there is no real advantage on upgrading sightstone

DoFr·Feb 6, 2015·105 votes·6,064 views

can we have 3 pathes? like AP, and Health with a pit of armor, and cooldown reduciton, or gold per x seconds?

you know, 1 for each type, AP supports and Tank supports and mobility supports

or, give us a pink ward after every 2 normal wards we place when it's upgraded.

normally when i play support, i'm too squishie, and im not supposed to get caught, so there's no real sense in having extra health on support, unless you're leona or something, AND even with leona there are still more important things to get than to upgrade ss

86 Comments

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20156 votes

From a guy who plays a lot of support,here are some ideas to improve item 2049 & item 2045 .Other people probably suggested some of these before.

Allow us to place an extra green or pink ward once we upgraded them.Having 4 green wards or 2 pink wards on the map at a time.
Like the jungle items,give us enchantment options.A defensive enhanctment that give us Armor &/or MR (not a decent amount,more defense is never too broken).An offensive enchantment that gives us AD or AP (not a lot,don't want everyone buying this.Maybe something small like 2% increased damage or +10 ad/ap).An utility based enchantment that gives.....uh........IDK.
How about a sightstone that builds out of ?For the more squishy but mana heavy supports.
How about giving ruby stone some sort of useful passive?Like you can see farther or your wards have increased range.

ProfirixFeb 8, 20151 votes

Inb4 "Sapphire Sightstone"

Kitten of EvilFeb 7, 20154 votes

Maybe if you had Ruby Sightstone you could place 4 wards instead of 3? That might make it worthwhile.

The PaulrusFeb 6, 20153 votes

I had a pretty extensive post to this effect...feel free to take a look.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/sdfAsrN4-how-to-improve-sightstones-usefulness-and-make-it-a-better-support-item

Wînter FoxFeb 6, 20153 votes

They need to do this. I completely forgot the red one even existed.

MrBuffingtonFeb 7, 20153 votes

You also have to consider whether other champions will be buying this, like Lee Sin or Nunu.

KidKaiserFeb 7, 201519 votes

Riot made it so laners can't get jungle smite upgrades/items. why not just deny smite users access to sightstone ?!

assuming sightstone is going to prove itself to be an annoyance on said junglers.

WolfBVFeb 7, 201515 votes

"Deny smite users access to Sightstone." LeeSin Just got Rekt.

HawkefireFeb 7, 20154 votes

And hence the reason it will never happen, with Lee Sin being Riots favored son.

Magma Lux MidFeb 7, 20151 votes

If there was an AP or CDR upgrade, I would be buying it on my mids as well. I'm already considering getting sightstone anyways so I always have wards (4th or 5th item).

Hyrum GraffFeb 8, 20151 votes

After the next patch, you won't feel this way -- upgraded yellow trinket will become a sightstone.

(ok, not quite: two ward charges on a 60s cooldown. But it's still enough vision, most of the time.)

pockettmouseFeb 7, 20156 votes

How about denying an upgrade to sightstone if they already have another upgradeable item (ex. jungle item with enchant)

GundayMondayFeb 8, 20153 votes

How about you need a support item item 3301 item 3302 item 3303 to upgrade sightstone?

TheFrozenIslesFeb 9, 20152 votes

I have love this idea for so long. You are all was going to get this two items. So why not just make them one item?

exiledFromBadmenFeb 7, 20152 votes

What? When I play a supportive tank jungler (e.g Sejuani) I sometimes buy Sightstone to ward enemy jungle.

LeeDarkFeb 7, 20151 votes

Which is preventing supports from having a sightstone that is actually worth something. Just buy wards instead.

KijinxFeb 7, 20155 votes

well, idk about you, but to me 6 wards seems still not enough to cover the whole map. So two people can have sightstone and co-exist peacefully.

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20151 votes

Um,I've seen pro games where the jg & sup have a sightstone.How the hell is less vision worth? "Oh just buy wards"Why buy wards when I can get them for free? A jg having a sightstone doesn't prevent anything except ganks.

LeeDarkFeb 7, 20151 votes

A jungle having sightstone is what is preventing supports from being able to upgrade sightstone into having decent stats.

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20151 votes

A jungle having sightstone is what is preventing supports from being able to upgrade sightstone into having decent stats..........Yeah,I had to retype that whole thing to make sure I'm actually reading this right.

