@Meddler or other Rioters responisble fro Aurelion Sol

Bellows·Aug 10, 2016·21 votes·13,764 views

I remember listening to a podcast where Sol was mentioned and that you guys might potentially just go back to the drawing board with him. Is this still being thought upon? I think he needs some serious changes. Im fairly decent with him but it feels like every match-up is going to be an up hill battle cause they have SOMEONE who will uber cc me or get in my "weakzone", garbo concept IMO, im sry. Its far different from gp not being with his barrels or illaoi not being near tentacles, cause they can controll if they are in their strong zone and weak zones, where as Aurelion pretty much carries it everywhere he goes.....

Just want to hear wants going to be done with him. He IS my favorite character (who isnt the Waifu Elise) and ill still play him here and there, but I just dont feel like im having fun, even with his cool animations and VO, I love dragons secondly to spiders and playing as one is so cool, but god is it un-rewarding to me....

You guys still considering going back to him?

56 Comments

RiotRiot AxesAug 10, 201620 votes

We are considering some changes for later in the year, but I wouldn't characterize them as "back to the drawing board" by any means. We'd target making him more accessible (though I imagine he'll always have a significant learning curve), plus opportunistic gains where we can get them.

If we could make a spell or two more satisfying to use or make his matchups less about hard counters, we'd be pretty happy about that. It's hard to predict exactly what will be possible until we actually get to that work, though.

World EnderAug 10, 201610 votes

This may be out of your area of expertise, but I'm hoping you can answer a question about Shen in a similar context to what's going on with Sol.

For me, and I'm sure for a significant amount of other players out there, Shen's rework didn't quite hit the mark. He went from being what I would consider a "true tank" to someone more along the lines of a fighter on the tanky side. Having a very situational shield, dodge and a spirit sword that encourages him to auto attack to use this shield to its fullest blurs the line between whether he's a tank or a fighter. This, along with lower base stats to compensate for his situational shielding has caused one of my main champions to fall out of favor with me.

Now, since you mentioned that Aurelion may be in line to have quality of life changes to make him more "accessible" and "satisfying" as you say, would it be possible to apply similar concepts to Shen? I know that quality of life changes happen all the time, but I'm getting the impression that what you're suggesting goes a little bit farther than that and is aimed more at improving how a champion feels, rather than just how they work from a mechanical sense.

Again, this may be completely out of your purview, so I won't expect much, if anything. All I ask is that you take a look at this and try not to forget Shenpai.

ArakadiaAug 10, 20166 votes

I've got 53k+ points on Shen and I like the ninja too. Alot.

One idea one of my friends suggested would be to replace his current passive with the old one. Then make it something like his Q auto's reduced the cooldown of it and for every auto blocked by his W the passive cd was reduced. However that would probably be too much auto empowerent for one character.

I feel that atleast he should get an actual recall, a ultimate that looks something like his splash and not the old recall painted purple, and finally a slight change from the bruiser he feels more like to the tank he was.

EDIT: (Less then a minute and Im downvoted....)

World EnderAug 10, 20162 votes

I don't honestly give a damn how he looks or what his animations are. I was fine with him before because I loved his gameplay. Now he just feels so different that I can't even stand playing him. His Q is just so gimmicky, his passive is too unreliable to be used as a good line of defense when trying to run away or getting kited, and while his W is really cool, I just miss his on demand low cost shield that was up pretty much whenever you needed it. His passive shield is only instant on his E, and if you use that for the shield without hitting anyone then half your energy is gone and you're probably dead. I had around 90k mastery on Shen before his rework. After 6-7 months, I've only gained like 10k more mastery on him. That's how little I've enjoyed playing him.

ArakadiaAug 10, 20161 votes

I agree alot. His shield wasn't super strong but it was cheap, synergized and was instant. I just don't like his current passive, it doesn't feel impactful or interesting.

His Q is gimicky. Its interesting but I miss the life tap.

Riot said they feel they didnt hit the mark so hopefully they will give him some changes like Sona got or QoL buffs. Just a new passive would be neat.

Blue Moon WolfAug 10, 20162 votes

Honestly I'd be happy if they removed the spirit sword mechanic from him. sure, put it on a new champ cause it is a fun idea, just get it away from Shen and give him his old Q back. If his old Q was a matter of "he shouldn't have a heal", then they could just give it a different effect like "allies who attack the marked target gain 10 armor/mr for a few seconds" or something.

