Why Lee players are so bad ?

Zezilian·Jan 4, 2019·11 votes·8,837 views

Seems like meta have shifted. For a long time Yasuo players plagued league as dominant brain damaged players, but for the last few weeks for w/e reason terrible Lee players plagues it. There are two type of Lee players: those who feed and those who are useless - they chasing kills but never focus objectives and even if they are fed they still find a way how to suicide and throw games. ~~There are some exceptional Lee players but they are minority and don't reflect recent meta. ~~ I Play in Platinum and pretty much every single one of them belong to those 2 groups. I haven't seen a good Lee so far since I got to Plat. I can only imagine what is happening in lower leagues.

Tell me, what's going on ? Are all Yasuo players suddenly switched to Lee ?

36 Comments

ØrnnToGetTrolleÐJan 4, 201912 votes

Enemy Lee > My Lee

Always.

Reaper ClawsJan 5, 20192 votes

Enemy Players > My Team Players Period.

Hyper5paceJan 5, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Reaper Claws,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-01-05T01:56:19.808+0000)

Enemy Players > My Team Players Period.

Every promo in a nutshell.

SaltyCauseBadJan 5, 20191 votes

An insects IQ > My ADC's ability to play safe

Cats Are FoodJan 4, 20198 votes

It has to do with a couple of things that I've noticed. I was never a "Lee Player," but I "Could Play Lee." If that makes sense. Here recently I tried him in a couple normal, and a couple blitz matches, and here's what I saw:

Mobility is wayyyy higher than when Lee was new. One of his -greatest- assets was his In-And-Out constant harassment, followed by a brutal close. Now as Lee you tend to be one of the least mobile things on the map, contrary to what you'd think, he only really has one true gap close and it is highly variable upon landing a Q on higher all around MS and blinks/dodges/jumps/etc.
He was always sort of gimmicky to begin with. Once you swipe his "Mobility Superiority," he just became another chump. I know a number of Yasuo mains who started off as Lee Sin mains, and those who are good were the ones who capitalized heavily on the fact that you could Never get away from Lee, and he was constantly in and out with punishment. Yasuo is better at it, so they ditched him.
His W now feels soft. I don't often pay much attention to buffs and nerfs that don't really apply to me, but with the current damage creep his W will rarely actually save you mid brawl. Formerly a clutch shield was a beautiful thing that only meant you were about to heal like a madman for a brief time... now nobody cares and blow straight through it. A core mage item is now one that just stops your healing in it's tracks.

He can't sustain as well in a fight, and now he just feels more gimmicky than before. I can still perform with him, but I've 5-6 other options that do everything he does but better. Sadly they are also generally played, so just wreck him.

All of that said, there are a TON of newer players, and they all want to try and master this former beastie.

SaevumJan 4, 20194 votes

Back in the day, you could troll susaN by shielding your siege minion from his Q.

Exin0Jan 4, 20194 votes

[{quoted}](name=Cats Are Food,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-01-04T22:00:50.782+0000)

It has to do with a couple of things that I've noticed. I was never a "Lee Player," but I "Could Play Lee." If that makes sense. Here recently I tried him in a couple normal, and a couple blitz matches, and here's what I saw:

Mobility is wayyyy higher than when Lee was new. One of his -greatest- assets was his In-And-Out constant harassment, followed by a brutal close. Now as Lee you tend to be one of the least mobile things on the map, contrary to what you'd think, he only really has one true gap close and it is highly variable upon landing a Q on higher all around MS and blinks/dodges/jumps/etc.

He was always sort of gimmicky to begin with. Once you swipe his "Mobility Superiority," he just became another chump. I know a number of Yasuo mains who started off as Lee Sin mains, and those who are good were the ones who capitalized heavily on the fact that you could Never get away from Lee, and he was constantly in and out with punishment. Yasuo is better at it, so they ditched him.

His W now feels soft. I don't often pay much attention to buffs and nerfs that don't really apply to me, but with the current damage creep his W will rarely actually save you mid brawl. Formerly a clutch shield was a beautiful thing that only meant you were about to heal like a madman for a brief time... now nobody cares and blow straight through it. A core mage item is now one that just stops your healing in it's tracks.

