Why does Janna always have a high win-rate?

VØIÐ·Mar 22, 2018·30 votes·5,373 views

I never recall her having a win-rate bellow 50% at any season/patch. Is she still that strong after the nerfs/reworks, or is it just Janna things?

121 Comments

dunder killMar 22, 201845 votes

Combination of high impact abilities, low risk, and ease of use

RainbowIceeMar 22, 20187 votes

yup, i know people say janna has a skill ceiling i believe them. But she is very easy to pick up if you know how the game works, once you know how ganks/ warding/ and peels work in the overall game janna becomes a breeze. When i first started i didn't get janna, now i'm like OP

rtbf221651412Mar 22, 201813 votes

{quoted}

once you know how ganks/ warding/ and peels work in the overall game janna becomes a breeze.

Huehuehue

LordGeovanniMar 22, 20183 votes

I believe the same thing about Vayne Yasou and Riven. because even though they can have a bunch of things done they are balanced so that even if you use the low end of they abilities you can carry. This is why when people meet these champions they dont go meta champions they go their absolute best pocket picks so they can shut them down at least try to go even with them.

ElohavenMar 22, 20182 votes

Vayne, Yasuo, and Riven - albeit annoying - require skill to use. Especially in high elo lol.

Jana in high elo linearly increases in winrate to 52% unlike any other support.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20181 votes

These champions require skill to use versus other people who main their champions. A yasou who just started yasou this game versus a trundle who just started trundle this game even though people will say its in trundles favor because he has targeted skills yasou out scale trundle by his first buy and invalidate him the rest of the game. same riven even more so she wont lose early lane to trundle. vayne while she might lose lane to the adc in her lane any one else in any of the other lanes is only prey to be hunted. Which is why i say people know if you see a riven or a yasou / vayne pick you cant try xxx champion that you wanted to play you have to pick your main champion you know you do well on or lose the game and when that happens those champions get buffed because their winrates dont reflect what other champions are when its people casually playing 'high skill cap champions' which are supposed to innately have lower winrates for being supposedly high skill cap. I can win lanes and games versus these champions but it usually consists of picking a champion i main beating them early and avoiding them the rest of the game.

ElohavenMar 24, 20181 votes

No. A new Yasuo will have no knowledge on the trades and how weak Yasuo is. They won't exploit his outplay potential. Trundle's kit is easier. The trundle will win.

You just lack the game knowledge to beat these champions.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20181 votes

If i lack the game knowledge to beat them then how do i beat them on my mains.???? These champions have very Little room to mess up because they only have cdr gating them and they get over buffed spells for some reason when they should have spells that are weaker than ones on their mana using counter parts because they dont use mana. Similar to vayne who does use mana but uses very little.

Spicy RiceMar 24, 20181 votes

Knowing how to use your main doesn't equal knowing how to play against a specific champion.

RainbowIceeMar 23, 20181 votes

The hard thing about yasuo is mostly paying attention to your dashes, can't just dash through thing mindlessly gotta set up a road / way back after engaging.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20181 votes

If the cooldown on the dashes were like 10 seconds not 6 id maybe agree. by time as you dash to block yourself in with front line minions you have 2-3 seconds on first front line minions and back line minions you can waste time on.

HalcyonDwellerMar 22, 201818 votes

It's because she has been safe and reliable for protecting her carries. Being easy to use makes it so that lots of people will play her by default when they have to support, and because she is easy to play she's also easy to carry.

The nature of the champion makes it harder to feed with her / with her on your team. Just like Ahri. So their win-rate is inflated because feeding when falling behind is a major factor in losing a match. Champions that are more resilient to that tend to have inflated win-rates.

ChaddyFantomeMar 22, 20182 votes

{quoted}

It's because she has been safe and reliable for protecting her carries. Being easy to use makes it so that lots of people will play her by default when they have to support, and because she is easy to play she's also easy to carry.

