PSA: Junglers, If Your Laner Is UNDER Tower

TS Media·Aug 1, 2017·28 votes·2,555 views

And the enemy top laner is past river backing in a bush. If you decide you have big cajones and wanna fight them and then die or get low (forcing your top laner to try and come and save your ---- cut it right there) and they get a double, your laners are entitled to be pissed. If you're not 100% sure the play will turn out in your favor, don't do it.

No need to over aggro or over greed for anything. And DON'T even DARE say anything to your laner. Cause if they explode, then that's on YOU.

39 Comments

HalcyonDwellerAug 2, 20175 votes

As a jungler, can confirm. If you try to gank the laner when your ally is not positioned to help, you're gonna have a bad time.

http://memecrunch.com/meme/PORN/you-re-going-to-have-a-bad-time/image.jpg

It doesn't matter if our ally should be in position to help us.

If they aren't, then who's fault is it that we decided to 1v1 the laner who has gold and levels up on us?

I'm not going to go jump off a bridge just because that bridge should have anti-suicide safety nets.

If the bridge doesn't then I'm fucked. And dying to prove a point is like the ultimate stupidity.

The same concept applies here as it does to taking objectives such as dragon / baron or pushing lanes. If allies are not in position to help, it doesn't matter how right the play is. Doing it without the team is worse than the team not doing it at all.

EmperorPenguAug 1, 20174 votes

It's their fault for not paying attention to where the jungler is. If they were paying attention then they wouldn't have to try & save us because it would be a 2v1

JbelsAug 1, 201720 votes

{quoted}

It's their fault for not paying attention to where the jungler is. If they were paying attention then they wouldn't have to try & save us because it would be a 2v1

Bullshit. If I'm backing under tower and you suddenly decide to go in on my laner, that's YOU not paying attention. Read the map and notice I'm backing so that you don't give up a free kill and inadvertently screw over your laner

EmperorPenguAug 1, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Bullshit. If I'm backing under tower and you suddenly decide to go in on my laner, that's YOU not paying attention. Read the map and notice I'm backing so that you don't give up a free kill and inadvertently screw over your laner

We notice that your backing but if you have the health & mana to help when it is obvious that we are going in. I even ping just to get the laners attention that way I don't get screwed over in what would have been an easy kill.

JbelsAug 1, 201712 votes

{quoted}

We notice that your backing but if you have the health & mana to help when it is obvious that we are going in. I even ping just to get the laners attention that way I don't get screwed over in what would have been an easy kill.

So what you're saying is, if you ping that you're coming and I don't come for whatever reason, whether that be judgement that I don't want that fight until I have the items I need or there's a huge CS wave under tower and I want it, you reserve the right to intentionally feed my laner by going in alone and dying? Do you realize how dumb that sounds?

This is part of the skill in being a jungler, knowing when you should and shouldn't go in. I don't go in when YOU want to go in. I go in when WE want to go in.

EmperorPenguAug 2, 20171 votes

{quoted}

So what you're saying is, if you ping that you're coming and I don't come for whatever reason, whether that be judgement that I don't want that fight until I have the items I need or there's a huge CS wave under tower and I want it, you reserve the right to intentionally feed my laner by going in alone and dying? Do you realize how dumb that sounds?

This is part of the skill in being a jungler, knowing when you should and shouldn't go in. I don't go in when YOU want to go in. I go in when WE want to go in.

Note in op's situation he was backing in a bush not behind tower. I do agree if the wave is big enough you should wait but sometimes the enemy doesn't give you that chance so you have to go at that very moment. Also yes farm may be worth more than a kill but for your jungler a kill is a lead over the enemy that the jg can use to help win the game.

I just had to copy & paste this because I think it still fits with what you said. I will notice when there is cs that can be taken but if I see a good opportunity & I just need your help then I can be more useful around the map. But if you refuse to come in on a open opportunity then I have the right to be a bit salty.

Skins ProjectAug 2, 20171 votes

The enemy TOP laner is backing in bush

HalcyonDwellerAug 2, 20177 votes

You beat me to it. People shouldn't make plays if the team isn't ready to back them up.

It's like jumping off a tall bridge and expecting it to have safety nets. Sure it is supposed to, but if it doesn't for some reason then who's fault is it really when we fall to our death?

