It makes no sense, he doesn't need a buff in any way. The only reason his winrate/play rate is so low, is because of the tank meta. Don't just buff him because worlds is around the corner, you make enough money as it is.
PePsiLemoNN6 votesI bet that 15 bonus shield ( which he gets at level 3 btw) will make his level 2 ganks even better. Did you even read the buff , your point literally makes no sense. Jeez you'll deshidratate if you continue the qq like that.
morris12 votesbUt hE wiLl gAnK W/ 15 mORe hP lV3 WTFF
GayFluffyUnicorn2 voteswhy would he get it at lvl 3? Most lee sins start with W or Q and then the other. Lmao.
PePsiLemoNN2 votesExplain how are his ganks ''the most opressive level 2 ganks'' if he takes W at level 2 ? ;) lmao
Catastrophic1 votesHe doesn't have to gank at 2, if he ganks at 3 he already saved on around 100 HP in W shields which is huge early game, that's about 15% HP early game. His level 3 ganks are just as fucked up.
PePsiLemoNN2 votesOP's point was that he is the most opressive level 2 ganker.
Pumping Iron5 votesMost oppresive level 2 ganker after Elise and Jarvan.
LankPants2 votesElise and J4 are both getting nerfed though.
report bot ples1 votes[{quoted}](name=Forearm Strong,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sqOFkxPE,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-09-07T18:57:54.682+0000)
Most oppresive level 2 ganker after Elise and Jarvan.
elise? lol what elo are you
Pumping Iron1 voteselise? lol what elo are you
diamond
FeederCricket5 votesHis winrate is low because he is overly popular and over 60% of the people who "main" him are bad with him and feed every game, losing and thus dropping his winrate.
He's very strong now, and in the right hands extremely oppresive and anti-fun to play against, and does not need a buff.
Cowseed1 votesHow would you know this. Do you have a record of every lee sin game?
.>_>
GayFluffyUnicorn1 votes58% winrate on mains and the average lee sin with this winrate is dia 2. Such a bad champ.
BobaFlautist4 votesTBH I think J4 has better level 2 ganks.
But Riot has systematically nerfed his first clear over and over again, so he kinda struggles to be above 50% hp at level 2, and if he fails a gank he usually gets chunked so hard he has to back or risk being killed in his own jungle.
Meanwhile, Lee has some of the best jungle sustain in the game.
TyroneWatermelon3 votesUseless shield buff, it doesn't affect his "oppressive level 2 ganks" in anyway besides giving his ally champ if he even dashes to one 15 extra shield
GayFluffyUnicorn2 votesSo coming out of jungle with even more health than before does not help? Blocking additional damage that could be a 1 for 1 trade does not help? What are these joke players on the boards nowadays-
TyroneWatermelon1 votesSo coming out of jungle with even more health than before does not help? Blocking additional damage that could be a 1 for 1 trade does not help? What are these joke players on the boards nowadays-
Tha simple useless buff may make him gank with 1 more autoattack worth of health, which increases his survivability in the jungle, and has no effect on his damage, mobility or crowd o control in any way. 15 more shields and an autoattack worth of hp won't contribute in any way to his ganks if he wastes it on a non champion ally. Even tho max rank shield is getting reduced(this alone justifies the buff) at the end of day the buff is so meaningless and lee's greatest strengths can be avoided overall with proper positioning and dodging. Ending an argument with an insult shows that you're pretty upset although it isn't surprising coming from a player that plays even more oppressive champs like GP and Jayce like you.
Lord Galvatron3 votesThree words: L C S
Catastrophic3 votesThese are three letters
The Yetii Rider1 votesAccording to the Scrabble Dictionary, El See and Es and all words. You can't stop me from running out of letters before everyone else!
ChompyWulf2 votesSo you don't want options that challenge the tank meta? Or just don't like its taking until right before Worlds?
hhaavviikk2 votesSo you don't want options that challenge the tank meta? Or just don't like its taking until right before Worlds?
ok so we go from seeing lee sin as a jungler every other game to seeing tanks as junglers all the time and somehow the solution is to go back to lee sin? how about we just buff a different jungler for once
ChompyWulf3 votesMost other junglers are in a decent place. The problem with Lee is he has a lot utility and playmaking in his kit. So he either is in a strong state and overplayed in high elo in particular, or a weaker state and goes on a slide with less and less play.
Frankly he needs some kind of rework. As he is now if you play against him, all you can do to counterplay is dodge Q. It's kinda like how Fiora used to be with her old kit. There was no way to play around her kit.