The nature of the champion makes it harder to feed with her / with her on your team. Just like Ahri. So their win-rate is inflated because feeding when falling behind is a major factor in losing a match. Champions that are more resilient to that tend to have inflated win-rates.

This person gets it.

Spacesuit SpiffMar 22, 20182 votes

This. I hate supporting against her (or rather, the version of her before they moved some power into her AD) because you can't really snowball against her. She basically stops the enemy support from carrying, and if you try to stomp her anyways, at best its a small victory and at worst you get ganked or just lose the 2v2 outright.

HalcyonDwellerMar 23, 20181 votes

I mean, I wasn't making an argument for OR against her. I was simply stating why she tends to have a higher win-rate than other enchanters. She doesn't oppress opponents really, she just inhibits snowballing, so people who aren't able to win without snowballing wind up having a really difficult time against her.

I don't think that win rate is grounds for buffs or nerfs in and of itself. Other analysis should be done as well, such as comparing play rate and % of mains among her total playerbase.

Spacesuit SpiffMar 23, 20181 votes

I shoulda mentioned that the mini-rework made this way more manageable. She's still the hardest to snowball against, but if you're better than she is it can be done to an extent now. Good solution rito.

HalcyonDwellerMar 23, 20181 votes

Ayyy, I like your username, only just noticed it. Good reference!

Yeah I agree with you on that. They improved it by making her have to actually play and interact more instead of just being a shield bot.

CochoMar 22, 201817 votes

because bad jannas dont exist

(except when I play adc xd)

RobbieFry13Mar 22, 20183 votes

What I can't figure out is how people get her to do so much more than I can. I build the same as everyone else but when I play her I just float around and maybe help with some cc and run away. I do no damage, am super squishy and My ult heals like 5 hp. when other people play her she melts minion waves and turrets solo pushing lanes, her shield is stronger than Morg's, and her Ult gives like +5000 HP at lvl 6. [sg-janna] Maybe its because I keep playing her when Cocho is ADC

Full AP JesusMar 22, 20183 votes

I play a decent amount of Janna on various accounts.

It's all about how you use her passives.

Like after the first 3 lvls, put points into W for harrass, with the frost knife thing, and aery it does good damage. If they don't have a heavy diver go ignite. Use your shields passive to follow up with the extra ad from auto attacks. Ardent censor makes the auto harrass really good. But if they are aggressive save shield for your adc.

With as passive and disengaging she can be. You can also use her abilities to be aggressive. Like flash behind enemy ADC or support and ult to push them towards your adc while your JG ganks. Q, w, exhaust (I doubt you'd need that much) is a death sentence.

Starting your tornadoes from the fog of war to where an enemy adc would have to stand to last hit is normally an easy knock up+full q damage. Follow up with quick w. Save shield for poke on ADC or you depending on enemy laners.

And that's just for starters but that's good harrass techniques for her.

And about being squishy, her w passive +mobis is the answer to this. She gets so fast that it is hard to hit her with abilities. Makes dodging super ez. But if they have a strong bursty AP. Go locket. If they have AD, go randuins or something. You really only need support item, mobis, and ardent censor.

I rarely need redemption(although it's nice to have) but if your dying quick then defense would be the better choice cause you'll just die right after redemption hits anyways cause bursty. Lol

But Hope this helps. : D

Snowman ArcMar 23, 20181 votes

Can't pass on Redemption, honestly. It's just insanely good for the team. You can use Redemption instead of ulti for the healing and save ulti for another time, like for a knockback, or a secondary heal. I can't recall a game that I lost where 1) we didn't fall behind hard and 2) my ADC couldn't get deleted in less than 1 second by someone like Zed + Rengar jumping on them. If someone doesn't get blown up early in the fight, then there is no way to lose that fight. Healing and shielding is just insane.

Full AP JesusMar 26, 20181 votes

Yes I agree. It's a really good item. But Im looking at it this way, if I die before the fight even happens, then we lost the fight. (Which isn't always true but that's how I treat it) When the enemy team starts seeing that the Janna is the problem, you'll become their number 1 target. Meaning no shields, peel, disengage, slowing, and healing for the team if you are bursted.

