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How many bronzies can 1 diamond carry?

meIontusk··1 votes·1,085 views

EDIT: This is assuming you are not necessarily the ADC & the enemy team is playing well. What do you do if you are... let's say a support? or a jungler? I would think that you are not going to dive into the 5 man lane push.

How do you carry a bad team against a team who has gathered enough momentum & confidence to stick together & have a stomp in mind?

Disclaimer: I'm not a diamond 1 player

Question:

**Can 1 diamond carry 4 bronzies (casual/bad players) to win a game? **

*I'm using the term "bronzie" loosely to identify people who may: *

  • not play LoL to win necessarily, and mainly care about just enjoying the gamble of it.
  • people who jump into games with a first-time champion & expect for the team to win
  • people who do not understand this is a team game
  • people who do not ward/supports who do not ward
  • fake supports who are more interested in being adc
  • junglers who don't gank/refuse to gank a specific lane for odd reasons
  • players who refuse to ping/look at the map
  • players who flame before the game starts/ at the beginning of the game
  • players who are naive enough to gamble for the pentakill (jumping into an obvious 5v1)

---------------------------------------------------------------------my thoughts---------------------------------------------------------------- One way I think this can be possible would be through strategic direction;

-pinging objectives -typing in chat

essentially, babysitting the entire team whilst still maintaining farm & roaming. (this is my standard practice when I'm jng)

**Is this the only way to do it? **

EDIT: This is assuming you are not necessarily the ADC & the enemy team is playing well. What do you do if you are... let's say a support? or a jungler? I would think that you are not going to dive into the 5 man lane push.

How do you carry a bad team against a team who has gathered enough momentum & confidence to stick together & have a stomp in mind?

11 Comments

Sailor Mint4 votes

In my experience as a Plat scrub, you can carry people who want to win. You can't carry people who are not willing to get carried.

As long as you have enough people playing, you can carry almost anything.

xDingwithsalad3 votes

i dont understand this. Of course a diamond can carry in bronze, i've done it hundreds of times lol

AnomalousChimera3 votes

A diamond player can absolutely carry 4 bronze players. I've seen Diamonds in normals singlehandedly stomp the other team with minimal help from the weaker members of the team. Those Diamond players know it too and can play recklessly during those matches because the skill gap is so large.

OhBoyItsaMegaman2 votes

essentially, babysitting the entire team whilst still maintaining farm & roaming. (this is my standard practice when I'm jng)

Um...

...

...you're sure this isn't your standard practice when you're jng?

http://i.imgur.com/r9aDz3J.jpg

Because I gotta say, this pic here would suggest that there are more pressing problems than how to carry a team of Bronzies. You rattle off a long list of terms that apply to your teammates, and I'll even give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that none of those apply to you. You're still going to desperately plummet to Bronze V at this rate due to severe lack of game knowledge if nothing else. People who flame or don't ward or don't look at the map or don't try their hardest; they still have a huge advantage over you because of the way you build and play.

In this game, you had: 64 cs in 28 minutes, only 13 of which were monsters. Zero completed items. No jungle item. No boots. A item 2049 on a jungler other than Lee Sin. A item 3070 with 0 other mana items. A item 3070 on a champion who has very little ability to charge it up. A item 3070 on a champion who doesn't scale with mana or require a ton of mana. No armor or MR on a tank who automatically gains max health.

You also got executed on your first clear.

If you had godly leadership and communication skills and were able to expertly direct your team to fight over important objectives at the right time, keep their morale high with praise, gently correct their mistakes, and rally them to position correctly in teamfights and focus the correct targets, it would not offset the massive mistakes that you're already making.