Wolf QueenAug 12, 20161 votes

i think itd be better if allies do bonus dmg to marked target then bonus armor

redfeenixAug 10, 20161 votes

I think the w change was good, but I hate that ghostly totem following him around.

He looks like a leashed dog. WHY WOULD YOU GIVE THE MASTER NINJA A BRIGHT GLOWING SWORD? Anyways the w change was cool, If anyone can dodge bullets and swords in an AOE, its gotta be the MASTER NINJA SHEN.

I think hes gonna see a lot of play in this year's worlds. He is pretty OP. So lets wait for the PROs to bust him out before we talk about any changes, eh?

JerulEonAug 10, 20168 votes

Maybe let Aurelion Sol double-click Q so he can peel for himself when someone is on top of him.... it's been something people have been asking for a long time.

ZT XperimentorAug 10, 20164 votes

This would be a nice quality of life buff for him!

NineTailedMysticAug 10, 20164 votes

That's a straight buff, not QoL.

DrCyanideAug 10, 20161 votes

Riot referred to Varus's Q cooldown starting when he starts channeling as a QoL buff, that proposed change for Sol would fit the same pattern.

NineTailedMysticAug 10, 20163 votes

Except ASol being able to double tap his Q would make him infinitely better in certain match ups. Sounds like a straight buff to me.

Evelyn EndwiseAug 10, 20162 votes

I don't think they'll do that since it's an intended weakness. (ie. If somebody gets inside his comfort zone, he should be punished. It's the same thing they did with making Cassio's W not be cast-able right on top of her either). Historically, sustained DPS-mages have been quite problematic with lacking weaknesses when you close in on them (Swain/Azir) so I can't see them backing down on that.

JerulEonAug 10, 20161 votes

Uh... lol. Every mage has some sort of self-peel. Anivia, Syndra, Viktor, Swain, Vladimir, Karma, Taliyah, Lissandra, Annie, Brand, Azir, Kennen, Lux, Morgana, Ryze, Velkoz, Xerath, Zilean, but of course if Aurelion Sol was able to recast Q in his inner circle he would be way too strong.

NarasimhaAug 10, 20162 votes

I mean, no other mage does damage just by kiting. Well, maybe Ahri, but other than that. Aurelion is the only one who can literally just walk/fly around and still end up contributing to a fight.

SiytherAug 10, 20161 votes

that would be a start but he needs his stars to move faster thats what i hate most about him. They move so slowly that i can rarely hit enemies with them (minions arent an issue) and the sad thing is that the slow moving easy as hell to dodge stars are the bulk of his damage. Which leaves you royally screwed against anyone with a half hand of mobility

KoboldAug 10, 20166 votes

Riot is there ANY plans for buffs or work to be done to aatrox? Heck you are even buffing Riven but not even looking Aatrox's way?

Jeanne fan clubAug 10, 20163 votes

aatrox should be getting a rework along with other dive fighters after the assassin rework, or so I've heard.

Blue Moon WolfAug 10, 20161 votes

Happy to hear. I really like how he works and would hate to see him go back to the drawing board (especially with how many years took to release ~~Ao Shen~~). That said, I can understand why some people have a hard time picking him up. Those orbiting stars can be a bit of a challenge to position correctly, especially when it comes to alternating between toggling on and off his W. It might be interesting to have a way to reverse their orbit if I were to toss an idea out :p

J EevoAug 10, 20162 votes

If we could make a spell or two more satisfying to use or make his matchups less about hard counters, we'd be pretty happy about that

You mean how his Q cannot be reactivated instantly making him automatically lose against champions with hard engage?

stone the blacksAug 10, 20161 votes

If we could make a spell or two more satisfying to use or make his matchups less about hard counters, we'd be pretty happy about that. It's hard to predict exactly what will be possible until we actually get to that work, though.

a small change to his q should be all thats needed, just allow him to reactivate instantly instead on at inner limit so people with more than 1 dash or cc dont screw him over if he misses it

Mara VenièrAug 10, 20165 votes

Please, let's just not give him EVERYTHING as with azir. Aurelion carries a good amount of cc, and a very strong dps output, decent burst and stellar (pun not intended) roaming potential.

