I'm fed up of having to invest thousands of IP just for a few runes, I have to spend 3690 for 9 410ip runes (The most used ones). That means if I wanted a full set without quints I would need 11070 IP, including quints (1025, the good ones) that's 14145 ip. That's ridiculous. With that I could buy 2 6300ip champs.
And this still doesn't account the fact you need more than just 1 page, some of them with completely different runes.
Doktor X31 votesOn a related note, I find that new players I try to get into this game get frustrated not having runes and feel stretched between buying runes and champions.
What if Riot gave you a free rune every time you leveled up? When you level up and unlock a seal slot (yellow), then they give you a tier 3 armor seal. I'd suggest: Marks (red): Flat AD Seals (yellow): Flat Armor Glyphs (blue): Flat MR Quints (?): Flat health
At least that way, everyone has at least one full rune page at level 30. If you want to specialize, then you have to pay. For those of us already level 30, then you get the runes free or equivalent IP (at your discretion? if you already own these specific runes?).
Arguably, if I love playing mages, then AD Marks aren't very great. Hybrid Penetration Marks are more general. But I'm not sure if Riot would go for giving out Hybrid Pen Marks: I suspect that's a big IP sink for them.
P.S. You can equip Tier 3 runes as a summoner less than level 20, you just can't buy them. At least, that was my experience when the Digital Collector's Pack came with Tier 3 runes.
Aych Pii4 votesThis would be amazing. Everyone would have access to a basic rune page, but if you wanted to specialize more you could spend IP to have that option. I think this is the way it should really work.
TheRakkun5 votesWhat does Riot care about IP Sinks? People don't buy IP.
MrEly2 votesNot entirely true. There is the option to buy IP boosters for RP. I know Ive been tempted before.
Aurelius Maximus3 votesInfinite crisis does something similar. when you level up you get a choice between 3
Dr Poro4 votesPick one: marks: flat AS, flat AD, magic pen Seals: flat Armor, flat health (or scaling?), gold/10 Glyphs: flat Mres, AP, CDR (or mana regen?) Quints: AD/AP/MS (there are too many possiblities tbh, but I guess this covers the majority)
cshakes1 votesMana regen seals are better than mana regen glyphs.
Centaur5004 votesI love this idea, runes are a pain to save up for but what about the being level 10 to buy tier 2 runes, and level 20 to buy tier 3 runes? (Just because any rune below tier three is useless) And for say every time you leveled up you get a ticket or something or another way to pay for runes, so you could save your tickets until you are level 20 to buy the good runes?
Saminus Maximus3 votes[{quoted}](name=Doktor X,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dQQ2pyAI,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-05-10T01:52:08.216+0000)
On a related note, I find that new players I try to get into this game get frustrated not having runes and feel stretched between buying runes and champions.
Its da truth. Hard to get anybody into actually playing the game when they're playing at a disadvantage for their first 365 games (The average amount it takes to get to level 30 which is needed to unlock all the rune slots and mastery points) If your system requires 182 hours of play time (With an average game length of 30 mins) to be on an even playing field with everyone else your system is pretty fucked. Especially compared to the closes competitor in dota.
Rootworth11 votesYou're just too lazy to play the game and earn the paper, brah.
Oddysseas5 votesOr he has a life and choses to only play 1-2 maybe 3 games a day. Which is how much time maximum people should spent on video games. Apart from that, even for people who play more than that it takes too long, did i mention SMURFS, yes people have smurfs and this shit takes forever to do and buy runes for, unless you make a smurf to play two seasons later...
T RexHasTinyArms6 votesUmmmmm......... smurfs having less shit is fine. Smurfs are generally for having an account that is lower mmr than your main, so not having as many options balances out that you are playing against weaker players than you usually do, and I don't really think we should make it easier to beat up on people below you (but maybe that's just me).
Also if you play 2 games a day holy shit you you get about 200 for a win (which you should hit one a day, you can play a 15 minute bot game on easy if you don't get one in your one or two games), and like 60-80 for what ever you get on the second. Even if we assume the low number of 250 a day for IP that way (which means over two games you only need 50 points each game since you get 150 free for fwotd), then you're making 1750 IP a week (1k w/ 3 days of no games). That takes a while, but that's also for a FULL page, you can add 9 of any one thing in like 2-3 weeks which isn't great but isn't the worst.
If we assume a more ridiculous 3 games a day you should be getting 300-350 IP consistently w/out any problem. That's 2100-2450 IP a week. In a month that's 8400-9800 IP. Suddenly you're adding stuff really fast (think about it, there are generally months and months between champ releases, so you have time).
