Mages got nerfed, now here come the compensation buffs for Assassins

Eye Of Terror·May 3, 2018·73 votes·17,040 views

Honestly, when I claimed this earlier on I was dumb enough to believe that this would never happen. Stupidity (watching at you, balance team) got not limits tho.

89 Comments

ThilmerMay 3, 201856 votes

Meanwhile, experts suggest that the changes suposed to nerf marksmen are eventually going to be a buff for marksmen.

Nothing new to see here, just Riot's balance team not knowing shit.

Automated RivenMay 4, 201811 votes

Mathematically speaking it's a net nerf to marksmen DPS until higher then normal (for a squishy) amounts of armor.

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20181 votes

makes them specific to tank killing.

I don't think it since tanks are too tanky right now and that just adds to the powercreep of anti-tank mechanics.

Automated RivenMay 4, 20181 votes

Tanks may find themselves more tanky by only purchasing HP now tbh. I would have liked to have seen IE simply have the 50% crit damage removed. I don't like the true damage addition. Specifically with the total armor pen back. I would have liked to have seen crits reduced to 150% damage and IE raise it to 200% with ad on purchases slightly buffed. However that may not have been much better.

I just really really hope that conqueror and IE convert the same damage to true damage as 40% would be a bit stupid.

ZioviMay 4, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Automated Riven,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rgd8l0R3,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-05-04T01:51:59.683+0000)

Mathematically speaking it's a net nerf to marksmen DPS until higher then normal (for a squishy) amounts of armor.

Not really. Later on, once they build LDR, thanks to the total amrmor pen and considering that they will haver higher critical rate, their DPS is higher against any target, even with 0 bonus armor.

Without LDR, though, the single critical hit will deal more damage if the total armor is at least 125. The difference in terms of DPS is lower though, since considering the single critical damage still doesn't take into consideration the critical rate increase.

Anyway, at full build they will be stronger against just about every target. However, it's difficult to estimate how much the different path build and gold required to buy certain items will impact the whole game.

LordGeovanniMay 4, 20181 votes

2 bad squishies reach that amount of armor by level 7 in game. While adcs didnt need strengthening versus anyone dedicatedly building to counter their damage.

Automated RivenMay 4, 20181 votes

60 armor is the wrong calculation. It's minimum of 125.

Nausicäa May 3, 201844 votes

Mages are getting nerfed again with the ADC update. ADC gaining 100+hp is an indirect nerf to mages making them harder to kill, meanwhile adc damage isnt going down much at all.

Daddy AntsMay 3, 20187 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nausicäa ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rgd8l0R3,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-05-03T20:31:22.918+0000)

Mages are getting nerfed again with the ADC update. ADC gaining 100+hp is an indirect nerf to mages making them harder to kill, meanwhile adc damage isnt going down much at all.

OH MAN 100 HP.

YOU HAVE TO HIT 1 EXTRA SPELL!!1

MAGES GUTTED.

Nausicäa May 3, 201844 votes

Damn you must be really trash at this game to not understand how 1 extra spell, that in most cases can miss or be dodged can mean the difference between a kill or death

OP Garen SupportMay 3, 201833 votes

He is a silver V ADC main.

IncubusReaperXMay 4, 201814 votes

Exposed

ShaolinToiletMay 4, 20182 votes

And you're a silver 3 player?? I'm not sure what you're trying to say

ArnoiMay 4, 20188 votes

I'm gold v, bow the knee.

Unlimited NinjaMay 4, 20185 votes

Yes, my Gold 5 overlord.

ModPeriscopeMay 4, 20182 votes

I don't want to pull rank (because that's and endless cycle) but let's refrain from rank shaming.

Anyone, regardless of rank, should be able to have their opinions, and we can respectfully agree or disagree.

AMYS GRAVEMay 4, 20183 votes

I belive this shifted into joke territory.

Now KNEEL before your unranked overlords!

saltranMay 4, 20182 votes

I'm Gold IV, bow to me.

InfernapeMay 4, 20185 votes

{quoted}

I'm gold v, bow the knee.

I'm wood V. KNEEL BEFORE ME AND BASK IN MY RADIANCE

MysteriousBootieMay 5, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=OP Garen Support,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rgd8l0R3,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-03T23:59:17.063+0000)

He is a silver V ADC main.

http://eune.op.gg/summoner/userName=OP+Garen+Support

and you're silver 3 champ [sg-lulu]

OP Garen SupportMay 5, 20181 votes

First of all. I'm not talking dumb things . That guy is both inexperienced and biased, because he is an adc main. This is what my comment means. By the way I have over 5000 games and was platinum for 2 seasons so I might have some experience here :P

Bishasaurus FlexMay 4, 201822 votes

{quoted}

OH MAN 100 HP.

YOU HAVE TO HIT 1 EXTRA SPELL!!1

MAGES GUTTED.

