Seriously in my last 6 or so games people were begging not to be stuck jungle.
I understand that the extra gold thing on jungler items was a bad decision but damn didn't think people would want to stop jungling all together.
I got to try it out earlier and honestly it was an unneeded and miserable change.
Woodakoodashooda102 votesIt doesn't matter how good you are at jungling. You will always be 2 levels behind everyone else on the map aside from support. You have to spend all your starting gold on jungle items, clear the jungle quickly without dying via invasion, go b to get an item that will help gank, go back into the jungle to try gaining enough xp to make an impact in team fights while hoping your jungle wasn't invaded/your whole team doesn't die on you, and then give the occasional gank with, at best, a 50% success rate, in which a failure is just another crippling blow to an already underfed team mate.
I can spend most of a game in the jungle as Warwick and kill every neutral unit in there n record time and whenever they respawn and I will still be behind everyone on my team.
And how often does a Jungler catch hell for killing an enemy champion? I've been in PvP where the Jungler has been reduced to apologizing for killing enemies when they were trying to get me kills. Why? I'm getting my endless supply of XP and gold from wave after wave of creeps.
People in lanes are in the presidential suite when it comes to getting fed and pampered. The jungler is the traveling gypsy whose presence is loathed if they don't have a 100% success rate!
Riot has turned the Jungler into a bench warmer. He practices off screen to prepare for a game turning play that may never come and gets sent in when someone on the team needs a refresher. At this point, the only viable junglers are ones with insane sustain or massive CC. Assassin jungle? Yeah, right. Not anymore. They're better off dominating mid lane where the most XP comes in.
Additional: And when laning ends, ANYONE on your team can jungle. I recently watched a ranked draft team where a Twitch took dragon at every given opportunity! So then the Jungler becomes a commodity whose biggest impact in the game was staying off lane so the rest of the team could get uber fed.
ImHerVoice16 voteswell you say it like a casual but yeah. you're right.
Now stop making my role feel like I'm a bitch.
Got enough stress don't need to feel like a bitch :|
Kitten of Evil6 votesAdditional: And when laning ends, ANYONE on your team can jungle. I recently watched a ranked draft team where a Twitch took dragon at every given opportunity! So then the Jungler becomes a commodity whose biggest impact in the game was staying off lane so the rest of the team could get uber fed.
What do you mean "when laning ends"? As soon as your second round of red and blue show up, mid or your ADC feel entitled to take them. Even though they're already ahead of you in levels. You're lucky if they even ask you first before taking.
CIit Yeastwood3 votesI can understand the mids wanting blue. With all the mana nerfs and what not. However, it's your job to let them know that mana regen/CDR items exist, and that one extra Q =/= one extra level that you would gain taking that blue.
Kitten of Evil2 votesRight, many mids want blue. And I'd be happy to give it to them if they ask, at least if there's something else in my jungle that I can clear (so I'm not wasting my time). But if you're 
, for example, then let me take blue. Last time I jungled as Nautilus, I was taking the third blue and my Kat came and last-hitted it with her Q, without asking. 10% CDR alone is not worth me running out of mana and losing experience.
Silents42930 votesYeaaaah. I used to love the jungle, But its getting increasingly difficult to even do it. I am not fond of being levels behind, because I am terrified of feeding the enemy mid laner who just hit 6, and I am just hitting 4.
I am not fond of playing a budget version of my champion.
I am quite sick of the increased pressure to get the dragon as soon as possible, and every second its up now.
I frankly went from jungling every game in S4 to top lane every game in S5.
Sovreign228 votes"I am terrified of feeding the enemy mid laner who just hit 6, and I am just hitting 4."
I have this thought every single game that I jungle. I look at mid who just hit 6 while I have one buff left and am at 70% health. I say to myself: "Looks like it's time to go farm the jungle some more" and proceed to have an epic battle with some chickens who will take me even lower.
Top lane has the same problem and often even has teleport making any would be gank a very risky maneuver to pull off.
JJ H0G2 votesGANK EARLY A N K
E A R L Y
Silents42911 votesThat doesn't mean anything, Even IF you get some kills on yourself as a Jungler you ALWAYS end up behind in levels.
This is assuming the jungle didn't kick your ass already.
