Swain was nerfed because he had long duration cc level 1 and synergized well with a mastery

IAMS4T4N·Jan 31, 2016·44 votes·2,586 views

and a high win rate

i wonder who that sounds like

86 Comments

KhaZix BotJan 31, 20169 votes

To be honest they're both pretty anti-fun. They're lazy mages, but Swain was a lazier mage. Lux can actually be fixed really easily, but I doubt it's going to happen.

Lux started getting out of control when it was decided that mages needed "equality" despite being different champions with different skillsets. A while back Riot decided to let her pop her singularity without it having traveled its full distance. Now it is virtually undodgable without a gap closer. If Lux even has half a brain, she can not miss that ability. After that, she gets a free bonus damage proc because you're slowed and there's no way you can leave her auto range in time.

I'll take the time to add that any champion that "builds Majai's because they don't die" is toxic to the game. There should be no champions with that low of a risk. However, it wouldn't matter as much if her singularity actually had counter play.

charcharmunroFeb 1, 20166 votes

I remember going "Hey, I wanna play Karthus." And then the enemy laner was Lux. I've never had so little fun in a game. I mean... One of my single-target Qs did LESS damage to her than one of her nigh-undodgeable Es. Lux is just... So annoyingly safe. I get that safe poke is her thing, but when the high risk, high reward item is recommended, isn't SOMETHING wrong?

Left Hook LarryFeb 2, 20162 votes

So you picked Karthus (known as a weak laner) into something that does well against him and get shit on, then come here to complain?

No wonder the majority of the community is silver and below. Pick any champ with a gap closer and you'll see how safe Lux exactly is

charcharmunroFeb 2, 20161 votes

I picked Karthus first. They decided to play Lux instead of a match-up that wasn't a total stomp. But the thing is, Lux has ONE "bad" match-up in the midlane, assuming roughly equal skill, and that's Galio.

Left Hook LarryFeb 4, 20162 votes

I picked Karthus first.

This isn't an excuse. If you pick Karthus first you should be expecting a bad matchup and you were lucky it was only lux and not a Zed or Leblanc.

Lux has ONE "bad" match-up in the midlane, assuming roughly equal skill, and that's Galio.

Um what? Have you ever played Lux in your life? She gets absolutely shit on by any assassin in lane

KhaZix BotFeb 5, 20161 votes

As a Kha'Zix main and platinum before reset (so not the bronze mage stereotype), I'm gonna say no. There was a time where Lux got trashed by assassins in lane. That's over and you know it. Lux losing to Zed isn't a legitimate argument when Zed is just as toxic as she is.

I won't even grant Lux's E the validity of being labeled a skill shot. It isn't. Skill shots can be missed. Back when she couldn't pop it early and had to make hard decisions about timing and leading it into her target, she was perfectly fair. Now you can not dodge it without a cap closer or insane movement speed.

As someone who spent hours on end practicing to dodge Brand's pillar of flame when he was popular (probably second in BS abilities), I can say that the two don't even compare, and that one doesn't even fly at you. That buff was unnecessary and a prime example of a group of players pushing for a change they had no place asking for. You, me, and everyone who plays Lux knows that to be true.

Beyond that, she has to make a catastrophic mistake to die in lane, as she usually has her double shield, barrier, an undodgable slow, a snare with a questionable hitbox, and flash. Where is the risk in that champion? Where is the weakness? She builds Majai's, she has one of the laziest lanes and play styles in the game (no, skill shots don't make "hang back and shoot shit at them" interesting), and there's just nothing redeeming about her.

Oh, wait, there is one thing. Maybe if she's really bad she'll face check a bush and you can pop her before she can shie- whoops, Zhonya's, nevermind.

Yeah, nothing at all.

Left Hook LarryFeb 5, 20161 votes

You finished gold before the reset so I don't wtf you're on about being plat before reset.

Lux losing to Zed isn't a legitimate argument when Zed is just as toxic as she is.

