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Vanguard Update: Likely Candidates, From What We Know.

Solideus·2/4/2017, 4:22:08 PM·33 votes·11,654 views

Who are the candidates? The Vanguards on the Subclass List are: Malphite Amumu Leona Zac Gragas Rammus Gnar Sejuani RekSai Sion Nautilus Skarner

What are the goals of the Vanguard Kit Updates? "We want to give tanks more mastery and skill expression, as well as unique identities."

Who is most likely to be cut from the get-go? X Gragas - With a number of reworks in his history, Gragas' kit already accomplishes the update's goals pretty well. X Rammus - Being on the Tier 1 VGU list, he is unlikely to get a lot of attention before his VGU happens. X Gnar - Gnar has a modern kit that already accomplishes the goals for the update. also, he is only a Vanguard sometimes. ;) X RekSai - As Meddler recently mentioned, Rek'Sai is close to a mini-rework that will push her from Vanguard towards Diver. X Sion - Having had a very successful VGU, Sion will likely get very little attention.

So, what are the chances for the remaining seven? Malphite - One Trick Pony, likely not something that could be solved with small changes. GOOD Chance for large-scope changes. Amumu - One Trick Pony, but has little but ambient damage after initiation. PRETTY GOOD Chance for large-scope changes, but perhaps smaller scope mechanical changes could do just enough for him. Sejuani - Not the worst in the world, but niche/skill expression/in-fight high moments could all use a little something. PRETTY GOOD Chance for large-scope changes. Zac - Decent uniqueness, but not a lot of skill expression/high moments to go with that. MODERATE Chance for large-scope changes. Nautilus - It's really hard to say with Nautilus, but I'd wager it's a coin-flip between larger- and smaller scope changes. LOW-TO-MODERATE Chance for large-scope changes. Leona - Leona has an ok niche and somewhat more skill expression than other older Vanguards. LOW-ish Chance for large-scope changes. Skarner - After the Juggernaut Update way way back, Skarner returns! This would be an opportunity to revisit areas where his last update fell short. Although his update wasn't as successful as others have been, his kit is in a somewhat decent spot, all considered. Smaller changes might be enough until a VGU a few years from now. LOW-ish Chance for large-scope changes.

Other Factors: In exploring the update designers could find a REALLY exciting direction/mechanic for a specific champion that could push it to be among the large-scope updates despite being Moderate or Low-ish priority. A Curse-mechanic tests really well on Amumu? Goo-y terrain-interaction for Zac? A way to make Nautilus 100% more Titan-sized? The PERFECT direction for Skarner? Discovering things like that would make a champion a lot more likely to jump right up to qualifying for a large-scope update. On the other hand, a champion that would have been prioritized for work could be demoted if they really can't find a good direction for them, or if it turns out that the scope would have to be too big to fit into a class-update.

In Summary Most Likely Large-Scope Updates: Malphite Amumu Sejuani Zac

Likely For Smaller-Scope Changes: Nautilus Leona Skarner

Edit: It is possible that Maokai also could be a candidate, despite primarily being a Warden. He has more Vanguard qualities than most Wardens, (e.g. twisted advance) and his picture did show up on the Devblog.

100 Comments

Chaos Milk Tea2/4/2017, 5:57:05 PM40 votes

"All right guys, what is the gameplay fantasy of Malphite? What is his overall theme and role?"

"..."

"......"

"............"

"Oh my god this champion is a rock."

Sahn Uzal2/4/2017, 4:36:24 PM8 votes

The interesting part is that Riot stated this is going to be a ''Tank Rework, with the focus on Vanguards''

Wardens are also tanks, I'm guessing some Wardens will also receive smaller changes...

Here is a list of all the Wardens.

Braum Nunu Tahm Kench Maokai Shen Thresh Alistar Poppy Galio (hybrid Battle Mage)

Taric (Hybrid Enchanter.)

From these, I'm guessing Braum, Alistar, Taric, Thresh, Poppy, Nunu and Galio will remained untouched for sure. All of these are pretty recent champions, or champions that are waiting for a VGU.

Tahm Kench, Maokai and Shen are the Wardens that might get some minor changes.

Tahm Kench: He had his time to shine when he was overpowered, but he would usually just end up stat-checking people. He's a pretty recent champion, but I wouldn't be too surprised if he got some minor changes.

