If you're not AD against WW, Malzahar, Skarner, what now?

weeaboomer··1 votes·519 views

Please don't even bother with your "Just sit in fountain so they never reach you" bs.

21 Comments

redniwediS6 votes

What do you mean what now? You keep playing the game, ward well, and move as a team. There are many champions you shouldn't fight one on one depending on your chosen champion, so don't fall into the trap of thinking you have to fight them by yourself.

Just farm up in the lane phase, play safe, and roll with your team.

Zero Skill Tank2 votes

This still doesn't explain why AD champions deserve defensive item so much superior to Zhonya's. It's not like all AP champions are long range mages.

redniwediS2 votes

Is that why AD champs can buy a slightly weaker Zhonyas effect and just not finish the item? Oh wait...

Zero Skill Tank1 votes

Slightly weaker Zhonya's effect? Like, prevents damage for a period of time, but not all of it?

There are AD items that do just that, y'know. item 3156 item 3053

Only they don't make you a sitting duck.

redniwediS1 votes

Quicksilver Sash does everything it's upgraded counterpart does, minus the speed boost. You knew what I meant but wanted to force in a mention to two other items that give AD. We all saw what you did there, and you should feel bad about it.

I don't know why you're trying to argue with me here, particularly since my first post had absolutely nothing to do with items. There are other people in this thread you can talk about items with who quite clearly already want to talk about it.

So please, go talk with the people who are already talking about items. I came here to answer the OP's question, not debate about which damage type has the better effects to their items.

Tormentula5 votes

What is the question?

So if you're ap against them...

well don't overextend and give them oppertunities to kill you for one. It's pretty common sense that positioning is all you need to counter them and never try to all in (if you're AP, you shouldn't be all-in period).

Never split from your team so you can punish a ww or skarner, and don't try to trade with champs like mal.

Annoxis2 votes

You need to understand " If you are not AD " as " If you can't build Mercurial Scimitar on your champ ".

Basically, he is making a complain about how the game heavily favors AD over AP, with Mercurial Scimitar, Maw of Malmortius, etc.

Tormentula1 votes

{quoted}

You need to understand " If you are not AD " as " If you can't build Mercurial Scimitar on your champ ".

Basically, he is making a complain about how the game heavily favors AD over AP, with Mercurial Scimitar, Maw of Malmortius, etc.

AP Mages are meant to be punishable for their mispositioning, lack of warding, and squishiness. Giving them QSS like item would just make them nearly invinicible glass cannons that hug tower all game with nothing you can do about it.

Velkoz's only counter is CC, if you manage to land anything that can lock him down you can kill him with his immobility or shut him down from ulting in a teamfight. Give him item 3140 with AP/CDR/M.Pen/whatever and now you have something way too safe to play.

We learned what happens when you give AP champs a small immunity to CC; Malzahar

If a WW/Skarner/Mal ults you, thats your fault entirely, you should know you're squishy and easy to kill and not front line so they can instantly go on you. A skarner flashing onto me as a vel'koz since I was standing infront of my garen for a second is wp by him, not gg cause broken game.

Annoxis1 votes

Just to be clear, I never agreed his/her/its complaints. But, since you seems to have some interesting things, and that I want to have a good debate, we will say that I actually agree with his/her/its bullshit.

Roleplay start now : But, why ADCs are allowed to have this things, if you should be punished for bad positioning ?

Tormentula1 votes

{quoted}

Roleplay start now : But, why ADCs are allowed to have this things, if you should be punished for bad positioning ?

Somebody probably has a better reasoning, but the way I see it..

ADCs's build path heavily rely on particular rush items. Rushing a QSS on an ADC isn't giving them the needed attack speed or AD to snowball, only what QSS builds into benefits the ADC. In a way, building a QSS on an ADC sets them back or waste 1300 gold when they could get a BF item instead. Its a teamfight item if you're the team's main source of damage and people can protect you.

With an AP mage, they can honestly build anything. Even if you build incorrectly vs. your matchup, you're still going to deal damage cause of how your kit works. Let's not look at vel, and look at veigar for example, he can protect himself with his cage, while still being safe under a tower and dealing tons of damage. Syndra as another example can push somebody away if they get too close, poke with Q, and just farm under tower. Now the way to kill these two, would be to lock them down with CC, say a WW ulti. Give them a QSS item, and now their only weakness is taken away, how do you kill them if they don't get caught out? How would you kill a syndra with QE, veigar with E, Vel'koz with E and rylais, etc if the moment you do catch them, you have no way to lock them down yourself.

That may sound a bit off directional, since I basically said "adcs are punishable build paths, while APs have tools to kite" but if you compare kits, you can see why a QSS would be more "balanced" to deal with on one champ over the other:

Jinx vs. Annie

Lets say you have a jinx with QSS and an annie with QSS, either one in bot lane split pushing, and your Elise is on her way to pick them off. Jinx's only counterplay to stop elise from securing a kill on her, is to land an E, which is kinda tricky, or QSS the cocoon and run away. However she's not guaranteed to live as elise can still kill jinx with her abilities and chase her. What jinx can't kill with just autos she's going to die to.

Now annie, elise is ganking a splitpushing annie (kek), annie can QSS the cocoon, but that's not done.. annie can then either insta shot elise, land a stun and walk away while jinx can't, and has maybe bonus bulk due to RoA+Abyssal+QSS.

This is where QSS can be balanced on an ADC over a mage, a mage has the tools already if played right, and their moment of weakness is getting caught out. If elise cocoon'd annie she could burst combo her before annie does the same, but because of QSS, annie can burst combo elise with a counter stun before she does. With jinx, jinx can have it as a safety measure or to stop a stun in a TF, however she's not going to turn a 1v1 completely around with QSS, that may have set her back by 1300 gold vs. the other ADC making her actual laning punishable. An ADC doesn't have "burst" to completely reverse the trade vs. something with CC, a mage can.

I don't mean for this to sound like "so QSS currently is stupid on annie/anything on paper?" as it doesn't since the stats it gives aren't significant, the burst would be gone making the math kinda lame, but pair QSS with CDR+AP/M.pen and it can be an effective core item on a lot of mages.

Commit Sudoku4 votes

dont have garbage positioning

Ralanr4 votes

Build magic resist, don't get caught out.

warpenguin5553 votes

you can still buy QSS, just dont upgrade it and sell it off later. also get mr vs malz

PermabannedGaren3 votes

Don't try to duel them?

1wolfpack3 votes

pick Annie and 1 shot them

Revali1 votes

item 3140

Caytheles1 votes

but it only builds into an ADitem. Mages dont have jack.

Salron4 votes

And before season 3 it didn't build into ANYTHING but people still bought it, AD or not

Dynikus1 votes

{quoted}

but it only builds into an ADitem. Mages dont have jack.

item 3222 ? or just build item 3140 anyway and don't bother building it into item 3139

Caytheles1 votes

But no offensive stats. so ad champs still have the 1up

agbudar1 votes

lol having those 3 on the same team... sounds like fun lets add Blitzcrank and Lucian to the botlane to make that a viable destroy everyone team

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