As an Aurelion player, he NEEDS not to be able to reactivate q instantly, or you would never really be able to get to him. Rylais passive, Health items, zhonia, even the GLP combined with flash, q and ulti are enough peel. Don't make him overpowered in his design and then nerf him to the ground, please.

I am not usually a ranter and I really enjoy your work on the balance side the majority of times: for example, while I loved azir, I can see why he was worth nerfing: his kit had it all, dps, monility, burst, pick potential. The only thing I won't like is that for the sake of making a design more accessible you make it overpowered and then nerf him to the ground.

People who don't like Aurelion weaknesses might as well play other champions, no hate, but he has a lot of pro sides to make up for those weaknesses. Just don't destroy the star dragon, please.

redfeenixAug 10, 20161 votes

I disagree.

I for one think you guys released a very unique, niche and really beatiful champion. The playstyle is very unique and nontraditional, both the orbs and the roaming.

Seriously the animations were stunning. Great emotes, and a free back animation too. You guys knocked it outa the park, only thing I might suggest is move his current w to his passive. Its dumb that the skill and the passive are the same.

Dont worry about changing him too much, you guys killed the eternal dragon fantasy with Sol.

BellowsAug 10, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j1wLKWXq,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-08-10T01:52:31.447+0000)

We are considering some changes for later in the year, but I wouldn't characterize them as "back to the drawing board" by any means. We'd target making him more accessible (though I imagine he'll always have a significant learning curve), plus opportunistic gains where we can get them.

If we could make a spell or two more satisfying to use or make his matchups less about hard counters, we'd be pretty happy about that. It's hard to predict exactly what will be possible until we actually get to that work, though.

Ty for responding! <3 I was glad to see that he can have some wiggle room potentially.

NazZomLordAug 11, 20161 votes

Just change his ult, his current ult doesnt work for his current kit and is just freaking bad and unoriginal. Why not actually use what he is about and put a star that after a certain period of time turns into a black hole sucking everyone in for so long, this would still offer him some peel and a way to get them into his circle, i love playing mages but Sol is just so incredibly lame that i will never play him, the only champ in the game i dont own.

DeadlyLazorAug 16, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Just change his ult, his current ult doesnt work for his current kit and is just freaking bad and unoriginal. Why not actually use what he is about and put a star that after a certain period of time turns into a black hole sucking everyone in for so long, this would still offer him some peel and a way to get them into his circle, i love playing mages but Sol is just so incredibly lame that i will never play him, the only champ in the game i dont own.

try to play him. that ult is necessary, trust me

SilvenAug 12, 20161 votes

I suggest something like ramping damage on his passive so you get punished harder for tanking the stars again and again. And maybe allow him to detonate his Q within his circle as a pre-6 safeguard...

YJRBqwXJcSAug 12, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j1wLKWXq,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-08-10T01:52:31.447+0000)

We are considering some changes for later in the year, but I wouldn't characterize them as "back to the drawing board" by any means. We'd target making him more accessible (though I imagine he'll always have a significant learning curve), plus opportunistic gains where we can get them.

If we could make a spell or two more satisfying to use or make his matchups less about hard counters, we'd be pretty happy about that. It's hard to predict exactly what will be possible until we actually get to that work, though.

just make his q work like anivias and he will be perfectly fine

Mage nobleAug 12, 20162 votes

I don't understood everything ( i'm french ), but don't rework Aurelion Sol please, i main him, just buff him if you want to up his popularity.

YadidDec 8, 20161 votes

Hey Axes, this is a little late. I was searching really far back in the ASolMains subreddit to find a thread and stumbled upon this. Speaking as an ASol main, I can understand where the thought process is going here if it persists. While I believe it makes sense that a large ass dragon could have a blind spot being up-close around ult, I think the problem at hand is something to the tune of maneuverability. As a star dragon who forms the cosmos, having more control over the spheres orbiting him sounds like something that'd make sense, perhaps? My thoughts shot from the hip here are the ability to reverse the movement of the passive to go the opposite direction, whether that's on a huge CD or otherwise. The other thought is making the player play around the orbs themselves (which we already do) with a different movement ability. Now, I must say, I'm not a huge fan of that option seeing as all Sol's love a good Q+E down mid-lane. But, I think Sol's already a form of high skill-floor champ which is dictated by his passive. If you want to make it more satisfying, then it sounds like some more ways to manipulate the passive is what's on the table. Maybe I just stumbled on the post late and this time period of consideration has been scrapped, but looking forward to your thoughts regardless.

