Why the ADC meta is our fault

Birdie Sànders·Jun 23, 2017·108 votes·5,469 views

"ADC IN 2k17 LUL" "TANK META OP"

we've outplayed ourselves

146 Comments

ChargeItDownMidJun 23, 201785 votes

[deleted]

xWatersJun 23, 201743 votes

You can thank reddit

RainfallJun 23, 201713 votes

riot has been buffing botlane since the start of the season. its not something new.

MordepoolJun 23, 20178 votes

{quoted}

riot has been buffing botlane since the start of season 1 its not something new.

FTFY

Hello I am BirdJun 24, 20179 votes

Actually, the ADC/Support bot lane only became meta around the Season 1 Finals ######Remembers this is a joke post

Pierce The VealJun 24, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Hello I am Bird,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-24T00:32:29.481+0000)

Actually, the ADC/Support bot lane only became meta around the Season 1 Finals ######Remembers this is a joke post

And it has never left. Closest it came to leaving was a half week of mordekaiser bot and then the occasional Ziggs picks. But at that point ADC's were in top, mid, and bottom lane. We've gotten to a point where we had fucking ADC support.

Baron PerenoldeJun 24, 20174 votes

Ah yes, and when Ziggs started to be a thing, I remember all the crying about adcs "becoming obsolete", followed swiftly by Riot assuring their golden children that such wouldn't be the case and nerfs would follow should Ziggs become mainstay.

UpDownLeftRightABJun 24, 20172 votes

I blame EU. I liked Ashe Mid meta.

GULAG 4 UJun 23, 20178 votes

[deleted]

StillnameJun 23, 201710 votes

That probably applies to boards more then the league sub. If I had to say the league sub is way more obsessed with esports then the actual game.

Just going over there to look I think there are only 2 posts on the frontpage right now that are even about gameplay.

RalanrJun 23, 201731 votes

Sits down in his favorite rocking chair "See, it all started with the marksmen update."

xShiNjiNxJun 23, 201715 votes

Maybe thats where it began lol, but it was clear to me after the assassin update.

"omg bullshit, so much dmg no counter play!! I should be able to solo push a side wave on adc past river and not die!!"

AirKingNeoJun 23, 20175 votes

No. The marksmen update. That's when they stole Trinity and Maw.

ThefrostyvikingJun 23, 20173 votes

.....Are marksmen building maw? And trinity?

Wasn't it always like only Irelia, jax and Ez that built trinity while like....

like.....

Talon and zed and sometimes Yas who built maw?

AirKingNeoJun 23, 20171 votes

Ok, maybe you don't know history well, but I'll tell you.

During the Marksmen update, Trinity was turned into a Marksmen item. Then bruisers got it back the patch after the Mage update, because Marksmen stole Rageblade (and Riot's bad design to keep "Phantom Hit").

Maw, ever since it became a big survival stick with Lifesteal, Spellvamp, and used to have Attack Speed, was then bought by AD carries. Now Maw sucks because of AD carries. No, assassins didn't the attack speed.

ThefrostyvikingJun 24, 20174 votes

What happened to trinity to make it a marksman item? I can only remember the AP to CDR and the crit to ats change. (second change you wrote of?)

Which favored Irelia and jax more than any other.

And the maw changes......it was essentially more AD, cdr, better shield and was made all around better for assassins like Zed and Talon while marksmen lost it? I can only think they built it when it gave ats.

Wukong might also like the current one.

Issue is however that damage has risen across the board, maw doesn't provide enough to be really worth it unless snowballing.

And only for a few champions.

I mean, when playing a mage i am usually able to ignore hexdrinker as long as i poke just a little more than otherwise. It´s not a big barrier or anything.

Big LincolnJun 23, 201730 votes

"supports are so weak omgggggggggggggggg"

item 3107 item 3190 item 3109 item 3504

Mody birdJun 23, 201715 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-06-23T18:52:19.759+0000)

"supports are so weak omgggggggggggggggg"

These 4 items are the most bullshit items

ElikainJun 24, 201716 votes

And yet, when these items didn't exist, supports were literal trash champions and only damage supports worked in bot lane. Like, come on. This complaining for no reason is just getting ridiculous.

ThilmerJun 24, 20173 votes

{quoted}

And yet, when these items didn't exist, supports were literal trash champions and only damage supports worked in bot lane. Like, come on. This complaining for no reason is just getting ridiculous.

