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Sabotaging your team does NOT get an excuse by being positive

Eternal Torment··14 votes·1,150 views

i just wanted to throw this one out as an informative post because a lot of people seem to misconfuse something.

that something is: trolling= intentional feeding ONLY. that is FALSE. Trolling, or in the reports written down as Griefing, is not just intentionally feeding. it consists of EVERY FORM OF GAMEPLAY OR BEHAVIOUR AT THE EXPENSE OF YOUR TEAMMATES. It does NOT!!! matter if you have a positive KDA or carry the game, if you do so by ruining someone elses experience, you have still trolled this one Person. trolling does not regard itself on victory or losing, much like toxicity does not either. winning does not excuse you enjoying the game AT THE EXPENSE OF OTHERS. Trolling no matter in what state of the game is not okay, and can, should and hopefully will be reported.

now, we all know there will be this one (excuse the rude language, just having a rough day) duckworshipping satanic that says "but tryndamere is basically made for solo-joy and disregarding your team through killcollection and splitpush. you can't report someone for playing tryndamere." and that phrase in the literal sense is true. BUT if you purposely take someone's hard effort away to help yourself out, per say, an adc 2v1ing botlane, burned all summs on both sides down and is about to win with the final aa and you just strut into lane and take both kills then walk away with an "thx" in chat, that is in a normal case considered an toxic attitude. why? let me explain like this:

Bad mannering. or in short BMing. you spat your adc directly in his face with that "thx" leaving a sour insulting stench on him which later on will transcend in mutual salt and toxicity. and this form of provocant behaviour is negative attitude, and much like the previous point mentioned, will not be excused whatsoever by victory or positive scoring. EVERY point of negativity in league, everything that you can be reported for is independant on individual or teamrespective situation. you can go 16/0 on a yi for all that's cared, if you Insult someone just once, you can and will be punished. and that example of no-excuse policy goes for direct and indirect toxicity aswell. if you badmouth anyone, and add in some false tough guy act by saying you don't care and LAUGH at that Person, you are transicioning from indirect into direct toxicity right there. just like before, you will ask me how that can be, and i will explain how:

Offensive behaviour. now, people will say "offensive" just means the standart pack of vocab, meaning extreme swearing, racism, sexism, bigotry and any other form of hatespeech or otherwise directly offending topic to count. now, note that hatespeech and offensive language/negative attitude are SEPARATEDLY sorted in the reports, and why that is? because insulting and black Humor are not the only Things counted as such. if you Insult someone, directly by swearing, calling out for fake reports through premade pressure or by lying, or indirectly by spitting at them, figuretively spoken, then that too is considered offensive behaviour. if someone suffers negative experiences from the game, per say as an example, gets ganged on by the enemies all the time because you as a support don't wanna support him by purpose, then not only is that trolling, but if you also laugh at him, and excuse your behaviour with stuff like "im having fun so chill" or "we are winning so stop whining" or "troll? look my score" then you add in negative behaviour and even possibly offensive speech into it aswell, because you openly and directly make fun of your teammates suffering just so you can get some benefit from it.

this is purely the purpose of informing, a lot of people have a vague and tunneled perspective on the points that are encounted for as "reportable" by riot, and often dwelve in some false sense of arrogant overconfidence only to later suffer a suspension. the Kinda people you see in boards claim it was undeserved? yeah, those are the very people i am addressing right now in this post. the points of a report reach far wider and deeper than most people care to believe and/or admit.

my advice, read Things through properly and dont grow the douchebaggery arrogance like the others, reading the ToS gives you major information not only about what you agree on, but also what riot considers a breaking of their rules and to what extend such can be treated with.

28 Comments

archerno17 votes

You wrote wall of text but you are wrong. There are certain strategies that are effective but your teammates might not enjoy so they accuse you of trolling.

