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the fact that tank champions like poppy and maokai are able to out damage Garen is sad

Peristant·12/11/2016, 7:54:02 PM·5 votes·1,333 views

Garen, a champ built around nothing but being Tanky with Damage can't even hold his own against the far superior champs such a poppy and maokai etc...

They are tankier than him, deal more damage than him though %health and constant shields/sustain. They have more mobility than him, more CC than him obviously. Courage of Collosus is unbelievely busted right now.

The E buff doesn't change any of Garen's initial flaws pre buff. Infact the rylais nerf is a bigger buff to Garen than the actual buff itself, because 24/7 permaslows prevent Garen from reaching a target.

Riot I feel wasted a buff on Garen, and I am worried they are going to leave him like this for a good year again until his winrate falls even lower than what is already is (46% plat+)

I think it's time Riot really consider reworking Garen into something that isn't getting clearly outmatched by all the FOTM champions.

3 Comments

Avienal12/11/2016, 8:09:40 PM1 votes

{quoted}

Garen, a champ built around nothing but being Tanky with Damage can't even hold his own against the far superior champs such a poppy and maokai etc...

They are tankier than him, deal more damage than him though %health and constant shields/sustain. They have more mobility than him, more CC than him obviously. Courage of Collosus is unbelievely busted right now.

The E buff doesn't change any of Garen's initial flaws pre buff. Infact the rylais nerf is a bigger buff to Garen than the actual buff itself, because 24/7 permaslows prevent Garen from reaching a target.

Riot I feel wasted a buff on Garen, and I am worried they are going to leave him like this for a good year again until his winrate falls even lower than what is already is (46% plat+)

I think it's time Riot really consider reworking Garen into something that isn't getting clearly outmatched by all the FOTM champions.

First of all Mao'kai is another part of the silly top lane champion sect i like to call: "I can harass you at a distance with one scummy ability and easily dive and CC you with ease". Poppy on the other hand i see more as a disruptive tank who can deny dashers with her W, her Q lets her do 2 instances of max health of opponents as bonus damage, her E is the standard peel a high damage whombo'er enemy off the team, catch up to a target or wall slam them to get them off for a while and her R is the good old, split up the enemy team to melt the ones left behind.

Garen on the other hand has not really had much done to his kit besides some few fixes here and there plus some additions and now he has a powerful gimmick to shred 1/4th of any enemies armor off just by doing 4 spins on them with his E (which he can do more hits with his E as he gets the related stat gimmicks linked to them up).

Not to mention as you said: "Courage of the Colossus is unbelievably busted right now." Because any champion that has just 1 form of disruptive hard CC can abuse it and use it as a perfect measure for initiating a team fight, even if they originally has no ability to initiate a team fight (diving in, AoE CC, etc). Obviously since Garen has no 'hard CC' him and Shyvana are amongst the tank-semi'tank roster champions who get the major middle finger when paired up against any champion who has at least one stun, root or similar ability. Doesn't matter how much they lower the health scale and adjust the cool down on it, only needs to give a burst of sizable health shield at least once to do its job.

Plus technically in the same letter as the huge stat drop on item 3116, the cost drop made it more of a grab for the utility, so the up side, any champion who gets it won't hit as hard or take as much damage, but in that same fold, if they can repeatedly apply the slow, it could be a useful way for them to chase down a target or give minor slow disruptive'ness on a enemy chasing them. But since the slow itself is now quite low for 'all' instances of applying it, that means less of a window for those item 3116 users to make use of it to peel away from being chased or chase down a target as easily.

[slayer-jinx-catface]

p.s. just double checked the E, since it only takes 4 spins to apply it and the spins scales 5 to 10 based on his level, its relatively easy for him to quickly apply it, just like how his passive gets stronger in later levels. Considering the scaling for each spin is:

「 PHYSICAL DAMAGE PER SPIN: 14 / 18 / 22 / 26 / 30 (+ 34 / 35 / 36 / 36 / 37% AD) 」

That basically ends up scaling pretty well since 10 spins at late game would be 300 damage + 370% AD scaling for all 10 spins.

It basically means once he applies that 25% armor shred the extra damage from the additional spins really rack up and he refreshes it every time E hits the target afterwards, with it already having a 6 second duration. Garen has E on a 9 second cool down so it would be quite easy for him to get enough CDR to keep reapplying the effect constantly, combined with black cleaver, Garen could affectively do what Darius does on armor shred then. Major difference being that Garen can use E as a ghost effect too, combine his Q which breaks slow and gives move speed and if he does a auto within the next 4.5 seconds he gets that silence hit and empowered, E lasts 3 seconds so combined it lets him self chase a target alot better then Darius does when itemization is not added into the mix.

Critmaster Garen12/12/2016, 10:43:17 AM1 votes

they dont outdamage him. but they win battles of attrition.

they repeatedly heal and shield themselves throughout a fight with him. their innate tankyness drags these fights out to the point that theyre winning just because of their sustain coupled with the % damage in their kits.

ScissorsNstuff12/12/2016, 11:15:40 AM1 votes

no