FearlessCreatorAug 2, 20171 votes

There is a reason people are down voting you, take the L.

Shuriman CuratorAug 2, 20172 votes

{quoted}

We notice that your backing but if you have the health & mana to help when it is obvious that we are going in. I even ping just to get the laners attention that way I don't get screwed over in what would have been an easy kill.

Tbh, as a top lane main it's usually the jungler that screws us over.

GesterrAug 2, 20171 votes

I'm just a scrub Gold jungler but even I know how stupid you sound. Minion agro cam be deadly at the very least losing a wave will cancel out any good from killing the opposing laner. You have to read the lane flow BEFORE you decide to gank to know if it's not just about "can I flank right now"

HalcyonDwellerAug 2, 20172 votes

I'm not going to go jump off a bridge simply because that bridge ought to have safety nets.

If the ally is not in position to be a safety net then it's our own goddamn fault if we decide to jump off that bridge by 1v1-ing the enemy laner.

Same thing with pushing lanes, have you ever had an ally try to tell the team to push one of the lanes, then go do it on their own and die when the rest of the team was busy doing something else? It doesn't matter how right the play is, if the team isn't in position to make it happen then the only smart decision is to not do it.

EmperorPenguAug 2, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I'm not going to go jump off a bridge simply because that bridge ought to have safety nets.

If the ally is not in position to be a safety net then it's our own goddamn fault if we decide to jump off that bridge by 1v1-ing the enemy laner.

Same thing with pushing lanes, have you ever had an ally try to tell the team to push one of the lanes, then go do it on their own and die when the rest of the team was busy doing something else? It doesn't matter how right the play is, if the team isn't in position to make it happen then the only smart decision is to not do it.

Daym you got me there. But I wouldn't go in if I needed a safety net I would go in however if I think I can do it I would like the extra help that way I can 100% get the kill.

z63XnLCMwXAug 2, 20174 votes

And then when you dont gank "omfg useless jungler, I was under turret whole time and no gank"

Kingdom CornAug 2, 20173 votes

Tbh your post is way to vague. For example who is the top laner? is it darius or illaoi? are they 6? how much hp do I have (jungler) how much hp does my top laner have and how much does the enemy top laner have. Its all situational you can have the same situation but instead its a teemo top backing in a bush with 40% hp and im a wukong jg with 60% hp... I can 1v1 him without my top laner's help.

TS MediaAug 2, 20171 votes

If you can do it, then by all means go for it. I specifically stated if you aren't 100% sure you can do it without your top laner's help, then don't do it. There's chances of being counter ganked, for you to mess up the play or for you to force your top laner's hand and end up in a terrible double kill situation. I'm just saying there's no need to be needlessly aggressive for a kill.

PePsiLemoNNAug 2, 20173 votes

Also if there's a BIG wave coming at my tower can you understand that I can't just walk through them and lose 50% of my hp cause you decided to gank right then?

Starcraft243verAug 2, 20171 votes

^ This please, THIS

MimrAug 1, 20172 votes

Soo... for me as a jungle main there's basically two possible outcomes here:

I gank and the laner is too lazy to come out under the turret to help me (assuming he's healthy) and I get flamed. If the enemy laner gets a double kill, then that's of course completely my fault.
I don't gank and the laner starts yelling OMGWHYUNOGANKIREPORTU.

Basically, with the LoL community being as toxic as it is, I have to choose between two possible evils. Why did I play this game again?

EmperorPenguAug 1, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Soo... for me as a jungle main there's basically two possible outcomes here:

I gank and the laner is too lazy to come out under the turret to help me (assuming he's healthy) and I get flamed. If the enemy laner gets a double kill, then that's of course completely my fault.

I don't gank and the laner starts yelling OMGWHYUNOGANKIREPORTU.

Basically, with the LoL community being as toxic as it is, I have to choose between two possible evils. Why did I play this game again?

Ik feels bad right. We jungle mains get eachother

FrikgeekAug 1, 20177 votes

No, you only have 1 option and that's not to gank in that situation. There are multiple reasons not to gank if your laner is under tower with a big wave.