After retyping & rereading it,I find that whole statement completely invalid. 1 - Let me reiterate:A jungler having SS won't prevent supports from upgrading their own SS. 2 - No one buys SS for the stats.They buy it for the free wards. 3 - The only "decent stats" the Ruby SS gives is more health,which is useless on half of the support roster.More health on Annie or Nami doesn't mean crap.More health on JarvanIV or LeeSin is useful. 4 - Like I said,in the the pro Esports players do this often.BOTH the support & the jungler do this often.If the challenger level players can do it,why shouldn't we?

LeeDarkFeb 7, 20151 votes

The strength of a CDR/AP/AD or whatever stats that could be added to an upgraded Sightstone being too strong on junglers early on is what is preventing that buff to Sightstone on supports from being implemented. It seems like you are really bad at reading the OP.
And they lament the fact that it provides nothing but health. Thus this ENTIRE THREAD, moron.
That's why this ENTIRE THREAD is about buffing upgraded Sightstone to have different build paths to provide supports better stats. L2Read, moron.
Again... MORON, since you've more than earned that appellation by now, this ENTIRE THREAD is about changing the upgraded Sightstone.

If you are too stupid to read the OP and actually talk about what the thread is about, then you are too stupid for me to bother responding after this.

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20152 votes

Dude,I'm responding to your comment.I already made my response to the thread.

Sheesh,no need to be so salty.

aaronconlinFeb 7, 20151 votes

Well, laners technically CAN get smite and jungler items, but usually don't. The only jungler than really uses sight stone often is Lee Sin, and Riot won't do anything to harm him

Hyrum GraffFeb 8, 20151 votes

Or just make jungle items be considered gold items (after all, they do give bonus gold on camp kill), so if you build a jungle item you can't also build a SS at the same time -- but if you want to sell your jg item later for a SS, that's fine.

JC DarkOmenFeb 8, 20151 votes

but sightstone isnt a gold income item. that would solve nothing

Hyrum GraffFeb 8, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=JC Da Beast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hy0jzjmk,comment-id=0007000000060000,timestamp=2015-02-08T07:43:04.755+0000)

but sightstone isnt a gold income item.

It is a gold item, of sorts, though. Each time you place a ward, you're getting 75 gold worth of vision, for free.

If you were buying wards instead, you'd have spent that money on them, but with a SS you can spend it on combat stats instead.

that would solve nothing

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here, so I'm just going to explain why I said what I said.

I was replying to a post that suggested, if SS upgrades became a problem on certain junglers, you could prevent anyone with smite from buying a SS. I was suggesting what I believe is a a more elegant solution to that potential problem.

JC DarkOmenFeb 8, 20151 votes

I'm saying that if we made jungle items gold income items, it wouldn't solve the problem of keeping junglers from buying sightstones because sightstone isn't a gold income item. therefore, if jungle items were gold income items, junglers would still be able to buy sightstones. your change doesn't affect the problem

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20153 votes

What if there's a jg enchantment that is basically a jg version of sightstone.Meaning that junglers have to choose between this enchant & the others. And if you have item 1039 then you can't build a sightstone as well.Or you can't have sightstone & this SS jg item at the same time.

They can still by wards though.

MrSexyHoboFeb 7, 20153 votes

the point is to get some slot efficiency out of sight stone once you are full build. if you upgrade it before your last item your doing something very wrong

GorzkeFeb 7, 20153 votes

Well, it gives 400 Health. item 2045 is probably the most slot-efficient item in the game. It takes your ward slot with the max number of them allowed (5 at a time), which recharges free wards every time you back, and on top of it you get a item 1011 .

So if we count it cost as 600 (1600 - 1000), it would need 8 Wards to be cost effective, and after that it just gives you free wards. It's a good item. For the Pink Ward idea, item 3362 becomes cost effective at the 2nd Pink Ward you place, use it.

Snd for the different item for supports, there are already different build-paths and items which fill the need of yours and your team.

DeadlyQuestionFeb 8, 20151 votes

This.

Any champion you build sight stone for that you also build with high health benefits from upgrading sight stone. Maybe you consider it a luxury item, fine. Upgrading your trinket and boots can be considered that too. So upgrade sightstone later when you can spare the gold. +400 health isn't anything to shake a stick at. #stewiejustsaidthat

Envy SinFeb 7, 20152 votes

They wouldn't want a support item to be good enough for anyone else to buy. Won't happen.

