New Champion Select Experience Disabled

RiotRiot Socrates·Jan 14, 2016·17 votes·16,481 views

UPDATE 8:50 PST - New champion select has been reenabled in ranked and draft mode.

Original Post:

Hey all, we are reverting the new champ select on NA back to regular Normal and Ranked draft due to unforeseen technical issues. We will update you on our progress in the coming days.

If you entered matchmaking via the new champion select in the past few minutes (~2:20 PM PST 1.14) you will need to leave queue and reenter in order to ensure you can find matches correctly.

101 Comments

NariilJan 14, 201643 votes

Could we perhaps have team builder back while this is happening?

3PowerJan 14, 201615 votes

Could we perhaps have team builder back period?

Why are you ignoring all criticism of its removal, riot?

SolashJan 14, 201619 votes

New champ select is objectively just a better team builder. If both existed, Team builder would not get used much tbh.

DeadlyStalkerJan 14, 201616 votes

Team builder is better than new champ select. Period.

I don't want to play a "secondary role" which dosn't exist because i don't like playing secondary roles.

Leave team builder for the casual players. Replace new champ select with ranked and everyone happy.

No need to make a percent of your player base sad because you just feel like enforcing something.

JariJan 14, 201616 votes

Are you someone that only finds enjoyment playing one role in this game? Try branching out a bit. It won't kill you.

GaralagonJan 14, 201616 votes

It could kill you repeatedly and then cause your team to lose because you fed. LOL

JariJan 15, 201612 votes

There are roles that complement each other.

If someone plays jungle, they could pick up support. Both of them have the goal of helping the team survive and win the lane.

People who play top could also go jungler. There's a lot of bulky junglers. Hell, some of them work in both.

Mid laners could go support or marksman. Support because there are mage supports, and marksman because you still stay back and perform your damage from a distance.

Nobody is demanding you perform your secondary as good as your first, but you are expected to at least have a basic understanding of the roles. Even just knowing the basics can help you out in your primary role.

EmposterJan 15, 20165 votes

Just because you can doesn't mean you have to. Team builder was perfect for people who just wanted to play one role. Personally, I'm a support main. I'm not bad at other roles, but I do not enjoy playing them. I can understand it for ranked, but for casual normals? Why should I have a 50/50 shot of just not having fun when the old system let me always enjoy it.

AbodyHUN666Jan 15, 20161 votes

It was made this way, so popular roles won't get oversaturated while everyone is waiting for support. It replaced Team builder, because it objectively did it's job better. Soon they will make a version of it for blind pick without bans which will drain the few remaining people from the original team builder. Basically if they kept both, you'd sometimes get a team in half an hour which isn't fun.

Hi im JTiffJan 15, 20161 votes

I agree with you... at least in the case of ranked, when I'm playing to win and not just to relax. You shouldn't expect to be able to play the role or champion that you wanted especially when the ultimate goal is cooperative and competitive gameplay.

I'm a top main but also frequently jungle since, as you pointed out, they somewhat compliment each other. Despite the fact that I'm proficient at both I find jungle far more stressful and less enjoyable than top lane.

With teambuilder I could hop into a game with the exact role and champion that I wanted, but now this avenue is gone. There is no longer a way to get this guarantee and that fact honestly just motives me to dodge queue until I get my desired role.

JariJan 15, 20161 votes

Dodge queuing brings it's own punishments. If you wish to do so until you get your role, it's none of my business since we aren't getting in games together.

The new system is trying to promote branching out a bit though. It sucks enjoying one role a lot more than the other, and therefor you want that role instead. I get that. What you can try to do is if you get jungle, ask the top laner if you could swap with him. Sometimes they'll swap with you, and the worst they can say is no. Team Builder's weakness was that the queue's took so long if you didn't fill in certain spots. From what I noticed, the demand for lanes goes about like, top=mid>jungle>Marksman>Support, meaning bot lane is the rarest. Whenever I queued with a couple of my friends in team builder, filling in jungle, Marksman, and Support, got us a party in five seconds. If we didn't, we'd have to wait 5-30 minutes.

Admiral ZeeJan 18, 20161 votes

So what if the queues took a long time, some people would rather wait the time and get their preferred roles than go into a game with a 50/50 shot. I personally don't care what role I go but I have friends who only enjoy certain roles. Why should the be forced to play a role they don't enjoy, in a game that is supposed to be fun, just because Riot said so? How does that make sense, this is a game and for most people is just for fun. What fun is there in playing a role you don't like, some people don't want to branch out and they shouldn't be forced to do so. So you didn't enjoy the wait, good for you. You like the new queue, good for you, but other people don't and they should bring teambuilder back. There is no harm in having it around.

JariJan 18, 20161 votes

My example of the wait time was the one I was still hearing. If we go way back people complained that if you didn't play 100% meta champions you were just kicked from the group or harassed first.

Even by the end of its life that still existed. We had a Vayne throw a huge fit over letting in a Vel'koz support. They even won lane and Vayne kept bitching over putting something off meta in the team.

