If someone tells you to 'go kill yourself', that player needs to be immediately punished

Zeanix·Jun 15, 2017·96 votes·6,342 views

There are still more league players who are saying this type of stuff, "go kill yourself" and "go slit your throat". I've been reporting these types of people for ages but none have been received any punishment or any notifications telling me that they had. Either I have really bad luck, or the reporting system still needs work. If we want to make this game better, we need to control these kind of people, Or more people will turn up like this. Thank you

181 Comments

MinaZer0Jun 15, 20173 votes

[deleted]

Jo0oJun 15, 201716 votes

It's not about orders, it's about encouragement.

At-risk individuals may be tipped over the edge by suicide encouragement. It wouldn't be the cause of suicide by any means, but it COULD be the straw that broke the camels back. This is a game that kids can play, after all.

I'm in my mid-twenties now, but in the years since I graduated high school my old school has had a suicide epidemic. At a rate of roughly one or two kids per year, kids have been killing themselves, presumably due to the high-pressure environment. I can readily imagine one of those kids trying to unwind with some League after school, only to be devastated by the words of a random internet troll and pushed over the edge.

MinaZer0Jun 15, 20172 votes

[deleted]

Jo0oJun 15, 20177 votes

Dank meme, bro. High schoolers jumping in front of metro trains is the sign of mental inferiority. Got it.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Dank meme, bro. High schoolers jumping in front of metro trains is the sign of mental inferiority. Got it.

Actually... ironically... that might be true...

Last I checked, natural selection would probably be selecting against those who choose to jump in front of trains.

Jo0oJun 15, 20177 votes

You are perhaps referring to the concept of Social Darwinism? The largely discredited theory that applies natural selection to human society, used over the past hundred years to justify racism, imperialism, and other generally deplorable practices that spit in the face of progress?

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20171 votes

Hmm, similar, but not exactly. My argument does not apply to any specific races. I am stating that natural selection tends not to favor those that commit suicide. The difference lies in that I am not applying a biological theory to a social context but a biological theory in a biological context. It's very hard to pass on your genes if you're dead.

Jo0oJun 15, 20175 votes

I was actually intentionally taking your comment way too far for humor's sake =P

But honestly, natural selection and evolution isn't a thing on a micro level in human society. And that's a dangerous reasoning path to go down; it opens the door to eugenics, selective breeding, etc. Lots of Nazi stuff.

Suicide is very much not an evolutionary tool. People do not kill themselves because they're genetically inferior.

We're not a pack of wild animals, breeding out undesirable traits in order to remain the apex predators. We're people. We help each other; we don't leave each other to die when the other makes a mistake or has an accident. Modern society is past that point.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20172 votes

{quoted} Suicide is very much not an evolutionary tool. People do not kill themselves because they're genetically inferior.

See, the problem with this is that there are plenty of people who overcome equal hardships compared to those that commit suicide. This leads me to believe that our likelihood of committing suicide is directly related to the genetics that govern our brains. Some people have committed suicide from being bullied. Others have their lives destroyed, their children killed, are tortured, thrown into prison, and still overcome those hardships to become a successful and powerful figure. Can you really say that genetics plays no role in this?

Jo0oJun 15, 20176 votes

That's not what I'm saying.

Genetic predisposition to suicide is very much a thing. But I take issue with your assertion that that makes somebody genetically inferior. The concept of genetic inferiority, taken as you have to the point of literally letting people die, is an extremely outdated concept associated with very dangerous groups.

People are born with fucked up stuff about them all the time, but we aren't ancient Spartans, leaving our weaklings out in the cold to die. It's generally accepted that, in MODERN SOCIETY, we have an equal shot at staying alive and thriving. If you're born without legs, you're given a wheelchair. If you're born with a defective organ, a doctor will do their best to fix it or replace it. If you're born with shitty lungs, you're given an inhaler. If you're born with shitty eyes, you're given glasses. **If you're born with a chemical imbalance in your brain that predisposes you to crushing depression and possible suicidal tendencies, you're given counseling and medication, and there's a very realistic expectation that assholes won't literally tell you to give in to your despair and end your own life. **

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20172 votes

{quoted} Genetic predisposition to suicide is very much a thing. But I take issue with your assertion that that makes somebody genetically inferior. The concept of genetic inferiority, taken as you have to the point of literally letting people die, is an extremely outdated concept associated with very dangerous groups. **If you're born with a chemical imbalance in your brain that predisposes you to crushing depression and possible suicidal tendencies, you're given counseling and medication, and there's a very realistic expectation that assholes won't literally tell you to give in to your despair and end your own life. **

Hey, please calm down. My entire argument was that genetic inferiority may lead to mental inferiority which may lead to suicide.