Ill give u something from personal experience. I played Ekko on my low gold account. I was constantly split pushing and backdooring to the point where enemy team didnt dare leave base. My team however, only wanted to fight enemies and called me troll for not grouping. Basically i took alone 3 towers bot, 1 mid, 2 nexus towers, 2 towers top, killed inhibs 6+ times and backdoored win when enemy team was fighting with mine for Elder drake. In post game both my team and enemy team flamed and agreef to report me (which ofc did nothing).

Trolling DOES regard itself on victory. Its definition is trying your hardest to lose game for your team. If your tactic or gameplay leads to win then its not trolling but effective strategy. If you are support and your ADC is utter trash and you leave him, roam and get your top and mid ahead ultimately leading to win ,then you DID NOT troll.

Eternal Torment1 votes

if you leave him, you can and will be considered one if you did not thoroughly communicate it through. in a team-oriented game you can't make selfish decisions. i had to learn it the hard way (which trust me is a lot more painful to your pride than you take it for) that if you leave your adc like that just because he is losing in that very stage of the game, it can actually be considered an sabotage of someone elses experience of the game, regardless if you bring benefit, and ultimately, victory to the others. a win feels worthless to the Player if he himself ultimately lost against his own very teammates he suppostedly was meant to trust.

sure, if you take objectives, become an active threat to the enemy where they can't ignore you at all, it will likely bring your game a win, but if you do so by enjoying the fact it is at someone elses expense, that will be considered trolling said teammate. the key factor here isn't victory, but communication. if you did attempt to clarify your intent and your teammates just stubbornly disagreed because they above all else wanted it their way, then that is another story entirely, but if you didn't clarify what you wanted to do, or even took pride in your action considering someone else is influenced by it, then that is by riot's rules considered trolling.

the smite-singed Player from a while back serves a prime example to that. almost (but only almost) got himself permanently banned because despite his strategy carrying him high into elo in S6 and giving both him and his teammates high amounts of win he still got his legitimate punishments because despite having done his best efforts, he ultimately did so at the expense of someone's experience of the game. the game alone here didn't Play much of a factor, but the emotional influence served played the greated factor here.

it may get you off once or twice, but on the long run it will only get you punished, even if the case should be unjust by your feeling.

i'll say it again just incase people lost track of my wall of Texts: the key is not victory, but communication and your behaviour.

archerno12 votes

[{quoted}](name=Click R for Win,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=E9NB0iPK,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-06-09T16:23:54.710+0000)

if you leave him, you can and will be considered one if you did not thoroughly communicate it through. in a team-oriented game you can't make selfish decisions. i had to learn it the hard way (which trust me is a lot more painful to your pride than you take it for) that if you leave your adc like that just because he is losing in that very stage of the game, it can actually be considered an sabotage of someone elses experience of the game, regardless if you bring benefit, and ultimately, victory to the others. a win feels worthless to the Player if he himself ultimately lost against his own very teammates he suppostedly was meant to trust.

sure, if you take objectives, become an active threat to the enemy where they can't ignore you at all, it will likely bring your game a win, but if you do so by enjoying the fact it is at someone elses expense, that will be considered trolling said teammate. the key factor here isn't victory, but communication. if you did attempt to clarify your intent and your teammates just stubbornly disagreed because they above all else wanted it their way, then that is another story entirely, but if you didn't clarify what you wanted to do, or even took pride in your action considering someone else is influenced by it, then that is by riot's rules considered trolling.

the smite-singed Player from a while back serves a prime example to that. almost (but only almost) got himself permanently banned because despite his strategy carrying him high into elo in S6 and giving both him and his teammates high amounts of win he still got his legitimate punishments because despite having done his best efforts, he ultimately did so at the expense of someone's experience of the game. the game alone here didn't Play much of a factor, but the emotional influence served played the greated factor here.

it may get you off once or twice, but on the long run it will only get you punished, even if the case should be unjust by your feeling.

i'll say it again just incase people lost track of my wall of Texts: the key is not victory, but communication and your behaviour.