So connecting a problem here, the host had too much control and this new champ select makes the power go around more evenly. Even in old draft that was the case, but team builder made the host able to just decline you because you wanted to play Yasuo top and he didn't like that. Even I'm guilty of this. If I was host, I'd never let a LeBlanc join my team because I didn't like the run the huge risk of it being someone who wants to just tear the team apart.

Or in a simple way to put it, forums bitched and whined about team builder. Well look where we are now. Sucks doesn't it.

ElladrilJan 15, 20161 votes

[deleted]

JariJan 15, 20161 votes

Team builder had the issue of making people wait an extremely long time if they didn't have anyone to fill in the remaining roles, provided there weren't many people. When I went with a couple of my friends, we noticed that the group fills extremely fast if we filled in bot lane and the jungle, where as if we only needed the marksman and support, we sat there for 30 minutes waiting for them.

I understand that it is shit that you can't play your most preferred or most fun role 100% of the time, but that was the weakness of Team Builder. With the new system, it's trying to promote branching out. In fact, sometimes if you ask, people will give you their spot anyways.

ElladrilJan 16, 20161 votes

[deleted]

JariJan 16, 20161 votes

Half the time we'd cover at least bot lane, since one usually plays mid, I usually ADC and one sometimes supports, so it would go by quickly.

However, if I wanted to jungle and he wanted to top, it took 20 minutes for a support, and we'd maybe find 4 marksman if lucky in that time, of course all of them leaving away. The new queue isn't longer by any means from my experience, and is faster provided people remember to lock in.

raviel4321Jan 16, 20162 votes

No it is not. For ranked yes its definitely better to play a role you are comfortable at, but what about practice? If i buy a champ im obviously worse with it then i am with one i have dozens (hundreds) of games on. So i enjoyed the more appropriate matching considering games played on the role and champ that team builder had to offer, also if i just want to train on a single champion or test new masteries or item build i want to get that champion on the role i want to test. If i want to spam 10 games on a champ for practice getting a different role or champ is counterproductive. its like wasting 20+ minutes playing a champ that im reasonably good at and don't want to improve on at the moment. Also there is the ban phase. If you want to try mundo who gets banned in 80% of the games you don't want to hope to get the 20% game where you can actually play him.

The0therDadJan 19, 20161 votes

This is how I feel. I mean I do Bot Games to get warmed up then I head to team builder to hone my skills. What little skill I have that is.

CrazedPorcupineJan 14, 20169 votes

To those complaining. This was essentially a live Beta Test. They stated that they were only going to turn on the option in NA and TR so that they could stress test the queue and find bugs that would not be found in the PBE. Many features that transition from PBE to Live are usually based on stress test situations and the fact that probability favors the Live environment.

Please, be patient with Riot. This could end up being an issue as severe as the Recall bug that caused them to close ranked for 2 days while they searched for a fix. They're working on fixing this so that we can have the new queue back as soon as possible.

EDIT: You may want to actually sticky this thread Riot.

YuinJan 15, 20169 votes

Why take away Team Builder? It's never guaranteed for us to play the champ we want in the new champ select!

MindWavesJan 14, 20167 votes

"We will update you on our progress in the coming days."

If this is going to take DAYS, then can we please get Team Builder back?

jfc

ThatH1N1Jan 14, 20167 votes

Bring back team builder permanently.

Alchemist PrimeJan 14, 20167 votes

Riot, can the LoL community at least know what caused the revert of the New Champion Select? Like what kind of bugs/technical difficulties were found that caused the revert?

I think the community deserves to know why something that was heavily anticipated, ended up being short lived. Thanks!

World EnderJan 14, 20163 votes

This thread describes the known issues.

Alchemist PrimeJan 14, 20161 votes

Tbh I don't think those should be reasons that the queue should be disabled, those are something we can live without, those were features we lived without patches ago.

There has to be some major issue they're not mentioning in that post, those things listed should be just added over time and are not reasons to disable the entire queue type.

Needles KJan 15, 20162 votes

They took it down due to problems with the hardware running the new features.

JacobAngel98Jan 14, 20166 votes

Can we please have team builder back, can we have some way of getting the lane we want again, especially if this will take days...

ThePartyLeaderJan 14, 20165 votes

Thanks for the update, best of luck with the mobs.

Fat SlobJan 14, 20165 votes

What is the point of PBE? Thanks for letting me down again like usual.

CrazedPorcupineJan 14, 20167 votes

The PBE just doesn't have the population to really stress test queues like the new champ select. That's why they turned it on only in Turkey and in NA. The Live servers stress queues in ways completely foreign to the PBE environment.

SaltincJan 14, 20165 votes

Which is why they need to start mass invites to the PBE server. I get that it's small and everything, but they could atleast make another PBE server. Maybe I'm just butthurt because they have't invited me, but still, if the population is too low to test something in the PBE then they need to bump it up a bit.