Thanks.

EDIT: Recently had another idea of making the passive or W a stacking system in order to activate the current passive with some other ability when there aren't enough stacks. Perhaps something similar to bard in order to encourage the roaming he has now which the E as a movement ability can synergize with.

Moulin RougeAug 10, 20169 votes

Illaoi and GP also arent neutured by their mechanics either. They can still fight back whereas Sol literally cannot fight back save for a ult.

KindredAndWolfAug 10, 20166 votes

I just hate how Sol can't defend himself. If akali or zed jumps im, im fucked. I cant even stun anyone if they are right on top of me.

The very worst part about his kit is the fact that his biggest defensive weapon is his ult, but HALF of the time if they've jumped on you, that ult WILL NOT SAVE YOU. So you died and wasted a valuble team fight tool. I really like sol alot, and enjoy him jungle, but I havent been able to play him since my last jungle game was against a nidalee, and she let me know exactly how stupid i was for picking sol jungle.

BeldairAug 12, 20161 votes

Perhaps a lower cd on his ultimate...it's damage isn't the highest of his kit..

BellowsAug 10, 20165 votes

I dont like bumping threads, but I really want to know from a Rioter is anything is being done or thought about.

ArakadiaAug 10, 20164 votes

I almost feel like his E's active ought to be reworked completely into a damage/utility ability to help him fight back, and give him ramping movement speed on his Q to compensate.

Another idea would be to swap his E and R and compensate the numbers.

EfficientDynamoAug 10, 20164 votes

Sadly, I have to agree. I want to love AS, but he is just so hard to master compared to other champs. Plus, when I do manage to dump a lot of damage on someone, it doesn't feel very exciting or rewarding.

TwëekAug 10, 20163 votes

As an Aurelion Sol main, this post makes me a little nervous.

Sol has AoE hard CC, damage, high DPS, and an incredible roaming tool. You don't get to have all of that without some sort of significant weakness, and I would not want to give up any of that for the sake of him being a little safer to play.

A tiny change that would make him far less frustrating for many to play would be to not have CC set his W on its full cooldown. Losing your primary DPS for 4 seconds because a Fiddle bird hit you feels bad. Getting CCed already makes you vulnerable; he doesn't need to be further gimped by being unable to re-enable his stars once the CC is gone.

Sol is not about being able to solo outplay your counters with superior mechanics - you have essentially an entire roster of champions who can do that, if that's your goal. He's about respecting counter matchups while creating huge pressure elsewhere on the map with his team. It doesn't matter if my lane opponent is a counter; I'll just push hard and roam elsewhere to get the team ahead. Olaf is the only really terrifying thing to see on the enemy team, with Fizz and Akali being challenging but manageable.

To address one suggestion in particular that I saw in this thread, I very strongly disagree with removing/reworking his E. It is by and far the most useful part of his kit. It is what enables him to snowball games from as early as level 4.

Mara VenièrAug 10, 20162 votes

I completely agree with this guy, as a fellow Aurelion player

ShahamutAug 10, 20162 votes

I also agree. I like E.

Honestly, if they want to leave his playstyle the way it is, weaknesses and all, they need to balance his numbers around being a tankier champ. Like some kind of bruiser mage. That or he needs some kind of mechanic that presents "windows of opportunity" where it is safe, and when it is NOT safe to dive onto a star dragon...

BeldairAug 12, 20161 votes

So make him kinda like Swain (Tanky mage), Ryze (Tanky mag), and Vlad (user Tanky sustain mage)?

I'd agree with that... I would also agree with the reactivation in close with Q but that might also make him too strong and cover up that clear weakness.

I honestly think ppl need to spend more time learning and studying him to see how he shines.

Most of my Sol games, I play safe early game...Then move in for the aggressive plays late, where I know I can stick to my target while also keeping ppl off me (unless of course its a Zed ult XD).

But I also try to work closely with my team so that they can cover my weakness for me.... Hence why I love top, jg, and support players when I am Sol...

