Something that has not been said enough...

Jimboslicer1··5 votes·791 views

I know that on the boards this is the apparent minority, but I like Dynamic Que. There I said it.

People talk about how they get flamed from premades, and yes that does happen. i will not sugar coat it, it happens it will happen, and no matter what you do people are assholes you cant stop the hate. But DQ takes away the attempt at 5 people fighting for the same position, which can lead to infighting and overall chances of loss that much greater.

And as for those who say, 'Just give us both Solo Que and Dynamic Que', just stop. Really all you are saying when you say that is that you have not put more than 3 minutes of thought into that statement. Solo players are key to make the DQ work. If all of the solo players defect to their own que, then a 4 man premade cannot work at all.

Also for those hating on Riot for their addressing this issue, your points are valid. Riot has been very bad at communicating the problems, but they are trying, its not like they have done something like this before.

Now back to my main point, DQ. I honestly feel better playing with 3, 4, 5 of my friends at a time. But I also enjoy queing as a solo. To me when I play with friends its purely because they are also on at the same time and we can enjoy the game we all love together. So why cant we all just get along and make the community for this game the best in all of gaming communities?

8 Comments

Slythion3 votes

no matter what you do people are assholes you cant stop the hate

Ya but at least SQ didn't almost encourage it by pitting Solo Players against groups that would only team up against you to be toxic

But DQ takes away the attempt at 5 people fighting for the same position, which can lead to infighting and overall chances of loss that much greater.

Well actually, the new Champ Select is what fixed that. Dynamic Queue had absolutely nothing to do with that (it's a misunderstanding that has been around since both DQ and the Champ Select where released at the same time, but I feel like it's been long enough for players to realize the difference).

If all of the solo players defect to their own que, then a 4 man premade cannot work at all.

Then why is it the Solo Player's (aka the system that league was running on for years) fault and not the new 4-man groups that have to take the fall? I see no reason why 4-mans should be allowed in ranked (leave that casual system to judge "skill" for norms for friends to have fun together).

I honestly feel better playing with 3, 4, 5 of my friends at a time. But I also enjoy queing as a solo. To me when I play with friends its purely because they are also on at the same time and we can enjoy the game we all love together.

I can't express this enough, but go play norms. If you are playing the game for enjoyment then you should be playing norms with friends. Ranked is about individual skill and polluting it with "happy happy friend time" because "it makes it more fun" isn't a valid excuse in my book (and for a lot of others as well).

So why cant we all just get along and make the community for this game the best in all of gaming communities?

Because Riot split the community in two when they decided to completely change the purpose of the game to better fit the casual friend player's ideals. When they did that, it basically said "fck you" to all the dedicated solo players that made up a large portion of the community.


And just to clarify, I have no hard feeling to you. If any of my responses seemed harsh or ill-toned, it's simply because I've seen these excuses for why DQ is better 1000000x and every single time they were shot down due to the reasons I've voiced above. This argument is old and it gets tiring to repeat the same thing over and over again without much result, yaknow?

Jimboslicer11 votes

First off thank you for a well thought out replay, and not hate.

Then why is it the Solo Player's (aka the system that league was running on for years) fault and not the new 4-man groups that have to take the fall? I see no reason why 4-mans should be allowed in ranked (leave that casual system to judge "skill" for norms for friends to have fun together).

I never said it was the solo player's fault, I was just stating a flaw in the system that does not allow for both DQ and SQ to cooexist.

I can't express this enough, but go play norms. If you are playing the game for enjoyment then you should be playing norms with friends. Ranked is about individual skill and polluting it with "happy happy friend time" because "it makes it more fun" isn't a valid excuse in my book (and for a lot of others as well).

Also we would go play norms if there was a feeling of accomplishment to it. Yeah when we want to try something new we do draft a few games to see if it can work, but even draft doesn't feel as competitive. We play ranked to have a sense of challenge and true accomplishment.

There has to be something that Riot can do, and I'm sure that if any compromise is met it would be what they did to higher mmr ques, limit the party size to 3.

Slythion3 votes

Basically it boils down to two very large issues:

  1. The purpose of ranked:

Ranked Games were to evaluate a player's individual skill in SQ. If you wanted to try out as a team, they offered 5-man ranked and you were graded completely separate than from solo ranked. Imo, this was a completely fair system, seeing as how you could still bring a 2nd player with you (it didn't completely jack up the system) and the 3-4 man premades really didn't have an issue with it. Besides, that's a very small selection of the community anyways.

With the change to DQ, and it's important to understand that Dynamic Queue solely means that you can queue with a 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5-man premades and have it count towards your individual ranked score (doesn't that just sound wrong to you?), it completely changed the meaning of ranked. Ranked has minimal representation of your personal skill in this season, and has a very large representation of the skill of your friends. To me, that shouldn't be what ranked is about at all.