It is definitely a grind, but considering you only need 16 champs for ranked and 2-3 rune pages will generally cover everything you need (to a minimum at least, it's not the worst thing ever. Personally I use the same two pages for 90% of my games (early ap vs scaling ap based on if I have kill pressure early), I rotate other stuff sometimes, but honestly I'm just lazy and forget to switch it a lot bc a good general page does what I need for the most part, and I stopped playing most of the champs I wanted a really specific page for.
MVDuneCats9 votesI'm fed up of having to invest thousands of IP just for a few runes, I have to spend 3690 for 9 410ip runes (The most used ones). That means if I wanted a full set without quints I would need 11070 IP, including quints (1025, the good ones) that's 14145 ip. That's ridiculous. With that I could buy 2 6300ip champs.
The situation isn't as bad as you're making it out to be. Many of the Runes you would want are useful for multiple champions, so it's not like you're having to pay 14k IP for a set of Runes for each and every champion you have.
Shield Villain2 votesGiven I bought Akali for 4800 IP, and now I have to buy Hybrid Penetration marks for 7380 Ip, no, it's not over exagerated. It costs more to have runes than to get a champion. Why do 9 marks cost more than a new champion? I know it's only 80 IP more than a newly released champion, but it's still a lot for someone who hasn't been playing long.
I've been playing roughly a year now and I still don't have all the champions I want, let a lot a lot of runes. I actually had to go out of my way to buy some champions with RP since I really wanted them but had to buy Runes instead. It's not entirely fair.
Everyone I've referred to play has stopped playing because of this. Champions cost too much, and Runes don't make it any easier. Not to mention you have to get to Lv 30 to make full use of masteries. From the beginning you're set to Shit Tier, and have to dedicate time into getting anywhere near decent/full content experience.
It's bad enough the game makes you invest time to learn the different champions, mechanics, and even find the champions/play style that fit you best. But to ask you spend even more time, simply so you won't have to pay real money for content, is just ridiculous.
MVDuneCats1 votesGiven I bought Akali for 4800 IP, and now I have to buy Hybrid Penetration marks for 7380 Ip, no, it's not over exagerated. It costs more to have runes than to get a champion. Why do 9 marks cost more than a new champion?
Why is it a problem for 9 runes to cost more than 1 champion? You don't have to have all 9 immediately. You can slowly get them one at a time. And since you can use those runes on other champions, I don't see why the cost comparison is even being made.
Loken Stoneheart2 votesWhy is it a problem for 9 runes to cost more than 1 champion? You don't have to have all 9 immediately. You can slowly get them one at a time. And since you can use those runes on other champions, I don't see why the cost comparison is even being made.
Because you can't play any champion well without runes. And at 14k for a runepage for your choice of either AD or AP, you can't play any champion well until you could have otherwise bought 2 full price champions.
AirRaid19882 votesJust because you cant play a champ well is no reason to whine.
Shadow Gilgamesh3 votesThey did it with tier 1 and 2, they really should with 3.
Rank 3 stuff should probably be half what it is now... or at the very least get rid of 820 runes, those are god damn offensive.
All Skillzz2 votes[{quoted}](name=Shadow Gilgamesh,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dQQ2pyAI,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2015-05-10T04:28:20.171+0000)
They did it with tier 1 and 2, they really should with 3.
Rank 3 stuff should probably be half what it is now... or at the very least get rid of 820 runes, those are god damn offensive.
i own all the 820 runes that matter like cdr and stuff. but i stick to few champions instead of owning tons.
Solaxo3 votesThere's no other moba that forces you to buy some crappy runes. Riot MUST make them free
Kapppaccino4 votesThere's no other moba that forces you to buy some crappy runes. Riot MUST make them free
Riot doesn't have to do that, my good lad. Riot does whatever they want.
Perigrin Took1 votesSolaxo (EUNE) - about 7 hours ago
There's no other moba that forces you to buy some crappy runes. Riot MUST make them free
Not cause others do it that Riot got to do the EXACT same thing as other... I am okay with reducing a very little but the price, but i don't see the point in making them free... Cause if the runes are free, well it's basicly a "big" free boost for everyone.
The Bíg Ticket3 votesYes lets give every player all runes, 20 rune pages and all 124 champions from the start. Also level 30. God forbid you actually have to grind a bit in a FREE TO PLAY online game that you can play 24 hours every day since 2010.
Gurt193 votesHonestly, they need a buy/sell option for runes. I have tier 1 and tier 2 runes I never use and just don't even want to see them ever again even if it means completely deleting them for like 10% ip back in return. So much is wrong with this game, the fact that 1 player can ruin a whole game of League, trolls, unskilleds etc.
FourVsFive2 votesThey some times have sales on runes maybe a couple times a year or so, thats what I waiting on..
Lauricella32 votesmeanwhile hybrid pen runes are 820ip each...