He can't sustain as well in a fight, and now he just feels more gimmicky than before. I can still perform with him, but I've 5-6 other options that do everything he does but better. Sadly they are also generally played, so just wreck him.

All of that said, there are a TON of newer players, and they all want to try and master this former beastie.

dont forget hes got dumbed down to constantly fish for q and still easily oneshot someone he is just another assassin right now and DH can bypass his lategame fall off.

The thigh guyJan 4, 20196 votes

Shaco syndrome. It’s just the laws of this game. I get it constantly with yasuo players.

PhearBunnyJan 4, 20194 votes

Lee is prob the best jungler atm. So lots of people playing him, including the baddies.

Daddy AntsJan 4, 20193 votes

Because muh Insec plays!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OP Garen SupportJan 5, 20193 votes

What? Lee players were always trash. Had a Lee Sin tower dive the enemy midlaner at lv 1 with no minions around. This happened in gold rank. Of course there are some 1 tricks who can play well, but they are the minority. Lee is no longer a free win champ thanks to Riot having having a hard on for removing wards from the game. No jungle ward item? Lee cant gap close because they suck at skillshots.

SalronJan 5, 20193 votes

Because despite what the boards might tell you, Lee not actually braindead and does require skill to play

ZedthulJan 5, 20192 votes

Because Lee has some of the craziest hard combos that require real skill to play, so it takes a few hundred games to master.

rayzoJan 4, 20191 votes

Azir players are worse. I swear to god every single fucking azir I see goes at LEAST 0/10 by 10 minutes.

ThefrostyvikingJan 4, 20194 votes

[{quoted}](name=Raymønd Åmantius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-01-04T22:53:47.644+0000)

Azir players are worse. I swear to god every single fucking azir I see goes at LEAST 0/10 by 10 minutes.

Probably wont see a good Azir below high plati, champ is hard to succeed with now and those who do are climbing up.

RagnaveilJan 4, 20191 votes

Not to mention very unfavorable in his current state and the meta.

ThefrostyvikingJan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Not to mention very unfavorable in his current state and the meta.

Well that is part of why he is hard to succeed with.

RagnaveilJan 5, 20191 votes

He's hard because he's too mechanically reliant on the player and not the kit. Similar issue that Kalista has that kinda kills the champ.

ThefrostyvikingJan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

He's hard because he's too mechanically reliant on the player and not the kit. Similar issue that Kalista has that kinda kills the champ.

He isnt actually terribly difficult when not nerfed like hell, i played him casually a few times way back at a few points where he was considered good but not OP or ban worthy even in soloq and lower plati.

His issue is just a terrible early compared to everyone else now, even the dogs could abuse him, but his mid/late has almost always been truly powerful.

I mean he isnt much more mechanically demanding than knowing how to position as a marksman while knowing when to dive in the way an assassin does.

Is above the average mage but if you play cassio or a marksman in addition to mages he wasnt that hard to get the basics down pretty quickly.

I just personally dislike him when playing mid as i absolutely dont like being so weak early, much more prefer being aggressive on Syndra or poke through a lane for a sudden kill at 6 with lux/ahri.

Sewer SideJan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Probably wont see a good Azir below high plati, champ is hard to succeed with now and those who do are climbing up.

Azir botlane works well if you ban Lucian.

He still scales obscenely, but competition midlane is too fierce for him to survive.

IPromiseTomorrowJan 5, 20191 votes

I've been playing Azir Support and I noticed his midgame is extremely well. I thought that I was spontaneous in Azir because I was doing extremely well in Midgame but the reality was.

My gold income compensated for any missed cs or unreachable cs.

So Azir botlane Has an easier time scaling with little or no drop off. I've done it in Gold and the results were shocking though. I only did it once. I shall test when I'm feeling Shuriman enough.

ThefrostyvikingJan 5, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sewer Side,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=000500000001,timestamp=2019-01-05T01:51:15.055+0000)

Azir botlane works well if you ban Lucian.

He still scales obscenely, but competition midlane is too fierce for him to survive.

Dunno, his killer moves relies on him dashing in but plenty of supports can abuse the daylights out of him when he does that, and sustain is a big question as well, midlaners wont just heal up his poke.