Zed is cancerous now too? You're one of those people who wastes a ban on him right? Lmfao. Why don't we nerf all the mid laners. Ahri, Zed, Ori, etc.

I won't even grant Lux's E the validity of being labeled a skill shot. It isn't. Skill shots can be missed.

Except just because it's hard for silvers to dodge it doesn't automatically make it not a skill shot. It is a skill shot by definition and it CAN be missed.

That buff was unnecessary and a prime example of a group of players pushing for a change they had no place asking for. You, me, and everyone who plays Lux knows that to be true.

Buff was unnecessary, but that's not the point of this convo

Beyond that, she has to make a catastrophic mistake to die in lane

As does Anivia with her 2 lives. As does Ahri with her free movement speed buff/3 dash ult. As do Lulu, Vlad, Kennen.

These are all mages that will die if they misposition just like Lux, but you will have a hard time killing them otherwise. It's just how those champs work.

Oh, wait, there is one thing. Maybe if she's really bad she'll face check a bush and you can pop her before she can shie- whoops, Zhonya's,

Zhonya's keeps her in that place anyways, so if you catch her out like that and she Zhonya's it shouldn't affect much.

Only people who complain about Lux are low elo baddies

KhaZix BotFeb 5, 20161 votes

Only people who complain about Lux are low elo baddies

^ This was the first thing I saw and I'm not even going to validate it with a response. You're right, Zed isn't cancer.

Your attitude is.

Left Hook LarryFeb 6, 20161 votes

It's the truth though LOL. Low gold players who can't dodge a skillshot are the ones who suffer against Lux.

Seriously, Ahri does the same thing with 3 dashes and no one complains about her?

Stay bad

Blumpkin NationFeb 4, 20161 votes

...You don't trade with Lux in lane if you're not getting her solo with your Q's. Especially as Karthus. But you own her late game when you can catch her and just spam your spells because she blew her cds.

Blumpkin NationFeb 4, 20161 votes

I mean, what's the point of Mejai's if you can't stay alive to utilize it then? It might as well be removed from the game if you think someone who uses it shouldn't be that safe.

KhaZix BotFeb 5, 20161 votes

Actually, no, that isn't the point of Majai's. Building that item is supposed to be an enormous risk. A tradeoff so big that you making a few mistakes could end the game. That is what Majai's is supposed to be and Riot has touched on this every time they do anything to Majai's. It isn't supposed to be a free disgusting amount of AP for lazy poke mages. It's supposed to be a risk for extremely skilled players to decide whether they want to take or not.

LaughingStaplerJan 31, 20169 votes

Swain's permabanned in LCS so obviously they nerf such clearly OP champs. like Karthus and Swain.

ArybusFeb 1, 20161 votes

...What? When have never perma-banned a champion because they're "OP". That destroys the integrity of a competitive game. IDK where you got your information from.

Only Play DariusFeb 1, 20166 votes

But Lux has no sustain and is easy to kill throughout the game

3TWarriorFeb 1, 20163 votes

only if you are Rengar, Twitch, another lux, a flash abuser and it's hard to think of anyone else that can outdo her viability

she can root two champions at once from long range and has an area of effect deterring spell that slows both while in its effect and if hit by it

finally, she has a shield that shields twice and can hit multiple targets

her mana use is atrocious, sure, but once she has any to use, she can just annihilate a set target

Shadow SavageFeb 1, 20163 votes

Zed.

charcharmunroFeb 1, 20163 votes

If she's laning against Zed, he'll never get to her, unless he blows absolutely everything.

Shadow SavageFeb 1, 20163 votes

Not true. Just played against lux as zed today, went 4-0 in lane. Your WQ has about the range of a xerath Q.

