Getting tired of this " you can only ban 3 " crap

19 19 19·Jan 31, 2015·21 votes·1,340 views

INCREASE IT RIOT, getting tired of people playing cheap champions for cheap wins. like for example, EVEN if Akali, Fizz, Lee Sin, Jarvan, Azir, Gnar, and Reksai are banned from each side. Janna, morgana, Leona, Kalista, LEBLANC, KASSADIN, IRELIA, and others are OPEN.

Akali doesn't feel nerf'd at all she still can burst you down btw.

And don't you guys tell me any of those champions are easy to play against because I've been watching different PRO LoL streamers who admit how OP and annoying they are which is why they ban them in diamond a lot or in any other elo.

We're increasing the amount of champions coming out which by now we should have more bans because chances are, the NEXT champion that comes out will just be as obnoxious as the other recent ones.

23 Comments

Ice Weasel XJan 31, 201512 votes

Considering how often I see people demand or beg for a higher ban count, I feel like I'm probably in the minority in that I don't want more bans.

For every one additional ban, players will be required to unlock two more champions to play Draft Mode. This is to prevent that highly improbable (yet very possible) scenario where all the champions available to a player are either banned or locked by the other players. Normal Draft currently requires 6 unlocked champions at a bare minimum (only if none of the champions you own are on the free rotation), whereas Ranked Draft requires 16 fully unlocked champions. 4 bans would increase those to 8 for Normal and 18 for Ranked. 5 bans would be 10 for Normal and 20 for Ranked.
There are champions I absolutely loathe playing against, but I don't want them to be permabanned. I need to be forced to play against them to learn counterplay.
Similar to my previous point, I don't want my teammates to be completely unprepared to face certain champions simply because they have always banned them in the past.

I don't want a situation where a larger pool of champions can be virtually permabanned.

ValyrianBladeJan 31, 20154 votes

I don't think you're in the minority. I think WE're in the majority but why would we bother to come to the forums to comment that 3 bans per side is right? :P

I agree with everything you've said exactly - and more.

I like draft mode the most by far, and it was really hard getting in to it at first while trying to save IP for runes when I hit 20 and also wanting to buy "good" champions rather than just stacking the 450 IP ones. I ended up abandoning that strategy anyways because I figure I won't "main" 16 champions so I might as well just own some cheap ones, but at first it was important to save up and buy a 4800ip champion I would consistently use rather than a 450ip one I would abandon quickly.

Second, add in to that the fact that in solo-queue you're not strategically banning. Aside from banning "OP" champions or counters to the champions your early-pickers want, most people just ban "meta" champions. First, note the distinction between OP and Meta. Patch 4.21 Warwick was OP. Patch 5.2 Irelia is META. The point being, Irelia is definitely strong and has an advantage over other top laners because of it, but she isn't to the point that picking her allows you to single-handedly win the game against a better opponent. I don't like banning meta champions for the main reason that you don't know who mains them - the only meta champions I play are Ahri mid and Jinx ADC (although I just bought Jarvan 4 so him too soon), and in both cases I feel like the other team got incredibly lucky to ban them because they'd have been wasted bans if I wasn't in that game. Meanwhile, say we banned Irelia, Zed, and Rek'Sai against a team who mained none of those champions - the other team gained an advantage out of luck rather than out of any form of skill. Increasing the number of bans will only increase the occurrence of this luck. People will have their "main" banned more frequently and games will be unbalanced because they're playing at an MMR they earned with their main champions while playing a non-main champion.

As someone who plays a lot of Hecarim jungle, even before his recent buffs, and had absolutely no problem competing against the Lee Sin / Jarvan 4 / Pantheon / Fiddlesticks / Rengar / Kha'zix / etc... in season 4 and early season 5, I think I can safely say that meta champions are not OP. Meta champions are just popular because they're strong in many situations and thus work well in solo-queue where you can't control your allies picks. It doesn't make them overpowered in solo queue. I could agree with arguments that they're overpowered at the challenger level - where it's a necessity for early picks to take someone that can't be countered and that doesn't instantly give away the type of team-comp you're looking to build. Even then though, they're being picked for versatility in team-composition and not for power within the game itself. You shouldn't be banning a champion because it's versatile when picked but just normal once in game, you should be banning champions that are too strong in game.

So in essence, more bans are bad in my opinion. I'd only want more bans if things like 4.21 Warwick were more prevalent, but really I think in the 9 months I've played league I've seen maybe 3-4 occurrences of a champion being truly undeniably OP.