MinardeJan 14, 20161 votes

Only a handful of things (e.g. new matchmaking algorithms) require stress/load testing. For most things (e.g. item or champion mechanics), a small group of focused testers works better to reduce noise.

SaltincJan 14, 20161 votes

Well that can be what the second server is used for. Make it larger and only used for said "matchmaking algorithms" and other large projects. While testing for this new PBErs are added, with the notice of only for the short time these things need to be tested. Then after every hole is patched in the system the new server is shut down and new PBErs are thanked and dismissed. Of course people will be mad, that's how the general public works, but this way would be better for the population at large by making sure everything is ready at the launch of new patches.

CrazedPorcupineJan 14, 20161 votes

Except, then you have players torn between the two environments.

And there's enough people to test stuff, but the people on the PBE are kind of stupid when it comes to balance/being able to actually play.

SaltincJan 14, 20161 votes

There's already a lot of people torn between the environments available atm to really justify this. And, there are millions of people playing this game every day. Also, the point I'm trying to make is that not everyone will have the PBE available at all times. Just long enough to fix the new large content projects' bugs and what not. So after they get done with that, they can get back to the live server until the next big project gets underway. It also gives more people the chance to be apart of the PBE and possibly make a game changing discovery. And it gives Riot the chance to weed out some of the stale PBE players and replace them with committed PBErs. I know I for one would jump at the opportunity.

CrazedPorcupineJan 15, 20162 votes

There's a difference between tens of thousands of players, and several million. hell even if you got up to a couple hundred thousand, it still wouldn't be as much or as big as the live servers. You just can't stress test servers in closed beta environments like you can on Live.

SaltincJan 15, 20161 votes

Like I said above, I think it's a risk worth testing. If it fails then it fails and is never seen again. Give the public a chance to test things without possibly screwing up the live server, and see how well it works.

MinardeJan 14, 20162 votes

The problem is that it'd be redundant and unused for most of the time. Testers would have to setup accounts again, mess with patching again, and whatnot. More importantly, it still wouldn't come close to Live server numbers unless an absolutely massive number of people are invited to this temporary PBE. At that point, it's more practical just to test it on the actual Live servers.

It might not even be bugs causing problems for TBDraft. Maybe there's a bottleneck somewhere that the team thought would be manageable, but now isn't.

SaltincJan 15, 20161 votes

I agree with the possible bottleneck issue, but opting over messing with everyone's game time, rather then testers who are prepared for it seems rather odd to me. I just think it's a more practical option. The setting up accounts and patching for the PBE server is still done when you do get accepted into it, and they do big projects around once a year, so I don't believe it would be too big of a deal. As for being unused for most of the time, that could be fixed with a crew that constantly applies the updates and patches to keep it in top shape for when the server is needed.

MinardeJan 15, 20162 votes

Yes, setup and patching is currently done for PBE. Having a second PBE means testers have to do so twice, once for each PBE server. Having a crew maintain an unused PBE servers eats into resources as well, either by increasing the workload of the existing server guys or by having to hire more people.

Furthermore, even if everyone who applied was accepted, the standard tiers of playerbase engagement means that the vast majority of the playerbase would not have cared enough to apply. The raw numbers of "players engaged enough to join PBE" compared to "all League players" just differ by too much.

SaltincJan 15, 20161 votes

I just feel like it would be a risk worth taking. If the server has a large amount of success, then I don't see a problem with hiring new staff to run it. and if the server doesn't have success then shut it down. You don't have to hire new people at first, just have the information analyzed by the PBE crew as it stands now. Just trying it out couldn't hurt. But I do get the problem with find dedicated PBE testers. But if the public is never given the chance, then we will never find out if that is a problem or not. I just feel like it could be a better solution then having problems on the live server.

McprowlingtonJan 14, 20164 votes

We'll update you on our progress in the coming days.

DAYS!?

VìcariousJan 14, 20163 votes

{quoted}

DAYS!?

Some bugs take a lengthy time to deal with, especially when you completely overhaul a system.

S H A Y C 0Jan 14, 20163 votes

Can you at least tell us what actually happened? Ive been looking forward to this all day, and i still havent gotten to try it because i had to work all day to buy more skins, lol! Im so bummed man....i cant even describe it.[zombie-nunu-tears]

GodJosephJan 15, 20163 votes

I hope you guys saw the post on reddit from a master tier. Being able to queue up in (SOLO QUEUE) with 5 people is not solo queue. Getting LCS pro team beating your ass in solo queue is not fun and right. Its not solo queue anymore its 5v5 ranked team so why DAFAQ does 5 people queue together in solo queue exist???

MrwiOzV6pBJan 15, 20163 votes

I believe the more people you have in your party the higher elo your enemies are. That's how it worked for duo. So like if your full party team is like silver the solo enemies will probably be gold. That's how I'm guessing it will work based on the current status of how duo works. It could also work like if you queue with a full 5 man party it will only find a full enemy team 5 man party. Riot isn't that stupid to just a people build an entire team to versus people playing alone in solo queue without some type of advantage.