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Toxic people and how we deal with them

nerak23·11/12/2014, 1:19:09 PM·3 votes·1,291 views

I'd like to start a civil convo about this subject as it comes up more and more. I will start slowly and explain what I do, if you want more info form me AMA.

Everyone has some nasty players in their games however I find I have less a problem with them then a friend who lives in my house To which I can see what is happening in her games.

Because of the 'don't be a Jerk' rule ( and plain common decency ) I tend to deal with some comments very low key such as :

Some one starts calling names (using vulgarity before any plays are made ). I might say "hey, please don't say such 'mean' things" or "please don't start 'picking' on teammates " Yes, I feel like I am 12 because I won't say "STFU and don't say stupid Sh!t" okay, you get my drift by now I hope. Most of the time it really does work, this easy !

If what I say doesn't stop them then I simply don't reply about anything but game related calls. I get how annoying this can get to people. It gets to me sometimes, If what I was Really saying to myself ever got typed I might be in the same boat as others and in trouble right now.

How do we combat this ? I mean, every day I read more posts about this. Some complaining that they got punished for calling out others. I am not sure I believe most did it the way I do, nor do I believe that the way I do it works all the time. Where is the slight in-between?

I feel like if you are Toxic for any reason You should get a appropriate punishment. But, I also feel bad when I see people upset enough to come here and post about it. Is there any real solution to this ? Is Riot working on something ? And, more importantly does anyone care to discuss the problem ?

23 Comments

Deep Terror Nami11/12/2014, 1:57:44 PM8 votes

When I started the game, I would respond to toxicity exactly how most would expect; Toxicman: "u suck bro l2p, gg noob, gay/racial slur, i fucked your mom"

Me: "You're the one feeding, your itemization sucks, use wards jackass"

Then I got my first (and so far only) report notification. Oops, guess the community doesn't appreciate that kind of talk. I'll have to respond a little differently, or not at all. Now it's; Toxicman: "u suck bro l2p, gg noob, gay/racial slur, i fucked your mom"

Me: /mute Toxicman. "Toxicman you're muted, please use pings to communicate. I'm having an off day so I need your help. We need wards right here and here. They have lots of AP, we need to build this and this."

Haven't had another report notification since I stopped responding aggressively.

TL;DR - Muting or ignoring trolls and giving positive feedback and direction to the team is always better. If one never realizes this and keeps responding to toxicity with toxicity, it will lead to more losses, a worse gaming experience, and likely restrictions or bans.

Eleshakai11/13/2014, 1:16:01 PM3 votes

There is a solution, but it's not a solution any one person can implement. The solution is to gradually change our mindset... we just need to stop focusing on winning at all costs, stop assuming we know better than others, and stop assuming everyone else is toxic.

Trinityunicorn11/12/2014, 3:49:56 PM2 votes

How do we combat this ? I mean, every day I read more posts about this. Some complaining that they got punished for calling out others. I am not sure I believe most did it the way I do, nor do I believe that the way I do it works all the time. Where is the slight in-between?

I think you've got the right idea, the words that come to my mind is "be peaceful--full of peace." That's what thought ran through my mind as I read how you dealt with it.

I feel like if you are Toxic for any reason You should get a appropriate punishment. But, I also feel bad when I see people upset enough to come here and post about it. Is there any real solution to this ? Is Riot working on something ? And, more importantly does anyone care to discuss the problem ?

Riot is obviously trying.

I can tell you I dislike interacting with people that attack with words, that use words as weapons to create emotional turmoil, to manipulate, and belittle. I don't like that. I try not to judge, I don't always succeed but I know that it is key to being neutral. I don't know what the solution is for the game, right now I'm thinking about a sort of driving school. lmao. maybe that should be mandatory. lol. I find it really funny in a weird sort of way but that might be an appropriate punishment. Some sort of reading material, access to a mentor that will answer questions, and at the end, a written test and then a probationary period of maybe two weeks where they apply what they've learned. Just loop them back through it if they fail. It wouldn't hurt if they also had to teach it. Author Don Miguel Ruiz comes to mind. 3 strikes and you're out. <that would encompass about 6 weeks worth> If they've shown marked improvement then they might get another chance, if they wanted it.

It would take a lot of work to put it together, but I actually think it might change a person.

