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Urf is a problem....

Support Position··1 votes·1,246 views

So as most people know AR Urf has came out and.... I don't know about many of you however the randomness makes this game mode only Pain. And Suffering.

So let's talk about this game mode for a little shall we?

From a standpoint. At the very beginning from the drafting stage. You already can tell IMMEDIATELY if your going to win. Annie Garen DrMundo Evelynn Blitzcrank Fizz Hecarim Jax Janna Irelia Katarina KogMaw Leona Lux Malzahar MissFortune Morgana Nami Nocturne Olaf Ryze Shaco Talon Tryndamere Veigar Velkoz Vi Vladimir Warwick Ziggs XinZhao

All of these champions. Are solo win champions if you're good enough. However if you don't get a single one of these champions (which I have almost 8 games in a row due to random) Urf is literally a STOMP. Especially with Tryndamere Veigar Velkoz Olaf Shaco Malzahar Nocturne Jax DrMundo Hecarim Evelynn Annie and MANY more.

I'm not asking to take out this game mode. I want it to stay around. However this game mode NEEDS bans. No less than 5 per team. LITERALLY. I understand that apparently we need the new client for that (Even though 10 bans for each time is literally what is ACTUALLY needed.) I feel at the CURRENT state of Urf. All Random is AWFUL. It's like rolling a 20 sided dice. However if you land on 1-18 you lose. Even using rerolls it is the same thing (I have literally used 3 rerolls for MULTIPLE games. to get a GOOD champion that ACTUALLY does something. But instead I get garbage.)

Personally I feel something NEEDS to happen. I love Urf. I love how it feels, the gold income, the no farm needed, the fights, EVERYTHING about it is amazing. But one thing. What champion you get.

If you don't get what is listed here, you might as well say gg and just go in lane. Try, get stomped and try again in another game.

How can we solve this?

As I stated: 10 bans each time (or 5 for now.... If you can't code 10...) would be amazing. Being able to ban stupid WAY too overpowered for Urf champions would allow this game mode to thrive. ( Tryndamere Veigar Velkoz Olaf Shaco Malzahar Nocturne Jax DrMundo Hecarim Evelynn Annie obviously many more)

Taking out the game mode

Making Urf NOT random

Giving a surrender option at 5 minutes (This would also be 100% AMAZINGLY ok. Even though most people troll others in staying in a miserable game. At 5 minutes in Urf you ** KNOW** when you're getting stomped. This would make a "Go next. This games too awful for me to carry or try as all I will see is a grey screen."

Anyway. I just felt like I should throw my 2 cents in. Urf right now is a hugely negative thing to a lot of people (believe me I've been more the loser than winner. By 8 minutes in the game.) And I have seen how many people want bans in this game mode. Or a surrender option EARLY because of how unfun the game mode is having to wait 20 minutes because of the option already in the game.

Have a good day everyone [slayer-pantheon-thumbs] [slayer-jinx-catface]

16 Comments

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Wonderland Clock,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r6cxLM56,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-03-06T02:15:17.734+0000)

From a standpoint. At the very beginning from the drafting stage. You already can tell IMMEDIATELY if your going to win.

no

Support Position1 votes

Yes you do. This is Urf not the normal game.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

urf being abnormal does not prove anything

Support Position1 votes

I don't know if you can read or not. But this post is ONLY about Urf.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

Which means absolutely nothing... I'm not sure why you posted this.

Shonjl1 votes

{quoted}

no

Actually yes. Its basically whoever has the most OP champs all on one team that wins. If a team that has all 5 that are very OP in URF against a team that has only 3 and the other 2 are garbage, the one with 5 will literally win every single time. How skillful you are at the game means nothing due to no cds, like you can have a challenger player vs a Bronze in URF and I doubt it honestly matters. If the Challenger gets a crap champ, chances are they will probably get stomped.

Yes its not 100% but it basically is at the same time, most ARURF games are won at champ select. What you do means literally nothing when you are against a Jax that can perma jump on you, a Xin that can literally 1v2 or take towers without minions even if they are 1/20, a Garen that has nonstop spinning or a Viegar that goes pure tank and can 1v5. This last one I have done a few times actually. Its basically impossible to kill a 4k hp Viegar with 1k AP and his stun is up every 2 seconds.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

{quoted}

Actually yes. Its basically whoever has the most OP champs all on one team that wins. If a team that has all 5 that are very OP in URF against a team that has only 3 and the other 2 are garbage, the one with 5 will literally win every single time. How skillful you are at the game means nothing due to no cds, like you can have a challenger player vs a Bronze in URF and I doubt it honestly matters. If the Challenger gets a crap champ, chances are they will probably get stomped.