But if you were to ask for my opinion, I'd say we should focus on those who want to be saved first, before proceeding to try to save those who don't want to be saved. Just food for thought.

Jo0oJun 15, 20175 votes

I ain't mad. It's a topic that I do have some passion for, though.

The flaw in your reasoning for focusing on those who "want to be saved" is that the very nature of depression prevents that desire from being expressed or even felt. Depressed and mentally ill people are difficult to help, because their conditions manifest in such a way as to prevent them from ASKING for that help, and there are usually no physical signs to suggest that there is a problem.

I personally struggled with depression for several years after high school, and only recently in the past year would I honestly say that I got it under control. I was never so disturbed that somebody telling me "kys" in League would have set me off, but I was certainly moving in that direction, and I entertained the thought of suicide frequently. And believe me: My family and loved ones have little or no clue of any of that, because the path of least resistance when you're in that state is to hide it at all costs. A couple friends know bits and pieces, and a couple college counselors know a bit too, but for the most part my own issues were kept close to the chest.

Am I genetically predisposed to depression, mental illness, and suicide? Possibly.

Am I genetically inferior? I humbly submit that I am not. I now have a degree, a great job, money in the bank, amazing friends, a great house, etc. I wouldn't mind getting laid more often, but who would? Just because some shitty part of my brain was misfiring (and at times still is misfiring) doesn't give me any less of a right to be alive and to get help if I need it than you.

Blood LyricsJun 16, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Am I genetically inferior? I humbly submit that I am not. I now have a degree, a great job, money in the bank, amazing friends, a great house, etc. I wouldn't mind getting laid more often, but who would? Just because some shitty part of my brain was misfiring (and at times still is misfiring) doesn't give me any less of a right to be alive and to get help if I need it than you.

I don't believe that having a degree, job, money, etc. is directly related to genetic inferiority or superiority. If you're born with a genetic predisposition towards getting recurring cancers, you are probably genetically inferior. That does not stop you from being a great person. Being genetically inferior does not have any impact on your rights or your ability to get help. I may need to revise my statement to something closer along the lines of "help those who want help first". Sure, a depressed person may not want to live, but if they want help, then that should be enough. If they don't even want help, then that is where I definitely fail to see the point of helping.

Jo0oJun 16, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=0001000000020000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-16T00:09:30.846+0000) If they don't even want help, then that is where I definitely fail to see the point of helping.

But part of suicidal depression is not being able to ask for help, for many who suffer from it. That's a symptom.

Look at alcoholism: How often do alcoholics realize that they need help? It usually takes interventions, even by loved ones or by law enforcement, for them to get a handle on their condition.

Jo0oJun 16, 20174 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=00010000000200000000000000000000000000000000000000000005,timestamp=2017-06-16T02:23:21.858+0000)

You stated that some people are not capable of asking for help. This is true. If help is offered and rejected then help is not wanted.

So you judge at-risk individuals based on a behavioral facet that is explicitly a symptom of their disease?

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 201723 votes

[{quoted}](name=ILittle IMonster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-06-15T16:58:20.364+0000)

if a person is dumb enough to take an 'order' seriously enough from a stranger on the internet, especially as drastic as killing themselves, we need less of those people in the world anyway, then again the world does require idiots to be functionally able to do labor work so never-mind.

This attitude is unacceptable in this community and you should find better ways to express your frustration with players.

This IS a teen game but statistically more adults play this game world-wide than teens anyway, saying a demographic as adults being more mature mentally (WHILE playing a video game which is one of the most popularly youthful things to do) than teens is ignorant, grow up, grow tougher skin, don't let idiots online get to you, ggez.

