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Anybody else notice how quickly the ADC hate threads died down since Trist and Twitch got nerfed?

AmWhaleIRL··37 votes·13,065 views

What a surprise that people hate playing against super safe hyper carries am I right?

Like Varus was op with rageblade for quite a while and I never saw one post on him get past 10 upvotes.

But Trist and Twitch posts were relentless it seemed, always getting high numbers.

Edit: For those who don't seem to understand how Twitch is safe compared to Tristana-Safe, it's fairly obvious, but I'll explain anyways.

Twitch and Trist have 2 different forms of safety.

Trist is frustrating to engage on, because she has her own very reliable self peel in her kit.

Twitch has a different form of safety that requires him to not be an idiot, simply that. If you get on top of him, he's donezo, save for maybe any peel provided by his team. But you'll only get on top of him in mid or late game teamfights if he's an idiot or greedy, or you get a nice unwarded flank, or you have a 10 - 0 Zed 😅. With his Camouflage he can wait for a perfect time in a teamfight completely unseen, (given he's not dumb enough to walk in range of vision indicator) wait for key enemy spells to be on cooldown or for his tank to get a good engage, then ult from super far away hitting potentially every member of their team.

Again, he's not Tristana-Safe, meaning that at least in Laning phase you can try to stomp him and have your jungle come and dive.

69 Comments

Sona Ping26 votes

I did not because I was noticing ADC hate threads after that happened instead.

Teridax688 votes

This is true, there are still anti-marksman threads around, but if nothing else they're a lot less prominent than around the time Twitch and Tristana were still the strongest marksmen around. I don't doubt that many players still have issues with marksmen as a class (I certainly do), but at least now it doesn't feel as bad when the worst offenders have fallen to the wayside, at least for now.

Sahn Uzal5 votes

Agreed.

saltran2 votes

{quoted}

This is true, there are still anti-marksman threads around, but if nothing else they're a lot less prominent than around the time Twitch and Tristana were still the strongest marksmen around. I don't doubt that many players still have issues with marksmen as a class (I certainly do), but at least now it doesn't feel as bad when the worst offenders have fallen to the wayside, at least for now.

I would add Vayne aswell to Tristana and Twicht.

Elohaven2 votes

Vayne isn't as safe as them. At least she requires a level of mechanics...

saltran2 votes

{quoted}

Vayne isn't as safe as them. At least she requires a level of mechanics...

Oh, my coment is misleading then:

I wasn't saying that Vayne is safe or braindead as the dump Boards circlejerk claimed. I wanted to say that when they were the strongest soloQ adcs (Twicht and Tristana) ppl complained a lot just as like ppl complain when Vayne was meta.

Which means that this ones are the most hated adcs.

Drugoth17 votes

Don't worry, it will come back when the Kai'sa v neck topic dies down.

hi ìm groot12 votes

How is twitch a super safe adc?

Teridax6819 votes

He has camouflage and access to an extremely powerful steroid that extends his range by several hundred units for a few seconds, in addition to a very bursty mode of damage application. Put another way, Twitch can burst his opponents down from stealth and from far away, which means that unless he misplays severely, he will always be able to create a lot of safety for himself.

hi ìm groot5 votes

{quoted}

He has camouflage and access to an extremely powerful steroid that extends his range by several hundred units for a few seconds, in addition to a very bursty mode of damage application. Put another way, Twitch can burst his opponents down from stealth and from far away, which means that unless he misplays severely, he will always be able to create a lot of safety for himself.

Hmm, sitting in a lane as twitch definitely dont feel that way. Definitely feel like if I'm gonna get dove im gonna get dove, and there's not a damned thing I can do about it.

Hibeki7 votes

in lane =/= everywhere else.

hi ìm groot4 votes

{quoted}

in lane =/= everywhere else.

Lane is where I would worry about whether or not my adc was "super safe" or not. Outside of lane my mobility just becomes a factor of where I can position. When im in lane I'm stuck, and if they're gonna come for me, if im twitch, they prob gonna get me.

TehNACHO5 votes

You just explained why he's such a powerful flanker, but that's far from Tristana's ability to leap away and knock back targets, for example.

His camouflage isn't instant, it's also camouflage so if somebody's already on top of Twitch it's as good as useless, his only CC is a minor slow in a small contained area, and in general he is the definition of a dead champion if an Assassin or Diver touches him.

ValiantKiller15 votes

{quoted}

You just explained why he's such a powerful flanker, but that's far from Tristana's ability to leap away and knock back targets, for example.

His camouflage isn't instant, it's also camouflage so if somebody's already on top of Twitch it's as good as useless, his only CC is a minor slow in a small contained area, and in general he is the definition of a dead champion if an Assassin or Diver touches him.

As an Assassin main, dealing with twitch is 100% better than dealing with trist hyper jump or xayah R or even kai/vayne sudden leap to hide.

saltran1 votes

{quoted}

As an Assassin main, dealing with twitch is 100% better than dealing with trist hyper jump or xayah R or even kai/vayne sudden leap to hide.

