Gnar gets "tired" out after his passive mega gnar wears off

360D3GR3SS·Oct 19, 2015·116 votes·6,484 views

Then he gets moment speed? Maybe rewrite the description of it?

66 Comments

SeductiveGrandpaOct 19, 201549 votes

Actually, he gets "tired" of destroying scrubs and decides to give them a chance.

(<3 Gnar )

Mister SunglowOct 19, 20152 votes

He get's tired so he has a Coffee. That has to be where he gets the speed from

SeductiveGrandpaOct 19, 20155 votes

Not Gentleman Gnar , Hes Too Gentlemanly for that: https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSbO8Af3dQZT-7TyhIhRD0DoxoVj-gyxYIqG3R29oVuQ-qa0oDl

Ser GarlandOct 19, 20156 votes

[{quoted}](name=Avian Dreams,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JErNEbgk,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-10-19T10:38:45.505+0000)

Actually, he gets "tired" of destroying scrubs and decides to give them a chance.

(<3 )

Yeah sure, little gnar gives them a "Chance". More like toys with you until you wither away.

SeductiveGrandpaOct 20, 20152 votes

This is actually true and is depicted by this: http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Bond1i5IeOQ/maxresdefault.jpg

IcyPepperOct 19, 201532 votes

Huh, odd.

I figured when he went mega, he got more health because he gets bulkier and tougher, and his movement speed boost is due to him condensing all that energy again and needing to release it in a quick sugar-rush state.

Tooltips aside, of course. It was just my impression.

PerishSoftlyOct 20, 20151 votes

Get your science out of our Rift! XD

KING OF MASKSOct 19, 201521 votes

Frankly I think the movement speed boost should be removed; or hell, have it replaced by a self-slow to reflect his "tiredness," since that's what the tooltip says after all. Oh, what I would give to see rito gut the annoying little -- ahem. I mean, er... he's a bit strong and should be nerfed accordingly. For balance. Not because he counters most of my top laners and I hate his guts, nope.

GorgannanOct 19, 20154 votes

That would destroy him though.

MetalGearTeemuOct 19, 201512 votes

Oh god no, i've got to hold a mobility skill to escape once mega gnar wears off instead of just having more resourceless mobility!

Face The LewdOct 19, 20155 votes

{quoted}

Oh god no, i've got to hold a mobility skill to escape once mega gnar wears off instead of just having more resourceless mobility!

You mean the spell you use to engage as Mega Gnar to ult?

MetalGearTeemuOct 19, 20158 votes

You mean you might have to commit to your engage and may not have your mobility skill back up for a few seconds after you leave mega gnar? ( at least until you build CDR or level it? )

Oh what a fucking tragety that would be huh?

considering its 18 if you leave it at a one point wonder. and by your 3rd point its cooldown matches the duration of gnar. even without any CDR.

I don't think this is nearly the horrible hamstringing effect you think it is.

Mistress MadokaOct 20, 20151 votes

-sniff sniff- I smell a bit of pent-up salt

Midder ScrayOct 19, 20157 votes

I love Gnar and I really don't want to see him gutted, but I do think replacing the movement speed boost with a slow would be a good idea. It doesn't really make sense for him to be "tired" and more energetic at the same time

Other than that I don't think Gnar's THAT strong. I mean, he's definitely strong for sure, but he's not OP or anything. I think Gnar's in a pretty good place right now and he doesn't need to be changed. He turns into a destructive, tanky beast that will take down anything in his path, and that's just who he is and I think he should stay that way

YumaS2AstralOct 20, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Midder Scray,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JErNEbgk,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2015-10-19T17:31:45.175+0000)

I love Gnar and I really don't want to see him gutted, but I do think replacing the movement speed boost with a slow would be a good idea. It doesn't really make sense for him to be "tired" and more energetic at the same time

Other than that I don't think Gnar's THAT strong. I mean, he's definitely strong for sure, but he's not OP or anything. I think Gnar's in a pretty good place right now and he doesn't need to be changed. He turns into a destructive, tanky beast that will take down anything in his path, and that's just who he is and I think he should stay that way

The only problem with Gnar is a problem that has never been solved ever since he was released; he is too much of a lane bully for how strong his late game is, even though his late game isn't that strong, he isn't that weak either. He counters melees too much.

Riot wants to make him weak early game and strong late, but the problem is that with the way that his kit works, he will always be strong early game, unless he is completely gutted. Being resourceless, with a escape, and lots of tools to kite the enemy (a slow on his Q, movement speed boost on his W, and a escape on his E) and not to mention his Mega form which has high base damage early, Gnar will always be a strong early game champion.