Linna Excel14 votes
HandheldBrandon12 votesI already know how to jungle its my second favored role.
Honestly though 2 people in is not worth missing map control and jungle pressure. Those 2 things alone make people play cautious without them strong laning comps will dominate weaker laning comps without fear of retaliation.
Orbv3 votesThe thing is though that two great lane pushers can push to turret and take their jungle together. With junglers being so underleveled their ganks are pretty useless as is. All you really need is a champion with smite, you may lose some map control but there isn't good jungle pressure. Top lane is already the most ganked lane in competitive play, having 2 people up there would cement it.
disregardable13 votesIt's just a very unrewarding way to play. If I make any impact in the game at all when I jungle, it's helping our team lose.
SeoSeBom13 votesdon't tell me you just noticed that riot is stupid as fuck at balancing.
Myrddin9 votesThe jungle in s4 was a joke, a blind monkey could do it and be successful. It didn't punish you for making poor decisions, it didnt punish you for anything it was just there.
The new jungle is fantastic, rewards strategic play, while still being some what flexible. Double smite is really a nice change.
Anittaweiner8 votesHeres why no one wants to jungle and why being a jungle is harsh... I just played a game as shyv jungle and did pretty good got us a drag got some good ganks and did ok no one was complaining then we go to drag and i hit smite a second to early and they steal it. Instantly "GG reported" "learn how to smite" "you are bad u havent done anything the whole game" And i end the game with 6/5/12 which is not the best but its not terrible anyway i went afk cause who wants to help a team who is just gonna say you are bad and usless anyway. We easily could have won but i prefer to let those kind of haters just lose. BTW riot you need a new stat on the loading screen that says 90 percent of afks are cause by a bad mouthing team cause its true. Or at least in my case XD
GloriousKaiser6 votesYou know how support took the longest to show up in a teambuilder?
Yeah... now it's jungler.
HandheldBrandon5 votesI actually gave up on team builder because i can never find a jungler or support. The last time i did it i had to wait almost 20 minutes to find a jungler and 13 to find a support.
1st HanarSpectre5 votesThey did the same thing at the start of season3 (or what is two, I forget it has been a while). They are killing jungle for casuals, yes, jungle main and pros can make it work easy, but for those without LCS level skills or 1000's of jungle game, it puts them at a really disadvantageous disposition. After all, you can not have a game without a jungler, so forcing someone in that role is not only not fun for them, but increasing the difficulty in the jungle it is also dooming them to fall behind or not be very impactful in the game.
Poptart Evelynn5 votesI quit jungle because I'm done with people raging when they don't get a gank every 3 minutes. I switched back to mid :)
tooitchy10 votesand when you do gank, god forbid you get the kill even if it requires diving and flashing out of tower range one hit from death, and the laner you ganked for is sitting back watching his ignite thinking it will do the 25% hp the target has left. And if you aren't there the minute he gets ganked from pushing way too hard without a ward, to save him, you're in for all kinds of [ALL] chat flaming.
Trylobyte5 votesPart of the problem with jungling is that laners in S4 got so used to getting jungle perks that many do it without thinking now, which sets the jungler back because he now needs those things laners take for granted. Mid wants to take raptors and always wants blue buff? Too bad, jungler needs that now. ADC wants red buff? Nope, jungler needs that XP. So, jungle has gotten more selfish than it was in S4 but players in lane are still playing like it's a bonus lane that gives them more gold and shiny buffs.
TheRainInSpain4 votesYou're right, only those with oppressive early dueling power or infinite sustain are having good success for the game's I've been in (Silver -> mid Gold teammates).
Tank jungler? Hahaha, gets invaded and shut down so easily buy anything with moderate amounts of damage or sustain. Assassin jungler? Volibear or another bruiser shows up and ruins your day. Bruiser jungler? Team yells at you for not having the same CC as Nautilus. Mage jungler? Yeah, that's the last time I pick Fiddlesticks. Got immediately countered at champion select and crushed in game, not including the part where both of use were two levels behind both supports.
Either I pick Yi/Tryn and go for a late game push, or I pick something with oppressive OP Riot CEO mains Lee Sin so they can't nerf him champion, or I grab infinite sustain and still be two levels behind the support.
