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Rengar is unfun to Play against

Cowseed··6 votes·901 views

I wan't someone to explain this "x champion is not fun to play against so they deserve nerfs" argument that I've seen quite commonly. Not as commonly as previous weeks. I wan't to know how is it that you consider a champion being unfun to play against to be a justified reason to nerf/delete a champion. I get that the champ being non-fun is just a way to say you keep losing against the champion and save face but come on! That is one of the dumbest arguments I've heard in a while.

Examples of this are assassins. I know that when you are plowing an assassin in the dirt you are gonna find that fun but if somehow you play against someone who knows how to play assassins you're gonna have a bad time and then say that this assassin isn't fun to play against. People will QQ and say darius isn't fun to lane against but more often than not I don't really have a problem with darius. I really don't like playing against vlad but most people in my situation would say that vlad isn't a fun champ to play against. I don't see it as vlad being an unfun champion to play against, I rather see it as a challenge I haven't overcome yet.

The same with yas and many others. So can someone explain this 'fun to play against' thing I keep hearing about. What kind of champ is 'fun to play against'. I would understand being bored of seeing a certain champ but this fun and not-fun thing I can't wrap my head around. Is it a champ that you can easily beat? Is it a champ that has a extremely clear weakness that pokes you in the face. It is a champ that lacks in areas where your play style excels?

I ask this because I don't really see champs as a fun or 'unfun' thing to play against. I just consider the match itself as fun or unfun. Another issue with this x champ is not fun to play against mentality is why aren't their as many threads saying that x champ IS fun to play against. You rarely ever see a thread where someone will say that laning/playing against this champ is fun and completely reliant on my skill and their skill. Can champions ever only be unfun to play against?

Oh and before I get downvoted to oblivion I guess I have to QQ about something. Ahhhhhhhhh Yasuo! Did I do it right?

7 Comments

Lux HD3 votes

For me, personally, it's a matter of "oh, I think I'm about to get deleted.. I'm not entirely sure if it's going to happen or not, but I thi.. oh yeah, there it is."

You should hear me on Skype when I see those eyes of doom above my head and hear that god awful noise. "Guys! Guys! I'm about to get shit on! Oh god, where is he? loads up the shields He's around here somewhere!" Then, bam, oneshot.

To me it is unfun to play against, simply because he will oneshot a squishy in 99% of circumstances. There is counterplay, but even control wards can be ineffective if you don't know which side he is coming from.

Having a Rengar on the enemy team makes you completely alter your play for the entire game, which consequently punishes unorganized teams (cough soloqueue and low elo cough).

I'm sure he falls off hard at high elo and in 5mans, but as a casual player he is very unfun to play against.

GULAG 4 U2 votes

Being annoying is no justification for a nerf, as it's something subjective.

Kitten of Evil1 votes

Generally it's a matter of agency: Do I feel like I have a fair shot or at least some amount of impact on this matchup? Let's say I'm laning against someone who counters me, like Annie against Lux. Sure, the lane might be annoying, but I feel like I have some ability to dictate trades and CS. I can dodge her spells, or flash in for a stun.

Compare that to something a bit closer to un-fun: laning against Pantheon or Darius as a melee champion. There's a lot less ability to trade on your terms and CSing can be harder, but you can still play passively and if you don't feed, you can make it to late game. Less fun to lane against, but still not a problem.

When you're playing as an ADC against new Rengar, there often is nothing you can do to avoid that grey screen. I've been between two teammates before, and still gotten killed by a single Jump AA-E-Q-Thunderlord's proc (even without the ult-Crit). There is literally nothing the ADC player can do in that situation to avoid dying--his you have to rely on teammates to CC him properly or to protect you, and he has a 14-30 second window to strike.

Cowseed1 votes

So you are saying it is somewhat subjective. I actually don't mind playing against Darius as that is actually what I call a fun matchup as I main Poppy. I used to really dislike playing against Fizz because I mainly used assassins in the midlane which are Akali and Katarina , which I find to be a hard lane.

Then I discovered that Orianna is pretty good against him so I found that kind of enjoyable. If I'm going to play against a champ I know I suck against I don't really focus on lane that much. I just try not to feed and roam if I can. As for the Rengar situation it is quite startling that he can kill so quickly still while the other assassins can't but I got used to that. Before the assassin update their would often be a fed assassin on the enemy team. I solve that by going mid and not feeding them. Plus don't see too many rengars myself though.

Thank you for your feedback.

Aptest1 votes

Generally it's a matter of agency

exactly that. Being 1-shotted or otherwise being unable to 1v1 an opponent because of any other reason (Ghosting Jax being too massive a ball of stats to fight) is part of that.

When the other guy gets to make too many of the "good" decision and your decisions are either "best of bad options" or otherwise gated by other players, its not fun for you (it's fun for him though).

Agency is ultimately a zero-sum game. That's a problem that can't be solved in this game.

Kirius Dark1 votes

Unfun to play against can be translated to little to no counterplay IMO. I like matchups where you can dodge skillshots, use minions or terrain and have a combo to fight out so if you die its either your error or their better trade combo to outplay.

Shit like rengar coming out of 30 sec move speed buffed stealth autocrit enhanced Q to kill you in 0.2 seconds isnt an outplay. Its just you were in his half of the map and happened to be his closest target at the time. Ive died with 3k HP & 2 defensive items at level 18 max build as a mage to his max build 45 min into the game in 0.37 seconds. Is that skill? Is that fun? Am I supposed to go straight full tank as an AP carry to be useless but survive for an extra 2 seconds?

Yasuo I dont mind since he's not straight up 1 shot and needs to hit his abilities and you can see where he is on the map

Lıttle Boy1 votes

TFW you think its actually fun to play against a Rengar.

Although I agree, I thought the assassin rework was supposed to increase the window of "one shots" but when I played Zed it was pretty much the same and Rengar... Well he's practically better than he was before.

Press R Jump on me Full Combo Dead

Happens all the time.

I only had fun against one because I was ADC Draven. He one shotted me but when I got the reversal on him it was over. PS. Only been playing Draven for the past week. So my opinion is subjected to change when I play as someone else.

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