They know who brings their AP and work to protect me and the adc.

Azir may have a better escape and attack speed , but Sol has the continual damage without needing to rely too much on his mana... Now both are fairly equal in sticking power though.

ShahamutAug 12, 20161 votes

I would really want to focus on giving Sol some kind of window. Right now, its just "dive him" and... "dive him now" and... "dive him always". until 6, then he has a single repel in his ult.

Giving him some kind of window where he has empowered auto attacks or something, like, in melee range he doesn't shoot his breathe he uses his claws and they do increased damage under X conditions. That way you have to think a little bit harder about diving him.

SamakiiAug 10, 20162 votes

He has some obvious weaknesses but overall, like you I think he is very unique and fun to play. Personally I think some things could be solved on him and other mages by offering more of a reason for Mages to want to use the resolve tree. Maybe a keystone that is made more for mages in the resolve tree.

If they do change him I hope its tweaks and not massive re working.

DarkfireAMAug 10, 20162 votes

Aurelion Sol is just fine both gameplay and thematically wise. The people that complain about him being lack-luster just refuse to put enough time and effort into playing him. I'll admit he may not be very suited for competitive play, but that doesn't mean that he isn't a very solid champion. In fact one could say he's fairly too strong with people who put enough time and effort into him reaching over 55% win rates across the board. Sol had very clear (very well implemented IMO) strengths and weaknesses that define how you need to play him in order to succeed. For example you can't just play Zed and expect to be able to solo kill the whole enemy team w/o proper setup and positioning. Trying putting in some more time and effort into the champion besides a couple of games and learn some of the match ups, instead of dismissing the champion as weak, underpowered, and ineffective. I picked him up after his release, and after playing quite a bit decided to take him into ranked to try and climb the ladder. In a short time span of 4 days I was able to climb from Bronze 3 to Silver 5, and while that doesn't seem like much of a milestone, I was able to clock in about a 79% win ratio out of 31 games. I really encourage you to more closely evaluate the champion, or perhaps change your play style, OR possibly even improving positioning. The statistics do show however that Sol is far from being a weak champion!

SiytherAug 10, 20161 votes

he isnt weak but his weakness are to much. yes i think that if u get on him he toast . He is extremly hard to do anything with in the mobilty creep era. I never seen him win a lane in my elo he aways gets face rolled except in arams where he is a god.Few ppl are playing him , i belive that it is because of the mechanics of his orb damage. u literally have to move in weird ways to get ur dps off. Anyone with half a brain can just walk outta range of the majority of ur dps. others champs that have a dps over time abilty simalar to sols like karthus or anivia also dont have most of the damage tied to it because it is so unreliable. If they must keep his damage tied to the orbs they need to feel way more rewarding to land. Either just make them move faster or do more damage. He is so dependant (at least to me) on how bad ur opponent play is.

Z3braAug 10, 20161 votes

One of the main problems I have with Aurelion Sol is that, during a teamfight, any stray CC can knock him out of his W. This, of course, means he is a sitting duck in a teamfight for 5 entire seconds when it comes to dealing any damage and is useless during a time he should be shining the most.

He also REALLY struggles to get going, so that on top of him being so easily hard-countered means if the game is not going well early on he will pretty much famine. His balance relies almost entirely on Rylai's as well, which makes a lot of Aurelion Sol mains worry about if that item gets a nerf/etc since that item is essentially what lets him do anything.

His E also doesn't get enough love unless he is jungling; it is too easy for you to lose all of your E stacks, even to minions iirc. Furthermore, the passive on E that lets you move faster if going in a straight line is also easy to lose/is gained too late, so it only helps when going into lane. It completely fails as any sort of escape mechanism most of the time, which means when "losing" you can't push up and roam safely...which is what Aurelion is all about.

I love how Aurelion Sol plays, so please don't do anything drastic. He just needs to be tuned up a little to where he can be safer on the map when in a "losing" situation and not be accidentally made useless just because somebody knew to "interrupt" him with a minor ability. There are so many little things stacking on top of eachother that are making him less accessible and unfun.

Mara VenièrAug 10, 20161 votes

I see your point but I disagree. Players who put enough time into the champion already have a very very solid winrate on him, so he deosn't need any buff. Plus, the rylai statement: if you check later games of r2ve, a korean challanger aurelion main, he did quite some games skipping it and found quite some success.