As a Cait-MF main, can I ask how hard is to deal with them as an assasin player?

Like a number from 0 to 10.

I'm curious.

Fairyfleur1 votes

Not an assassin main but MF is usually pretty easy to kill.

ValiantKiller3 votes

{quoted}

As a Cait-MF main, can I ask how hard is to deal with them as an assasin player?

Like a number from 0 to 10.

I'm curious.

Cait - mf ? or the list of champions i listed? if you asking about cait-mf, both of them are easy to jump on and brust without even able to do anything or their support help. So 0/10, While if you talking about the list of champion i did mention, dealing with xayah is 5/10 since it ult, dealing with trust ist 7/10,vayne is 5/10 since it just leap while kai is 7.5/10 cause it leap and can just dash into you with a big brust of damage yet get like half of her hp in a shield for no reason.

Teridax685 votes

It's not the same kind of safety as Trist's, but it is still a form of safety. Trist's own safety is reactive in that it lets her recover very easily from messing up, but Twitch's safety is proactive in that he can create very safe situations for himself ahead of time. If he gets dived, then sure, he doesn't really have the tools to get out of that kind of situation, but unlike Tristana, he can attack opponents without warning and give them very little opportunity to react to him. In both cases, the champions are given tools that hinge on mitigating their opponents' ability to retaliate when fighting them, which is what causes these champions to be so frustrating to deal with.

AmWhaleIRL3 votes

[{quoted}](name=hi ìm groot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=uPQQ1EOI,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-04-09T21:28:07.935+0000)

How is twitch a super safe adc?

The ability to be invisible (or is it stealth 🤔?) and just simply wait for a good time in a teamfight then pop out unseen and (potentially) hit all 5 enemies with your ult auto's from a really far distance. He's obviously not good anymore though thankfully. He's not Tristana-Safe where it's frustrating to engage on him. He's Twitch-Safe where once team fights start rolling around he's able to pick a fight on his terms and create his own safety via Camouflage (or stealth?? I really don't know the word but I know how it works) and come of nowhere with incredibly far auto range, giving the enemies little chance to respond.

Xonra11 votes

I would rather play against a Cait than a non-nerfed Trist.

Unless you are dumb or step on traps Cait will just be annoying and pushing you in.

If Trist just suddenly decides, she is jumping in and blasting you in the face. Then hyperscales. Quickly destroys your tower, and gives you a middle finger.

Blu 110 votes

I think people are just resigned to the fact that we'll have to deal with the bullshit that is current ADC's until midseason. Similar to the ardent meta, riot says changes are coming in the (fairly distant) future and we all have to deal with their mistakes until then.

Oleandervine8 votes

That's because people haven't realized how OP Varus will be with Guinsoos.

IceKingChernobog3 votes

or the how stupid the kaisa buff was.

Infernape4 votes

Honestly all she needed was her AA range being increased. She didn't need all that additional shit on top of it.

IceKingChernobog1 votes

kai'sa and varus are just freelo for adcs at the moment.

saltran1 votes

{quoted}

kai'sa and varus are just freelo for adcs at the moment.

You sure about Varus? He dropped in winrate last patch with the Tabis change and Guinsoo tweak

Hexs Fortune6 votes

Glad riot kept to reason and nerfed the offending marksmen instead of following boards rhetoric and carpet bombing the entire class

Poske5 votes

{quoted}

What a surprise that people hate playing against super safe hyper carries am I right?

Anti ADC threads died down because Riot does nothing

Similar thing happend to kassadin/kha zix complaints..

Xayah and Varus are like tier -4 tier (Apish varus tho) Kai sa is tier -3.5 Twitch is tier -4 when played as jungler with Egirl Pet toplaner/midlaner (twitch farms 2 resources) Tristana and Cait are still absolute bullshit -3 tier, Jinx and kog are tier -2.5 Mf is quite high to

Overpowerd AD carry is on average more busted then Overpowerd (insert another role)

If you nerf this AD carries wont be seen as the best role

However Half of ADC power budget is in itemization which is an issue on its own, They all lack agency compared to other roles (not compared to juggernauts) (Agency is how much you can force stuff rather then enemy forcing it on you) Due to this reason its not obvious ADC role is busted

Now sure Ezreal doesnt lack agency for example but he is quite ehhh weak and an ADC on average does

AirKingNeo1 votes

Xayah and Varus are like tier -4 tier (Apish varus tho) Kai sa is tier -3.5 Twitch is tier -4 when played as jungler with Egirl Pet toplaner/midlaner (twitch farms 2 resources) Tristana and Cait are still absolute bullshit -3 tier, Jinx and kog are tier -2.5 Mf is quite high to

Good joke. Now, realistically:

SS: Xayah S: Trist, Kai'sa, Varus (?) A: Varus (?), Caitlyn, Kog'maw, Ezreal (?) B: Sivir, Jinx, Twitch C: MF

M00ndanc32 votes

when everyone seems to forget about ashe and kalista

AirKingNeo1 votes

sorry I don't count D tier...

