Fizz Nerf Numbers on PBE

Tilted Your Game··11 votes·3,168 views
Fizz 7.10

Hi, I'm a platinum fizz one trick on multiple accounts and just wanted to talk about some numbers in the fizz nerfs with 5 bullets.

  1. I think Fizz top is a problem, he's unhealthy and should definitely be dealt with in exactly the way done on the PBE right now (which is lower base values and increase ratios)

  2. I think the numbers are just slightly off because of the nerf they put on mid fizz. Last time riot balanced fizz, it was a buff because he was under-performing, and with the new banshees his winrate mid and dropped again. So nerfing his early game in an attempt to stop top lane fizz is a mistake imo.

  3. I have calculated the numbers for both old fizz at rank 5 W, and new fizz at rank 5 W (image below).

  4. As you can see in my numbers, his early numbers for AP fizz are down quite a bit and especially mid game they become apparent before hitting 375AP (a VERY high number for fizz who builds utility AP items like protobelt and zhonyas)

  5. My suggestion is simple increase it to 25/35/45/55/65, from the current 20/30/40/50/60 and that'll save his early game. This saves his early game by basically equaling his early game dmg by bringing back the 15 damage from before but keeps intact his poor scaling as you put points in W without any AP.

20 Comments

Papa Andrei5 votes

Fizz Seastone Trident (W): Passive's AP ratio increased from 33.3% to 40% Active's AP ratio increased from 33.3% to 40% Charged Active's AP ratio increased from 100% to 120% Damage changed from 25/40/55/70/85 to 20/30/40/50/60

You know, All I see here are buffs and a loss of 25 base damage, its a light tap with a candy bar attached.

yay nibbers5 votes

It's only meant to nerf bruiser/tank Fizz, which it does. If you'd actually looked at OP's image, you'd notice Fizz's early-mid game damage is down considerably even for AP Fizz. early-mid game is where Fizz does best and that's getting nerfed. ** Also, since you clearly have no idea what you're on about**: It's not just 25 base damage nerf, that's only on the base W active. The real damage is when Fizz W's a marked target which does triple damage. Triple 60 a lot less than triple 85.

Bisaknosp3 votes

wow minus ~20 dmg omg gutted

yay nibbers4 votes

Someone needs to brush up their game knowledge and/or learn how to read.

Bisaknosp1 votes

ah i didnt realize marked targets get triple dmg idc tho this champ deserves some nerfs

Chønklord2 votes

What exactly is wrong with allowing tank fizz -- or at least a version of tank fizz? I'm still not quite grasping everyone's dilemma over it.

Shouldn't off-meta builds that are viable be encouraged instead of gutted into oblivion?

So riot and the community only want assassin ap squishy fizz mid, built only a certain way with cookie cutter predefined builds, and anywhere else is somehow destructive to the meta?

dominusx6 votes

tank fizz is a tank ekko with more dmg and no utility. Its an abomination and should never be a viable build path.

The build is toxic get your head out of your ass. If you so much want tank people to do damage bring back old mallet and make Yasuo mallet meta again. Or buff shaco and let him go tank and oneshot your ass. Sounds fun right?

Chønklord3 votes

I was looking for cohesive ], well rounded arguments. Not flaming shit posts. Try again please.

dominusx1 votes

1000+ games in silver. eh nvm waste of time here have fun

Shahamut5 votes

The problem with Tank Fizz is that he doesn't sacrifice much for doing it. Even as Tank Fizz, his burst is still very much assassin like in terms of damage. If building tank fizz meant that he could no longer Insta kill you with a single spell rotation, it wouldn't be a problem. Because that would be the trade off. Currently he just gets to have way better survivability while still blowing up any squishy on the map faster than they can react.

Chønklord3 votes

So is it the general consensus from a lot of players or board members here that the nerfs on pbe can effectively do what you say for tank fizz?

Shahamut2 votes

The general idea is that lowering base damage and raising scaling is that it reduces damage on builds that don't build damage.

I don't have a ton of experience on fizz, but my gut seems to think this won't be enough initially to kill tank fizz

Penns1 votes

There is nothing wrong with allowing it imo, but when it makes him have over 60% ban rate despite not being good mid lane, theres probably something wrong. Tho his stats did drop a lot this patch... except for his ban rate lol

Only Play Darius3 votes

Fizz is extremely mobile and has invulnerability on a low cooldown, so his counterplay is to kill him in between cooldowns. Tank Fizz removes that counterplay and makes him essentially unkillable even when focused, while he still has no problems getting to or killing your backline.

Chønklord1 votes

So how does that differ from most mobile bruiser/fighter champs that build tanky after 2 or 3 damage items, i.e. Fiora or graves?

Or is the hope of the nerfs to be able to allow a version of tanky bruiser fizz, but one that doesn't do as much as or almost the same as ap burst fizz?

MunchCrunchLunch2 votes

300 ap breakpoint.

Fızz1 votes

Ap Fizz is going to be really weak, his midgame, where he is supposed to shine is nerfed, late game isn't really good for fizz, where everyone has item 3102 item 3157 item 3026

Fîzž1 votes

Stop nerfing me riot.item 3070

Danjeng1 votes

Isn't this change supposed to be a nerf? Some champions don't get the luxury of compensation buffs, and lose out on a lot more than some damage.

Anyway, Fizz is one of the best midlaners and toplaners at the moment. He has a high ban rate, and with these changes, the ban rate will likely drop. I doubt that Fizz will be "gutted" (get it?), if these go through. He will lose out on about an auto's worth of damage, which I think is appropriate for a champion that performs as well as he is in this current patch.

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