The cs under tower might be equal or nearly equal in value to a kill, making it rather pointless to go for a kill if it means missing that cs
Suddenly walking past that creepwave makes it as obvious as possible that he's setting up a gank, making the enemy laner back off and escape safely in most cases
IF the wave is big enough it could seriously hurt your laner if he walks into it and takes aggro, big minion waves can do some serious damage earlygame

So either go do some jungle camp or wait around 10 seconds for your laner to clear the stacked up wave, then try to go for a gank.

Unless the enemy laner is right up under your tower trying to harass your laner as he lasthits just don't go for it.

EmperorPenguAug 1, 20171 votes

{quoted}

No, you only have 1 option and that's not to gank in that situation. There are multiple reasons not to gank if your laner is under tower with a big wave.

The cs under tower might be equal or nearly equal in value to a kill, making it rather pointless to go for a kill if it means missing that cs

Suddenly walking past that creepwave makes it as obvious as possible that he's setting up a gank, making the enemy laner back off and escape safely in most cases

IF the wave is big enough it could seriously hurt your laner if he walks into it and takes aggro, big minion waves can do some serious damage earlygame

So either go do some jungle camp or wait around 10 seconds for your laner to clear the stacked up wave, then try to go for a gank.

FrikgeekAug 2, 20173 votes

What do you mean the enemy doesn't give you that chance? Nobody is stopping you from just letting them go and going back to farming, that option always exists.

If you have to force a gank that could potentially go really badly, waste your laner's time for no reason because he has to make it extremely obvious, or even set your laner behind through cs then you're forcing a really terrible gank.

Sun Wu RyuumokuAug 2, 20171 votes

The cs under tower might be equal or nearly equal in value to a kill, making it rather pointless to go for a kill if it means missing that cs

It depend when the gank happen. If its early u don't want ur top to abandonn all cs, even for a possible kill. Both should ping, when im top i ping "no" to my jungler. And the jungler should look at wave.

CatastropAug 2, 20172 votes

Or you could go to another lane? Or farm? Just anything?

Asayake 5150glowAug 2, 20172 votes

If I go for a 1v1 (junglers are no longer behind laners in terms of gold/xp so it's not like I'm at a disadvantage) and lose, you have absolutely no right to yell at me.

Otherwise I 'should' be able to yell at you for giving up first blood without being ganked.

Fuck it, just don't fucking explode. It doesn't help.

TS MediaAug 2, 20171 votes

If you go for a 1v1 in the jungle and lose to the enemy jgler, that's on you. If you come to MY lane when I stated or pinged that I was in NO position to help you and you DIE to a heavy snowballing lane, set me behind, curse ME out for no map awareness and then never come back to the lane that YOU set up for your laner to lose... then yeah, I think we can agree that your laner has every right to be pissed.

However, I never said yell at anyone. If he decides to mute/block you and loses all trust in you, then you cant really get mad. Most people will only explode if you criticize them on a bad play that YOU did.

The DeckownerAug 2, 20172 votes

I always have the occasional autofilled top games when I play flex with friend, then I see these bronze junglers trying to gank my lane when I have 2 waves right in front of my tower and needed that wave for level up, actually hurts my eyes.

GelmousAug 2, 20172 votes

one day i was walking from fountain back to top lane, my jungler decided to 1v1 the enemy top laner and died and then he started shit talking me like wtf ????????????

Weasel KenseiAug 3, 20172 votes

I always tell people a gank doesnt have to be a gank. A jg acan just harass a lane, do some damage, put them on their heals and move on.

Junglers should always ping ganks in advance so the laner has time to position, and save health and mana for whats coming. Or to wave the jungler off if theyre not ready for the commitment.

I dont jungle a lot, but when I do I often tell the lane Im coming in chat 30 seconds ahead of time so they can be ready, then I commit a rotation and a chase to about 3 Teemos outside their turret range and if they die good, and if they dont thats a back and 30+ seconds of free farm and a chance for my laner to back also if need be.

Problem is a lot of people arent playing the long game and get focused on playing deathmatch.