Actually xPekeOct 20, 20151 votes

At the moment, he's not a huge lane bully like before.

Midder ScrayOct 21, 20151 votes

He's not that bad of a lane bully if he's up against someone who counters him well, or your jungler is good and keeps an eye on your lane, and he can be easily taken down if you watch his rage bar and time your fights

So Gnar's early game can be shut down if you do it right. The bully can be bullied

And honestly, I've only been playing League for a little over a year I think, so I'm not exactly sure when Gnar came out or what his history is in detail, but apparently he used to be a lot stronger. And as you may know, the current meta is filled with extremely mobile champs, flash, and also CC. So that could be why Gnar seems kinda overpowered, because of all his CC and people get used to just going anywhere they want and being able to easily escape, but Gnar says fuck that

So basically, yes, Gnar's early game is pretty strong, but it can be countered, and there are many other champs who also have great early games who are MUCH worse than Gnar (Yasuo, Kalista, Darius, etc.) If you think Gnar's bad, play against one of those jerks... It's just terrible. Gnar's annoying but all you have to do against him is play it safe, stay away from him when he's at full, or close to full rage, and have your jungler help you out and make sure he won't go into Mega Gnar while you're fighting him

Puppet33rOct 20, 20152 votes

No way. That would create an opportunity for an actual counterplay. Riot would never approve.

TurquoiseYoshiOct 20, 20152 votes

To be fair, replacing the speed with a slow would make him worse than he was on release. Now, instead of his changing forms being annoying, it can kill you easily. You want to chase down that kill? Go fuck yourself. You want to get away from someone? Go fuck yourself. You want to stay generally near the fight after you transform back? GO FUCK YOURSELF. Removing the speed would be okay, but this would, at the very least, murder his non-tank build paths (since, otherwise, he wouldn't survive being ganked in Mega form ever), and, at worst, completely gut the champion.

Although, to preserve the non-tank build path, we could make it possible to lock yourself into Mini form. That would be cool.

KING OF MASKSOct 20, 20151 votes

I think you're being... hyperbolic, to say the least. Gnar is already all about artificial windows of opportunity that are (relatively) out of your control. Like I said I don't play Gnar at all, but I highly doubt that the speed boost is just that absolutely critical to make his kit function.

Plus, if you find Gnar's changing forms "annoying" or difficult to deal with... maybe you're playing the wrong champion? I dunno, that strikes me as being sort of the idea behind the entire champion.

TurquoiseYoshiOct 20, 20153 votes

I'm not saying that the speed boost needs to exist, I'm saying that the idea of a slow instead would really just destroy him. Remember how he was unreliable and complete crap on release? Yeah, that's what this nerf might bring him back to.

There are times when you're kiting, and then, randomly, you turn Mega and are fucked up. It's not a problem on tank Gnar, but AD Gnar hates it, and would die completely from a nerf like this, and I though alternative builds were a good thing.

Gator RaidOct 20, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=KING OF MASKS,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JErNEbgk,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-10-19T14:24:27.700+0000)

Frankly I think the movement speed boost should be removed; or hell, have it replaced by a self-slow to reflect his "tiredness," since that's what the tooltip says after all. Oh, what I would give to see rito gut the annoying little -- ahem. I mean, er... he's a bit strong and should be nerfed accordingly. For balance. Not because he counters most of my top laners and I hate his guts, nope.

Someone got rekt

AltricadOct 19, 20159 votes

An actual weakness would be to slow him down as he comes out of mega-form, so that it's actually possible to kill him

Mega form has too much damage/cc to get close

Mini form is too fast/slippery

He really does need a "window" of oppurtunity

AnidanOct 19, 20153 votes

I could see removing the speed boost, but punishing him for his rage mechanic by slowing him seems like a cheap way to give a window of opportunity.

Count ZubatOct 19, 20155 votes

Meanwhile, Blitzcrank slows himself after W effect wears off.

Jet SettOct 19, 20152 votes

Don't forget that it's Gnar's passive, not an ability that he can choose to use whenever he wants, but something he needs to manage in order to not waste tanky cc monster mode. unless you mean slowed down after hyper from Mega Gnar ends, then that wouldn't be so bad.

AnidanOct 19, 20154 votes

What's good for one champion is not necessarily good for another.

Actually xPekeOct 20, 20151 votes

Meanwhile, Blitzcrank can choose to use his W while Gnar cannot choose to use his Passive.

Ace Access Oct 20, 20151 votes

he needs to get caught in a closing window

and by window I'm mean a guillotine

AuroramancerOct 19, 20156 votes

He gets hyper, then tires out...