I keep having people tell me this right before I beat the shit out of their team regardless of who they got as long as they aren't a direct counter and focusing on stopping me specifically.

Yes its not 100% but it basically is at the same time, most ARURF games are won at champ select.

did you notice that they intentionally pick counters when possible? If you get a vladmir you can pretty much guess that the other team will get shaco, fiddle, or something.

What you do means literally nothing when you are against a Jax that can perma jump on you

item 3075 doesn't care if the onhit was magic or physical

here's a list of champs whos names also start with J

Janna JarvanIV Jayce Jhin Jinx

interestingly the only one with no answer to jax is jayce... like jayce needs more benefits...

a Xin that can literally 1v2 or take towers without minions even if they are 1/20

Many champs can do this in urf mode and tanks can do it a lot sooner than xin can. Both things I mean.

a Garen that has nonstop spinning

can still be kited as always

or a Viegar that goes pure tank and can 1v5.

can be prevented by not being a noob

This last one I have done a few times actually. Its basically impossible to kill a 4k hp Viegar with 1k AP and his stun is up every 2 seconds.

you don't have to kill him even if he does reach this point. He has a lategame powerspike if you screw around too much but he also falls off again even if the game drags out because he's incredibly limited in what he can do even with 1k ap

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

Annie is best tank in arurf bar none. Permanent 40% reduction ahoy!

Shonjl1 votes

{quoted}

I keep having people tell me this right before I beat the shit out of their team regardless of who they got as long as they aren't a direct counter and focusing on stopping me specifically.

did you notice that they intentionally pick counters when possible? If you get a vladmir you can pretty much guess that the other team will get shaco, fiddle, or something.

item 3075 doesn't care if the onhit was magic or physical

here's a list of champs whos names also start with J

Janna JarvanIV Jayce Jhin Jinx

interestingly the only one with no answer to jax is jayce... like jayce needs more benefits...

Many champs can do this in urf mode and tanks can do it a lot sooner than xin can. Both things I mean.

can still be kited as always

can be prevented by not being a noob

you don't have to kill him even if he does reach this point. He has a lategame powerspike if you screw around too much but he also falls off again even if the game drags out because he's incredibly limited in what he can do even with 1k ap

No he doesn't rofl. There is nothing you can do to stop a Viegar in URF. his Q is on a 2 second cd and it goes to 1 second. It doesn't matter how much MR you build since he dishes them out so fast you will get chunked and his ult gives jack shit about your MR. And you can't stop a Viegar from farming, unless you want to devote multiple people to the same lane as him, which basically will screw you over since he will just move somewhere else. So saying only noobs will lose to him is laughable since you can't stop him, just like you can't stop a Nasus from farming in URF. He will very fast stop giving a shit about your damage or just walk up to you and kill you since you have no chance of escaping his perma slow which is basically a bind. There is a reason back in normal URF those two were perma banned, they were even WORSE than things like Jax and Xin.

When he can have you stunned every other second, chunk you or nearly 1 shot you with his Q, and his R is there just to add insult, there isn't anything you can do to stop him if he builds tank and doesn't die in 1 shot. Even if you do manage to somehow kill him by dogpiling him, he 100% no questions asked killed at least 1 person in the process, if not more. Now you have to worry about the other 4 people coming for you while you have 1 dead, possibly more dead or extremely weakened, if not still stunned too.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

{quoted}

No he doesn't rofl. There is nothing you can do to stop a Viegar in URF.

unless you can kill him

his Q is on a 2 second cd

not if he's dead

and it goes to 1 second.

up to like 30 seconds if he's dead

It doesn't matter how much MR you build since he dishes them out so fast you will get chunked and his ult gives jack shit about your MR.

But he has no defensive steroids

and you can't stop a Viegar from farming, unless you want to devote multiple people to the same lane as him, which basically will screw you over since he will just move somewhere else.

except that you can and probably will because its extremely easy to lane against viegar if you aren't a wuss whos afraid to lose hp

So saying only noobs will lose to him is laughable since you can't stop him,

he's been nonviable for years because of his weak laning and limited teamfight capabilities. Urf does not fix these issues

just like you can't stop a Nasus from farming in URF.

you actually can.

btw in the case of nasus vs viegar you've made a paradox here.

He will very fast stop giving a shit about your damage or just walk up to you and kill you since you have no chance of escaping his perma slow which is basically a bind. There is a reason back in normal URF those two were perma banned, they were even WORSE than things like Jax and Xin.

you are delusional

When he can have you stunned every other second, chunk you or nearly 1 shot you with his Q, and his R is there just to add insult, there isn't anything you can do to stop him if he builds tank and doesn't die in 1 shot. Even if you do manage to somehow kill him by dogpiling him, he 100% no questions asked killed at least 1 person in the process, if not more. Now you have to worry about the other 4 people coming for you while you have 1 dead, possibly more dead or extremely weakened, if not still stunned too.

for the most part I don't even bother building against viegar specifically.. his pushing power is shit even when he's fed.. seriously. You can stall him out into oblivion which is part of how you beat viegar.

