all of you toxic fucks just let them go because they say in all chat that they were trying. A heads up to all of you morons in gold elo who think they were trying...you don't go 2/18 while trying to survive.
JhomasTefferson2 votesHonestly. If you take your kills and assists, and put them over deaths, and that value that comes out isn't at least .5, you should be able to be reported for feeding. And it should be bannable. or restrict them from ranked.
AsphodelNext1 votesSeriously? Supports would just be banned left and right; if you don't have a good ADC, you don't get anything. And as supports, your KDA means very little compared to your ADC's. I would happily go 0/4/1, so long as my ADC is 4/0/2.
JhomasTefferson1 votesSo you would feed to feed your adc? Then if the enemy is fed your ad carry will have a harder job, despite being fed themselves. It would be better for the adc to not get into that many situations where you have to die for them, and if they're being stupid, even if your sup, don't sac yourself for them. If you have to die that much for your adc either you or the adc is doing it wrong.
DrCyanide1 votesIf the enemy ADC/Support have two death's each in the above scenario, even if the enemy carry got all the kills and had as many assists, you fed your carry more than the enemy got fed.
People often assume that those who died the most fed the most, and that's not necessarily mathematically true.
JhomasTefferson1 votesOh really? I always assumed it was best to just not give the enemy carry kills at all.
How can you tell who fed the most? Cuz i did assume it was whoever died the most unless the jung just was standing in river bush and bot engaged an got killed cuz jung never came in. Then i would blame the jung. I want to make sure it wasn't me, cuz then i'd feel like an asshole.
DrCyanide3 votesI've written some Python code to figure it out, and I'm working it into a website, but it's not ready for prime time yet. If you've got an individual match you're curious about I can feed it in and tell you, just post the Match History link to it.
The gold fed works on a sliding scale. Everyone starts out at 300 gold value. Killing one person or dying once keeps you at 300 gold. Beyond that, your gold value goes up/down more. You can read more about it here - http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Kills#Gold_reward
PS: This sliding scale is the premise of how Proxy Singed works. You died enough that you were worth about as much as a single cannon minion, and yet several members of their team would chase you instead of getting actual gold via farming.
JhomasTefferson1 votesI kinda knew that, and i knew that was an exception, because i've run proxy farm singed. In general, is it safe to assume the person with the least deaths fed the least, or is that false too?
DrCyanide1 votesGenerally, yes, although not always. Take this game for example:
http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1945497344/42592968?tab=overview
The player that fed the most gold in the game was Kalista (3450 gold). Not too surprising, she died the most. Following her was Thresh (2362 gold). Again, not too surprising, he died the next most.
The surprise is the third biggest feeder. It's actually Sivir, the most fed person in the game. She fed 2250 gold. She got to the max gold value (500) every time, and every time she was shutdown it was in an assist situation, making it so each death she was worth 750 gold.
Obviously if a person never died, they fed the least, but beyond that it really comes down to the kills.
LaceUp231 votesUhm, you wouldn't be 0/4/1 if your adc was 4/0/2. If you were, you were doing nothing in that game whatsoever to put your adc there. If your adc was 4/0/2, you would probably be at least something like 0-X-5/6.
OhBoyItsaMegaman1 votesHonestly. If you take your kills and assists, and put them over deaths, and that value that comes out isn't at least .5, you should be able to be reported for feeding. And it should be bannable. or restrict them from ranked.
Are you telling me that your K+A/D would be higher than .5 if we put you into a game with all Challenger players?
Your number of kills, deaths, assists, and cs depend on your skill level relative to the other players in the game. If you are put into a game where you are the most skilled player by far, your KDA will be very high. If you are put into a game where you are the least skilled player by far, your KDA will be very low. There is nothing you can do to prevent that. Even if you improve, there are always more highly skilled players who would crush you if you had to play against them.
If someone's KDA ratio is very low, it is generally a sign that either a.) their MMR is too high and they are currently on their way down to the MMR they belong in (where they will start having a much better score), or b.) they have an unusual skillset that allows them to win games even while dying often and getting few kills and assists. For example, they understand how to pressure the map and focus on objectives, so that their team wins even if they are feeding.
Neither a.) nor b.) should be punishable, obviously.
JhomasTefferson1 votesBut if the mmr system is right no ones mmr should be too high or too low. And yes, the figure i gave didn't account for that point made in b). I do that too, but even when i "feed" my score isn't that bad. I might have 14 deaths, but i have usually an equal or close to equal number of assists.
It's possible to put an objective score into that too, and would probably be a good metric to include in calculating mmr.
OhBoyItsaMegaman1 votesBut if the mmr system is right no ones mmr should be too high or too low.
Yes, ideally, but there are many reasons why someone's MMR might not be accurate. Someone practices and gets better at the game, or their main gets buffed (or nerfed) or a new champ gets released that they're really good with. If their MMR—or their opponents' MMR—become inaccurate and they have a bad game, is that a reason to ban them?
I might have 14 deaths, but i have usually an equal or close to equal number of assists.
"Usually"... But not "always". Everyone in every division has had the rare game where they go 1/7/1 or 0/11/4 despite their best efforts. You have too, or else I don't think you would have used the word "usually". Would you feel good about receiving a 30-win ranked restriction next time you go 1/7/1?