It was the time of: "Why the hell every support is Brand, Annie or full AP Lux?"

AhristocatsJun 23, 20172 votes

i said knight's vow was a fcking bad idea when it got released nobody listened it was garbage, and then riot buffed it like 5 times in a row

now it's bought on every single bruiser/tank/tank support, you no longer have any purpose to buy any tank item over knight's vow and adc gets god knows how much damage reduction with their itemization+this

Big LincolnJun 23, 20178 votes

kv should be reworked, no more damage transfer, give it like doubled MS bonus if your ally is taking damage/is low on health

shouldn't passively reduce the damage they take but should enable you to protect them better with your own kit

NymzoJun 23, 20176 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=000500010000,timestamp=2017-06-23T19:11:26.397+0000)

kv should be reworked, no more damage transfer, give it like doubled MS bonus if your ally is taking damage/is low on health

So basically a Soraka passif? And Soraka passif is not even that great to begin with. Do you want this item to be the new item 3056 or what?

I get that you want to remove the dmg reduction but the MS would be SUPER situational and almost useless in combat.

SpoofghoulJun 23, 20174 votes

not a bad idea

though i find item 3046 item 3812 item 3504 more bullshit tbh, and lifesteal could be toned down as well

i can live with redemption locket being there those have been re balanced a number of times and look ok now

or they could simply remove item 3036 & item 3033 and only leave item 3035 that would fix a lot too

Critmaster GarenJun 23, 201713 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-06-23T18:52:19.759+0000)

"supports are so weak omgggggggggggggggg"

i dont even see strong support itemization as much of a problem. because you can apply those heals and shields to any member on the team.

but ffs i just hate the fact that riot made these items available to ranged carries.

item 3139 item 3812 item 3046 item 3072 item 3026

why do so many of their big damage items have this much defense attached to them?

there is no reason pd as the biggest stat stick for multiplicative stats for adc also grants damage reduction.

there is no real reason mercurial has lifesteal. like isnt the fact that you get an "oh shit i fucked up button" on a big ad + mr item enough?

there is no reason for this version of g.a. to even exist. what was wrong with the old one? why in the FUCK do they get this passive without any sort of tradeoff?

Big LincolnJun 23, 20172 votes

I would much rather have more varied and interesting support kits tbh

50ShadesOfÀDCJun 23, 20171 votes

Given how many times i saw on youtube adc's getting oneshot by zed,syndra,lux,kata it is actually good and those items are still not enough to keep them alive.And DD+PD is mostly built on Graves and Draven because for other ADC's they arent good compared to their usual build.

SolidariusJun 24, 20174 votes

lets be honest here, if ADC's are geting oneshot by zed,syndra,lux,kata, there has been a grave mis positioning by the ADC,

or the Zed/syndra/lux/kata are so far ahead in gold and items that they most likely can 1 shot or 1/3 everyone else on the team including the "tank".

SkiasJun 23, 20177 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=00050002,timestamp=2017-06-23T20:15:59.408+0000)

i dont even see strong support itemization as much of a problem. because you can apply those heals and shields to any member on the team.

but ffs i just hate the fact that riot made these items available to ranged carries.

why do so many of their big damage items have this much defense attached to them?

there is no reason pd as the biggest stat stick for multiplicative stats for adc also grants damage reduction.

there is no real reason mercurial has lifesteal. like isnt the fact that you get an "oh shit i fucked up button" on a big ad + mr item enough?

there is no reason for this version of g.a. to even exist. what was wrong with the old one? why in the FUCK do they get this passive without any sort of tradeoff?

The combination of giving ADCs tons of defense items and strapping damage to it, then also giving supports mitigation for adcs has made a bastard child.

Critmaster GarenJun 23, 20175 votes

{quoted}

The combination of giving ADCs tons of defense items and strapping damage to it, then also giving supports mitigation for adcs has made a bastard child.

so lets start by stripping adc of their defense on their big damage items.

step 1. revert item 3026 to pre tank update, as it was perfectily fine.

General Esdeath Jun 23, 201729 votes

"we"

the adc2k17 was started by bad adc players who didn't understand why they were being "one shot" by "tanks" like full AD Darius or full crit Garen under their tower at 400 HP.

The tank meta had nothing to do with actual tanks, rather champs (usually AP like Ekko Fizz ) becoming viable tanks with sunfire, iceborne, and grasp, due to their % HP damage they could shred tanks had the base damage to burst squishy champs. Grasp kept them alive vs tanks/bruisers.