Nah ,you are wrong. Feelings are irelevant. Just because my teammate values kills over objectives doesnt mean that im gonna sabotage my chance of winning just so i wouldn't hurt his feelings. Its a team game ,yes, but you are ranked based SOLELY on whether you WON or LOST.

Eternal Torment1 votes

i'll just repeat what i said, look up the highest mastery points singed topic, you will see that his strategy got him nearly permanently banned regardless of him getting an near 56% winrate the way he played. a person's feelings very well do matter, why else do you think negative attitude, hatespeech and the likes are reportable to begin with? while being rude in itself is punishable, in LoL it ultimately Comes to how hurtful it is to the others that will determine how severe it is. that's why calling someone a (i am VERY sorry for this word) f***ot just once, even "as a joke" can get you instantly, and in some cases permanently suspended, not only because it is considered hatespeech, but also because it is considered very hurtful.

if you believe that someone's emotional state for the game does not matter at all, then i think you are not suited for anything in life that even remotely includes Teamwork. sorry if i Sound harsh right now, but that's how Things stand. someone with injured feelings can't properly Play, will be very vurnerable to tilt and is likely losing the game

riot, to underline that, even sometimes post a tooltip in the loading Screen. "tilted Players lose XX% more often"

archerno12 votes

[{quoted}](name=Click R for Win,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=E9NB0iPK,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-09T16:38:49.493+0000)

i'll just repeat what i said, look up the highest mastery points singed topic, you will see that his strategy got him nearly permanently banned regardless of him getting an near 56% winrate the way he played. a person's feelings very well do matter, why else do you think negative attitude, hatespeech and the likes are reportable to begin with? while being rude in itself is punishable, in LoL it ultimately Comes to how hurtful it is to the others that will determine how severe it is. that's why calling someone a (i am VERY sorry for this word) f***ot just once, even "as a joke" can get you instantly, and in some cases permanently suspended, not only because it is considered hatespeech, but also because it is considered very hurtful.

if you believe that someone's emotional state for the game does not matter at all, then i think you are not suited for anything in life that even remotely includes Teamwork. sorry if i Sound harsh right now, but that's how Things stand. someone with injured feelings can't properly Play, will be very vurnerable to tilt and is likely losing the game

riot, to underline that, even sometimes post a tooltip in the loading Screen. "tilted Players lose XX% more often"

Stop using Singed as example. He wasnt perma banned. He was nearly perma banned because his strategy didnt always work and in a lot of games it led to him losing game for his team. Also it was his sole strategy, he didnt use it because he believed that his ADC cant help him win game as he never went bot lane.

Hate speech is different. It targets groups of people who went through a lot of abuse throughout centuries. A white person can hardly be hurt himself if someone calls him N word and will be more offended if someone calls him moron/idiot yet you are more likely to get perma banned if u call him N word right? Regardless of his feelings.

Eternal Torment1 votes

you didn't Research it at all huh? the singed Thing i Keep bringing up is because it is the best existing example of this topic AND you taking Things your way for the sole purpose to wrong this post.

he didn't nearly get perma banned because he suffered many losses, which he didn't considering he had an nearly 56% winrate, he got himself nearly banned because his strategy, and i Quote, NEGATIVELY AFFECTED HIS TEAMMATES AND HE WAS ACCUSED OF LACK OF COOPERATION AND COMMUNICATION because most of the times, despite winning, his teammates to the bitter end did not agree to his playstyle and suffered a horrible experience, regardless of an positive Outcome. he was considered punishable because of the sheer amount of Players that suffered a negative experience. had it been one party he'd by all means not have gotten a scratch, but since it wasn't just one soloq team, but many, and i say MANY he still got a good hit where it really hurts.

meaning, as i said, maybe once or twice the "unconventional strategy" might get you away with an win, but actively running it on the long run will just get you punished.

and no, nothing is "different". the offense to someone's emotional state does not determine itself by background and the "General standing". if someone gets seriously hurt by what you said, REGARDLESS of what that something is, then in LoL such can get you punished.