Now, I've been a bit harsh, but I don't want to seem like I'm just completely being mean to be mean. I realize that you didn't come in here specifically to ask for advice on what you should be doing in ranked when losing, but that is the vibe that I got from your post. So I just want to put this in perspective for you. "Getting a bad team to come together and make a comeback against a team that has a big lead" is an important skill for a Diamond player who is smurfing in Bronze. Sure. That is not the skill that you need to work on right now. If you are interested in learning the important skills, there are a ton of resources in the Tips & Tricks board, so swing on by and ask away.

meIontusk1 votes

Interesting advice.

If you don't mind, I would like some questions answered?

  1. Is it more important to have a full build rather than prevent ganks? -I don't believe a full build would be enough to counter a 2v1 gank

  2. How can I assist my team as a jungler, whilst still maintaining a good farm when all lanes are losing? (btw, i ended with the 3rd highest CS of my teammates with 63) -If all 3 lanes are losing, how can I help them (without losing farm).(Teleport helps me a lot)

Which leads to my next question:

  1. Is farming more important than losing a lane? -Should I keep in the jungle while their Jarvan is camping a lane?

Good point about the Tear of the Goddess, I probably would have been better off building glacial shroud. I ran out of mana very quickly, considering I had to constantly slow/knockup enemy allies off teammates. The tear was cheaper, so I opted for it.

I won't touch the "You also got executed on your first clear." comment, because it happens (rarely). It seems to be a loaded critique on my skill level, but I'll leave it alone.

But I'd really like your input on the questions listed above. (1,2,3)

The questions seem pretty straightforward. And seem to have pretty obvious answers. But, I will not assume I am correct.

I thank you in advance for your input.

The MechE2 votes

Interesting advice.

If you don't mind, I would like some questions answered?

  1. Is it more important to have a full build rather than prevent ganks? -I don't believe a full build would be enough to counter a 2v1 gank

  2. How can I assist my team as a jungler, whilst still maintaining a good farm when all lanes are losing? (btw, i ended with the 3rd highest CS of my teammates with 63) -If all 3 lanes are losing, how can I help them (without losing farm).(Teleport helps me a lot)

Which leads to my next question:

  1. Is farming more important than losing a lane? -Should I keep in the jungle while their Jarvan is camping a lane?

Good point about the Tear of the Goddess, I probably would have been better off building glacial shroud. I ran out of mana very quickly, considering I had to constantly slow/knockup enemy allies off teammates. The tear was cheaper, so I opted for it.

I won't touch the "You also got executed on your first clear." comment, because it happens (rarely). It seems to be a loaded critique on my skill level, but I'll leave it alone.

But I'd really like your input on the questions listed above. (1,2,3)

The questions seem pretty straightforward. And seem to have pretty obvious answers. But, I will not assume I am correct.

I thank you in advance for your input.

...interesting view of the game. Not the way I'd be looking at it though.

First, I suggest focusing on farming. You should start either red or blue and gank after you get your 2nd buff. After a gank attempt fails or is successful though, go back to the jungle and keep farming monsters. You'll want to get spirit stone as soon as you have enough for it. I'm not saying to start machete though since I question how useful that items is on cho, but GET THE SPIRIT STONE.

Next, it's good to gank, but don't gank too much. You have to farm. You need gold. You need xp, and no, I'm not saying to go into your ally's lane and steal their cs. Earn your cs in the jungle where you belong.

You must learn to balance csing with ganking. It's an art

meIontusk1 votes

I really like this part:

"Next, it's good to gank, but don't gank too much. You have to farm. You need gold. You need xp, and no, I'm not saying to go into your ally's lane and steal their cs. Earn your cs in the jungle where you belong.

You must learn to balance csing with ganking. It's an art"

I will practice the artform summoner 13

Thanks for the tips, it is very valuable advice & I will put them in practice :)

OhBoyItsaMegaman2 votes

1.) Is it more important to have a full build rather than prevent ganks? -I don't believe a full build would be enough to counter a 2v1 gank

I'm not sure I understand this question. When I mentioned that you had no completed items, it was a combination of two pieces of advice: A.) You should farm so that you have enough money to buy items, and B.) You should generally finish one item before starting the next one, because completed items are that much more powerful. Simply concentrating on a single item is not enough to fend off a gank, but farming up is. It definitely is. If I were to go top in a low Bronze game and concentrate entirely on getting 4x my opponent's farm without even bothering to kill him, I'd be able to 2v1 when the jungler came. That's the power of having a large item advantage.