M00ndanc31 votes

thats cold

Niggles913 votes

Get it? Cold? Ashe?

Spank the Fox2 votes

{quoted}

Kai sa is tier -3.5 Twitch is tier -4 when played as jungler with Egirl Pet toplaner/midlaner (twitch farms 2 resources) Tristana and Cait are still absolute bullshit -3 tier, Jinx and kog are tier -2.5 Mf is quite high to

Good joke. Now, realistically:

SS: Xayah S: Trist, Kai'sa, Varus (?) A: Varus (?), Caitlyn, Kog'maw, Ezreal (?) B: Sivir, Jinx, Twitch C: MF

Everyone’s ignoring Jhin like ????

M00ndanc32 votes

ikr him ashe and kalista

Poske1 votes

You play at gold 5. I play at the highest elo my representation was more realistic

I wanted to point out with my post that every lane has tier 0 champions. Marskman role has tier -4 champions. Ezreal and Jhin are worst ad carries you can play. Whenever I see them my dodge senses turn on.

I see the best of best MFS and they did rise my thoughts on her. This people skip on boots and invest everything in lethality and 2/3 hit everything or AOE BPS entire path

AirKingNeo1 votes

You play at gold 5. I play at the highest elo my representation was more realistic

Ok? Neither of our ranks represent the facts that are found by looking at statistics.

I forget Jhin, but he's either A or S. Ezreal is safe, but not enough damage to be 'high tier' really.

MF didn't raise at all.

Mizaya1 votes

Ezreal has a 45% pickrate in KR, and still the highest in most other regions I would assume. He's not weak by any means, just most players are better off playing champions that only need to autoattack.

Poske3 votes

{quoted}

Ezreal has a 45% pickrate in KR, and still the highest in most other regions I would assume. He's not weak by any means, just most players are better off playing champions that only need to autoattack.

Korea is horrible server for measuring

Keep in mind this people ragequit if the game lasts more then 30 minutes due to internet caffee not to mention there is no ban system so early game performance expectations are really high due to flaming

You pay to play 1 hour and they expect 2 games

So korea is dogshit for statistics because you ll always see early gaem strategies being prelevant even if they are not the best strategies (THEY ARE NOT)

Now if you want to see whats good for stomping early game korea is good

Ezreal teamfight damage is really low

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/euw/platinum/plus/grid/

Ezreal is horrible

Alex h87212 votes

Yeaaaaaaah, i hate having an ezreal on my team b/c i know if the adc's on both sides get past 2 items he will be outscaled by ANY rightclicker crit/attack speed adc.

Mizaya1 votes

He's top 3 popularity in just about every region except eune, 60% pickrate on JP for some reason, and still #1 on NA.

I don't know how accurate what you said is, certainly sounds a bit exaggerated and there are counterexamples like Azir who are picked a lot more often on KR, Zed played less, etc.

Ez isn't even weak until past 3 items (average Diamond +, even probably plat game is done by then), it's just that most players can't play him to his full potential whereas on Trist for example it's just autoattacking.

IceKingChernobog5 votes

um....since when was twitch a safe carry?

AmWhaleIRL1 votes

{quoted}

um....since when was twitch a safe carry?

The ability to be invisible (or is it stealth 🤔?) and just simply wait for a good time in a teamfight then pop out unseen and (potentially) hit all 5 enemies with your ult auto's from a really far distance. He's obviously not good anymore though thankfully. He's not Tristana-Safe where it's frustrating to engage on him. He's Twitch-Safe where once team fights start rolling around he's able to pick a fight on his terms and create his own safety via Camouflage (or stealth?? I really don't know the word but I know how it works) and come of nowhere with incredibly far auto range, giving the enemies little chance to respond.

IceKingChernobog1 votes

i play twitch and he’s by no means safe compared to other carries mentioned. His camo has a detection range so he cannot slip under your nose like he used to do. For him to get his “safety” he has to hit level 6

AmWhaleIRL1 votes

{quoted}

i play twitch and he’s by no means safe compared to other carries mentioned. His camo has a detection range so he cannot slip under your nose like he used to do. For him to get his “safety” he has to hit level 6

You say the bit about his stealth as if you're walking in melee range in teamfights, like what? With your ult, you can camo a safe distance away and wait for spells to be down then come in with your massive ult range where nobody can get on top of you, save for someone with a good flank. But yeah you right about his Laning phase.

Orange Caramel3 votes

Now the new circlejerk is hating on supports

saltran9 votes

{quoted}

Now the new circlejerk is hating on supports

Look at the "Which role is the strongest" thread and tell me if there's more adc or supp hate.

AirKingNeo6 votes

Not really a circlejerk when nothing gets to the front page and supports are actually the issue.

Daddy Ants3 votes

Since when was Twitch "safe"?

Lol XD

Acheron163 votes

Nah, it's Cait's turn to be hated now, already saw a couple threads complaining about her despite her not receiving a single buff (it's in fact the opposite, with the nerf to Shiv).

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