ADC main spotted

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20183 votes

Discrimination spotted

BattalionMay 4, 20183 votes

Good one.

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

AirKingNeoMay 5, 20181 votes

He's literally insulting the guy on the basis he's an ADC main.

That's discrimination.

Daddy AntsMay 4, 20183 votes

{quoted}

ADC main spotted

and?

flibitydooMay 4, 20182 votes

I like how this post also does not mention that they're losing armour which makes lethality assassins better at killing them especiall given that the armour reduction also devalues shield ehp as well.

SkorchMay 4, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nausicäa ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rgd8l0R3,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-05-03T20:31:22.918+0000)

Mages are getting nerfed again with the ADC update. ADC gaining 100+hp is an indirect nerf to mages making them harder to kill, meanwhile adc damage isnt going down much at all.

But wait, ADCs gaining more HP with that logic is actually a nerf to every champion in the game with that mentality. Harder for assassins to kill them Harder for bruisers/juggs to kill them Harder for tanks to kill them Harder for supports to kill them Hell even harder for ADCs to kill eachother.

So why is this a mage thing?

ZioviMay 4, 20182 votes

They are losing some armor but gaining some HP, and MRes is the same. That means their effective HP against magic damage is a bit higher.

Tanks often deal magic damage instead of physical, but they don't play around fast kills, so it matters a bit less for them, compared to mages.

It is valid for supports that specialize in dealing magic damage, though.

SkorchMay 5, 20181 votes

{quoted}

They are losing some armor but gaining some HP, and MRes is the same. That means their effective HP against magic damage is a bit higher.

Tanks often deal magic damage instead of physical, but they don't play around fast kills, so it matters a bit less for them, compared to mages.

It is valid for supports that specialize in dealing magic damage, though.

But that would mean more if 4 armor = 100hp, which it doesnt. If anything it is more of a laning adjustment than a nerf to any 1 class. If anything it is to make it harder for ADCs to burst eachother, or to make them harder to burst so that they dont have to 1-shot assassins in order to stay alive, so that they can nerf the ADCs damage TO SQUISHIES SPECIFICALLY without making them a target. Which means HOPEFULLY the assassins will stop bitching and be nerfed (which will be an indirect buff to mages) And also make it so they can nerf support shielding since the ADC is less likely to just disappear if they cant pop a 1k health shield on them at the drop of a hat.

ZioviMay 5, 20181 votes

Well, i wasn't expressing any opinion on it. Just saying that technically speaking they will gain more EHP against magic damage, since they gain HP and not lose MR, compared to the EHP against physical damage they will gain, since they DO get a base armor nerf. I didn't pay much attention to these changes until now, so i can't say if they are relevant and how much.

But since i am now a bit curious, let's take Ashe for example:

Armor lowered from 31 to 26 HP increased from 527.72 to 539 HP/Level increased from 79 to 85

That means that at levels 1-18 her EHP against magic damage increases by 15-158. On the other hand her EHP against physical damage at levels 1-18 goes from -12 to +116 (basically, she loses 12 EHP at lvl 1, she is basically on par at levels 4 and 5, and then get s little bit tankier).

Since -12 EHP at lvl 1 it's really nothing, yeah, i'd say she gets overall a little bit more tanky against physical damage and a little bit more than that against magic damage. Everyone can decide for themselves how much 158 EHP will impact them. Of course one should take magic pen into consideration, so Ashe's extra EHP against magic damage at level 18 will be something between 114 (if you have magic pen equal or higer to her MR) and 158 (if you have 0 Mres).

Also of course values are different for every adc, but i would suppose that they are in a similar position.

Personally i find the item changes way more relevant than this.

KhristophorosMay 3, 20187 votes

Mages feel fine, if not better since AP values got increased on lots of items.

I'm not having any mana issues mid or late game.

Yeah hardcore Tear users are probably weaker now but they needed a nerf.

Packun FlowerMay 3, 201837 votes

You realize mages have no starting item now right? item 1056 is actually so garbage in stats now its actually better to start item 1082 + item 1004 For safe farming or + item 2031 for harass lane. There is no reason ever to pick over those two other options as your starting item, win or lose Seal offers better stats and the possibility to snowball hardcore IF you win, if you lose you would just sell it for something better like you would old Dorans Rings.

CasterGilgameshMay 3, 20181 votes

i always liked Dank seal best but the mana regen was a little nice touch for me to pick Dorans Ring

KhristophorosMay 3, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Annie x Zoe Yuri,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rgd8l0R3,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-05-03T21:52:33.188+0000)

You realize mages have no starting item now right? is actually so garbage in stats now its actually better to start + For safe farming or + for harass lane. There is no reason ever to pick over those two other options as your starting item, win or lose Seal offers better stats and the possibility to snowball hardcore IF you win, if you lose you would just sell it for something better like you would old Dorans Rings.