EbonyBladeJ88Aug 2, 20171 votes

In the event that I see my JG coming up top to gank: While I do my best to watch the Mini-map, and I'm sure everyone else can attest to this as well, but sometimes circumstances force you to focus your attention on your IMMEDIATE surroundings; such as if you are low and your enemy laner is making motions as though they are going to dive you. In that event I will ping my HP and MP/Secondary Resource (as whatever the case may be with my chosen character) to HOPEFULLY get my JG to see that I might not be in a prime position to aid them, and their efforts would probably be best used elsewhere.

If they go in regardless, that's their choice. I've made mine, I'm staying where I am and thus are at least preventing them from getting a double-kill in the event that my JG ends up dying in the fight. If my JG succeeds, then Kudos to them.

Now, granted, that's only an example of ONE possible situation in a game of countless possible scenarios. Here's a different one:

Let's say I'm in a good state of whatever champion I'm playing. Oh we'll say, 50 to 70% HP, and about the same for my MP or other secondary resource. Enough for at least 1 full rotation of abilities, maybe 2, and a few more uses depending on the ones I choose to use. The JG's heading my way, and they ping to alert me to it. So I do my best to get myself into a position to aid them when they arrive. But the enemy laner, perhaps though wards, or simply a "I've got a bad feeling about this" vibe, realize what's being set up for them. Therefore, they turn tail to retreat to the relative safety of their tower as the JG and I try to converge on them. Dependent on my current location when my JG arrives and my chosen champ, I might not be able to stop the enemy laner, and they make it alive to their tower. But the JG, instead of cutting their losses, decides to tower dive and ends up dying before I can even get there to aid them. At that point, I'd just turn around and get myself into a safe position to back.

WinBoatAug 2, 20171 votes

People watch the minimap in League Of Legends?

EbonyBladeJ88Aug 2, 20171 votes

There are those that TRY (I didn't necessarily say SUCCEED), and I am one of them.

LauchmelderAug 2, 20171 votes

There's a minimap in league?

oSEXYPLATYPUSoAug 2, 20171 votes

if i am a top laner and i am under turret shoved in trying to last hit to cs before the wave dies to turret as the enemy is backing in a bush and my jungler is approaching ...

chances are i cant get through the wave to get to them with out burning flash ill lose the cs and gold and experience i would of gained from lasting the wave at my turret if i have some hp and some mana chances are my cooldowns on my abilities have been used during a trade that happen before you got there..therefore i might not have my cc available or my gap closer or my major damage abilities

and if its already in a losing lane where i am in a bad match up or behind and the enemy laner is ahead and if there is a possibility of them turning it due to this advantage and getting they could turn that over agro attempt to kill into a 1 for 1 or a 1 for 2 then the favor is still in their hands and gained nothing in return

i rather have my cs

Malleus DeumAug 2, 20171 votes

I ping a million times when I come and lvl 3 gank early. Games my top laner pays attention we not only first blood and snowball his lane but I ward as I am coming in giving little chance for a counter gank. Games my top laner just cs and no gank happens he loses lane and I never come back to gank. Now I don't typically die either so there is that. I refuse to help his lane any more. I'll go to a lane where they pay attention and allow me to snowball them.

Malleus DeumAug 2, 20171 votes

SubdueAug 3, 20171 votes

While the OP isn't technically wrong, he's only viewing a small part of the whole situation. As a laner, your farm comes to you, to the same spot, over and over again. As a jungler, I need to move about the map. You are looking at the same jungle that I'm looking at. If (on blue team) my red side jungle is clear, I'm farming wolves on blue side, and you, top lane, have managed to get pinned to your tower while your opponent is going back, preventing me from ganking, that's okay, as long as you're not complaining 5 minutes later that I'm not ganking top, because I'm back on red side, clearing jungle and looking for a gank at bot or mid. Ganking isn't free. There is an opportunity cost to every gank, be it gold/exp in the form of camps I could have already cleared, a gank in another lane that could have succeeded, and often most painful of all, camps and objectives stolen by the enemy jungler because they knew where I was.

We're looking at the same map. You can see where I'm likely to be in the next 2-5 minutes. If you mismanage your lane and make it difficult or even impossible for me to gank it when I'm close by, don't complain when I choose not to gank your lane and instead venture elsewhere.

Triple3TAug 3, 20171 votes

While I agree that it was a misplay on the jgler's fault. It does not call for any negative behavior. Some people prefer to take risk while others enjoy a more docile playstyle.