if you by this point still think that win/loss stands above communication, teamplay and sportsmanlike standing, then not only have you not read a single Thing i said, but proven yourself unsuitable for this game. and while i cannot force you to anything, i am increasingly growing scared at your future teammates' respective states of mind if they meet you.

archerno13 votes

[{quoted}](name=Click R for Win,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=E9NB0iPK,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-09T16:58:32.572+0000)

you didn't Research it at all huh? the singed Thing i Keep bringing up is because it is the best existing example of this topic AND you taking Things your way for the sole purpose to wrong this post.

he didn't nearly get perma banned because he suffered many losses, which he didn't considering he had an nearly 56% winrate, he got himself nearly banned because his strategy, and i Quote, NEGATIVELY AFFECTED HIS TEAMMATES AND HE WAS ACCUSED OF LACK OF COOPERATION AND COMMUNICATION because most of the times, despite winning, his teammates to the bitter end did not agree to his playstyle and suffered a horrible experience, regardless of an positive Outcome. he was considered punishable because of the sheer amount of Players that suffered a negative experience. had it been one party he'd by all means not have gotten a scratch, but since it wasn't just one soloq team, but many, and i say MANY he still got a good hit where it really hurts.

meaning, as i said, maybe once or twice the "unconventional strategy" might get you away with an win, but actively running it on the long run will just get you punished.

and no, nothing is "different". the offense to someone's emotional state does not determine itself by background and the "General standing". if someone gets seriously hurt by what you said, REGARDLESS of what that something is, then in LoL such can get you punished.

if you by this point still think that win/loss stands above communication, teamplay and sportsmanlike standing, then not only have you not read a single Thing i said, but proven yourself unsuitable for this game. and while i cannot force you to anything, i am increasingly growing scared at your future teammates' respective states of mind if they meet you.

You keep talking nonsense. Why dont u use Disco Heat as example there? He has a whole series of videos dedicated to weird strategies where people flame him, yet he was never even close to punishment. Even really high ELO players like Dopa and more mute their teammates on start and focus on their own strategy.

Communication weird strategies isnt required because of their feelings, but because it can backfire due to them not knowing what you do, ultimately leading to loss

Eternal Torment1 votes

i'll just yet AGAIN repeat myself: you didn't Research it at all huh? the difference with disco heat is, he always gives proof that he to his best possibilities tried to communicate, it is often his teammates who just selfishly disagree and call out for reports over it.

i mentioned it before, there is a difference between them being selfish and you being selfish. to you i appear as talking nonsense because you won't take it that you got away once does not mean you will get away with it every time. sometimes teammates really are just selfish douchebags, but if it honestly affects someone negatively, then nothing you do or say will change you trolled said someone. regardless of win, or hard carrying, the ultimate factors are communication and influence, behaviour in other words.

as i said, i can't force you to anything, but of over 3 years of experience, and carefully following every single post on the boards that claim to "having been banned unjustly" i can tell you as an well-meant advice to not be so arrogant upon your own opinion. that very tunneled view you have is what you see in 2 out of 3 board Posts, the ones that usually end up with 20+ negative votes, followed by massively negative and tilted behaviour.

archerno12 votes

[{quoted}](name=Click R for Win,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=E9NB0iPK,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-09T17:08:40.557+0000)

i'll just yet AGAIN repeat myself: you didn't Research it at all huh? the difference with disco heat is, he always gives proof that he to his best possibilities tried to communicate, it is often his teammates who just selfishly disagree and call out for reports over it.

i mentioned it before, there is a difference between them being selfish and you being selfish. to you i appear as talking nonsense because you won't take it that you got away once does not mean you will get away with it every time. sometimes teammates really are just selfish douchebags, but if it honestly affects someone negatively, then nothing you do or say will change you trolled said someone. regardless of win, or hard carrying, the ultimate factors are communication and influence, behaviour in other words.

as i said, i can't force you to anything, but of over 3 years of experience, and carefully following every single post on the boards that claim to "having been banned unjustly" i can tell you as an well-meant advice to not be so arrogant upon your own opinion. that very tunneled view you have is what you see in 2 out of 3 board Posts, the ones that usually end up with 20+ negative votes, followed by massively negative and tilted behaviour.