JustMyBassCannonOct 19, 20155 votes

Nah, it kinda makes sense.

He's moving, then suddenly becomes small again. He still has the same forward momentum, but with a much smaller amount of mass, making him move much faster.

The MS boost decays over the duration, like he's stumbling back to his normal pace from the spontaneous burst of speed.

AlëkOct 19, 20154 votes

I think slowing him upon exit from Mega-Gnar is too much. When he comes out of Megagnar he will most likely be in the middle of the enemy team. So essentially he becomes literally useless bag of meat sitting in the middle of their team. There is no way for him to outplay anyone from that position. I think something more along the lines of him not being able to cast spells until the MS boost ends makes more sense. Gnar's strength isn't his damage or his versatile build, its his ability to switch from offense to defense so quickly and so exceptionally more than anything else. He can engage for tons of CC and dmg to the enemy team, then minignar and kite and poke the fuck out of the enemy team. I think this idea DOES give you a windows to target him and burst him since he won't be able to kite you or hop away, but it also rewards good positioning since if you plan correctly and place yourself close to a bush or exit his MS Boost might allow him to escape.

Meep ManOct 19, 20153 votes

I think the bigger point is why does it matter? The entire point of it was he goes into a fit of rage like a baby. And like any angry baby, they get tired.

The Yetii RiderOct 19, 20152 votes

The problem is that it doesn't matter how low Mini Gnars base stats are if he just builds tanky bruiser.

Transformation champions should not change roles. It makes them way too versatile.

SulghunterOct 19, 20152 votes

item 3070 Quinn

The Yetii RiderOct 19, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Quinn is not a transformation champion. She is more like Shyvana, in that all of her abilities become slightly different when she ults.

Transformation champions like Nidalee, Gnar and Jayce gain completely new abilities when they shift forms.

WarlockLawOct 19, 20152 votes

Gnar's abilities are about as different between forms as Quinn's abilities are.

The Yetii RiderOct 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Gnar's abilities are about as different between forms as Quinn's abilities are.

No, Mini-Gnar doesn't HAVE a W or R active, and Mega Gnar does. That's two abilities extra, and both of them are stuns. How is that "not different"?

WarlockLawOct 20, 20151 votes

Let's compare Gnar's q to itself. Both are line skillshots that can hit multiple targets. One returns towards Gnar so he can catch it to lower the cd, the other stops but can be picked up to lower its cd. Both versions of e are a short range jump, one bounces off of a single target for extra distance the other has large aoe damage. The w is the most different as in one form it's a three hit passive whole in the other it's a line nuke stun. Gnar can only use his ult at full rage/mega, but it's only one ult.

Now let's look at Quinn. Both her q's are aoe nukes that apply a blind, one as a skillshot and the other around her. Her e in both forms is a targeted mobility spell, one as a gap closer and one that sets you to max auto range, both of which interrupt enemy channels. Her w active is the same in both forms however the passive changes from proccing off of her passive to being static and at twice the value. Now for Quinn's ult the first cast just switches stances, honestly not much of an ult by itself. The second cast switches back to Quinn and deals aoe execute damage near her as she does.

Now let's look at a real stance changing champion, Jayce. His ranged q is a line nuke aoe skillshot that hits the first unit, the other q is a targeted gap closer. His ranged w sets his attack speed to the cap for the next 3 auto attacks, his melee w is an aoe burn around him with a passive on hit mana refund. His ranged e puts up a gate that increases allies movement speed and doubles the distance of his ranged q, while his melee e is a targeted knock back.

Now between those 3 champions I would say that Gnar and Quinn are in a category separate from Jayce. However if you still don't believe me I have one more point, Gnar and Quinn maintain the cooldowns of their basic abilities when they switch stances, in other words if Quinn switches right after she uses her e she will not be able to use her gap closer. Meanwhile Jayce has separate cooldowns for his 6 basic abilities, so if he were to shoot his q and then transform he could immediately use his gap closer. Jayce shares that trait with Nidalee and Elise while Gnar and Quinn do not.

The Yetii RiderOct 20, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Let's compare Gnar's q to itself. Both are line skillshots that can hit multiple targets. One returns towards Gnar so he can catch it to lower the cd, the other stops but can be picked up to lower its cd. Both versions of e are a short range jump, one bounces off of a single target for extra distance the other has large aoe damage. The w is the most different as in one form it's a three hit passive whole in the other it's a line nuke stun. Gnar can only use his ult at full rage/mega, but it's only one ult.

