miss Renzo :'(

Scorpio Flameth10/30/2015, 11:04:17 AM1 votes

I dig any changes to Honour System, also Karma

SpongebobIsLife10/30/2015, 11:07:42 AM1 votes

just want to input that some of the creators of Dawngate are creating a moba similar to it. I believe it's called Aetherforge, and right now it's in its alpha stage. I'm so pumped for it, Dawngate was retardedly fun.

ReQnosis10/30/2015, 1:06:25 PM1 votes

You should post this on Reddit or try to get the guy who runs Surrender@20 to retweet your post.

Not only is this system a much better replacement (meaningful) compared to our "Honor" system. But it also opens the door for Riot to create more fun/engaging systems to reward players for working together.

IE: Karma Rewards > Lyte's "Toxic chat" bans.

Maple Crusader11/2/2015, 9:22:03 PM1 votes

I like this idea. Makes it more meaningful to reward fellow players.

Rueian11/2/2015, 9:24:36 PM1 votes

Issue being IP has no meaning in the game at the moment for veteran players.

Dweeebles10/4/2017, 6:31:19 AM1 votes

Yeah the DG system was awesome! It was so good it helped promote positive attitudes in game and made people feel active in the community and in game even if they didn't dominate. You got great rewards and that made you want to be a better player so you could get more rewards. The current LOL is not great. Passive, no involvement with the community (can only honor 1 person and not opponents...) and useless rewards that are barely even noticeable. Not sure what the LOL team was thinking.

Razgriz Stra1ts10/29/2015, 10:42:36 AM1 votes

I agree completely. Among the dozens of serious big errors with Riot, ethically and systematically, this is a big one that is directly related to in game experience.

Daen10/29/2015, 2:17:20 PM1 votes

Hmm. My only concern with that Karma system would be whether or not the reward system incentivized people to beg for Karma or otherwise pander in order to get it. Did you feel like that was a problem in Dawngate?

FostXTV10/29/2015, 4:25:31 PM1 votes

How Wuks and Daen have blue names :3? Karma system would be nice. I owned Mentor Ribbon and Riot took it away for no reason. Just because I wasnt on for 2 weeks due vacation which is unfair. We really need honor system that will actually reward positive players.

Puynsi10/29/2015, 5:55:40 PM1 votes

Time to rev up those karmas. But I have a question, will it end like the honor trade? Also, teamwork ribbon ftw.

RamboDash1510/29/2015, 8:39:03 PM1 votes

I'd love this idea, I get honour all the time, (just from being a decent human being), and I have nothing to show from it despite having received all of the banners at least once. This would be a great addition to the community.