It's possible to put an objective score into that too, and would probably be a good metric to include in calculating mmr.
It actually wouldn't! The MMR formula is based on the Elo rating system. It predicts the percent chance to win based on the players' win-loss history. If you award extra points based on what happened in the game, it becomes a less accurate predictor. For example, if using a bishop to capture a piece awarded you extra Elo, players who consistently focus on using their bishops would have an inflated Elo. That player's Elo would do a poorer job than before of predicting who he would have a good chance of beating.
JhomasTefferson1 votesThe third point is true. But of course the banning wouldn't be after one game. It would be after 2 or 3 in quick succession. Maybe if you have three in a day. Or something like that.
OhBoyItsaMegaman1 votesWell wait, are we talking about intentional feeding or unintentional feeding? If you think that having a terrible KDA is something that people should be punished for even if it was unintentional, why be lenient?
We've already established that having an extremely bad game can happen completely out of your control if a.) your MMR is higher than it should be (bad player just starting ranked), b.) the MMR of someone else in the game is lower than it should be (Challenger smurfing in Silver), or c.) you're in a totally fair game but just get unlucky.
What kind of behavior are we disincentivizing by punishing people who have three extremely bad games in a row, or in a day? What lesson is learned? What is the goal of this rule?
JhomasTefferson1 votesIt's to stop unintentional feeding. The penalty for it should be less severe than intentional, but it shouldn't go unpunished. It could be a simple as ranked restriction. I know my plan isn't perfect. The point of my post was to say that there should be something like what i suggested in place.
I guess the goal of this rule is to make ranked experience better. If i did really shit over and over again i would just take a break from ranked anyway. I just want their to be some way that unintentional feeding can be punished, and since there's no system in place i suggested one flippantly without giving much thought to it. It would be a hard process yes, but would there be a way to do it? I believe so.
Your points have been good, and i see that what i at first thought was a cut and dry issue is not so cut and dry. I still think a system that punishes unintentional feeding is necessary. I don't know how to do it, but i think there should be a way to.
OhBoyItsaMegaman1 votesOkay, let me put this "problem" of unintentional feeding in a different perspective.
Unintentional feeding is something that cannot be accomplished by one person. It takes two. One person to die, and another person on the other team make the kill.
What if Riot implemented a system to punish both people who were responsible for the unintentional feeding? The player who had the really bad KDA and the player who kept killing him. This would put a REALLY fast stop to unintentional feeding, don't you think? As soon as you realize that you have a lead on someone, you would stop fighting them entirely, even when they can easily be killed, even when they clumsily engage on you. Failure to comply would mean that your account gets restricted or banned, maybe even permabanned. There would definitely not be any more unintentional feeding.
That's ridiculous.
It's ridiculous but it would absolutely work. I'm sure you don't think it's fair, but why not? You're winning the game, you have some items, and if you keep making the decision to position properly, use skills effectively, buy the appropriate items, and focus on the correct enemy, you're going to ruin the game for a bunch of people who got stuck on the same team as that feeder. But you're not doing anything wrong, are you? You can't help it if he's bad. The game is about making good decisions in order to get your team closer to winning; you can't help it if your decisions are right and his decisions are wrong.
And he can't help that either.
The failing here is not the bad player's failure. How is he bad? Just because he's worse than someone else, that makes him bad? Maybe the bad player in this example is in Silver, and the good player is Gold. Maybe the bad player is low Diamond and the good player is high Diamond. Maybe the bad player is xPeke and the good player is Nagne. It's relative. And saying "you should be punished when you're pitted against someone who is better than you and you do worse than them" makes EXACTLY as much sense as saying "you should be punished when you're pitted against someone who is worse than you and you do better than them."
I understand that you're looking at this with the goal of making the ranked experience better. And in your view, when someone on your team does really poorly, that makes ranked suck for you. But there is no possible way of making this go away. One of the two teams is going to lose, and half the time it's going to be your team. One person on your team is going to have the worst performance, and four out of five times it's not going to be you. If that seems like something to get upset about, if it seems unbearable that you will frequently lose games because of someone else's unintentionally bad performance, then you may have to re-examine the reason that you play a team PvP game. Because people will always lose. People will always feed. It's relative.
Raptamei2 votesHonestly. If you take your kills and assists, and put them over deaths, and that value that comes out isn't at least .5, you should be able to be reported for feeding. And it should be bannable. or restrict them from ranked.
0-1-0 is feeding and bannable?
JhomasTefferson1 votesYou're being a smartass and i have nothing to say to you if you want to continue to be retarded.
JhomasTefferson1 votesHas anyone noticed this comment has more comments than the actual thread?
Archon X1 votessays the level 24.
qnn4MLdDF41 votesHad a player call gg at 12 minutes. Then proceeds to go 0/8/0 and wants 3 of us reported for sitting in fountain while the enemy team destroys our base at about the 25 minute mark because we had no way to stop them thanks to not only that player, but our jungle going 0/7. The system will never catch them or if it does maybe in a couple months, but from me saying "FU*KING SURRENDER" I will probably be chat banned or get a 7 day ban within the next 12 hours. Rito such gud system. They literally don't care because swearing is according to Lyte the literal worst thing any human being can do, but feeding over and over in matches is less bad because it doesn't hurt peoples feelings.