Maokai: Dear god this Motherfucker is just too damn reliable. He's a Toplaner who does a great job at out-surviving his lane opponent, and has amazing Pick and Peel potential during the mid and late game. He's also one of the better scaling tanks because of Vengeful Maelstrom. I'm not sure if Riot loves or Hates his state. He tends to be a strong pick in Competetive LoL, overwhelming even when he's strong in general.

Shen: This guy doesn't get to be good in solo Q because of how amazing he is in LC$. A lot of his mains really dislike the Spirit Sword mechanic they gave him with his rework. I could see Riot revisiting him.

Ahristocats2/4/2017, 4:29:13 PM7 votes

If rammus isn't reworked i kill myself

it's been 7 years that he was never balanced

Blakiepug2/4/2017, 6:15:30 PM7 votes

Please Rito do not mess up Nautilus with one of these "reworks."

Greymoore2/4/2017, 7:21:00 PM6 votes

Reav3 stated "They all are basically different versions of Amumu". So I would imagine thatAmumu wouldn't get a LARGE scale update. Rather the champs that are most like Amumu will get the large updates to make them diffrent form Amumu

Chaos Milk Tea2/4/2017, 9:42:08 PM5 votes

Oh god no, Nautilus is fun as fuck. I really wouldn't want to see any mechanical changes to his abilities. Every single one is super satisfying to use and makes you feel useful at all stages of the game whether you are winning or losing.

Variks the Loyal2/4/2017, 9:41:14 PM4 votes

NO SKARNER. NO. SKARNER.

Juggernaut is the perfect class for Skarner, please do not make him a Vanguard. He's a durable duelist, and always has been. Remember Triforce+Spirit of the Elder Lizard? That was what Skarner players loved, not the idea of him being a pure tank.

ThatHaleState2/4/2017, 11:01:57 PM3 votes

If they touch Zac Im 200% done with this game. His Lore change was already stupid enough, if they fuck with his gameplay im out.

LankPants2/5/2017, 2:03:02 PM3 votes

I'd certainly prefer to see Sejuani just get small scale reworks. I think she already has a fairly good and cohesive kit, all she really needs done is a little bit of work on her passive IMO. I certainly don't think that a large scale rework to Sejuani would be warranted and I'd personally be very disappointed to see her change too much.

Gnart Even Close2/5/2017, 6:12:14 PM2 votes

I think Gnar will be a candidate for smaller changes. Especially since he interacts with itemization differently than other Vanguards in that his Mini form doesn't scale well with tank items but he needs them for Mega Gnar. He's also a bit too strong as a generalist and tends to outclass other champions when he's strong, and in 6.18 they said he was too good at shutting down aggression. He's definitely unique and modern, but he could use some changes to help him with new itemization and to fix some of the issues they've had with him in the past. I just made a post actually (I know it's frowned upon to share posts, but I put some quotes and stuff to talk about why he should get changes more in-depth than I just did here)

LiI Brother2/5/2017, 11:24:07 AM1 votes

I wonder if they'll finally take a good look at Nunu with this update, I know he isn't classified as a Vanguard. But him being basically useless in all but one role, and even then as a Jungler he's completely outlcassed by Ivern

Zane Zephyr2/4/2017, 5:04:30 PM1 votes

Sej and Maokai are already comfirmed via them saying they're updating their splash arts for the upcoming tank update

Robert Smith2/4/2017, 5:11:25 PM1 votes

Rammus still looks good compared to other champions and they recently updated his splash art so I'm not sure if they are going to change his appearance much. His kit is very binary, Q to get into range,E to taunt and W+R for damage. The occasional W for when they focus you (rarely happens) or Q to run away. No other combos or actions take place. W needs another skill to fully work which besides Azir and Kalista no other champion needs another ability for one of their other abilities to do anything. And speaking of his E, Rammus has one of the weaker of the 3 taunts in the game, single target when Shen can get multiple targets but it cost a lot of energy and Galio has it in the form of an ult with a high cdr.

Rammus is also one of the few armor scaling champs where his armor increases his ad, but has no ad scaling on his kit. Only his passive and W scale with armor while his Q and ult scale off of AP, a stat that Rammus almost never builds. The kit he has is very niche so if he is against a full AD team he can do very well until they build item 3812 item 3139 item 3139 item 3036 then Rammus loses and threat in the game besides a short taunt. If he is ahead against a full AD comp it then becomes hard for them to fight him if they don't 1 v 5 him. Rammus has little interaction with how he fights people, and almost no variation in the fighting style. He is super niche and if the enemy builds armor shred then he becomes useless since he gets damaged too quickly without being able to be helpful