Shonjl1 votes

The funny thing is, Riot could easily fix it by doing just one small thing.

Making it truly random. Its called All Random URF after all. Unlock the entire champ pool so you can't abuse it like plenty of people do with ARAM by only having champs that are good in it and problem is solved.

Since as it is right now, it isn't truly that random when there are tons of people that have accounts specifically dedicated to ARAM with 10-20 champs all great at it, and they also just happen to by godly in URF as well.

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

ARURF could use a fully unlocked roster. But rolls rack up so easily, it probably wouldn't be noticeable. Champs you don't see a lot of in random queues get rolled a lot, not chosen seldom. Nobody wants to play Mordekaiser because he has a huge chance of being completely zoned or controlled in a non-toplane situation.

This sounds nice on paper. But what you don't realize is that this A) completely opens trading and B) allows an entire team to use rolls to optimize their lineup (as global roster means global trading). I think your system will draft more homogenized teams in the end, due to teams having even more control over what they get. A five-man premade could theoretically spend 10 rolls aiming for an optimal team-- from which few champs are actually absent in ARURF.

I've faulted this process for being applied to ARAM too. This just gives players more excuse and opportunity to roll into better lineups. We don't want this.

Shonjl1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Fuzzi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r6cxLM56,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2017-03-08T05:57:29.984+0000)

ARURF could use a fully unlocked roster. But rolls rack up so easily, it probably wouldn't be noticeable. Champs you don't see a lot of in random queues get rolled a lot, not chosen seldom. Nobody wants to play Mordekaiser because he has a huge chance of being completely zoned or controlled in a non-toplane situation.

This sounds nice on paper. But what you don't realize is that this A) completely opens trading and B) allows an entire team to use rolls to optimize their lineup (as global roster means global trading). I think your system will draft more homogenized teams in the end, due to teams having even more control over what they get. A five-man premade could theoretically spend 10 rolls aiming for an optimal team-- from which few champs are actually absent in ARURF.

I've faulted this process for being applied to ARAM too. This just gives players more excuse and opportunity to roll into better lineups. We don't want this.

Rerolling means little when all what? 140 champs are possible selections. It is another story if you only have a pool of 20 champs + whatever is free that week. Now those rerolls have a higher chance of being something good.

I honestly can't get how you think it will be bad lmfao. Even if everyone used their 2 rerolls each, that is still 10 more chances. So including your first 5 given, that is a chance of 15(5 starting champs plus the 10 from RR) out of 140. That is still making it mostly random which is what it is suppose to be. Since you can't deny the same champs were in almost every single Urf game. I saw Karma in like 7/10 games, Jax in 5/10, Quinn in 5/10, for supposedly being random, very select champs being shown very often shows how flawed it is.

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

The TL;DR is that it probably won't really matter in ARURF. The fact is so many champions are good, and normal lackluster picks are even good in it because, well, what are you going to do against Xin when he can charge you every 1.4sec with a slow and gapclose?

Even if they did have all 134 to choose from, how many of those are really picks that won't inherently have an advantage (or rather, will provide a disadvantage for their team)? Surely, the roster for each team can't be to blame for that many losses or victories.

For that argument's sake, I'm interested to know who's a 'bad' pick. Udyr and Darius come to mind, and maybe Illaoi (although I feel she would have a nasty lane if she had a high-range partner). Low mitigation, low range (engage/poke) champions seem to suffer the most; having either range or mitigation pretty much bumps them to well above average performances.

Bad players are bad players, and about all it takes in a mode like ARURF is a little planning to thwart most performances. Any time I lost was generally because of one player on the team having no idea what was up; an Ashe that kept three-manning lanes, or a Pantheon who didn't know how to play. I lost very few because ultimately, they have to have an exceedingly powerful lineup to just roll based on that alone.

I will say I lost very hard to Jax, but I'm pretty sure he's on free week anyway. I wasn't even mad, I was impressed.

Besides, it's ARURF. It won't ever really be balanced. It's not meant to be.

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

So your problem with random is that it picks strong meta picks... What, exactly is stopping anyone from picking these champions outside of random?

Random means random. No pattern, no bias, no preference. Sometimes you get Xin a ton. Sometimes, you just don't. That's random.

Look, it's an RGM queue anyway. Shouldn't it be exactly what it is, so nothing else is or can be?

Mcloved1 votes

last year it was each team got 3 bans, then the picked w/e champs the wanted, was way better last year....

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