AxlStream2 votesImo you only really want 2 sets of runes.
Magic pen. Marks x9, Armor Seals x9, MR Glyphs x9 and 3 AP Quints. AD Marks x9, Armor Seals X9, MR Glyphs X9 and 3 AD Quints.
These are basic and can cover most champions. Although I get that with such an extensive choice of runes it might be overwhelming and very tempting to rush those specialized rune pages for certain champions.
Decrit2 votesWell they did discounts and mostly revamped the t2 runes: i agree it might suck a bit, but looking at what runes add tot he game and how are t2 compared to t3 it should soften the blow.
However i agree that is too much - that is why they are aiming to change that, but is far far out of prevision...
ComannderShepard2 votesI don;t want runes free (I'm prepared for the flak) as someone who owns every champ and 18 rune pages (all bought with IP) I like to have stuff to buy. Accumulating IP for nothing but the next champ (which takes a lot longer to come out because of all the other cool shit Riot is doing now like special game modes and VU/Champ Updates).
Drunk Rummate2 votesif runes get a price reduction or get made free...
fuck that man I'd want a massive refund, and I promise you that aint happening. so may as well leave it as it is.
powerbats1 votesNo and as someone pointed out in another thread just like this that by level 30 you should've earned around 285-385 thousand ip which is more than enough to buy your runes/masteries as well as a core set of champs.
Sinc ehtey took out the rune combiner which was a bad idea to ahve it in the 1st place, they should simply make tier 1 runes free once you hit say level 15 and at 20 you're able to buy at really reduced prices level 2 so that by the time you hit 30 and can buy level 3 you alreayd know what you want.
MVDuneCats9 votesas someone pointed out in another thread just like this that by level 30 you should've earned around 285-385 thousand ip which is more than enough to buy your runes/masteries as well as a core set of champs.
Either a typo was involved or someone was off by quite a bit. I've been keeping track of my IP and XP earnings per game, and I'm likely going to wind up between 47k and 48k IP total by the time I'm 30.
Still, that would be enough to put 20k IP toward runes and still have enough IP left to get all the 450 champs, a couple 6300 champs, and 7 1350 champs. That's a pretty decent start.
powerbats1 votesEither a typo was involved or someone was off by quite a bit. I've been keeping track of my IP and XP earnings per game, and I'm likely going to wind up between 47k and 48k IP total by the time I'm 30.
Still, that would be enough to put 20k IP toward runes and still have enough IP left to get all the 450 champs, a couple 6300 champs, and 7 1350 champs. That's a pretty decent start.
I'll look for the post later since it was about a month ago and don't feeling like digging for it tonight. I've got all the chmaps currently and don't even play all of them really but a good core group of 30-50 champs should suffice for anyone and sitll be able to get the runes/masteries you want. There's also sales, 1st win of the day, boosts, double ip weekends, the new party rewards etc.
Zavern1 votesI don't remember the last time they did a double ip weekend. Some players may also not have the money to pay for champions.
T RexHasTinyArms4 votesOr just don't want to. I think I played for 2 years before I ever bought RP.
StreakLight3 votesWhen I hit level 30, I never bought anything beforehand (Maybe I bought Ryze) and I ended up with 30k. Nowhere near the 300k you're saying.
Let's say each game, you get 200IP (This is an overestimate to demonstrate a point, unless you only play first win for 200 days), at level 30 you probably have 200 games (This is also an overestimate). 200IP X 200 Games = 40,000IP. At some point, I had nearly 100k IP, but that took like 300-400 games.
MVDuneCats1 votesWhen I hit level 30, I never bought anything beforehand (Maybe I bought Ryze) and I ended up with 30k. Nowhere near the 300k you're saying.
Let's say each game, you get 200IP (This is an overestimate to demonstrate a point, unless you only play first win for 200 days), at level 30 you probably have 200 games (This is also an overestimate). 200IP X 200 Games = 40,000IP. At some point, I had nearly 100k IP, but that took like 300-400 games.
Your 200 games to reach level 30 is an underestimate.
It takes 40,084 xp to get from level 1 to level 30. To do that is only 200 games, you would have to average 200 xp per game. I haven't gotten more than 170 xp for a win, but I also haven't had many games go longer past 50 minutes. Wikia says that the max xp for a normal is 198, which I can believe.
200 wins might be more accurate, especially if you assume roughly 0.500 winning percentage (and thus 400 total games).
branasce1 votesI think rune prices are fine as is. The reason they're fairly costly, is the fact that they give players an edge in the game. Once youve got your runes, youre all set and instantly have an advantage as soon as the game starts
Champion Skin1 votesRunes are expensive because... They want you to buy champions with RP so you still have IP to afford runes
branasce2 votes[{quoted}](name=Champion Skin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dQQ2pyAI,comment-id=001d0000,timestamp=2015-05-10T23:28:37.324+0000)
Runes are expensive because... They want you to buy champions with RP so you still have IP to afford runes
I suppose so, but even still; they have sales where champs are 50% off. I still think they're expensive, because they give you an advantage. Would you rather take a vanilla champ or one with runes?