Now some argue that DQ promotes a more team-orientated mindset for league. While this may be true for the 3 or 4-man premades, my question is this: What popular sports allow you play with a fraction of the team? I base this question off of the "Riot Plz" Blog in which they stated they wanted League to become viewed as more of a traditional sport and not some video game. I 100% applaud this ideal, but DQ was not the answer. SQ provided both pure individual skill representation and team skill representation, both fairly accurate. DQ meddled these two together and now rankings mean very little to say the least, completely ruining the purpose of ranked imo.

  1. Trade-offs

At the core, Riot basically did this: They took a significant portion of power from Solo Players (who had no say in the matter) and gave it to the small 3-4man premade part of the community. Not only was this an issue that area, but it created issues. Riot made a large portion of the communities contributions in ranked nearly obsolete, and for what? So that a small portion of the league community could have more fun in ranked? I mean sure, if you play the game with friends it's a great deal for you isn't it? But think about the much greater cost that Solo Players were forced to pay for such a silly gain for other players.

Conclusion:

The intentions of DQ was pure. It was a good idea in theory, but has clearly flopped and left a lot of players feeling unsatisfied and useless (rightfully so). In my opinion, those who agree with DQ are either ignorant or just lack sympathy for those that it clearly hurts. I do not mean these as insults but simply as my version of the truth. Hopefully I've allowed for yourself and any others that read this understand the struggle that DQ has forced players through for quite frankly, a lackluster payback.

As for:

I never said it was the solo player's fault, I was just stating a flaw in the system that does not allow for both DQ and SQ to cooexist.

I believe you misunderstand, I did not mean to call you out for blaming Solo Players but was trying to state that the punishment for implementing DQ (and not SQ) has fallen on the Solo Player population's shoulders. My mistake for not clarifying that well enough, I do agree with you though that DQ and SQ can not exist together, it would split the community too much and wait times would increase wayyy too much for both systems.

and for:

We play ranked to have a sense of challenge and true accomplishment.

I think I've stated this enough but I'll say it again. How do you think solo players feel about being placed in matches where player's, both enemy and their own teammates, have advantages that they don't have? I feel as though that saps away the "challenge" and "true accomplishment" when you win a game knowing it's because your premade was better than theirs.

and for:

There has to be something that Riot can do, and I'm sure that if any compromise is met it would be what they did to higher mmr ques, limit the party size to 3.

They did not implement DQ without knowing what it would do to solo players. They've had months to figure out how to help solo players (even while they were making DQ) and when they said in the round table that they have no clue what to do yet, there doesn't seem much possibility for a solution. If they are going to reduce the max premades to 3, think about the 5-mans that get screwed over. It would be much better to just cut out the 3/4-man teams and allow 5-mans to have their ranked back, don't you think?

Jimboslicer11 votes

If they are going to reduce the max premades to 3, think about the 5-mans that get screwed over. It would be much better to just cut out the 3/4-man teams and allow 5-mans to have their ranked back, don't you think?

I think they should reduce the max number to 3 and give the 5 man their own que back. I for one, when I play with friends normally we get 3 on at anytime and then look for a 4/5th person. I also personally think that the large pat of the problem is the 4/5 man premades and the 3 mans are, mostly fine.

You have the best laid out argument I have seen from the 'Bring back SQ' side I have seen. I still have my own Ideas for what they could do to try and salvage DQ, but you have opened my eyes to some issues in the rest of the community.

Slythion2 votes

Glad I could help man <3

Jessicaaa1 votes

I've made another thread if you're interested in a different angle/opinion http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/3PPleKBd-all-this-dq-hate-lets-talk Reading the comments here just gave me a thought... What if solo players were compensated when slotted in with premades? It's far more challenging to play against a coordinated team when you are with people you've never met. Could that be solved by mitigating the LP loss when your team loses that match, and giving you a little more LP gain if you pull off a victory? At the moment the opposite is probably happening to some extent - according to riot you would be playing a team that is slightly lower mmr than you meaning your LP loss would be greater and the gain would be higher. What if this was adjusted, and even better, the bonus made visible to players?

You might see a lot more solo players going for the LP bonus but the benefit of premades is still there. What do you guys think?

Jessicaaa1 votes

Hrm just realised this is somewhat addressed here http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/9YqzOFht-riot-is-punishing-solo-players-with-heavier-lp-losses-in-dynamic-queue But the suggestion for Solo bonuses still stands.. Especially when considering the Hextech bonuses for parties etc... I think both methods of queuing should be encouraged, rather than many bonuses just for being in a premade.

YJRBqwXJcS1 votes

{quoted}

But DQ takes away the attempt at 5 people fighting for the same position

"Something that has not been said enough..." DYNAMIC QUEUE AND THE NEW CHAMPION SELECT ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.

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