In certain situations, I feel like replacing redemption early with heavy defensive items could benefit your team more. Cause redemption is once every 120 seconds or something. While her shields, Nados, slows are every 10 seconds ish. I feel like Janna being alive is more valuable than a small 80-370 heal (roundabout numbers) after she dies which your team could be zoned out of it or die before it hits.

But like you, I buy redemption every game they don't have divers or have divers that don't target me. Which is a pretty good percentage of my games.

Redemption or not, with her ult up the diver should never be able to successfully jump on you or your carry.

Vapor Wave VibesMar 22, 20187 votes

Good disengage and her dmg is higher in lane than it used to be. With a good adc most games you just run on auto pilot

InfernapeMar 22, 20187 votes

Because it's close to impossible to be bad at Janna. Her kit is so rewarding but you have to put in near enough zero effort.

GelmousMar 22, 20182 votes

that's why i hate having a Janna support, they sit back and Q through your minion wave

CrazFight Mar 22, 20189 votes

{quoted}

that's why i hate having a Janna support, they sit back and Q through your minion wave

A good janna shouldn't be q'ing your minion waves 99% of the time...

GelmousMar 25, 20181 votes

good Janna

pick one

adorable supportMar 22, 20186 votes

{quoted}

Because it's close to impossible to be bad at Janna. Her kit is so rewarding but you have to put in near enough zero effort.

that's not exactly true lol. just check QTpie's stream in the morning. he usually has some autofilled janna who has no clue what they're doing and just ints/doesn't use their abilities.

that being said, you don't need to be good at Janna to be ~~somewhat useful~~ on her. you can just spam shields and hope that your carries can carry you.

as a janna main (and as someone who plays lots of enchanter supports in general), i wish riot would find a way to make shields more skillful to use. I don't think you should be able to just put a shield on a 100% hp ally and have it negate damage while also giving your teammate stat buffs. that being said, I haven't really thought much of a way they can make shields more skillful.

i do hope they rework champions like janna and lulu in the future, though. for how little effort and skill you need to play these champions, they shouldn't be so rewarding to play. as champions they are also boring, unimaginative, and lack personality.

VØIÐMar 22, 20183 votes

"as champions they are also boring, unimaginative, and lack personality."

Soraka item 3070 That personally hurts to hear, coming from me who is quite a long time Soraka main.

Spacesuit SpiffMar 22, 20182 votes

At least raka has to land a skillshot for some of her utility. Its not much but its more than Janna/Lulu.

Maybe Janna has some E power tied to Q? E is scaled down, but multiplied if cast while someone is knocked up by Q. That also makes the shield predictable.

Glory97Mar 22, 20187 votes

In most elos people just dont respect janna. They counterpick themself. If the enemy first picks janna, your midlaner will still don't give a fck and lock that Zed . And the toplaner will still pick Riven . And janna counters these champions making them absolutly useless.

Der LindwurmMar 22, 20186 votes

{quoted}

In most elos people just dont respect janna.

This is huge. People mistakenly breathe a sigh of relief when the enemy team picks Janna rather than something more clearly menacing like Thresh or Brand. They think she'll just be another target in bot lane and get caught off guard when she uses her abilities to make plays because they're not worried about her.

FairyfleurMar 22, 20186 votes

I mean I'd still rather fight Brand or Janna over Thresh. His kit so so overloaded and annoying. Plus, Brand and Janna are punished much more for bad positioning than Thresh imo.

CasterGilgameshMar 22, 20184 votes

when has thresh ever felt fair to play against lol?

Spicy RiceMar 24, 20181 votes

I don't know how he isn't fair, as you pretty much know what he will do at any given moment.

Is he running at you? He's gonna flay you.