2.) How can I assist my team as a jungler, whilst still maintaining a good farm when all lanes are losing? (btw, i ended with the 3rd highest CS of my teammates with 109)(higher than our mid & ADC) -If all 3 lanes are losing, how can I help them (without losing farm).(Teleport helps me a lot)

This is a judgment call. It's important to first ask, why are all lanes losing? Is it because of bad matchups, bad luck, or bad players? If possible, go help the lane that lost because of bad luck, because they'll be able to benefit the most from your help. You also want to question whether there's something you did wrong that caused your lanes to start losing, so that you can avoid it next time. If someone is in a lane where the opponent has a large advantage over them early, consider making that a priority right after your buffs. If someone seems to be overextending and you suspect they will be ganked, head there to countergank.

Maintaining farm while helping lanes is a matter of moving around the map intelligently. Never dilly-dally. It helps to have a sense of urgency. Put this song on loop in the background. Go to a camp, clear it, make a beeline for the next camp, clear it, then run to the lane that's most appropriate. Don't stand around in a bush hoping that a gank opportunity opens up, and don't hang out in lane killing minions if you could go for another jungle camp instead.

3.) Is farming more important than losing a lane? -Should I keep in the jungle while their Jarvan is camping a lane?

This depends heavily on who the junglers are. Jarvan has strong early ganks. It makes sense that he will gank early and often to get his lanes rolling. Yi (whom you play a lot) is a strong farmer. While your laners may protest, it probably makes sense to keep farming rather than try to gank for them. Yi has no CC at all, just a little slow if you have red buff. Unless an enemy is very overextended without wards, your gank will fail. On the other hand, if you completely ignore lanes, there's no way of hitting your late game power spike because the game will just end. So in some sense, it is a judgment call. It is also a case where you'll want to pick an appropriate champion. If they have a strong early ganker in the jungle and they also have strong early game laners, a farming jungler who doesn't gank well will be a huge risk.

I actually spectated one of your games tonight, the one where the enemy had Ahri mid and Hecarim jungle. I noticed that you spend a ton of time in the early/mid game killing minions in lanes, and very little time killing camps. I was especially surprised to see you totally ignore your buff camps. There was even one point where you put wards in the bushes behind and inside your blue buff, without noticing that the blue had been counterjungled a long time ago. Your wards were defending an objective that didn't exist, and won't exist for several more minutes because you didn't stop to clear the tiny lizards. If you're going to jungle Yi, you definitely must buy a Wriggle's and focus heavily on farming, always taking your buff camps right on time. You would need a very good reason for deviating from this strategy on that champion.

meIontusk1 votes

{{summoner:2}} Enlightenment achieved. {{summoner:2}}

I really like this part: "Yi has no CC at all, just a little slow if you have red buff. Unless an enemy is very overextended without wards, your gank will fail. "

It gets me thinking about how useful Yi (and other champions) can actually be in certain situations. I was usually only interested in if the enemy laner is low on health, not considering their escapes (e.g. Tyrand's Spinning Slash, Ahri's Spirit Rush) or maybe how easy it is for them to get away. I guess in a sense I've been taking a very caveman approach to the games; not considering all the outcomes that the engage can have(how much a waste of time, or how great of a time investment it can be).

This gets me thinking of the value of tier lists... I totally understand why Warwick or Rammus can be high tier.

Thanks for your help, it really gets me thinking about how one good player can make a huge impact on the game.

OhBoyItsaMegaman2 votes

Awesome!

Lover Lips2 votes

You can't carry an entire team by yourself. It just doesn't happen. Ever.

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