Now let's look at Quinn. Both her q's are aoe nukes that apply a blind, one as a skillshot and the other around her. Her e in both forms is a targeted mobility spell, one as a gap closer and one that sets you to max auto range, both of which interrupt enemy channels. Her w active is the same in both forms however the passive changes from proccing off of her passive to being static and at twice the value. Now for Quinn's ult the first cast just switches stances, honestly not much of an ult by itself. The second cast switches back to Quinn and deals aoe execute damage near her as she does.

Now let's look at a real stance changing champion, Jayce. His ranged q is a line nuke aoe skillshot that hits the first unit, the other q is a targeted gap closer. His ranged w sets his attack speed to the cap for the next 3 auto attacks, his melee w is an aoe burn around him with a passive on hit mana refund. His ranged e puts up a gate that increases allies movement speed and doubles the distance of his ranged q, while his melee e is a targeted knock back.

Now between those 3 champions I would say that Gnar and Quinn are in a category separate from Jayce. However if you still don't believe me I have one more point, Gnar and Quinn maintain the cooldowns of their basic abilities when they switch stances, in other words if Quinn switches right after she uses her e she will not be able to use her gap closer. Meanwhile Jayce has separate cooldowns for his 6 basic abilities, so if he were to shoot his q and then transform he could immediately use his gap closer. Jayce shares that trait with Nidalee and Elise while Gnar and Quinn do not.

None of this changes the fact that Mega Gnar, as a kit, functions BETTER than existing pure tanks like Malphite, Maokai and Sejuani, but he also gets to have a ranged auto attack form during lane that not only guarantees him immunity to harass from champions like Vladimir and Ryze (which is the main reason pure tanks can't go top) but also allows him to harass those same champions throughout the laning phase, contributing to the problem.

WarlockLawOct 20, 20151 votes

I wasn't really addressing his state of balance just comparing his kit to other transformation champions to show why he is more like Quinn than he is like Jayce/Nidalee/Elise.

As for that conversation yes Mega Gnar can function better than most tanks in most situations, that's why Gnar cant control his rage 100%. If he gets engaged on right after turning back to mini Gnar or while he has low rage he will have to fight in that form and he has no cc and the jump only has so much range if he can't get the double jump he should die if caught out. Gnar is honestly just a champion that you need to learn to play against, if you fight him properly he dies and if not you die.

The Yetii RiderOct 21, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I wasn't really addressing his state of balance just comparing his kit to other transformation champions to show why he is more like Quinn than he is like Jayce/Nidalee/Elise.

As for that conversation yes Mega Gnar can function better than most tanks in most situations, that's why Gnar cant control his rage 100%. If he gets engaged on right after turning back to mini Gnar or while he has low rage he will have to fight in that form and he has no cc and the jump only has so much range if he can't get the double jump he should die if caught out. Gnar is honestly just a champion that you need to learn to play against, if you fight him properly he dies and if not you die.

And for the 20 seconds or so that he's Mega, he completely turns fights, because again, he's the most powerful, overloaded tank in the game with ridiculous CC.

If he just dashes away after he tires out...he's still built full tank. He may have slightly less base health, but he has more movement speed and plenty of tankiness from his item set. That argument doesn't really hold water.

WarlockLawOct 21, 20151 votes

Playing around his passive makes or breaks him. If you can teamfight while he is mini and kill most/all of his team he can't do anything. While he is mega it's all about disengage/kiting.

Continuing off of that there are very few champions that should lose lane to Gnar because if you figure out how the match up plays out and show Gnar you know it, he will be forced into farm mode

The Yetii RiderOct 21, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Playing around his passive makes or breaks him. If you can teamfight while he is mini and kill most/all of his team he can't do anything. While he is mega it's all about disengage/kiting.

Continuing off of that there are very few champions that should lose lane to Gnar because if you figure out how the match up plays out and show Gnar you know it, he will be forced into farm mode

There are very few champions that "should" lose lane to Gnar, but plenty still do. He's a full tank that bullies out Nasus, Malphite, Jax, and any other top laners with a weak early game. He pays no price for his insane CC because his laning phase is as safe as Caitlyn's.

WarlockLawOct 21, 20151 votes

Malphite has a lot of harass that Gnar cant really avoid and at level 6 Malphite can easily kill Gnar with his ult, neither of them should lose its a skill match up.

Jax is a little harder but if you can set up Jax's stun while Gnar is mini he's going to die. While Jax is at a disadvantage I wouldn't write him out.

Also both of those champions are relatively weak themselves, their losing lane attributes to them being weak more than Gnar being strong.

Finally Gnar's ranged form has the shortest attack range for all ranged champions in the game. His auto attack harass isn't that great because it usually puts him in engage range for everyone in the game. I'm pretty sure Morde could walk up to mini Gnar and force the jump