Boards›Gameplay

PSA: Shunpo gets 15% damage reduction, and Death Lotus gets Grievous Wounds

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb··16 votes·1,682 views

Is there a reason for this, or did Riot just decide to give Kat this shit cause why not? Why does she need the damage reduction? To mitigate the risk of her jumping in even though the risk of letting her jump in is higher? Grievous wounds? Idk, I thought I'd just lifesteal through it. Lol jk, 1 AP scaling worth a damage per second.

I mean, shit, despite having 345 base movespeed, she still gets an MS steroid for hitting with her W, on top of the 700 range instant dash that's on a 6 second cooldown.

Honestly, I'm not even going to ask them to nerf the resets, even though that is what rightfully should be hit. They clearly won't. Just the same, why does she get damage reduction, low to literally no cd mobility, and one of the highest bursting combos in the game? Yeah, it can be interrupted.

What do you do as someone without hard cc? You die. For free. You're a free kill. Nothing you can do if kat gets to you. What about when your teammates get greedy when pushing and forget that kat respawned 20s ago? Look, she got a quadra kill with 3 no cd moves and an ult.

Did I mention that all of her basic abilities get less than a 10s cooldown and none of her abilities cost anything to use?

Fuck this champ.

37 Comments

X8ViEhkPS06 votes

Because her previous iteration had an ability that gave her stuff like Grievous wounds on her Q and damage reduction on her E. When she was reworked they just shifted all the stuff her old W gave, put them her other abilities, and made Sinister Steel.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

That was with Killer Instincts activated, yeah? I'd take that over sinister steel. I've seen the shit they do with that little bit of extra burst once everyone is low.

X8ViEhkPS01 votes

Yeah that is the thing.

Also remember post rework it use to be 20% damage reduction for 3 seconds.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb3 votes

I didn't know she had damage reduction. Frankly, I think it's retarded that an assassin should get free tank stats at all.

IcyPepper3 votes

Didn't they remove that from Akali for a reason?

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb2 votes

Yes, but Khazix Rengar still have that as well. Stealth is fine.

IcyPepper1 votes

They don't really mid-lane all that much, which might explain if they get some tankier stats (if that's what you're talking about). I don't really have a problem against stealth, I'm just saying they switched Akali tank stats in her shroud with MS. Probably healthier that way.

The Bearded Bard1 votes

[{quoted}](name=hgjkdlsaf jeldvb,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iw5ffgNB,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-05-16T00:27:42.606+0000)

That was with Killer Instincts activated, yeah? I'd take that over sinister steel. I've seen the shit they do with that little bit of extra burst once everyone is low.

Mmmmmm no, the current version is definitely much better, but also makes her super easy to play, so I guess if you want a more difficult champion you'd take Killer Instincts over Sinister Steel.

Vistha Kai4 votes

Meanwhile somewhere in Ionia: "We nerfed your shield for the 24th time" item 3070 Yasuo item 3070

Reikken2 votes

Silly Vistha. Yasuo doesn't use mana.

Vistha Kai3 votes

Are you implying my Muramana build is bad?! ಠ_ಠ I've seen it in LCS!

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb4 votes

Riven still has her shield. There's another thread for that.

Toothless Lion3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Vistha Kai,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iw5ffgNB,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-05-16T00:16:30.396+0000)

Meanwhile somewhere in Ionia: "We nerfed your shield for the 24th time" item 3070 Yasuo item 3070

It was buffed recently. Hurr.

Vistha Kai3 votes

At the price of 28% bigger down time it's hardly a buff.

Alorasence4 votes

I am a Kat main.

They should remove her damage reduction on E.

And replace it with nothing.

It doesn't belong on her kit.

JustMyBassCannon7 votes

Because assassins don't deserve defensive tools, apparently.

Except for Nidalee, who has a heal. And Talon, who has stealth. Oh, Akali also has stealth. And Leblanc has dashes with return blinks. Then there's Zed and his shadow dancing, not to be confused with Akali's Shadow Dance. Can't forget Evelynn's fucking huge shield and burst of MS that breaks slows.

Katarina has...a single blink, which is also her only means of engaging a fight, so it's not a reliable escape.

I can see Riot removing the %DR, but they would need to change something else and give her a more apparent defense tool.

Alorasence1 votes

All I've said is that "damage reduction doesn't belong on an assassin's kit".

You've extrapolated far too much and put words in my mouth.

JustMyBassCannon5 votes

{quoted}

All I've said is that "damage reduction doesn't belong on an assassin's kit".

No, you actually said "They should remove the DR, and replace it with nothing," which definitely implies more than just, "DR does not belong in an assassin's kit."

{quoted}

They should remove her damage reduction on E.

And replace it with nothing.

It doesn't belong on her kit.

Yes, you have the "Damage reduction doesn't yada yada," but that one line in the middle is implying something else. I made an assumption of what that implication could be, and you believe that I took it too far.

{quoted}

You've extrapolated far too much and put words in my mouth.

Well, what am I supposed to take from that line? "Replace it with nothing." It's the only defensive aspect she has aside from using her one and only engage tool to escape a fight instead. Is it awkwardly implemented? Yeah. Could they do something better? Definitely. So do something better, something more apparent than a tiny bit of DR. Don't just say, "Delete it and don't do anything afterward," because it makes you look like the average, butthurt loser instead of the Kat main you claim to be.