Didnt Singed get overwhelming support from community? Didnt people stand behind himultimate getting Riot to state that he can continue using his strategy as long as he finds ADC who is ok being left alone and if he does that, his team doesnt have to agree to his strategy. And if u look at his profile he still uses same tactic. Vast majority of community supported his "selfish" tactic and didnt downvote him

Eternal Torment1 votes

and yet again you twisted a bunch of Things.

he got major support from the community because riot's official Response as a warning, which came with the permaban threat was a long version of enforcing the meta into him. the community took high offense from that and defended his playstyle under the presume that riot wanted to enforce the meta by telling him he needed to buy sightstone and run exhaust botlane.

second point, not just his adc, but all his teammembers Need to agree to it, if even one Person says no, he can scrap his tactics.

point 3, last but not least, he uses his tactic but not permanently as he did before, you still find the majority of his games being without smite, exhaust botlane and with an early sightstone purchase. he still finds times where he can Play his own strategy, but he is tightly bound to the conditions now.

please, before you respond again, Research what you are gonna say and be very sure that you at least bring fully true points.

Troll for Trump2 votes

Singed did communicate with his team, he just didn't care what his team said about his idea after he copy+pasted his paragraph.

Same with Disco Heat. Disco Heat does practically the same thing as Singed. He says what he wants to do, and doesn't care about what you say about it. Currently, he's more tamed, but before he wasn't.

Especially with his "roaming" ones, where he essentially leaves the ADC to 1v2, and, when they get pissed for being forced to 1v2, he highlights them for being "toxic."

And his entire League of Children/Toxic player videos are just naming and shaming.

Not exactly the embodiment of a positive person.

I don't think Disco Heat does the roaming things anymore, but he was just as big of a douche as the singed player, if not bigger.

Scary Door4 votes

Gonna have to agree with you on this one.

I'm here to win games not be your friend, not play the way you want me to. I'm not going to be toxic in chat, I'm not going to feed intentionally, but I'm going to play to my strengths and one of those might be split pushing. I'll tell the team what I'm doing, but if they tell me "No", I'm still going to do it if I see the opportunity.

I care about winning first and your feelings and philosophies dead last. Again, I won't go out of my way to hurt you, but if I get 20 kills, take 4 towers and an inhib and you're left dying over and over to foolish conflicts elsewhere on the map, I'm not responsible for that.

It is not trolling if you are playing to the best of your ability, trying to win and feel that your teammates are engaging in a losing strategy so you decide to utilize your own. Nothing you say will convince me otherwise.

LOSINGISMYPRIDE4 votes

youre not the support of your adc but of your team [slayer-jinx-wink]

Need Gold 4 Tent3 votes

I get into a game, especially a ranked one which thank god I no longer play, I want to win. I honestly don't give a damn (but I'm very subtle about it though, so people generally don't notice) about anything else than my win.

If the jungle yi is carrying and you (adc) are feeding, you can bet your ass that I (the support) am gonna be his bitch, not yours. I'm not going to join a pointless 5v5 teamfight that have been proven to fail a few times already, when I can get take top turrets while forcing and winning 2v1 skirmishes. I'm also not the type who stands for the nonsense of mastery spam/fountain diving in the enemy base, I take the damn nexus and be done with it.

Sure, you have a "bad" experience because of me (or your own skills perhaps?). But I am not playing for you. I am playing for my own win, and if you are not with me, then you are in my way. That doesn't mean 0 teamwork on my part, however, I will gauge the situation by myself and contribute in a way I see fit.