People need thicker skins. That's a fair statement to make. But it's no excuse for harassing people. Blaming the victim is very poor reasoning.

You are given options to block people in-game and so in-depth that even pings are ignorable, yet complain on the forums about childish people in a video game. People love to complain about things there are already solutions for.

By the time a player has said "kys" to the receiving player it's too late to mute them to avoid the harassment. The damage has been done.

MinaZer0Jun 15, 20173 votes

never condoned harrassment, if it happens and you get angry sad butthurt or commit suicide its on you, nobody can make you get into your feels but you. You are the captain of your body, if you are weak itll show in your action.

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 201710 votes

Jooo countered this pretty effectively already:

{quoted}

It's not about orders, it's about encouragement.

At-risk individuals may be tipped over the edge by suicide encouragement. It wouldn't be the cause of suicide by any means, but it COULD be the straw that broke the camels back.

The point is that the impact is real. Emotional or not... the harassment, its purpose, and its possible results are all wrong and immoral.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Jooo countered this pretty effectively already:

The point is that the impact is real. Emotional or not... the harassment, its purpose, and its possible results are all wrong and immoral.

As someone who has known tons of people who fought tooth and nail for the right to life, I honestly have extremely little patience for those who can simply be encouraged to end their lives. If they themselves do not value their lives, what reason do we as outsiders have to value their lives? All human life is sacred? Hardly. The very principle of life is overarching equality via death. Harassment is wrong and immoral? There was a day and age where harassment lead to the desire to improve oneself. Perhaps that day and age has come and gone. Then again, perhaps the notion of self-improvement has also come and gone.

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 201712 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=00010001000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-15T22:25:14.382+0000)

As someone who has known tons of people who fought tooth and nail for the right to life, I honestly have extremely little patience for those who can simply be encouraged to end their lives. If they themselves do not value their lives, what reason do we as outsiders have to value their lives?

Whether you value their life or not, it's not your place to encourage them to end it.

All human life is sacred? Hardly. The very principle of life is overarching equality via death.

I never said this. You brought it into the conversation yourself because you had a counterargument for it that you must have felt proud of.

That said, your counterargument is your own opinion, and the majority of people do not agree with you. And to be completely honest those sound like the words of a person who would shoot up a school and not care if they ended many lives. Not saying you are one of those people, but your argument comes dangerously close to a justification that such people would make.

Harassment is wrong and immoral? There was a day and age where harassment lead to the desire to improve oneself. Perhaps that day and age has come and gone. Then again, perhaps the notion of self-improvement has also come and gone.

I don't know about other people, but I strive to improve myself and my gameplay still. I most often take issue when players say these things to my teammates rather than to myself. I care very little about what is said to me.

Ah yes the glory days when we could say whatever we wanted no matter the impact it had on others.

Somehow I don't find myself missing those. I just don't see how using blunt insults and telling a player to kill themselves is an effective way to communicate to them how to improve themselves.

You want them to improve? Be restrained with your anger, and intelligent with your use of words. If they aren't receptive, learn to figure that out. Any negative response you give them after that is just toxicity. No justification can cover that up.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Whether you value their life or not, it's not your place to encourage them to end it.

Actually, everyone has the right to voice an opinion. Whether or not the recipient chooses to adhere to that opinion, is the recipient's right. Just because an opinion is harmful, does not mean that it does not have the right to be voiced. There is no natural law dictating that we must be kind to our fellow human being. Sure there is the platitude "do unto others...", but I would imagine that those doing probably aren't so affected by having it done to them.

{quoted} I never said this. You brought it into the conversation yourself because you had a counterargument for it that you must have felt proud of.

That said, your counterargument is your own opinion, and the majority of people do not agree with you. And to be completely honest those sound like the words of a person who would shoot up a school and not care if they ended many lives. Not saying you are one of those people, but your argument comes dangerously close to a justification that such people would make.