Riot just has a huge bias where they favor ranged champs.

SkorchJun 23, 201715 votes

First off, in January ADC's WERE in a bad spot, less because they were weak, more because the meta tactic was 4 man the shit outta them (which im pretty sure i made a post about. "DO NOT BUFF ADCs")

Second of all, NO ONE HAS USED "ADC IN 2K17" UNIRONICALLY SINCE THEN. The only people still saying it like its true, are the ones saying that people say it, which no one does. That phrase is just an upvote farm message, which is what this thread is.

Dextix LTJun 23, 20172 votes

Yes, that meme is still used unironicaly to THIS DAY, you should check some of the adc discussion threads. People STILL USE THAT FUCKING MEME!

SkorchJun 23, 20176 votes

All i see are ADC discussion threads, complaining about how strong they are, and then theres that one idiot like "ADC IN 2K17 RIGHT GUYS?" and he just looks like an idiot because everyone KNOWS ADCs arent bad anymore.

SasogwaJun 23, 201711 votes

"targeted ranged spells are unhealthy and need counterplay"

Yeah, but they're the only good safeguards we have against range and mobility creep. Since skillshots are obviously harder to land on far away/mobile targets and favourise range and mobility over melee.

Sraeg2013Jun 23, 201710 votes

Every meta is an ADC meta.

LyndrisJun 23, 20177 votes

LOL 10/10

https://hugelolcdn.com/comments/2062873.gif

LordGeovanniJun 23, 20177 votes

Not like we had a 5 adc team meta this exact time last year. Riot ignores compliants about every other class being weak but when they fuck everyone else for adcs we did it. I neve agreed with adc 2k17 and spoke against that bs on the boards

Pierce The VealJun 24, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=godly lord,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EEiJKsmJ,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-06-23T18:07:07.101+0000)

"ADC IN 2k17 LUL" "TANK META OP"

we've outplayed ourselves

"Holy fuck assassins are OP how come they can kill me 100-0 when they're 10 kills ahead"

Destroy all of ADC's counters, give all the ADC's nice practical reworks that make them scale better, make AD caster and bruiser items become "ADC items," then wonder why all of a sudden ADC is OP.

Maligaro SpikeJun 23, 20174 votes

I love when adc mains write essays carefully explaining why the current meta is unfavorable to them and how ADC and their items need buffs...holy fuck just admit that ADCs are busted right now

BALDG1VEN BOOMERJun 23, 20173 votes

People will cry about any meta honestly.

GelmousJun 23, 20173 votes

honestly all you guys do here is whine and complain i'm genuinely interested of why didn't riot merge these boards with memes and games and restricted any sort of discussion revolving around balance, you're allowed to joke around but no touching the balance subject because everybody here yells like a monkey oh nerf this oh buff that, this is weak this is strong .. etc etc

i never complain about what riot does and never will, literally the only thing i dislike about this game is autofill and that's pretty much it and i still don't open a thread and complain about it.

YaskamasandwichJun 24, 20173 votes

It actually really start with the Fiora update in season 5 when she gained %true damage. It could have possibly started with the Gangplank update before that, but he seems way more balanced and tamed now. He actually has counterplay. Anyway Fiora lead to the juggernaut update which made things worse by forcing tanks into mid game champions. Tanks no longer have a say in late game anymore with their group CC and are just blood packs for Marksmen. So now Marksmen are the grand overlords.

rtbf221651412Jun 24, 20173 votes

You outplayed yourselves while I was going wtf.

pixelvoxelJun 24, 20173 votes

I don't know what anyone's talking about. I've never seen any intense drain tanking without someone being ridiculously fed and if you're getting 3 shot by an ADC you'd have to be squishy and they'd need to have item 3031 and a decent amount of crit chance.

Tobias BracknerJun 24, 20173 votes

The meta is literally our fault.

That is how a meta works.

It's what the players choose.

LoL is unique in that it creates imaginary metas where people get complacent and whine for nerfs rather than actually learn how to defeat what is popular.

ThilmerJun 24, 20173 votes

When I said "ADC 2k17" I was talking about nerfing the absurd burst damage of the assasins, not asking for turning ADCS into ranged killers with tank resistance and sustainde burst damage.

And I haven't complained about tanks since season 4.

So not my fault. [zombie-nunu-bummed]