Riot really does NEED to offer an incentive for people that don't get reports or get very, very few of them. It doesn't have to be particularly big but it does need to have some sort of value to the player. It needs to be offered to daily players, end of season ip boost or special ward or even tiers of reward based upon seasonal sportsmanship. One really enticing idea would be an extra rune page, which even if you were at max, you could get this one in addition to a few free runes. The ward would show recognition and the runes or pages would be helpful. For long standing players runes wouldn't help much cause they may have them all. One free skin. Whatever it is it needs to have value.

nerak2311/12/2014, 2:36:56 PM2 votes

I had the chance to watch the game before I installed it. I had to ask myself 'did I Want' to play, knowing what I was likely to encounter. And the foresight to think about what I would do when I had to deal with Toxic remarks. Because I really feel not everyone who says bad things are bad people. To much random pressure to be sure of it ( in most cases ).

While I understand the 'Mute' function and the good value of it, I will say Why should anyone Have to use it. It is good for the majority of people I get it. Personally I don't use it, I don't want to come off sounding Holier then thou, just for me I can ignore insults to an extent. I Just Don't like when the 'Just use Mute' is used an an excuse for anyone to insult others.

nerak2311/13/2014, 3:03:06 PM2 votes

There is a solution, but it's not a solution any one person can implement. The solution is to gradually change our mindset... we just need to stop focusing on winning at all costs, stop assuming we know better than others, and stop assuming everyone else is toxic.

I do agree with what you are saying. The solution of which you speak of starts with each individual player, People do need to try going into games with a positive outlook and try to be kind to each other. I never complain when someone calls me out personally on a bad play even when they do so rather unfriendly, I instead opt to ask what I could have done better and then try to learn something from them. I didn't start playing with a bad attitude nor do I allow anyone to Make me have one during games. I never said that winning at all costs is an answer either :) I never assume someone is going to be Toxic, I will nicely point out when they are however then leave it at that, if you will read my posts here I hope that you will understand that.

Having said that their are a couple of things I tried to emphasize here:

There is an issue with players feeling bullied. Some people will go the opposite route of me and be rude back instead of just ignoring. Then they sometimes become Toxic themselves and get punished feeling as if other players are getting away with it. This Is a problem !! when someone feels they get punished for what they are trying to stop others form doing. (I am not saying either way is right) I said in the beginning of this thread I believe Most people who say bad things are NOT bad people.

This all led into my last post about why people feel the need to rage and troll. I would like to believe most people are having a bad moment, day, month or whatever that leads them to negative remarks and game play. However, It is a certainty that Some people just do it for Fun ? out of Anger? Spite for not getting what they want? Some do this because they like to "hurt" other people for whatever reason, it is not nice and I don't like it.

Really I don't think you and I are on different pages and I'd like to think that what you said was in reference to all people and not directed at me and this is how I will take it :)) I don't want to sound hostile to you, as I have seen you post before and I understand that these things have a big meaning to you and rightfully so. Do you believe that Riot can influence what you have stated, any program that might help ?

Nudz11/12/2014, 3:46:42 PM1 votes

Usually I try to kiss ass, not because I want to, but because I need the jerk Vayne to win, so I might as well just politely talk to them and do everything I can to win. (PSA Announcement; I have never encountered a polite Vayne main and I doubt I ever will)

Angry Monster11/12/2014, 3:48:24 PM1 votes

The 'don't be a Jerk' rule , worst rule every made. It is very ambiguous and can mean many things. Is taunting in game when super far a head being a jerk? What about being honest about about a team mate that is refusing to group? How about saying GG at the end of a game?

I have seen people on the forums take a different position on each of these. Some are for X and some are for Y. Part of the problem is riot does not give clear rules for what is acceptable. Riot could just as easily say no negativity game and make it a rule. Then everyone would know exactly what is against the rules. Though riot members say that they encourage talking things out in game and pretend that you can give positive criticism and not have it taken the wrong way.

The fact that we do not have clear rules gives trolls the ground to constantly argue and hide in.

LA Woman11/12/2014, 2:35:59 PM1 votes

this is exactly what is wrong with this game...the whole tribunal system is bad...bans should not exist other than for leavers/afks....sometimes offering suggestions to someone translates into you being a jerk for even saying anything and still get reported....people act so childish in this game...apparently they forget that its just a game after all...free to play games are the worst

nerak2311/12/2014, 4:12:50 PM1 votes

Just lost my electricity, oddly enough. Be back when it comes back on. To hard to use phone.

nerak2311/12/2014, 7:02:32 PM1 votes

Well !?! I was typing a response to AFK ing, when I heard a crash and bang, jumped a foot off my chair and banged both me knee's on the table as the lights went out. haha. The sub-station down the road just blew up...