Alorasence1 votes

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/78/78be62f68a84116500dd40052c820fbed5ab2831658d6cd3c0836c110d35a88c.jpg

JustMyBassCannon1 votes

I prefer jackass, but some people see them as interchangeable monikers.

The Bearded Bard1 votes

{quoted}

Katarina has...a single blink, which is also her only means of engaging a fight, so it's not a reliable escape.

Nononono, don't pull this shit. I'm not on either side for this discussion since I both play Kat and hate playing against Kat, but don't say she doesn't have a reliable escape just because it's her only way into a fight. Do you know what her passive does? If you're going into a fight and at least one person isn't dying, you're not playing Kat correctly. The reason she's so awesome is because she goes in, someone dies, and she can either get out again or continue killing.

JustMyBassCannon1 votes

I didn't say she doesn't have a reliable escape. I said she only has one, and it's also used to engage.

Yes, if an assassin goes into a fight and nobody dies, they messed up. It still happens.

The Bearded Bard1 votes

{quoted}

I didn't say she doesn't have a reliable escape. I said she only has one, and it's also used to engage.

Yes, if an assassin goes into a fight and nobody dies, they messed up. It still happens.

Yes, and they should die for it. You shouldn't just be able to go in and make a major mistake like that and not be punished for it.

Abyssphere2 votes

[{quoted}](name=I am Maokai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iw5ffgNB,comment-id=00050000000100000000,timestamp=2015-05-16T23:42:01.457+0000)

Yes, and they should die for it. You shouldn't just be able to go in and make a major mistake like that and not be punished for it.

A lot of assassins don't get punished though. And those who don't generally have defensive tools to help them not die (Diana, Akali, Kat I guess).

Sure, Riot removed the tank stats on Akali's shroud because they weren't right on an assassin but they didn't get rid of her spellvamp, nor have they got rid of Diana's shield. I don't get what's wrong with Shunpo's damage reduction - if any assassin deserves some defenses then it's the only assassin in the game whose damage is tied to a channel.

DanofDemacia2 votes

{quoted}

I am a Kat main.

They should remove her damage reduction on E.

And replace it with nothing.

It doesn't belong on her kit.

Thank you she's an assassin not a tank

A Miss Fortune2 votes

Katarina is a living example of how poor Riot's balancing capability is. She needs to be gutted and at this point I really wouldn't care if she was unviable. People use her as the easy way out because of how easy, reliable, and overpowered she is and I'm not saying they're terrible people but I've even seen streamers who main'ed champions like Katarina to get to Diamond, but were almost immediately demoted when they started playing real skill based champions like Yasuo who are extremely powerful but require skill to play and not just slamming your face into the keyboard over and over and over.

Removing the Mark from her Q, the damage reduction from her E, grevious wounds from ult, and removing the damage from her E would make her balanced I think? She'll still do damage but at least she won't have a bonus to every spell in her ridiculous kit.

The Yetii Rider1 votes

The damage reduction is invisible power, so if Katarina does get that rework that was on the pbe a while back I imagine she'll lose her damage reduction

Abyssphere2 votes

{quoted}

The damage reduction is invisible power, so if Katarina does get that rework that was on the pbe a while back I imagine she'll lose her damage reduction

Umm, I don't know if you know anything about the rework that was mentioned a while back but they buffed her Shunpo to 30% damage reduction in that, and made it so that she had that damage reduction up almost all the time.

Mandang01 votes

It's bc she always used to have it, and she used to have it because it cost her one of her skills. Now she gets it for free and gets another AOE damage spell that gets a movespeed buff thrown on it (hell, why not?).

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb2 votes

go big or go home?

Mandang02 votes

With resets, why not both?

JustMyBassCannon1 votes

Pre-rework, her Grievous Wounds/%DR lasted longer, and all of her spells dealt more damage.

I could see them removing the %DR at some point, when they get around to it.

Malix Farwin1 votes

They took Grievous Woulds from Fizz and Tristana... Why does Kat Still have it?

Nameless Voice1 votes

Those aren't the problems with her kit, though. Taking them out won't change any of her issues.

The issue with Kat is that she has a lot of instant burst on instant-cast spells with decent AP scaling and resets. She can delete someone before they can react, and then continue to do it again, because of that combination of instant-cast skills and resets.

In the laning phase, her kit is fine because it has nuance and counterplay. The problem is that in the mid-late game when she buys AP, people don't have much chance to react to her any more because her burst is instant and offers no counterplay, especially if she's fed and can instantly delete someone with a single QEW combo.

Alorasence1 votes

They need to shift more power onto her ultimate. It is the skill people refer to when they say "just cc her ult".

Lately, she's doing so much damage that her ult is only some of her damage. her qwe has most of their health bar gone instantly. They need the ratios down on qwe and up slightly on her ult. That way your punished for not interupting the ult, but she doesn't insta burst with just qwe.

Desiderium1 votes

I would have been against removing her shunpo's tank steroid and her ult's grievous wounds before they added the 1 sec delay on Zed's r-back.

But if you can break such an intrinsic piece of a champion's gameplay like that

........then I am 100% positive Katarina wouldn't mind losing either of those things at this point

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