It was an anticipatory counterargument. Shooting up a school seems to be a bit of stretch... All I am saying is that death is the great equalizer. Human life is no more sacred than any other life. Few would argue so vehemently on behalf of cattle. Why should we care so much just because it is a human being? In what way is that life more sacred than another?

{quoted} Ah yes the glory days when we could say whatever we wanted no matter the impact it had on others.

Somehow I don't find myself missing those. I just don't see how using blunt insults and telling a player to kill themselves is an effective way to communicate to them how to improve themselves.

It's a matter of perception. There was a time when people who received insults choose to improve themselves so as to rise above those insults. Now many just complain. Now, I am not (and have not been) singling you out specifically - I'm saying this in a very generic manner - but if one doesn't want to be looked down upon, then perhaps one should become better? If wallowing in self-pity and then committing suicide is the hallmark of the present, then yes, perhaps the time when we could say whatever we wanted was in fact the glory days.

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=0001000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-15T22:59:31.264+0000)

Actually, everyone has the right to voice an opinion. Whether or not the recipient chooses to adhere to that opinion, is the recipient's right. Just because an opinion is harmful, does not mean that it does not have the right to be voiced. There is no natural law dictating that we must be kind to our fellow human being. Sure there is the platitude "do unto others...", but I would imagine that those doing probably aren't so affected by having it done to them.

I understand the importance of rights and freedom of speech. That's not what I'm talking about though. Notice how I said "not your place to do so" I didn't say it wasn't your right. It's not your place to tell a stranger to harm themselves. That is because you do not know them, you do not know their situation, and you do not know how impactful your words could potentially be. I also think it is irresponsible to do so for those same reasons.

It was an anticipatory counterargument. Shooting up a school seems to be a bit of stretch...

Fair enough. I hyperbolized a bit. Do you understand why I did though?

All I am saying is that death is the great equalizer. Human life is no more sacred than any other life. Few would argue so vehemently on behalf of cattle. Why should we care so much just because it is a human being? In what way is that life more sacred than another?

I understand your position in this, it's very far removed and coldly logical. It makes sense, and it's not factually incorrect. I'm not going to argue comparing humans and animals, but I think it comes down to sentience. We are capable of thinking freely, of experiencing joy and pain. It's common decency to not try to inflict pain upon others.

It's a matter of perception. There was a time when people who received insults choose to improve themselves so as to rise above those insults. Now many just complain. Now, I am not (and have not been) singling you out specifically - I'm saying this in a very generic manner - but if one doesn't want to be looked down upon, then perhaps one should become better?

I understand that people should strive to be better. I even agree with it. But I don't think that insults and suggestions of self harm are an effective way to communicate how that person should improve. All it usually achieves is voicing your own displeasure while simultaneously hurting another human being.

If wallowing in self-pity and then committing suicide is the hallmark of the present, then yes, perhaps the time when we could say whatever we wanted was in fact the glory days.

I do not think that every person just wallows in self-pity and commits suicide in response to such things. We'd see a much higher suicide rate if that were the case. I think you've made a rather large sweeping generalization about people who complain about others' behavior.

Blood LyricsJun 16, 20172 votes

{quoted} Notice how I said "not your place to do so" I didn't say it wasn't your right. It's not your place to tell a stranger to harm themselves. That is because you do not know them, you do not know their situation, and you do not know how impactful your words could potentially be. I also think it is irresponsible to do so for those same reasons.

If someone is so deeply impacted by the words of a stranger, then they are not fit to live in modern society. That's what life is, interactions on a daily basis with plenty of strangers. I don't believe it is irresponsible, because you do not have a responsibility to a random stranger over the internet. General decency among human beings is not a responsibility but a luxury.

{quoted} Fair enough. I hyperbolized a bit. Do you understand why I did though?

Actually, no... Perhaps I'm missing your point.

{quoted} We are capable of thinking freely, of experiencing joy and pain. It's common decency to not try to inflict pain upon others.

Plenty of things outside of human beings are capable of experiencing joy and pain. I believe that's why the phrase "animal cruelty" exists. I think you may be extending common decency a little too far. It is kind to not inflict pain upon others. But I don't believe all human beings must necessarily be kind.