So forgive me for triple posting :)

Lets see, first thanks for all the posts, even those who may not agree with me. I don't mind getting other perspectives as long as they are civil in nature and everyone has been.

nerak2311/13/2014, 12:57:38 PM1 votes

I'd like to talk about all of the things mentioned above (can't though hehe) and I do hope more people will chime in and let me know what they think..:) ty

competition is the reason

I knew as soon as I hit enter that this would come out :) And rightfully so, I realize that you mean that as a reason why and not an excuse To rage. I'm very competitive myself, at sports, gaming, and Work. Yesterday ( after the power went out) I tried to assimilate All those things with league, I am still hard pressed to find where it is at All acceptable to flame others. ( later when I get back here, I need to ask someone how to underline things lol)

Take for example: under-skilled players, 'Unintentional' afk's, lack of knowledge about where to be and lack of understanding opponents specific abilities ....All are reasons for annoyance, it goes back to how you deal with these things. 'Care when turret diving', 'Watch no wards in jungle', or 'Annie is mia' 'might gank'. I am no different then anyone else, Yes I want to win but not at the risk of being an Ass.

I believe their are other reasons for Toxicity, while I don't entirely understand all of those, To Wit:

Losing so player x just feeds or does nothing for team Then they get Toxic ...K, this may be more normal then I'd want to admit but hopefully the next game they are doing better. If this behavior continues an undetermined amount of time, I say go ahead and hand out a punishment. Hope that person learns form it.

But Then there are the people that Troll games for the fun of it... Worse they come here on forum and brag about it, thus causing distrust !!! Doing this action is bad enough, coming on to say "Hur Hur, I can do this and Riots wont get me" That is plain disrespectful !!! Sometimes they say they did this conduct on their smurf and therefore it won't matter if they get caught.

And this last one disturbs me greatly !!! It is bad for anyone who has to play with them and It sows discord threw the player-base that reads or hears of it from this forum.. In this case not only am I okay with punishments but encourage it... I thinks it is One of the worse kind-of abuse. Yes I think it is just that Abuse. I Would very much like to Hear what the rest of the community thinks of this action and how it should be dealt with. Problem with asking for this means I may hear from the very same ones who do this, or one upset with a current punishment, I will take the chance and hope for honest feedback.

Brotha11/12/2014, 2:14:04 PM1 votes

I personally just feel so frustrated when someone starts talking shit in my games. I get annoyed and before I know it I am in an argument with someone I don't even know. People say to just "mute and continue to play" but what makes you WANT to play with a jerk like that? I'd rather he lose the game and feel as angry as he made me than to carry him and allow him to benefit.

nerak2311/13/2014, 5:43:25 PM1 votes

^^ Thanks I was pretty sure it wasn't. I understand how hard it must be for Riot to try to find fixes for bad attitudes, maybe more role models..I can't loose hope! And then the quote below:

Trinityunicorn from earlier comment:

...... I don't know what the solution is for the game, right now I'm thinking about a sort of driving school. lmao. maybe that should be mandatory. lol. I find it really funny in a weird sort of way but that might be an appropriate punishment. Some sort of reading material, access to a mentor that will answer questions, and at the end, a written test and then a probationary period of maybe two weeks where they apply what they've learned. Just loop them back through it if they fail. It wouldn't hurt if they also had to teach it. Author Don Miguel Ruiz comes to mind. 3 strikes and you're out. <that would encompass about 6 weeks worth> If they've shown marked improvement then they might get another chance, if they wanted it.

I have seen others talk about this approach also, in those conversations some felt like this would be easy to bypass, and like you say hard to implement. Something to explore if interested, I am all for hearing ideals like this...lately I have actively been searching for people to talk about this or at least read about this stuff. Any further links or comments appreciated. ty

nerak2311/12/2014, 2:41:38 PM1 votes

bans should not exist other than for leavers/afks

Respectfully I will say, I wouldn't go so far as to approve of the above statement. I do believe Bans have their place and should be used. I don't have a problem with that.

It is true that people act childishly in the game. Just wondering why is that so prevalent in these types of games ?