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Tristana Needs to be Nerfed!

SleepyWolfie·Nov 17, 2014·2 votes·781 views

Its not only about Tristana its about all Hypercarries, in my opinion: between some others. This "HyperCarries" are what they are Hyper carries, they carry hard the game and i personally think that influences on many things: Solo Q in Ranked ( if you check, the best players at Challenger Solo Q are ADCs and their most played are generally these Hypercarries), Popularity of other champions: ( i dont see them much, and i think thats consecuence of these Hypercarries) and they are almost obligatory picks, and get banned a lot in Ranked and so. I dont know what riot could do, maybe Nerf them, they have done that to but it was mostly a buff in my opinion other than a nerf. Buff other champions to make them more playable and are very good examples ive been playing in this free week, and ive done perfectly well so far, until i was up to , she owned me, and i think thats consecuence of these champions who carry so hard and im not talking about late game only, they are strong in most times through out the game. Take in account this is MY opinion and criticism is perfectly accepted as long as it doesnt get too dirty verbally :P , isnt seen much either (unless shes free).

7 Comments

ValyrianBladeNov 17, 20142 votes

How is caitlyn a hyper carry? ? She's an early game adc, peaks early/mid game and falls off late game.

Lucien is a Lane bully and also not a hyper carry.

Kog'maw is a hyper carry but is seen far less frequently than some of the other adcs you've mentioned, such as jinx or corki, or even Ashe.

Vayne is a hyper carry but has a really weak early game and can be shut down pretty easily with some adcs.

Tristana WAS quite OP, but since her attack speed nerf, q duration nerf, and ultimate cooldown nerf, she's really in a good spot now. You can take advantage of her e passive in Lane by making her push Lane if she tries to cs, and then lock her down for a jungle gank. Yes her w is an excellent escape but with cc from the support and jungle it shouldn't be enough. Choosing draven, or any burst adc or high damage adc against her will give you a good edge.

Honestly I think adcs are really balanced. Also the fact that the top players are adc mains merely means that adc is less popular and so they get their main role more often (whereas a mid or top main doesn't always get it and loses in their off role). They pick from a small pool of Champions because those are meta right now. Just as top has Ryze/maokai/Rumble/gnar (/alistar every game at world's), mid has Syndra/orianna/zed, jungle has Lee sin/kha'zix/rengar, support has thresh/Janna/braum/Morgana. Each role has a limited number of super meta champions that you'll see most games but that doesn't mean other champions aren't viable or can't compete. It just means that the pros want their kit in the team comp, and lower elo players just copy the pros hoping for freelo instead of actually improving themselves.

AozoraNov 17, 20141 votes

Caitlyn isn't a hyper-carry I agree, but she doesn't really fall off late-game. Her early-game is great, her mid-game is bad, and her late-game is decent.

TO OP:

Tristana isn't really OP anymore. She's still a powerful hyper-carry, but her AS steriod was nerfed and they also emphasized her weak mid-game by increasing her ult's duration.

Kog'maw (especially) and Twitch are pretty reliant on their teammates to help them reach that hypercarry stage. Kog'maw and Twitch are excellent in Ranked teams because you have reliable teammates and comps that are built around each other. Vayne also need help in the early game only due to her range, but she can snowball.

Lucian, like you said is a lane-bully with no real weak points in the game, but is not a hypercarry. He does already when he's behind, but he doesn't really snowball all that well either. I won't disagree that they need to make some changes to him :P

Corki is pretty popular right now actually. He's strong early and amazing mid thanks to 3-force. Same can be said for Draven, although he isn't too popular, but is very snowbally.

Jinx is in an awesome spot right now. She can snowball hard, but can suffer if she makes mistakes. She's a strong pick with a great kit.

You really just need to work on taking advantage of the weak points of champions and when they are weak. If you let champions like Tristana, Kog'maw, and Vayne hit their strong points or let champions like Caitlyn get ahead early, your team will just have to suffer and deal with it.

Kuroi86Nov 17, 20142 votes

Cait and Lucian aren't hyper carries. They're just obnoxious if they get fed. Trist and Kog both saw nerfs recently and Vayne is probably one of the most balanced of any marksman you mentioned.

As for those you said you don't see often, Urgot is on the table for a rework due to his kit just being all sorts of awkward and bad, Quinn is better top lane as a ranged AD bruiser. Corki and Draven are actually really friggen strong, they just have a high skill cap which means only those good at them will play them often. Jinx to my knowledge is also considered fairly balanced, good for snowballing but very bad if you get behind.

jimmylismNov 17, 20141 votes

Its not only about Tristana its about all Hypercarries, in my opinion: between some others. This "HyperCarries" are what they are Hyper carries, they carry hard the game and i personally think that influences on many things: Solo Q in Ranked ( if you check, the best players at Challenger Solo Q are ADCs and their most played are generally these Hypercarries), Popularity of other champions: ( i dont see them much, and i think thats consecuence of these Hypercarries) and they are almost obligatory picks, and get banned a lot in Ranked and so. I dont know what riot could do, maybe Nerf them, they have done that to but it was mostly a buff in my opinion other than a nerf. Buff other champions to make them more playable and are very good examples ive been playing in this free week, and ive done perfectly well so far, until i was up to , she owned me, and i think thats consecuence of these champions who carry so hard and im not talking about late game only, they are strong in most times through out the game. Take in account this is MY opinion and criticism is perfectly accepted as long as it doesnt get too dirty verbally :P , isnt seen much either (unless shes free). So she owned you and based off that one game, you say that she needs a nerf? Put pressure on her mid game and delay her core build and you will be fine.

Sightless66Nov 17, 20141 votes

Corki and Draven are considered extremely strong right now. They're not hypercarries, but they're two of the strongest AD carries. Lucian also isn't a hypercarry by any definition. He doesn't have any autoattack steroid and his damage, while good, does fall off significantly compared to a pure autoattacker. I also wouldn't classify Caitlyn as a hypercarry due to her having a lower DPS than most other AD carries. Hypercarries could include Jinx, Trist, Kog, and Vayne. On that note, Vayne isn't doing too great right now, and there are actually discussions of small buffs for her because of her lack of success compared to other champions.

Right now, the group of strong AD carries is made up of a mix of hypercarries and more early-mid game carries. Corki and Draven and Lucian have about as much power as Trist and Kog and Jinx, and probably more power than Vayne. The problem is the marginilization of some of the AD-based caster carries, such as MF, Graves and Varus, who were hurt a lot by the BT changes.

Also, if you look at the makeup of Challenger in general, you actually see that roles are represented roughly equally. In fact, in Korea's Challenger scene, the people at the top of their ladders are not ADC players. Additionally, Riot has actually noted that one of the Season 5 goals is to reduce the impact of junglers because they tended to be the most influential players throughout season 4. So, no, I don't really agree that AD carries need to be taken down a peg. I think that what needs to happen is that itemization gets buffed for caster-carries, so that they get an item actually good for them instead of the worthless Essence Reaver.

Finally, Urgot is not really an ADC nowadays. He's much better as a bruiser tank top/mid.

AtheosisXNov 17, 20141 votes

She's 110th in win rate in Diamond, right below Twitch. For what it's worth.

SmokingPuffinNov 17, 20141 votes

Caitlyn and Lucian have pretty poor scaling. They're early game bullies that exist more to beat the opposing carry more than they seek to become objectively huge.

Corki is the best ADC in 4.19.

Draven is probably better for solo queue than any of the carries you listed.

Don't get too attached to playing what the pros play. Their reasons for playing those champions probably are not relevant to your level of play.

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