Only Play DariusFeb 1, 20162 votes

Yasuo works quite well too

Eunbi BiasFeb 2, 20161 votes

{quoted}

only if you are Rengar, Twitch, another lux, a flash abuser and it's hard to think of anyone else that can outdo her viability

she can root two champions at once from long range and has an area of effect deterring spell that slows both while in its effect and if hit by it

finally, she has a shield that shields twice and can hit multiple targets

her mana use is atrocious, sure, but once she has any to use, she can just annihilate a set target

Kha. Quinn. Kindred. I'm just naming off of from what I can to to beat up on Luxes

KhaZix BotFeb 5, 20161 votes

For a Kha'Zix to beat Lux, the skill gap needs to be obvious. Otherwise, he'll need enough jungle pressure to put PETA to shame. That is a garbage matchup. You need to burn leap, your only engage until six, just to dodge her singularity. After that, you aren't dodging it if she has a couple brain cells.

She farms just fine under tower and can wave clear from fairly far away, so after six, you're never going to kill a Lux in lane that has any idea how to play this game. My best strategy for killing Lux during lane phase is to fake a roam and hope she's dumb enough to walk through jungle without vision (which she'll usually have a free ward for).

That matchup was fine until they caved to the river of tears and made singularity the biggest joke of a "skill shot" in the game. Now it's one of the worse Kha'Zix vs mage matchups in the game.

You want to know what a real, intesting to play against, non rage inducing mage looks like? Vel'Koz, Xerath, Karthus. Notice the pattern? You can actually dodge their abilities. Incredible! Who would have thought?! It's almost like "disgustingly safe mage with handicaps all over her kit" is not interesting design.

Sire HippingtonFeb 1, 20164 votes

easy to kill? that surely explains why she has the 3ed lowest deaths midlane, only anivia and zilean have less and they have revive mechanics.

Only Play DariusFeb 1, 20161 votes

Well Anivia/Zil have less counterplay when it comes to killing them. A good Anivia will time her wall perfectly to block you off and the egg is pretty durable if she built remotely tanky. Chronoshift is essentially 7 seconds of "you can't kill me" because if you do then he goes untargetable for a few seconds then gets healed to 100%, which is often much worse than just letting him escape

With Lux, if you outplay her skillshots and reach het she gets instagibbed, no way out aside from Hourglass, which is abused much harder by many other champions

Sire HippingtonFeb 1, 20162 votes

if you outplay her skillshots and reach het she gets instagibbed

Just that few champs can reach her after she burns the skillshots, as she will be still at ~1k range, and if your alone on her you won't instagib her unless your a fed assasins. With her shield, she has more effective hp than diana and her shield.

Left Hook LarryFeb 2, 20161 votes

The reason her death count is low is because the only people who play her are people who main mages and know how to position themselves correctly.

No one goes Lux when they want to play a mid lane mage. Everyone goes Ori

Sire HippingtonFeb 2, 20163 votes

yea, sure, that's why lux has more than twice the pickrate as ori atm...

IAMS4T4NFeb 2, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=Savage Bear,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hlEVM1UP,comment-id=000600010001,timestamp=2016-02-02T00:41:41.984+0000)

The reason her death count is low is because the only people who play her are people who main mages and know how to position themselves correctly.

No one goes Lux when they want to play a mid lane mage. Everyone goes Ori

Lux's pick rate is ~20% and Ori's is ~5%, so none of that made sense lol

CatSithJan 31, 20164 votes

You can't compare lux's binding vs swain lol. His is a long range aoe root, her's is two target root in a straight line.

IAMS4T4NJan 31, 201622 votes

{quoted}

You can't compare lux's binding vs swain lol. His is a long range aoe root, her's is two target root in a straight line.

Lux: Range: 1175 Swain: Range: 900

??????????????????

WoonStruckJan 31, 201615 votes

{quoted}

You can't compare lux's binding vs swain lol. His is a long range aoe root, her's is two target root in a straight line.

You're right. Its worse because her range and harass early are cancer.

TroiannJan 31, 201625 votes

His W is long range?

I hate playing against swain but come on that's fucking bullshit.

CatSithFeb 1, 20162 votes

900 range isn't long range? is that the new melee?

HeadHonchkrowFeb 1, 20167 votes

Lux's Q range is 1175

A Miss FortuneFeb 1, 20169 votes

It's more like 11,750 range with that broken hitbox.