Vectros3 votes

{quoted}

You wrote wall of text but you are wrong. There are certain strategies that are effective but your teammates might not enjoy so they accuse you of trolling.

Ill give u something from personal experience. I played Ekko on my low gold account. I was constantly split pushing and backdooring to the point where enemy team didnt dare leave base. My team however, only wanted to fight enemies and called me troll for not grouping. Basically i took alone 3 towers bot, 1 mid, 2 nexus towers, 2 towers top, killed inhibs 6+ times and backdoored win when enemy team was fighting with mine for Elder drake. In post game both my team and enemy team flamed and agreef to report me (which ofc did nothing).

Trolling DOES regard itself on victory. Its definition is trying your hardest to lose game for your team. If your tactic or gameplay leads to win then its not trolling but effective strategy. If you are support and your ADC is utter trash and you leave him, roam and get your top and mid ahead ultimately leading to win ,then you DID NOT troll.

He's not wrong, but the guys accusing you of trolling were. You weren't winning at their expense...they just had no idea on the strategic value of what was going on. There is a distinct difference here. It's entirely possible for a teammate to be trolled and still win.

archerno11 votes

{quoted}

He's not wrong, but the guys accusing you of trolling were. You weren't winning at their expense...they just had no idea on the strategic value of what was going on. There is a distinct difference here. It's entirely possible for a teammate to be trolled and still win.

Yes, maybe. But are we talking here about trolling game, trying to lose but still somehow winning. Or using strategies that some people might percieve as trolling with purpose of winning?

Vectros2 votes

{quoted}

Yes, maybe. But are we talking here about trolling game, trying to lose but still somehow winning. Or using strategies that some people might percieve as trolling with purpose of winning?

Neither. The former would be you trying to lose, and thus contradicting the topic at hand. The latter isn't the point of the topic and is the style you pointed out.

The point he's making is when you're helping to win in some way, but still act like a jackass towards your teammates in one way or another. Maybe saying something like "My back HURTS from carrying you", or sometimes an action-such as the ones the creator listed, I'm not going to repeat the original post. You can go read it. If you do or say something with the intent of pissing them off, you are trolling, even if it helps you win. What you did with Ekko was NOT intended to piss them off, so it was not trolling.

Really, I think it comes down to intent. Are you trying to piss off your team, even though you're winning? Then you're trolling. Or are you trying to win, with maybe an off the wall strategy (which you should probably communicate so they know ahead of time and aren't caught off guard)? Then you're not trolling. Same with how you chat.

archerno12 votes

{quoted}

Neither. The former would be you trying to lose, and thus contradicting the topic at hand. The latter isn't the point of the topic and is the style you pointed out.

The point he's making is when you're helping to win in some way, but still act like a jackass towards your teammates in one way or another. Maybe saying something like "My back HURTS from carrying you", or sometimes an action-such as the ones the creator listed, I'm not going to repeat the original post. You can go read it. If you do or say something with the intent of pissing them off, you are trolling, even if it helps you win. What you did with Ekko was NOT intended to piss them off, so it was not trolling.

Really, I think it comes down to intent. Are you trying to piss off your team, even though you're winning? Then you're trolling. Or are you trying to win, with maybe an off the wall strategy (which you should probably communicate so they know ahead of time and aren't caught off guard)? Then you're not trolling. Same with how you chat.

Well thats what i meant. Its about intent, not about feelings.

Kartagia2 votes

{quoted}

You wrote wall of text but you are wrong. There are certain strategies that are effective but your teammates might not enjoy so they accuse you of trolling.

Ill give u something from personal experience. I played Ekko on my low gold account. I was constantly split pushing and backdooring to the point where enemy team didnt dare leave base. My team however, only wanted to fight enemies and called me troll for not grouping. Basically i took alone 3 towers bot, 1 mid, 2 nexus towers, 2 towers top, killed inhibs 6+ times and backdoored win when enemy team was fighting with mine for Elder drake. In post game both my team and enemy team flamed and agreef to report me (which ofc did nothing).