{quoted} I do not think that every person just wallows in self-pity and commits suicide in response to such things. We'd see a much higher suicide rate if that were the case. I think you've made a rather large sweeping generalization about people who complain about others' behavior.

I stated that is was a hallmark (notable trait or characteristic) of present day. This is true, the suicide rate during modern times is far higher than any other period in history.

ModUlanopoJun 16, 20177 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=000100010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-16T00:03:25.438+0000)

If someone is so deeply impacted by the words of a stranger, then they are not fit to live in modern society.

That feels an awful lot like victim blaming or at least a dull-edged sort of Darwinian libertarianism. I would suggest there is a weakness also in the inability to have even that minimal level of compassion for another. An extreme lack of character, if you will.

Blood LyricsJun 16, 20173 votes

{quoted}

That feels an awful lot like victim blaming or at least a dull-edged sort of Darwinian libertarianism. I would suggest there is a weakness also in the inability to have even that minimal level of compassion for another. An extreme lack of character, if you will.

Personally, I find making negative assumptions about a specific person to be rather toxic, but it seems to be acceptable since it happens quite frequently whenever I attempt to voice an opinion. You should not assume that I have no compassion for another. My compassion is perhaps just lacking towards those who are easily influenced into killing themselves.

Now, yes, you can state that you aren't targeting me directly, but we both are intelligent enough to recognize the connotation behind the text.

On a more related note, I think I made an argument regarding victim blaming in a different post, but I'll repeat the general gist. A victim who for no reason at all is harmed perhaps is not to blame (e.g. a guy safely attempting to cross a crosswalk is hit by a speeding drunk driver). A victim who however instigates or escalates (in any way) the situation perhaps should share at least some of the blame (e.g. X makes a bad play. Y ? pings it. X escalates by insulting Y. Y escalates by stating "kys").

ModUlanopoJun 16, 20176 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=00010001000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-16T00:30:18.964+0000)

Personally, I find making negative assumptions about a specific person to be rather toxic, but it seems to be acceptable since it happens quite frequently whenever I attempt to voice an opinion.

You expressed an opinion. I expressed one in response. Both analyzed the value of people who exhibit certain behaviors. That's the way this works.

You think people who allow words to affect them aren't fit for society. I think people who expect their words not to have meaning and impact aren't fit for society.

A victim who for no reason at all is harmed perhaps is not to blame (e.g. a guy safely attempting to cross a crosswalk is hit by a speeding drunk driver).

I'm genuinely curious in what possible way the pedestrian could possibly be at fault, unless you're espousing the notion that we are all obligated at all times and places to minimize the risk to ourselves, which is an overture to fascism. I mean, taken to the logical conclusion, even leaving your house or opening your mouth opens you up to violence.

That's what I meant by a grim Darwinian libertarianism - in a world where there is no expectation of sympathy, the strong rule.

A victim who however instigates or escalates (in any way) the situation perhaps should share at least some of the blame

How many times do you have to ping before someone is justified in raging and using racial slurs? Asking for a friend.

Blood LyricsJun 16, 20172 votes

{quoted}

You expressed an opinion. I expressed one in response. Both analyzed the value of people who exhibit certain behaviors. That's the way this works.

You think people who allow words to affect them aren't fit for society. I think people who expect their words not to have meaning and impact aren't fit for society.

Oh I see, so we are allowed to make snide comments at each other? Or is that an arbiter only permission? "I'm asking for a friend"

{quoted}

I'm genuinely curious in what possible way the pedestrian could possibly be at fault, unless you're espousing the notion that we are all obligated at all times and places to minimize the risk to ourselves, which is an overture to fascism.

Like I mentioned, sometimes, there is no blame to be placed upon the victim. Are you going to tell me that there are no situations in which some blame can be placed on the victim? Also, yeah, I'm pretty sure it falls under common sense to minimize risk to oneself. You know, simple things, like don't walk into mine fields, avoid dark alleys in suspicious neighborhoods, etc. But hey, perhaps my advocation of common sense is, in fact, just an overture to fascism.

{quoted}

How many times do you have to ping before someone is justified in raging and using racial slurs? Asking for a friend.