I' not saying it's not core, but it's not crucial to make Aurelion work.

I'd love some tuning too, but I'm very scared that then he gets just overpowered and riot has to nerf him into oblivion :c

Z3braAug 10, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chtulhu Awaits,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j1wLKWXq,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2016-08-10T15:46:53.163+0000)

I see your point but I disagree. Players who put enough time into the champion already have a very very solid winrate on him, so he deosn't need any buff. Plus, the rylai statement: if you check later games of r2ve, a korean challanger aurelion main, he did quite some games skipping it and found quite some success.

I' not saying it's not core, but it's not crucial to make Aurelion work.

I'd love some tuning too, but I'm very scared that then he gets just overpowered and riot has to nerf him into oblivion :c

The main point of my post was that he only needs a little, possibly one or two things from my original post or something in a similar genre. He doesn't need everything. All of those are tiny, tiny buffs/help with quality of life. Particularly his E, to make him more accessible. [I play the hell out of Aurelion - I know how broken it could be just to let him instantly re-detonate his Q.]

I love Aurelion Sol to death, but as a business decision him having such a low playrate so soon after release absolutely sucks and I can see why they would want to take a look at him...even if he is gorgeous and unique.

My thought is mostly based on making him less absolutely punishing to try out by taking out some of the tiny things that "keep him down" in a bad situation if other people on his team made mistakes before he could get rolling/if he is way behind via laning phase because his player isn't familiar enough with him yet. Play well, and yeah! He's almost stupid strong. But getting there is not only just difficult; it can be extremely frustrating.

Point-by-point rundown of why this is:

There's an unusual but core passive. Lots of people do not "click" well with this passive.
You have to use the passive well to do well.
If you don't use the passive well, not only do you not do well, you will have low CS and will likely be hugely punished for it because of how many people can get into your "no no zone".
Aurelion Sol is better midgame or lategame depending on build. If the team loses early, your effectiveness is hugely diminished.
Aurelion Sol has extremely hard counter picks (EX: assassins like fizz) that can make playing him in the lane extremely frustrating.
He has huge windows in his kit that people can learn to take advantage of easily if they know what he does. This applies to anyone that has CC.

People will try Aurelion, won't click with his passive initially, get in a losing situation and then have a very difficult struggle/be unable to climb out of it. His successes aren't "instant" as in an ADC facemelting teams once caught up in farm or a Riven/Azir pulling off a sick or flashy play that turns around a teamfight. He can, of course, pull off important/sick plays and melt entire teams, but it is over time and deceptively powerful more than anything. This means his satisfaction is different to other champ and not necessarily what others find to be the most fun. Overall, his playstyle means it hurts more to make a mistake [or get hard countered, which is extremely frustrating/off-putting] than for something he does that "pays off" or succeeds. Repeat a few times and people who are simply "trying him out" just don't want to play the dragon anymore. When all of these little things (on top of the big things that keep him balanced) stack up for people who either aren't determined or don't click with him, I can at least understand why people don't want to work with him. We'll also have to see how he does with the assassin reworks, since that is a huge weakness of his.

But I also don't want huge changes to his kit either, because I do "click" with him and not many other champs, if any. His theme is gorgeous, he is surprisingly versatile with his power spikes/utility, and he is unlike anything else in this game...which shouldn't be overlooked just because of his low play rate.

LuggAug 10, 20161 votes

Personally, I think Sol is one of the best balanced champs in the game. He has clearly defined strengths and weaknesses. Plus he has a very unique playstyle.

EchoezOfRainAug 10, 20161 votes

I honestly think letting him reactivate Q early is all Aurelion needs.

Imagine Aurelion and a zed in mid. When trying to gank a zed, I wait for him to use his Shadow. I know it will be on cooldown and Zed will have to flash to get away. If I don't wait for it, he easily Shadows away to safety. Now If I try to gank Aurelion, as long as I'm able to jump on top of him, he's dead, no escape other than flash. He'd have to waste ult, if anything else. Now if Aurelion's Q could be reactivated, that's his escape. You'd want to have your midlaner bait it out before you go in on him. That's how just about every other champion is. Heck, even Vel'Koz has a way to get people away from him if he gets jumped.