Finnical1 votesIt's the opposite. When you first hit 20 any player who has a full set of tier 3 runes has an immense advantage over you, especially during the laning phase. Then when you make it all the way to 30 if you haven't filled up that rune page you are again at a massive disadvantage. In addition picking up any champ who requires an unusual runepage (tryn, critplank, hybrid champs) you now have to farm ip in order to be on par with other players.
Runes aren't an optional advantage at a premium, they are a minimum for play. Making runes cost IP is a tax designed to make buying IP boosts for real money appealing. Actually I am not personally offended by this tactic in a free to play game, but I think Riot has outgrown it and should simply make them free.
branasce2 votesIt's the opposite. When you first hit 20 any player who has a full set of tier 3 runes has an immense advantage over you, especially during the laning phase. Then when you make it all the way to 30 if you haven't filled up that rune page you are again at a massive disadvantage. In addition picking up any champ who requires an unusual runepage (tryn, critplank, hybrid champs) you now have to farm ip in order to be on par with other players.
Runes aren't an optional advantage at a premium, they are a minimum for play. Making runes cost IP is a tax designed to make buying IP boosts for real money appealing. Actually I am not personally offended by this tactic in a free to play game, but I think Riot has outgrown it and should simply make them free.
I always thought it was common sense to start buying runes as soon as you've got access to tier three. I personally don't think that champions "require" a specific set of runes. It really is entirely up to you and your play style. I also dont really like to call it farming. I mean , you're playing a game after all. Just see it as "getting stronger" in a sense.
As much I believe that runes provide an advantage, they are optional. Not required or really needed. If you're skilled enough, you could surely hold your own just fine.
Im not too sure that i like the notion of them going free. Might aswell get rid of runes entirely
ShaftyMegee1 votesThey already reduced the prices of t1 and t2 runes to basically nothing A few patches ago. If you are really that hard pressed then get those, make a full rune page and trade them out as you get the higher runes. And you all HAVE to remember we that this is a free to play game with micro transActions, they want to make spending money on rp more of a viable option
Loken Stoneheart2 votesThey already reduced the prices of t1 and t2 runes to basically nothing A few patches ago. If you are really that hard pressed then get those, make a full rune page and trade them out as you get the higher runes. And you all HAVE to remember we that this is a free to play game with micro transActions, they want to make spending money on rp more of a viable option
T2 runes are still hella expensive and a scam. T1 runes are like 30% of the effectiveness of a T3 rune. This still leaves you with like 10% less starting stats than the opponent laner.
ShaftyMegee2 votesHave you even looked at the t1 and t2 runes? T1 runes are 5 ip for regulars, 15 for quints. Meanwhile t2 quints are 100 ip... and the regular ones are 35... are you really that cheap? Like... srs? t2 runes USED to be a scam and a noob trap But not anymore. For example... t3 quints for cool downs are 2.5%, while t2 are 1.95%.... are they still a scam?
Edit: they are good enough until you can replace them
Loken Stoneheart2 votesHave you even looked at the t1 and t2 runes? T1 runes are 5 ip for regulars, 15 for quints. Meanwhile t2 quints are 100 ip... and the regular ones are 35... are you really that cheap? Like... srs? t2 runes USED to be a scam and a noob trap But not anymore. For example... t3 quints for cool downs are 2.5%, while t2 are 1.95%.... are they still a scam?
Edit: they are good enough until you can replace them
Yes, they're absolutely a scam. Considering that you buy them and it delays you from getting the only ones that actually matter, and the ones that actually matter are so expensive, they're a grand scam. The whole rune system is a scam.
ShaftyMegee2 votesHeh, you gave me a pretty good laugh. Go on strIke then! Go show rito who is boss.
powerbats1 votes[{quoted}](name=Loken Stoneheart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dQQ2pyAI,comment-id=001f000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-11T04:45:43.097+0000)
Yes, they're absolutely a scam. Considering that you buy them and it delays you from getting the only ones that actually matter, and the ones that actually matter are so expensive, they're a grand scam. The whole rune system is a scam.
So because you feel it's a scam it makes it so right? Wrong, it's your choice to buy them or not and what you or anyone else spends their ip on. If you feel so strongly about it then why bother playing this or any other game that has a system similar to this that you can buy something to help you. Do you seriously expect us to believe you don't play any other game that does this?
AirRaid19882 votesSo you want free stuff when the other guy put in time and effort?