Is that not a question I was, in fact, asking you? As, after all, I cannot be as brave as a mighty arbiter and post whatever I wish without fear of reprisal. Some of us need to hide the subtext with a little more effort.

ModUlanopoJun 16, 20174 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=0001000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-16T01:04:15.904+0000)

Oh I see, so we are allowed to make snide comments at each other? Or is that an arbiter only permission? "I'm asking for a friend"

I wasn't being snide.

Like I mentioned, sometimes, there is no blame to be placed upon the victim. Are you going to tell me that there are no situations in which some blame can be placed on the victim?

Depends on what you intend by blame.

If you want to use blame as a teachable moment, that's not something I advise, but I can see how some people fall prey to that particular fallacy.

If blame in some way excuses or condones, then I do not agree. There's no amount of "you shouldn't have been on the street at night" that acts as consent to be mugged, for example.

Also, yeah, I'm pretty sure it falls under common sense to minimize risk to oneself. You know, simple things, like don't walk into mine fields, avoid dark alleys in suspicious neighborhoods, etc. But hey, perhaps my advocation of common sense is, in fact, just an overture to fascism.

"Common sense" is an overused term when it comes to this topic because it's almost always an attempt to say that the victim or target should change their behavior which can be highly oppressive - hence the reference to fascism.

Is that not a question I was, in fact, asking you? As, after all, I cannot be as brave as a mighty arbiter and post whatever I wish without fear of reprisal. Some of us need to hide the subtext with a little more effort.

Hey, we're all good. As long as we both stay away from the slurs and personal attacks the way we have, this is just a good healthy debate. At least that's how I see it.

Deep Terror NamiJun 16, 20175 votes

Hey Solidarius, I've edited a few things out of your comment to avoid deleting it altogether. I understand how strongly you feel about this, but we need to try and avoid insulting or making inflammatory remarks which only serve to heighten tension here in this thread and possibly derail constructive discussion. Please try to avoid resorting to insults, as your post can hold up with it.

Pierce The VealJun 16, 20176 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blood Lyrics,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=Anompku2,comment-id=00010001000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-15T22:25:14.382+0000)

As someone who has known tons of people who fought tooth and nail for the right to life, I honestly have extremely little patience for those who can simply be encouraged to end their lives. If they themselves do not value their lives, what reason do we as outsiders have to value their lives? All human life is sacred? Hardly. The very principle of life is overarching equality via death. Harassment is wrong and immoral? There was a day and age where harassment lead to the desire to improve oneself. Perhaps that day and age has come and gone. Then again, perhaps the notion of self-improvement has also come and gone.

People like you who mistake apathy and bloodlust as strength are the reason our society is an unstable as it is.

Bobo113Jun 15, 201711 votes

Ummmmm.

Victim blaming is wrong in almost any known circumstance. You really need to learn a thing or six about human nature before you claim to be this stunningly profound intellectual.

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 15, 20171 votes

No one opens a game with the kys comment 99% of the time its being said to someone who is feeding or trolling or is extremely unskilled, (Ill admit kys is an incredibly mean thing to say to someone) but if they are cool with wasting their 4 teammates time because they decided they wanted to play a dumb unpracticed pick (norms and ranked games alike it is still a game I want to win) and got smashed in lane sorry not sorry, they have bot games and practice tools if you wanna f* around

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

Two wrongs do not make a right.

Even if the receiving player is at fault somehow for irritating their teammates, it's never appropriate to tell them to "kys."

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 15, 20173 votes

Without looking you up I bet youre a teemo main

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

Pfffaahahahaha ok go check. Haven't played teemo in years.

I don't say what I said in the comment above to get under the skin of people who get irritated with off-meta picks and people who feed. I say it because I believe it.

Telling another human being to kill themselves is a deplorable choice of action. If you think that's ok then you clearly don't know how to properly treat your fellow human beings.