I've had more "Anything but Jungle" in the last month than "Anything but Support" in the last year.
Tough Guy4 votesHave you been on team builder recently? finding a jungler is like finding a diamond in the rough.
TheI3igDaddy3 votesI don't get why people hate jungling so much. Yeah there are a handful of champs that can't really jungle much anymore, maybe I'm just not playing those specific ones.
I'd say that if you can only clear one buff before you get low, try to immediately gank before you get your other buff. You may throw off the enemy team and even get first blood because they don't think you'll come so quickly.
HandheldBrandon16 votesI dont think people hate jungling but this new change really made it miserable.
If you aren't playing J4 or Lee Sin or Vi then you are backing after 2-3 camps. The three mentioned can then come and counter jungle you except for maybe J4. Even if they dont counter jungle they can gank right off the bat with their extremely powerful kits. Nautilus used to be one of the scariest things coming out of the jungle however this change pretty much neutered him into constant farming to keep up. Its awful and i really dont like the change.
Taarki2 votesWW doesn't have to back after 2-3 camps. He can clear the whole jungle on first clear. But he can't really gank until level 6.
Ayame Isaki5 votesI think it is time to learn WW... I really will miss my Eve jungle.
MrPessimist1 votesKeep playing Eve jungle. She is still viable and super fun to play, but I had to change up my runes and masteries and practice her clear for a couple hours. People hate playing her because she’s not “easy mode” like J4 or Lee Sin. She’s a high-risk/high-REWARD jungler, unlike those previously mentioned.
The tough part is coordinating with teammates when ganking which is just a general problem in low elo solo-q anyway. This is also the case when playing my other favorite jungler Nautilus. He absolutely relies on the laner paying attention. Low elo map awareness is crap.
Speaking of Naut, I’m pretty sure he can clear the entire jungle without backing.
I find WW to be kind of boring. He can’t gank until 6 and, to a certain degree, he’s “easy mode” as well.
Ayame Isaki1 votesWhat runes and masteries do you recommend? If you check out my lolking, my second rune page and my 6th masteries are dedicated to her so you can see what I am currently using.
Thanks!
MrPessimist2 votes[{quoted}](name=Ayame Isaki,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AsNAFqrM,comment-id=000900000000000100030000,timestamp=2015-01-31T20:03:14.101+0000)
What runes and masteries do you recommend? If you check out my lolking, my second rune page and my 6th masteries are dedicated to her so you can see what I am currently using.
Thanks!
Your runes are the same as mine, but masteries are different. You should put points in spell/blade weaving since you're doing both ap and ad at the same time. This will give you extra damage. Your defense tree looks good.
Be sure to pull camps out, or at least line them up, while using Q. The trick is to maximize how many creeps you're hitting with a single shot. Make sure you land E on the big monster too. So after gromp, line up Blue so each is gettting hit by Q, take both health pots, E everytime it comes up. Pull wolves out making sure Q hits all of them, then you can usually clear chickens before back. After back get red and gank, gank gank. Don't force ganks though, if nothing is obviously gankable, keep farming or counter jungle. Never lose time gaining xp, if Eve get's behind it's gonna be a rough game.
Abyssphere3 votesMy two problems with the jungle are:
Increased pressure. Specifically of early invades. They seem to be very common right now and it really makes it difficult to justify choosing a weak early jungler because the monsters just hit so hard that it's ridiculously easy to pick off a jungler with a weak start. Saw an Evelynn vs Lee Sin game yesterday and the Lee Sin decided to spend 90% of the game in the enemy jungle, attacking Eve every single time she went into her jungle for an extended period of time. I won't say it was the most efficient use of his time but it completely destroyed any chance she had of being relevant in that game because people like Eve just can't duel early, particularly when they get so beat up by the monsters.
Lack of satisfaction. As other people have noted, it's very easy to fall behind in the jungle and very difficult to catch back up when you do. Often the "ideal game" as a jungler seems to be "not falling too far behind everyone else" and that just doesn't make you feel like you've done a good job at all. Getting ahead is VERY hard, no matter what happens.