Trolling DOES regard itself on victory. Its definition is trying your hardest to lose game for your team. If your tactic or gameplay leads to win then its not trolling but effective strategy. If you are support and your ADC is utter trash and you leave him, roam and get your top and mid ahead ultimately leading to win ,then you DID NOT troll.

Do not expect player who is playing adc and worrying SUPPORT bad manners on adc talking... That player quite likely think that kill and creep steal whining is not bad manner, but appropriate scolding of bad mannered servant who does not know his place. The author does not get that he is trolling quite likely more than support.. This is due sad fact community think adc can do whatever they want and others has to adapt, as adc has to carry... They cannot grasp the fact ADC is not king... Game can be won without adc, and many times they can only be won if adc is left alone on bottom, as too many adc just cannot play duo lane. They just cannot.

archerno13 votes

{quoted}

Do not expect player who is playing adc and worrying SUPPORT bad manners on adc talking... That player quite likely think that kill and creep steal whining is not bad manner, but appropriate scolding of bad mannered servant who does not know his place. The author does not get that he is trolling quite likely more than support.. This is due sad fact community think adc can do whatever they want and others has to adapt, as adc has to carry... They cannot grasp the fact ADC is not king... Game can be won without adc, and many times they can only be won if adc is left alone on bottom, as too many adc just cannot play duo lane. They just cannot.

Exactly. I have won many games as Morgana support by leaving bad adc. I didnt flame or blame him. I just focused on doing what i can to win. ADC would throw tantrum, blame me, rage and rhreaten to afk/int but i just mute him and do my way.

SnakDatSmilesBak1 votes

Split pushing isn't what he's talking about. Just because you chose to bring up something that he didn't even mention in his post doesn't make him wrong. In fact, your post hardly has anything to do with his, which is about offensive behavior and not playstyles.

Edit: he brought it up but it's plain to see that's not the focus of his post

Tahngarthor3 votes

misconfuse

is not a word. "Confuse" is just fine.

Eternal Torment1 votes

thx XD didn't know that

Koonta Kintae3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Click R for Win,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=E9NB0iPK,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-06-09T16:01:31.097+0000)

Trolling, or in the reports written down as Griefing, is not just intentionally feeding. it consists of EVERY FORM OF GAMEPLAY OR BEHAVIOUR AT THE EXPENSE OF YOUR TEAMMATES.

This is pretty much where I stopped reading. You're just wrong here. There are countless examples of players doing things that come at the expense of teammates, it happens practically every game at every level. By your standard other players routinely ruin 80%+ of my matches. Here are some examples of how they do this.

  • Anyone picks Yasuo or they fail to ban this cancer cuck.
  • Toplane doesn't take a tank champ.
  • Teammates take summoner spells I don't agree with (no exhaust sup, no tp top, etc).
  • Support doesn't take a support champ.
  • Team locks in a full 5 late game carries and no tank (this is like 30%+ of low bronze matches easily).
  • Any teammate makes any kind of play that I don't agree with.

All of these things come at my expense as a player. But I'm not being trolled. Players routinely do things that screw over their teammates in this game. It's not automatically griefing, it's just part of the game. If you have this much of a problem with it, you should probably just play something non-competitive, like minecraft.

Eternal Torment1 votes

that is pretty much where you are wrong

your "examples" are just forms of the meta you think people are dictatory enforced to follow. if a toplaner picks something non-tanky it is not considered trolling, however that does not mean you can go tank soraka top or something like that.

what you gave as an example was simply the "meta" as it stands, and added to it you are making some very selfish explanations, the very selfishness i later on even said "do not do it"

while Players do to some extend Need to Keep in mind what they Play and how, the meta is not necessarily an force, it is just the standart unit of measure for league.

PS: "what i don't agree with" you do not control league of legends, you can't call everything a troll that you personally do not agree with. you are the kinda Person who'd report a support for not buying sightstone.