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 15, 20171 votes

If the said "victim" is okay with wasting my time as well as 3 others as his form of fun? Sorry you are wrong its really not that deplorable to me if they get told that I would not miss that person in the slightest. The combo of that person being selfish and being a huge reason why my team is losing makes me think they are a scumbag IRL, and just to clarify Meta is nice but I do not care what champ you play in any role all I ask is you are SOMEWHAT familiar with the champ

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

{quoted}

The combo of that person being selfish and being a huge reason why my team is losing makes me think they are a scumbag IRL

OK, humoring your argument for a moment:

You have assessed based on a limited experience with that player that they are a scumbag IRL. This may be correct, but what if you're wrong? what if you just lumped a person who is having a bad day into the category with perpetual scumbags?

Part of the problem is that it's possible to be wrong in our assessments. And if you were wrong, and tell an innocent person to kill themselves, are you then in the wrong?

Now that I'm done humoring that line of thought...

"The player is making a selfish decision that negatively impacts my and 3 other people's fun in a game"

So your fun in a game is worth someone else dying for?

Sorry but I don't see how that could possibly be rational.

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 16, 20171 votes

how is it not rational? if the person is that inconsiderate in a game that means nothing hes 100% a scumbag IRL and nah Im not wrong at all there is a distinct difference from a troll and someone who is having a bad game

HalcyonDwellerJun 16, 20172 votes

You have no way of knowing for certain, short of hacking the internet, stalking the person in question, and finding out every facet of their life and analyzing it to see how they behave in other parts of their life.

I hate trolls too. But punishing another player because we believe they are a troll is wrong.

There's two reasons for this:

It's harmful to them, which means that if they are in fact not a troll then we just hurt an innocent person having a bad game.
And if they are a troll, saying anything to them only feeds them and encourages them. So you're only setting yourself up for more trolling.

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 17, 20171 votes

My point is if you dont play like a selfish f* you probably wont get told to "kys" and if a troll gets told to kys hes not going to take the comment seriously

HalcyonDwellerJun 18, 20172 votes

Not everybody who plays badly is a troll. It's not your place to judge them.

Sup3rKamlGuruJun 20, 20171 votes

Thats where we differ in opinion I practice champs before I take them to pvp so yes everyone who plays badly is a troll to me 100% is my place to judge them as they are on my team, you can go ahead and que up with the guy who goes 0-8 before the 10 min mark lemme know how many games you win please

HalcyonDwellerJun 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

lol intolerant? since you like listing things ill break it down slow for you so I don't lose you

Pointless ad hominem. *Yawn* If you want to prove your point it would help if you didn't go off topic to try to insult me. Also insults don't bother me so you're wasting both our time.

I practice champs before I take them to pvp (so I am not the guy who goes 0-8 practicing my first time on a champ which is not an extreme case at all but actually more than likely to happen, since you know he's practicing his 1st time in my game)

Ranked is the competitive environment for league. If you want to be competitive go play that. In Normals people will still play to win, but they also play for fun. It's not your place to decide how others should use their time in normals for fun. If you think they are in the wrong then you should report them and leave it in Riot's hands. Taking it upon yourself to flame them is egotistical, selfish and toxic.

I consider it trolling if you are playing a champ you have no concept of how to play the specific champ

If you are that guy I don't feel bad if people flame you

Then your definition of trolling is very different from everybody else's. Here's what the internet agrees a troll is:

"In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[2] or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion,[3] often for the troll's amusement."

This can be applied to online games in that trolls are people who do things in the game for the sole purpose of upsetting others.

Whatever you believe to be the case, a player who is trying a new champion to have fun with it is not doing so for the sole purpose of upsetting you. Assuming their champion choice is all about you is extremely self-centered.

HalcyonDwellerJun 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

My point is if you dont play like a selfish f* you probably wont get told to "kys" and if a troll gets told to kys hes not going to take the comment seriously

Flaming teammates is selfish too. It's seeking personal catharsis at the expense of another.

So really, you saying this just shows us all that you are a hypocrite.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20171 votes

{quoted} Blaming the victim is very poor reasoning.