19 19 19Jan 31, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ice Weasel X,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Aaax7AUT,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-01-31T21:20:54.528+0000)

Considering how often I see people demand or beg for a higher ban count, I feel like I'm probably in the minority in that I don't want more bans.

For every one additional ban, players will be required to unlock two more champions to play Draft Mode. This is to prevent that highly improbable (yet very possible) scenario where all the champions available to a player are either banned or locked by the other players. Normal Draft currently requires 6 unlocked champions at a bare minimum (only if none of the champions you own are on the free rotation), whereas Ranked Draft requires 16 fully unlocked champions. 4 bans would increase those to 8 for Normal and 18 for Ranked. 5 bans would be 10 for Normal and 20 for Ranked.

There are champions I absolutely loathe playing against, but I don't want them to be permabanned. I need to be forced to play against them to learn counterplay.

Similar to my previous point, I don't want my teammates to be completely unprepared to face certain champions simply because they have always banned them in the past.

I don't want a situation where a larger pool of champions can be virtually permabanned.

forced to play against to learn counterplay? wtf ?

MahautsukaiJan 31, 20153 votes

I largely agree with your points.

The call for more bans reads like a perpetual problem to me. Say they up it to five for each side. I feel these same people will just find the next stage of champion that is OP and need 7 bans each. Rinse repeat.

RoyaiChaosFeb 1, 20151 votes

I still have never played with against a Reksai cause she's always banned so I have no idea what she does Dx.

But adding on to that, a lot of people ban the same champions because it's popular to ban them and not actually because they need to.

Magma Lux MidFeb 1, 20151 votes

She hops around and knocks people up. She was permabanned because she had insane damage in addition to her tankiness and mobility.

If you do play against her, step on her tunnels when you get the chance. Her ult lets her essentially teleport to any of them.

colesyJan 31, 20158 votes

did you just say akali can still burst you down?

isn't she an assassin?

isn't that what they're meant to do?

therefore isn't she working as intended?

insaiyanbaccaFeb 1, 20151 votes

indeed

SnarflazJan 31, 20156 votes

You guys are still afraid of fizz?

Magma Lux MidFeb 1, 20151 votes

To be honest, I never really was, but I was in the minority that picks Lux into him (which is actually pretty strong vs him if played right).

Kat HeadJan 31, 20154 votes

10 bans total, each player gets to ban something.

BemaponJan 31, 20154 votes

The point of only having 3 bans is because if there were more some champions would NEVER be able to be played. And I will not say they are easy to play against, to be honest no champion is really "easy" to play against in the right hands. But I do not think that they really need nerfed. Akali is an assassin, she is supposed to burst people down. The same goes for Fizz and Leblanc. Fizz Akali and Leblanc all got a general "nerf" now that DFG is gone anyway. They all have things that make them actually quite balanced. They all have counterplay. While I absolutely hate Fizz and would be okay if he was removed from the game, I can still play against him. I have won against Fizz many times. All you need to do to stop the "Cheap champions for cheap wins" is to learn how to stop them.

Akali for example. Get pink wards and her shroud is countered hard. Have cc, which most teams should have anyway, and she cant dash. Assassins are all hard countered by cc and being able to burst them down first.
Janna, Morgana and Leona. They have great team presence but tend to fall off late game and cannot really carry a team by themselves. Expecially Janna. Janna typically does not do damage. If possible try to bait out their ults before engaging.
Lee Sin has a really strong early to mid game, but falls off late game as well. If he is jungleing watch out for ganks and during the mid-game make sure you have vision and don't let him pick off your teammates. Lee Sin also has a fairly weak team presence.
Kalista's kiteing makes her hard to catch, but she is countered by cc and gap closers. On top of that she is very squishy and can be blown up easily by most assassins.
Gnar and Jarvan are similar to Lee Sin only they have more team presence. For Gnar try to stall the fight until right after he goes back to normal Gnar. If this is not an option try to spread out a little so his ult does not hit your entire team. It is also important to try to keep him off of your carry. If you can kill his team it is a good idea to do that THEN deal with him. The same goes for Jarvan, try to keep him off of your carry and try to kill his team first.
Rek' Sai can be overwhelming but her damage was recently nerfed and she is a lot easier to deal with now. I do not have too much to say about her because she is still relatively new and she is always banned so I don't play against her that often.
As for the last three, Irelia Kassadin and Azir. Azirs strength is in his ranged poke. If you can avoid it look for an opportunity to burst him down as he is fairly squishy. If you pay attention to the positioning of his soldiers try to outmaneuver him.
I fail to see how Irelia is OP at all. While her passive makes most cc ineffective she normally lacks either damage or tankyness. It is possible to have both with her, however only one of her abilities can hit more than 1 target and that is her ult. While her passive gives her more tenacity with more enemies around her, that really doesn't matter if shes dead. AKA you can just group try to catch her out. Another thing that makes her less of a ban is her pick rate. She does get picked occasionally, but a lot of the time she isnt (At least in my experience).
How to counter Kassadin. I have only ever played against him twice due to his low pick rate. Neither time was in ranked. The first time I was Annie and he was really bad. A lot of people do not actually know how to play him. Every time he walked into lane I would drop a bear on his face and kill him. The second time I actually got to see how Kassadin works. I believe his passive reduces magic damage? So hit him with physical stuff. Play AD against him, similar to playing against Veigar and Galio. As I was playing Teambuilder with some friends I did not know I was going to be up against a Kass the second game. I was playing Nidalee mid and that was not a fun experience. We still won, but it was not because of me.

