Transformation champion: Elise rework

Hupsis··1 votes·1,764 views

I'm excited for the upcoming champion Kayn. He seems like a cool champions with a unique transformation mechanic. Really made me think why Riot hasn't applied this type of transformation sooner into the game... or something closer to this than the "combat transformers" we currently have.

Immediately after hearing from Kayn I thought to myself how Elise's transformation could be more meaningful for her gameplay. Currently it is very crucial for Elise to transform whenever fighting since she doesn't function without utilizing both parts of her kit. However what would be the case if Riot made both her transformations function as separate kits? I'm not suggesting that Elise should choose one transformation each game like Kayn does, but just making her transformations more of a choice how to take on upcoming situations.


#Review of Elise

I love Elise's theme. I simply love all creepy Tim Burton style things and Elise fits that bill quite perfectly.

Pros of Elise:

  • awesome graphical/lore design
  • transformation based champion

Cons of Elise:

  • straight forward kit even with two transformations
  • lack of an ultimate ability
  • lack of interesting spider mechanics
  • transformation way too easily achieved (one button click, instant transformation, low cooldown)

Clearly the cons (for me) are outweighing the pros.


#Future of Elise?

I do not know whether Riot thinks Elise needs a mini rework or full blown rework. All I know is that there has been some rumors that Elise might need some changes (although these rumors are rather old). And I'm pretty sure in order to make her a more interesting champion, Riot has to change her transformation mechanic.

Elise is a mage/assassin/bruiser... She catches you with a cocoon and assassinates you with a mix of spells and melee abilities. This all happens very quickly and is deadly. How does that feel for the Elise player and the player who is against her? When a game becomes about "who does the most burst in shortest amount of time", the game gets extremely stale and it feels overwhelming for the opponent. That is exactly the case with Elise when she reaches her intended playstyle currently (it's extremely apparent when her burst abilities are targeted spells).

Now imagine if Elise had to choose to approach a situation as either in human form or spider form without being able to transform mid fight. In order for this to happen, she would need her kit to function independently in both forms (and a new ultimate for both forms):

  1. Human Elise approaches a fight as a mage, poking from distance, maybe applying poison and withering down her targets. Nothing too crazy or overpowering in short engagements. I heard of a mechanic that was cancelled in her design which allowed her to cocoon multiple targets which made all targets share damage taken... pretty damn interesting mechanic.
  2. Spider Elise approaches a fight as an assassin, closing distance fast, capturing an enemy, assassinating her target and escaping. Risky gameplay but highly rewarding. With Zac's new Ultimate, I wouldn't be surprised if there were ever going to be a single target capture mechanic.

So how would the transformation happen if not by pressing a button? Simply visit your local nexus base and click your precious champion icon. Very similar to Kayn's transformation except this time the transformation can be done as many times as you like as long as you are in base. Maybe even occasionally the spider god shines her "light" on a certain area on the map which allows Elise to transform without visiting base.


#Transformation: Kayn vs Elise

So why did I make this thread now and not before?

I wasn't so sure what Riot's opinion on champions that potentially fill multiple roles was (specifically with transformation kits). With Kayn being released and filling either the role of an assassin or a bruiser, it became clear that Riot is not opposed to having champions who can totally change their playstyle depending on situation.

There are still restrictions in Kayn's case. He can't change his form once he has chosen a form, he's gonna stick with that form till the end. In Elise's case this can never be true because Elise has always been intended to be played with altering forms during the game. Whether it's balanced to allow Elise to have two separate kits (mage/assassin), being able to play with either form efficiently and then allowing her to change forms as many times as needed depending on situation is not completely clear to me.

When Kayn was introduced, one of my first thought were if it was balanced to have a champion that could fill either an assassin's role or a bruiser fighter's role. He could potentially rule out many champions due to this duality mechanic. Would Elise do this with such efficiency, if she was changed to have two separate kits, that she would outclass all mages and assassins? Not necessarily. I believe there is a way to balance a champion with two kits however it might mean their kit's overall power level might take a hit. For example, she might not be as effective of an assassin as Zed cause she has the option to counter certain champions as a mage.


Sidenote: Nidalee

I really don't mind Nidalee being a combat focused transformer. We ought to have at least one of those as well and I deemed Nidalee more fitting as combat transformer than Elise since Nidalee's kit plays with the long range hunter / pouncing cat theme better than Elise does with her cocoon/rappel gameplay.

8 Comments

FurriesAreHot2 votes

Elise is fine as is, there is really no reason to rework her. She has a unique identity and is fairly balanced.

Hupsis1 votes

So are many other champions and they still receive reworks.

You don't seem to understand that reworks are done in order to create interesting gameplay patterns on champions that lack them, however non-balanceable champions are prioritized first. Champion reworks are based mainly on the fun factor, balance comes later.

I'm not asking for a rework right now. I mean she needs one eventually. There are many champions that have kits that do not allow them to be balanced hence them receiving reworks sooner.

Elise is extremely straight forward in her patterns and doesn't allow players to really make game altering decisions. You go in every fight with the exact same mindset.

Her identity is unique, her playstyle leaves much to be desired.

Naching2 votes

Elise need buffs or a mini rework. I have her in my champ list but...she feels weak even when doing well full combo is lacking something.

Its not fair than elise using 7 skills do less that other using 2 skills, a bad joke.

Hupsis1 votes

One would guess having a transformation kit brings its own benefits such as having the option to play as either form efficiently without depending on the other form... nope!

Picking Kayn is basically saying "I am ready to alter my playstyle to fit either the assassin role or bruiser role" Picking Elise should imo mean "I am ready to alter my playstyle to fit either the mage role or assassin role", not both at the same time.

ZapMyHeart1 votes

I think her kit is pretty fine as is, but probably could use a few touch-ups for modernization.

My gripe is that her human form is relatively weak. Squishy. Moves slow. Attacks slow. Damage is pretty non-existent unless you get some AP in. Mana hungry for pitiful damage early game.

I like her theme as a spider, but felt it could be pushed further. Black Widows are known to be poisonous, but none of her skills remotely deal with "poison".

Her E's cooldown is ridiculously long during early game. I get that she has "invincibility", but it's still rather situational. Give me a dash over wall skill on a lower cooldown any day. Any jungler with mobility has pretty much half the cooldown she has on that E. Kinda frustrating.

If Riot is going to change her, I think addressing her combo would be a good idea. At the moment, all she does is Human E>Q>W>R>Spider Q>W>AA>AA>E if necessary. It's a burst mage combo, but I feel like it is rather stagnant. Her Human form seems more poke than burst.

The Q scaling prevents her from choosing which form to use in order to maximize her damage output, which is rather unfortunate. Switching her Human Q to deal damage + DPS true damage ("poison"), while Spider Q does damage with scaling %max health damage might be an option. This alleviates the need for her to start off with Human Q before Spider Q.

Her Human W seems fine, except the mana cost. Perhaps they could allow her to detonate it earlier? Spider W can lower Spider Q's cooldown upon every successful AA for the duration, giving her a bit more options than to unload everything and then wait around. Plus, it gives her a reason to continue sticking onto her enemies.

Hupsis1 votes

"all she does is Human E>Q>W>R>Spider Q>W>AA>AA>E if necessary. It's a burst mage combo, but I feel like it is rather stagnant"

This is exactly what I mean. Her burst ALWAYS includes both forms, and this is the reason why I think she should get a rework. No matter what number changes you do on her current kit, she will always utilize both parts of her kit when bursting down a target simply cause it's so easy to change forms. This means her forms can't be strong individually cause they are intertwined to her one and only combo.

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