Is he moving back and forth a distance away from you? He's gonna hook

Is he running away from the fight? He's gonna lantern

etc

CasterGilgameshMar 27, 20181 votes

thresh is a support that litterally crowed out a lot of other supports just from his existance...this is all IMO btw. i just hate hooks like thresh and blitz cranks.

LordGeovanniMar 24, 20181 votes

Id rather facea good thresh or a good Janna over bad Brand bot lane.

HópeMar 22, 201812 votes

{quoted}

In most elos people just dont respect janna. They counterpick themself. If the enemy first picks janna, your midlaner will still don't give a fck and lock that . And the toplaner will still pick . And janna counters these champions making them absolutly useless.

Its a problem because she counterpicks more than half the roster.

ZedexMar 22, 20188 votes

She counters divers. There's plenty of long range champions that can deal with Janna and her carry late game, imo.

EedatMar 22, 201812 votes

What? She counters divers, assassins, juggernauts, tanks, bruisers, practically anything melee. That's why she's always viable. She's not just strong in "assassin meta" or "tank meta".

no to toxicMar 22, 20183 votes

She doesn´t counter Trynd since trynd counters himself by picking Trynd instead of Fiora or any other splitpusher.

NorthernRedStarMar 22, 20183 votes

{quoted}

she counterpicks more than half the roster.

AmenPersonMar 22, 20186 votes

She's just a simple champ. This is essentially Janna, and I wish I was kidding.

https://i.imgur.com/INkoDs6.png?noredirect

THE RlVER KlNGMar 22, 20185 votes

she does one thing really well extremely easily

and the thing she does (godlike peel and carry protection) will never be out of meta

JJI744Mar 23, 20183 votes

OK, before I say the rest, I want to say I think Janna takes a lot of skill to play well.

That said, the skill floor is really low. Its super easy to play Janna at a lvl where you get a lot out of the kit. And to be blunt, the majority of the player-base is bad at the game. So easy to play champs usually do well. To the point that if a hard to play champ is doing really well, the champ is usually either not as hard as people think, or just plain OP to the point you can play them badly and still win.

ZephyrDrakeMar 22, 20182 votes

she is a champion with a simple, straightforward kit that anyone can use and still be of some value. Only real ability that you can screw up royally with is her ult if you want to try something fancy with it (also a horribly placed tornado)

ZedexMar 22, 20182 votes

She's got really strong support capabilities through disengages and protections for her carry.

The marksmen is a prime target by everyone and she excels at passively defending them. She's a very safe pick and overall one of the best enchanters in the game, and has been for a very long time. I don't think she's overpowered, but she's got it going in all the right places if you know what I mean.

PopcornBunniMar 22, 20182 votes

Keep in mind that if Janna has a poor winrate, all the other enchanters will have a worse one yet. She does all their jobs better, so until she's gutted below them she will always have a high winrate.

Ben SwoIoMar 22, 20182 votes

All Janna players do is spam shields and pray for a carry.

rtbf225618241Mar 22, 20182 votes

As someone who mained Janna for 3 years and achieved near-total mastery on her it's because her kit is designed to be used by the most cowardly support possible for it's safety and large nets of safety. Her Q is wide and effective enough to work as a reliable disengage, her W is a reliable...dis/-engage and it's point and click and her E...POINT AND CLICK B.F.SWORD with a large shield. Her R goes beyond explanation. it's literally a massive knockback with a huge heal on it.

And her passive's just a...passive movement speed increase.

She's not called the queen of disengage for nothing and Riot seems to not care for her lack of skill expression. There are ways but i have seen nobody surpass me or even come close to my playstyle which doesn't involve hiding behind your Adc until the game's over. It's fucking annoying and i've grown disgusted by almost every Janna player i've come across as they're all a bunch of cheesy cowardly little shits who think that's skill. Spamming point and click abilities...even Pantheon take more than that.

Unfortunately, with how damage creep went out of control, i haven't played her in a very long time now as Support has become an unreliable role to carry from and Janna can only keep people alive, not fix their mechanical errors that they consistently make.