Maestro80Feb 7, 20152 votes

This same thread comes up at least once a week, and probably has since there's been a sightstone. I'd love to see a Rioter actually post (for once) and tell us whether there's a snowball's chance in hell they'll ever follow any of the suggestions in these threads.

delonixFeb 7, 20152 votes

I like ruby sightstone the way it is. Not only does it give health, it allows you to stay away from base longer without running out of wards.

If you want supports to be stronger, why not just ask for buffs on the support items? They've already been designed so that they aren't optimal for people in solo lanes or in the jungle.

AetherKingdomFeb 7, 20152 votes

250 more health is an advantage.

Jesus is SaviorFeb 7, 20152 votes

The advantage to upgrading is you can place 3 wards, wait for them to run out, and then place 3 more wards before needing to back, keeping your vision optimized if you're in extended sieges where you can't go back to base to recharge your stone.

And that's about it.

toxıc sIutFeb 7, 20152 votes

Blue sightstone is already the most gold efficient item in the game when bought early. The second one is there to provide some sort of stat, so come lategame it's not a wasted slot. However, giving Ruby Sightstone a passive that lets you place 1 more vision or sight ward would make it much worth it. Why pay 800 gold more when you already have an item that does the same thing?

JC DarkOmenFeb 7, 20152 votes

Dude, I was just talking about this the other day. If I'm playing a support game, I'd upgrade my trinket and boots and sell my income item to buy a more useful item before I even consider upgrading Sighstone.

That being said, not everything needs to be diversified. Sight, when coupled with map awareness (freakin blind bronzies) is one of the most powerful mechanics in the game. To keep this item balanced (and to make sure non-supports don't take advantage of it LeeSin ) you'd have to have values so small it's not even worth it. What I'd suggest instead of stat changes is giving you the extra ward and allowing you to place up to four invisible wards and two visible wards. How often as a support do you think "we need vision right here" then go to place a ward but you see you already have 3 down in other strategic locations? This would be a game changing, but not game breaking, improvement to the support role, which I feel can still use some love.

side bar- What's the point in giving supports gold income items if they still don't make nearly as much money as anyone else? Especially those taking the item 3401 route, as they're just tanks; 4 creeps and another every 30 seconds is almost nothing, and if you're losing lane too hard you can't even take advantage of this. How about doubling the number of creeps you can take and halving the health and mana given?

ChrisB5Feb 8, 20152 votes

Um... you are very wrong. First there's the health boost, but you also get additional charges. So if you're out longer, it's an advantage, even if it may be a small one. It's one of my last upgrades, but it's there. And also, upgrade your trinket to a pink ward, since you get normal wards with your sight stone. Whenever I go pink ward, I usually have a new one by the time my old one is destroyed or I need to replace it. The cooldown is incredibly low if you place/defend them well, which I hope Riot doesn't change.

JC DarkOmenFeb 8, 20152 votes

but most supps sell vision totem for sweeper after buying sightstone, because junglers stopped buying sweepers after Flare and SotAG were taken out.

ChrisB5Feb 8, 20151 votes

Okay fair enough, I've noticed this as well. I guess I haven't really been playing support too much (I try to play top/mid most games).

Irelia BotFeb 8, 20152 votes

Make ruby sightstone increase the max number of stealth wards you can have out from 3 to 4.

There now it has a reason to be bought sometimes.

TeemoJenkinsFeb 6, 20151 votes

I still buy the red, regardless of what support I have so I have the higher quantity and moar HP's. But I completely agree that diversity here would make support less of a vision master and more of a participant in fights.

Champion SkinFeb 6, 20151 votes

Even on Soraka?

Duke AnaxFeb 6, 20151 votes

Especially on Soraka, Otherwise I tend to run out of room to heal myself any more.

Champion SkinFeb 7, 20152 votes

Soraka loses more HP from healing with W the more HP she has? And well the amount she heals herself from Q is based on AP so wouldn't it be better to rather get AP or mana so you can either use more Q's or heal yourself more per Q you land?

NubeelFeb 9, 20151 votes

Her W has a flat cost but the heal amount is dependent on your AP. So more AP = more bang for your buck.

You can build resistances but if you have 10 hp left because you healed your nearly dead team no amount of armor or MR will help you.

Champion SkinFeb 9, 20151 votes

Her W costs 10% of max health so the more HP you have (from base stats and levels or items) the higher the health cost so it isn't really a flat cost...

And AP also heals you more for each Q you land on enemy champion(s)

NubeelFeb 9, 20151 votes

What I meant was it's a flat 10%. A flat unchanging cost.