Koonta Kintae1 votes

now you're just contradicting yourself. I gave examples that meet your supposed standard for trolling and you wanna backslide on your all boldface words? You don't win many arguments do you?

[slayer-jinx-wink]

Eternal Torment1 votes

then you should go down and read again, you only gave examples based on your own ego, not legitimate examples.

-picking an specific champion, in your example, yasuo, or failing to ban him is by all means not trolling. the select itself is not in any way or form or shape influencial, but it is the influenced.

-toplane does not just consist of tanks, it is also the "home" lane of Bruisers and fighters, you Forget that toplane is the place where people Play riven, jayce, kennen, rumble and renekton right?

-summoner spells have always been a question of meta, not a specific Player. while it would on the most part be comsidered trolling by an biast set of mind that taking cleanse mid is a bad choice, as just one example, it does not automatically mean it truly is. the summoner spells are there for helping a Player out in influencing the game to his favor, flash for escapes or dives to kill, exhaust to shut down their damage, ignite to deliver a finishing blow or cut down healing etc etc etc. all summoner spells have an equal basic and an equal standart, and no matter what dispopularity one might gain, picking it does not mean it is trolling just because you disagree.

-"support champs" is a very wide range, 4 out of 5 tanks are capable of supporting and technically seen every champion that possesses at least 3 of the following points can be a support by Logical consideration: +peeling +strong reliable CC +diverse shareable sustain (e.g. heals, shields) +disruption

and knowing the current phase of the meta These criteria more or less summ up 80 from the 130+ champions in league of legends. a "support" is not necessarily defined by the champion alone, but by his role and how he performs in it. sure, there are champions that are very favorable and meant by design to be supports, but just because you don't pick them doesn't make that trolling by default. again, it is not something you alone can decide out of a whim.

-you know, if you say "locks in 5 lategame carries" you just automatically counted yourself amongs them, and therefore admittedly considered yourself the very criteria of egocentric shaming you tried to display as a means to say i am wrong whilst you couldn't even read past sentence 1. as for the topic at hand. so what if you got 5 lategame carries? sure, it might not be favorable, but if everyone did it, you included, then you have neither right nor excuse to judge them before you judge yourself. earlygame might not end up so well, but many lategame carries have in common that their scaling already Begins during the midgame, so it is not all that bad. the picks themselves are not what would make your game lost. how you Play with them will. if you lose, it is not because of what champ you picked, it is because you are not good on that champion

-"any Plays that i don't agree with" is the very arrogance, which i multiple times addressed in my post, is the complete contrary of the point at every stage presented. the point here is communication. if you refuse communication just to have it your way, then that is not their fault ad trolling, but yours. the point of trolling and communicating can go both ways, while someone doing something disfavorable or getting extensive joy at someone elses expense is considered sabotage by all points of the rules, that does not necessarily mean that trolling is that very point. trolling and sabotage are not one and the same, and sabotaging your teammates can also go by you trying to dictate them like some wannabe hitler saying everyone not doing it your way should be reported.

as i said, you're the kinda guy who reports supports just for not buying sightstone. all the points you listed here are merely excuses for bronze-clichees, and if you want to express your personal feelings and how noone will obide them then this is not the place to do so. league of legends is still teambased both ways, not just oneway. meaning you are just as responsible as your team is if you do the same mistakes they did.

last but not least: openly saying yasuo is a cancer cuck in Connection to falsifying the term "trolls" just underlines the fact that your list of "examples" is purely butthurt opinion, you can go ahead and Play tough guy with the Emojis if you want, but if you have an issue with an champion, then go to Gameplay to discuss it there, because in Player Behaviour we talk about Behaviour and mindsets, ecspecially the biast ones like your examples given.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

You're right. People will argue with you because they're unable to read carefully and think for themselves.

The gist of your post is that trolling and offensive behavior is not excused by score, correct?

My advice is to ignore the people who choose to overlook the point of your post.

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