RogueWill3 votesThat's not true. I still jungle 90% of my games. I even created a new path so now I can solo drake at lvl 5 adter my first buy (no ganks but early dragon also helps lanes) which is also a nice xp boost. try new paths personally I'm now including scout crabs on my runs but I tried to kill them when my hp is high to discourage counterjungling (is not fun to start scout crap at 100hp)
KlNG ACE3 voteswell its mostly because riot wants the meta to have junglers be tanks, which is super boring and they will have no carry potential. most tier 1 junglers that arent tanks have (or will) get nerfed (rek-sai, warwick, khazix, all got nerfed) leaving jungler mains with a small champion pool with only lee, j4, rek sai, and some tier 2 junglers that arent that good. riot screwed the jungle real hard :/
ModCaptainMårvelous3 votesTBH, Jungling is rougher now...but I still enjoy it.
Why do I like jungling?
Honestly, yes, a lot of the changes have been questionable and by-and-large the jungle is a harder place to be. But to be honest, I'll always enjoy jungling. Long as you call my name, I'll come running.....after red buff.
Navai3 votesAs much as I love jungle(I mained it for the majority of S4). Since the pre season, i've just come to the result of how I first played this game my reaction to supporting. When I first started this game( I think most people are like this) whenever I was forced to support, i'd just be like,"I hate this role so much..it's so boring..nothing to do in it..(in reality its now actually one of my favorite roles along with jungle). Just now when I jungle, everything is just a bit too hard..The jungle can be dealt with, with certain champions..but the limited pool to the ammount of champions this game has is crazy..You see about 10/15% of the game champions every time you play. Only about 4-5 champions can actually jungle easily compared to other roles. The EXP is un rewarding, the gold income is un rewarding. When playing jungle, the second your laner gives a kill at the (2 min mark of 3) before you even backed from your leash. You know you can't help that lane that much unless you are playing someone who just doesn't fall off..I'm lazy to write more so i'm going to stop.
Sluiceway3 votesJust a small addition from me: I was watching TheOddOne's stream yesterday, and he was questioning Riot's commitment to "strategic diversity" by making the jungle harder and thereby shrinking the pool of viable junglers.
I never thought I would see the day when I would have a harder time getting support (my preferred role) than jungle.
Rennagade3 votesI used to love the jungle- no one wanted to play it so it was readily available and I was able to actually be a threat to enemy laners without falling behind when ganking. Now I have a lot of difficulty with just keeping up level-wise while jungling with laners, and gank attempts seem more likely to fail and put me further behind the rest of the players. I just don't want to jungle anymore. Its no longer fun. It hasn't been fun sinse the biggest challenge of jungling became maintaining a level that allowed you to safely gank.
Destabilizator2 votesI hate that I end on lvl 3 "ready to gank" with half hp... Hate first b.
exiledFromBadmen3 votesMe too, I miss the old days that I could gank right after the fourth camp even as a tanky jungler...
JC DarkOmen2 votesliterally any jungler can do smite gromp > blue > wolves > smite red. I promise you Nightblu3 and TheOddOne can still do Eve jung, sothe problem isn't the jungle changes, it's your lack of game knowledge
Kikirino7 votesTheOddOne does not Eve jungle anymore. The jungle pool is incredibly restricted and might be a reason why if you don't main jungle you dread doing it. That, and jungle camps are harder than ever to clear without losing most of your health.
MajorPain92 votesThere are only about 6 champions that can jungle right now, of course they don't.
jusho11 votesname them
S H A Y C 03 votesJarvan, lee sin, pantheon, warwick, sejuani, Vi, elise, hecarim, jax, rek'sai, rengar, shyvanna, shaco, zac. Oops! Sorry you only wanted 6, my bad :P
Skias7 votesShyvana and Zac are very poor at the moment.
Zakennayo1 votesSo..
Now instead of ganking after first set of jungle camps are cleared, you gotta gank after the second?
Hmm no issues here.
I jangle jungle Hecarim, Amumu, J4, Malphite if Im bored, Shaco, Yi, Rammus, Udyr, and Warwick if i want an easy win.
HandheldBrandon3 votesThats not the problem.
The problem i would do first run then have to back run back into jungle with no pots do another clear then back immediately to pick up jungler item. Thats annoying and not only that but time wasting and removes precious seconds from pressuring the enemy.