I hope this helps you deal with these people. Sometimes it isn't who you can play, it is who can your opponent not play against.

jjookkeerrJan 31, 20152 votes

you must be bronze if you are having troubles against leblanc

JunkοFeb 1, 20152 votes

Fizz and Akali both got nerfed, Rek'sai also got nerfed twice, Kalista is shut down by 2 items that any bruiser can buy and she doesn't deal much damage compared to other ADCs, Kassadin was made unviable long time ago, LB was gutted

Are you bronze or something?

AreFeb 1, 20152 votes

Fizz is dead.

Akali feels terrible to play now. That nerf really shot her down.

Janna has clear counters. Her laning is one of, if not, the worst of all the supports. She can not carry games.

Leona is a multiplier. If her lane is losing, she can't do anything. Likewise, if her team is doing bad, there is little she can do.

Kassadin isn't that strong.

LB isn't that strong anymore.

insaiyanbaccaFeb 1, 20152 votes

akali is not really powerful just annoying fizz is as good as dead now lee sin i never really saw a problem with him, int he right hands he seems good but most of the time he doesnt seem that good jarvan i can completely understand that he is really good azir i also understand that hes a big lane bully with a great late game gnar hes annoying to but if you watch the rage bar its not so bad rek'sai really isnt annoying to me but i can see why she annoys others janna bad laning phase kinda morg shes not to bad but shes a good champ leona if her team does good she does good if they do bad she does bad kalista as i recently played olaf and the enemy had her i can see the frustration leblanc is weak af kassadin is also weak af irelia yeah i can see what your getting at there

and honestly the words of "pros" are not set in stone facts they have a lot of opinions some of these they can back up very well with good reasons.

Shiny PidgeyJan 31, 20151 votes

It should be at least 4 bans now. 5 and up can be debated but 4 bans is something that should be done.

Aratez TreatyJan 31, 20151 votes

Not all games will be fair, but banning 5 on each side makes it so that so many champions people will never be able to play. That could be a good thing for some, but a bad thing for others. Each mode has its own rules, and Riot makes those, not the community, so we really just have to play by the rules and if we don't like it either deal with it or don't okay that mode.

SnarflazJan 31, 20151 votes

They only allow 3 bans because what if you bought a champion you REALLY liked. You might wanna rekt people with him cuz of him/her OP'Ness

If your allowed to ban 6 champs, the rate of you not playing your OP fav champ is close to none.

ZahzFeb 1, 20151 votes

champs dont get considered op just because they counter syndra

Kitten of EvilFeb 1, 20151 votes

I don't care about the % of total champs that can be banned (after all, there's no "right" number... it's somewhat arbitrary). That being said, I wish each player on the team could have one ban. As it is now, some captains ask who to ban (I always do), but many of them just ban whoever they hate facing. That's not ideal for everyone and gives a lot of game-shaping power to one randomly-selected person.

FastAsHeckFeb 1, 20151 votes

i think we should get 5 bans per team, not only because naturally the amount of champions increases (how many were the champions when the 3 bans system was designed?) but it could also be a way to distribute the bans instead of having 1 player choose. 1 ban per player gives you some freedom instead of begging the captain to ban katarina, and it also lets more champs be banned. plus, 10 banned champs per game is not THAT big of a deal, hell maybe people will start expanding outside of the meta since meta picks will be banned.

DecaedeusFeb 1, 20151 votes

Valid point, turned into a rant about game balance. This could have been good if you laid out argumentation about how a larger champion pool warrants more bans, instead, it turned into "OMG SO MANY FREELO CHAMPIONS."