Done257 votescoughRemove ward hoppingcough
TwinkiePro1 votesHis mobility is already pretty limited. They may change it to a point and click dash like most everyone else were they to take that away.
edit: i should probably elaborate what I mean by limited. What i mean is that both of his mobility spells have some kind of requirement to work. Q requires it to hit a target, while W requires a friendly target. without either of these his mobilty is very limited.
Done251 votesHis mobility is bullshit. The whole point of a targeted ability is that you can't use it on demand. It wasn't as bad when he had to pay for his wards, but once Trinkets became a thing...why even bother trying to land Q from a distance?
TwinkiePro1 votesThen how do you feel about all the other superior, one press dashes?
Every one of these champions have a dash that does not require any other commands or outside forces to use to their maximum efficiency and cannot be blocked (
). Most of these are of similar range, with some being much longer with matching cooldowns. Most of these also have some form of added benefit to using them, whether its something as simple as additional damage ( ) or Hard CC ( ).
Use this knowledge and apply it to Lee Sin. He has to use a ward in order to freely hop, meaning a charge must be used. The standard warding trinkets starts at a 3 minute cooldown, going down to 1.5. Lee Sin is almost forced into 
in order to ward hop more often.
His W also goes onto full cooldown, 14 seconds, and does not scale down with rank. He also loses the shield which is, ironically, what they are buffing.
His mobility is heavily restricted compared to others.
Done251 votesJust want to call out a few, in no particular order, since I'm short on time atm:
TwinkiePro1 votesI'll point out a few for clarity's sake, as well as show why some are still superior.
Done251 votesTwinkiePro1 votesmy bad on #2, I totally mixed it up on that, both with it actually being number 3 and with graves same all of them actually, I mis-numbered them pretty bad. [zombie-brand-facepalm]
Also, another problem with Grag is that by making his E ignore minions would make that ability way too similar to sejuani's.
What Is Smite1 votesThey could always send the buffs to the tournament servers rather than send them to live, legit the reason worlds is always 1 patch behind live is because they are using tournament codes and those servers don't get updated as often as live mostly it's only when in use
ChompyWulf1 votesOh hell no. Part of the charm of Esports is being able to play the same game as pros, no special rules or changes between the casual and professional. Being on slightly different patches is one thing, but making LCS or Live only changes is not OK.
What Is Smite1 votesYea but then you realize that the game hits extremities of the balance spectrum more often than not if you've been playing the game long enough to understand the differences between Meddler's and Morello's idea's of a "balanced game"
ChompyWulf1 votesBalance will never be perfect. Some thing or things will always be better than others for some period of time. That is no reason to change balance between the mass servers and the pro games.
Vekkna2 votesIf the challenge to the tank meta is an overloaded hybrid assassin-support-minitank...yeah, give me fucking tank meta for the rest of time.
Weiss Guertena1 votesSo we're back at Lee Sin meta which was pretty much default for years because if he isn't the uncontested king of the jungle when Worlds hit he gets buffed? I think I prefer tank meta to that. It's different if nothing else.
ChompyWulf1 votesThe way I see it, even if Lee is a top tier pick and used a lot, it frees up ADCs to play a lot more marksmen if less tanks are on the field rather than needing one of only a few hyper carries.
King of Demons2 votesOppressive level 2 ganker? WHAT LOL
Ever seen Twitch? Or Eve?
He's good because if you're half HP from jungling and he meets you, you'll die. This shield won't make these situations worse for you, they'll largely stay the same. You'll continue losing these moments where you have lost before and if you could beat him before, the 50 HP he'll have more in a clear won't make him survive that either.
OMGSoAnnoying2 votesMost oppressive level two ganker? Nah.
sends his regards. You might not be ganked by 2:30 with a root that allows the enemy laner to dash to you as well, then slowed by his shield. He might not gank AGAIN within the next 90 seconds after getting level 3 when your flash was blown.
Devilreaper XIII1 votesnothing new here nothing to see here just keep walking its only a buff for a god again.
DaNinad1 votesEveryone forgets about twitch lol
Nea1041 votesThey made Kayn to sell. They can't nerf him. Lee Sin is still very popular and then he sells, so...
aqours fanboy1 votesMaybe...ward and respect the level 2?...
DunkinNoobs1 votesLiterally every ranged jungler with red buff is a better lvl 2 ganker than Lee. Give me a break OP.
AlienPrimate1 votes"play rate is so low"