CatSithFeb 1, 20162 votes

Is hers a huge AOE? no. 2 different types of bindings. You cant compare them.

HeadHonchkrowFeb 2, 20161 votes

Still long-duration cc

ShonjlFeb 1, 20164 votes

Hey look, another Lux cry thread.

Diana Hmmm Zed I Yasuo wonder Talon who Leblanc can Ahri beat TahmKench her Morgana

Surely none Xerath of Velkoz these Malzahar can.

But really, any Assassin can murder her, some have similar kits that just do better, and others just downright nullify her (Can't root Morg shield, can't root Ahri's mobility, can't stop Tahm's pure tankiness and damage.)

Rain NTFeb 1, 20165 votes

lol you said Zed can beat her when Lux has a easier time beating Zed than the other way around, look at this 1-5 Lux can outdamage Zed with AA harass, E and passive proc which is easy thunderlords, and she can guarantee hit her E because Zed has to farm or he will miss 2 or 3 cs per wave if he choses to farm with Q only and he will definitely be punished under turret if he goes for cs. Second, if Zed try to go into melee range and trade with her Lux has 2 shield (one coming out and one coming back to her) and she can have an easier time landing her Q. If she land her Q at 6, Zed is dead most of the time or chucked so hard he has to go back to base. If Zed ults her, like I said she has 2 shields which she can put two point into to really negate Zed damage. I never pick Zed into Lux, if another go Kass into her and its way easier.

Left Hook LarryFeb 2, 20161 votes

Once Zed is level 6 all he has to do is land one combo on her in lane and go all in with an R and she's dead.

He can also dodge every skillshot from her with his r

Rain NTFeb 2, 20161 votes

Youre facing bad lux, good lux dont use her Q or W(shield) until Zed R onto her, and only harass with E. And her shield is enough to keep her alive (mostly if she runs barrier mid as well). And her E max will harass you out of lane, and if you R in and try to land a combo without trying to dodge, you'll die if you get caught within her Q.

Left Hook LarryFeb 4, 20161 votes

Zed will never R onto you when you're full Hp. He will poke you with w and then all in. All he has to do is land one poke combo and nothing with save you if you're lux.

Yeah I'm playing against bad Lux's in my elo and you play against all the good ones who happened to be in gold right

Rain NTFeb 6, 20161 votes

Lol youre talking to someone who was one game from diamond last season, and yes you are facing bad lux. And btw Zed cant outpoke Lux so even if he all in, hes gonna go all in with 1/3 hp. If he doesnt choice to all in he will have to back every single time.

And his Q is WAY easier to dodge than Lux E and not to mention Lux can AA to proc her passive and not to mention thunderlord. A good lux can easily dodge the small width Q Zed throws out unlike Zed who has to melee to farm efficiently and the range and aoe of Lux E is big enough so that Zed cant dodge it without using his W.

So all in all Lux>Zed.

Left Hook LarryFeb 6, 20161 votes

Lol youre talking to someone who was one game from diamond last season

Finished plat 5 40 lp. Really hope you weren't 1 game away from diamond and dropped that hard because it only makes you look bad

Honestly there's no reason to argue with garbage. Especially one that honestly believes that Zed gets shit on by Lux LOLL

FeathermaneFeb 1, 20163 votes

Yeah, but Lux doesn't go top and bother all those nice champions like Fiora, GP, Jax, Riven etc who never hurt anyone themselves.

WoonStruckJan 31, 20162 votes

Is it Graves ?

Very Epic GuyFeb 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Is it ?

No, I think it's Karma .

OverpoweredSoapFeb 1, 20162 votes

Don't those two champions serve different purposes?

JbirdsandoFeb 1, 20162 votes

Swain has such an annoying kit it was a good idea to force him to level w in order to increase the cc length. Comparing him to other champions with cc is a stupid idea because Riot doesn't balance every champion, so you can't really ever know what the definition of balanced is. Also, other champions with cc have different ranges, different damage, and different speeds, etc.