Success takes the Azir having to be much better than his opponents which kinda makes it a high effort low reward kinda thing.

rayzoJan 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Probably wont see a good Azir below high plati, champ is hard to succeed with now and those who do are climbing up.

Why am I getting downvoted? It's true, people do badly with him unless they're much better at the game.

ThefrostyvikingJan 5, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Raymønd Åmantius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=000500000002,timestamp=2019-01-05T03:40:43.682+0000)

Why am I getting downvoted? It's true, people do badly with him unless they're much better at the game.

Probably some Azir players that werent happy with the statement of them being bad, after all the few players that champ has all try quite a lot and are mostly competitive about it.

ZedthulJan 5, 20191 votes

Azir requires IMO other teammates that know how to CC for Azir to be successful. I bet he does a lot better in team ranked games and does badly in Solo. Also, Azir's sand soldiers all look like him, so it's damn hard to tell which one is your guy when all of them are moving together. This means you may not have a clue where you are standing and which one is you when they all stop their charge.

Frontline FuryJan 5, 20191 votes

"Lee players" aren't bad. There are plenty of bad players playing lee sin, because he is and has always been an extremely popular champion and he can also be quite strong early game. He is very easy to play in the jungle.

Also keep in mind the other jungler might just be a better player than your lee.

Hyper5paceJan 5, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-01-05T00:41:50.081+0000)

"Lee players" aren't bad. There are plenty of bad players playing lee sin, because he is and has always been an extremely popular champion and he can also be quite strong early game. He is very easy to play in the jungle.

Also keep in mind the other jungler might just be a better player than your lee.

Lee is definitely not easy to play in the jungle. Yes early he is dominant but he is still one of the most mechanically demanding champions in the game. If you look at lee sin highlight videos the shit looks like pinball half the time with all the wardhops, flash kicks and qrq combos.

ZedthulJan 5, 20193 votes

Yep, Lee Sin is one of the hardest to play at a high skill cap. If anyone thinks he's easy I want to see you Flash Step his ult every time without fail placing the enemy perfectly where you want him to go. Anyone can flash step ward hop and ult, but kicking the champion exactly where you need them to go especially if you are going to be kicking him into other champions to make his ult land on an entire group and still getting out alive is hard. Unlike other champions, his 4 buttons have 7 functions. IMO playing Lee Sin at his full potential is only seen in high Elo or maybe even at pro level.

Frontline FuryJan 6, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Lee is definitely not easy to play in the jungle. Yes early he is dominant but he is still one of the most mechanically demanding champions in the game. If you look at lee sin highlight videos the shit looks like pinball half the time with all the wardhops, flash kicks and qrq combos.

Oh, he is very easy to play in the jungle. It's outside of it he's hard.

Hyper5paceJan 9, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wfP66u1f,comment-id=000600000001,timestamp=2019-01-06T01:57:55.396+0000)

Oh, he is very easy to play in the jungle. It's outside of it he's hard.

Yeah but you could apply that logic to every jungler because unless you are a weapons grade r%%%%% everyone is easy in the jungle because you are mostly fighting ai monsters in the early game.

Elemental LuxJan 5, 20191 votes

Why is this community so prejudice based on what champs you enjoy?

Meany StingJan 5, 20191 votes

I just feel Lee out plays don't matter that much right now. Sure Lee could kick an enemy into your team after landing Q. Or nidalee could hit her spear and 1 shot same enemy with her combo.

In general Lee is not too great at contesting scuttle either now with kha/nidalee/udyr and rengar beeing good he just can't duel many of them withouth outplaying them, and with less vision after recent nerfs it is harder to actually ambush someone.

the shy topJan 5, 20191 votes

There are two type of Lee players: those who feed and those who are useless

Tunnel visioned af.

Zeppelins circusJan 5, 20191 votes

The strange thing is, every player demanded a practice mode. Lee sin was considered one of the candidates to benefit the most from practice mode.

...Then nobody practices Lee in practice.

PoskeJan 5, 20191 votes

I used to be a God at lee sin (Master tier level atleast ) but then he lost Green trinket

nOW YOU have a choise either you are a player who puts 0 wards per game or you dont ward hop. They tried to compensate this with small dmg buffs and other irelevant buffs it didnt matter