And how does this make mages weaker than last patch?

Packun FlowerMay 4, 201817 votes

Because old Droans ring gave better mana regen and also gave them HP. item 1082 + item 1004 is good but it wasn't as good as pre nerfed item 1056 . But with dorans ring being the most useless item in the game now mages have no choice but to go with seal + Charm (OR Seal + Potion)

KhristophorosMay 4, 20184 votes

Ok that would be true if Doran's Ring actually was nerfed but actually now it gives consistent mana regen now instead of requiring last hits. It's better than before.

McsquzzyMay 4, 20182 votes

It's only a nerf if you still have it at level 5 Edit 1 this is using the old mana regen numbers, I have not checked if the increased mana regen with this ring is better than old regen with the old ring Edit 2 OK most mages got 2 mp5 to compensate so there level 1 dorans is the same and it gets worse for new dorans every level, but that is kinda insignificant compared to the mana on kill, that was broken enough for galio to abuse till they nerfed it to unique status Edit 3, added edit labels

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20184 votes

D ring is garbage in stats

said no pro ever...

looks at high elo

sees everyone taking d ring

NineTailedMysticMay 4, 20182 votes

I hate to even slightly agree with you but d-ring is legit buffed unless you have like 80%+ cs rate

AirKingNeoMay 5, 20181 votes

Well, unlike most boards users, I use facts and look at stats.

ShadowmenderMay 4, 20181 votes

You realize, unless you had perfect cs, that you have higher mana regen from doran's ring than before? Up until what...level 7 or so? Well beyond starting level.

Total EclipseMay 4, 20186 votes

Mages got nerfed. Mages got nerfed.

God this shitpost honestly IRRITATES me, let me tell you why. Patch 8.9 was one of the greatest reads on league in a looong time. This is the one time that our balance team actually deserves praise, and here you are shit posting that...... mages.... got nerfed?!? x'D x'D x'D Mages got nerfed. My god the IGNORANCE. Mages got BUFFED. The only thing that got nerfed was OVERPOWERED WAVE CLEAR. If you adore being able to 1shot every wave as ekko, xerath, syndra, oriana, whoever, then you are despicable and should try getting good. That play style is what we like to call NON-INTERACTIVE. High diamond players often complain about how EASY it is to coast through mid-game as an AoE mage by just safely 1shotting every single wave. Yes. Mana is down SLIGHTLY across the board. Ok. Now what about the rest of the patch notes? Let's take a quick look. Shall we.?

Luden's Echo: Buffed. -100g cost. Mejai's SoulCarryItem: Buffed. Grants movespeed (outplay/carry potential) on purchase. Rylai's Crystal Scepter: Buffed. +5 FREE ap. Spellbinder: Buffed, if that's actually your thing. Seeker's Armguard: Buffed. -100g cost on an incredible early purchase. Twin Shadows: Buffed. 10 (TEN) free ap. Fiendish Codex: Buffed. 5 free ap. Hextech GLP: Buffed. Double slow. Lost Chapter: Buffed. +15 ap for just 200g. Incredible.

As for assassins and ADC? Lets see here.... hmmm.... not a whole lot..... almost like they buffed tanks and mages this patch to compensate for ADC being too dominant.. hmmmmm... Oh wait check out this bit I found about ADCs!... Kai'Sa got the nerf she needed. Yep. Absolutely terrible patch notes. 0/10. Please flame our balance team as hard as you guys can. I hope y'all find my sarcasm palpable. Ily so much rn Rito. <3

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20186 votes

Anyone here using actual facts are being downvoted.

People lying are being upvoting.

Who knew that the "whiny" ~~adc~~ mage 'overlords' would flood the boards if their class ever got nerfed?

ModPeriscopeMay 4, 201810 votes

I mean, if it were your champ/class, you'd want to voice your discontent.

Is it so bad that players come to the boards when they're upset?

aqours fanboyMay 4, 20183 votes

It is when the other end of the spectrum gets perma downvoted and it's literal whining instead of an actual discussion/dialogue.

AirKingNeoMay 5, 20181 votes

so basically what's happening with mage posts right now. Literal whining and no discussion.

Athenes LuluMay 5, 20181 votes

Meanwhile there are plenty of support mains that want shield/heal power to be nerfed because they knew overloading it was unnecessary, for example.

aqours fanboyMay 5, 20181 votes

I don't deny Riot is targetting the wrong archetype if trying to help assassins, but:

a) This change doesn't hurt mages that much. It's all overreactions and Boards angery circlejerk b) Anytime anyone gives valid points or at least offers the chance at a reasonable discussion, "lul downvoted theyre jus mad let them vent" and it kinda makes this whole gameplay board a 100% joke.

Athenes LuluMay 6, 20181 votes

Pretty much.

But you see, pointing out the truth that goes against their sentiment is a free downvote farm :^)