This is slightly (but not completely) off topic, but why is blaming the victim always viewed so negatively? Sure in some situations it's awfully hard to blame the victim (e.g. a guy gets hit by a bus crossing the street on a crosswalk when it appeared perfectly safe). But sometimes, can't you say that it's at least partially the victim's fault? Some situations are entirely avoidable. X starts an argument, Y responds to it, X escalates, Y escalates by saying "kys". Sure, it's mostly Y's fault for saying something like "kys", but can we really say that X had no fault in this issue? Rarely do you get an entirely unprovoked negative comment about inflicting self harm.

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

I think I understand your concern. I'm not saying the victim is faultless...

But regardless of fault, saying "kys" is never a mature or appropriate response to a player causing frustration.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20171 votes

{quoted} But regardless of fault, saying "kys" is never a mature or appropriate response to a player causing frustration.

I ask these questions as a sort of "food for thought" sort of notion: Why is "kys" not considered a mature or appropriate response? Why must we respond to players in an appropriate or mature manner?

Some might say we should adhere to these notions because society dictates it, but there was a time when society dictated that African Americans ought to be enslaved.

HalcyonDwellerJun 15, 20175 votes

I think that it is safe to assume that someone who is willing to tell another person to kill themselves is probably seeing red by that point.

Losing one's temper and taking it out on others is not something that a responsible and level headed adult would do. Level headed adults would address the person in a plain and decent manner, or simply ignore them for being toxic.

Getting angry at them is normal, even level headed people do that, but the difference is that the immature person does not know how to handle that anger and takes it out on the perceived source of their irritation.

It's because they are handling their anger irresponsibly, immaturely and inappropriately. That is the source of my conclusion that telling someone to kill themselves is immature and inappropriate.

Blood LyricsJun 15, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I think that it is safe to assume that someone who is willing to tell another person to kill themselves is probably seeing red by that point.

Losing one's temper and taking it out on others is not something that a responsible and level headed adult would do. Level headed adults would address the person in a plain and decent manner, or simply ignore them for being toxic.

Getting angry at them is normal, even level headed people do that, but the difference is that the immature person does not know how to handle that anger and takes it out on the perceived source of their irritation.

It's because they are handling their anger irresponsibly, immaturely and inappropriately. That is the source of my conclusion that telling someone to kill themselves is immature and inappropriate.

Compare "kys" to "f u". For someone who's intention is to be toxic, do they really need to be extremely mad to choose the former over the latter? Heck, it takes less effort to type those three letters than the majority of insults that come to mind.

Sure, losing one's temper and taking it out on others is probably not something a level-headed adult would do. But really, how does one release that anger then? Repressed anger is as dangerous if not more so than the harm that toxicity can bring.

How does one handle anger responsibly, maturely, and appropriately? If I weigh it on a scale, saying "kys" is far more mature and appropriate than going on a shooting spree. It's probably slightly worse than "stfu" (maybe?). How are these things even measured?

HalcyonDwellerJun 16, 20176 votes

I agree it's unhealthy to repress anger. Here are some basic guidelines I found with a quick google search.

These are fairly similar to what I've been taught. And as someone who has dealt with severe anger issues in the distant past, I can attest that with practice they can help a great deal.

Think before you speak. - Give yourself time to process your thoughts before you speak out.
Wait until you're calm to express your anger. Do so in an assertive but nonconfrontational way. Try to be clear, direct, and without hurting others or trying to control them.
Get exercise. Physical activity helps to reduce stress.
Take time to prepare yourself before going into situations you know have the potential to be stressful.
Identify solutions. Focus on how to solve the problem, not on what has angered you.
I statements. yea, they feel silly as hell sometimes. But by avoiding talking directly about the person you can prevent or even stop blame-games in chat.
Don't dwell on your anger. By focusing on it and thinking about it you only deepen your negative experience. It is healthier and even more fun if you can let go of the frustration and move past it.
Use humor to diffuse tension. Don't use sarcasm though, that doesn't go over well usually.
Practice relaxing. Building skills to let go of stress makes it easier to do so when the need arises.
Get help. Seriously, there's a lot of stigma about seeing therapists, but even people who are not mentally ill can benefit from their services. They are extremely helpful for processing difficult thoughts and emotions, and they can help to keep you feeling mentally stable and healthy. Just like seeing a doctor for checkups and nutrition can help you to maintain a healthy body.