Why no Elise buffs =(
Why not Riot? =( Her win rate is so low
Why not Riot? =( Her win rate is so low
Elise is a little bit of a problem champion. If her damage is high, like it was around her release and for awhile afterwards, she becomes a power pick because she is somewhat of a generalist, much like Vi, Jarvan, and Lee Sin; However if she has lower damage, she's a walking stun bot more or less. Her kit is somewhat feast or famine in my opinion. To this end, I've created a rework proposal, keeping many of the same abilities that Elise already has and tweaking a few things, check it out if you're intrested! Black Widow or Beefy Tarantula?
Elise is a little bit of a problem champion. If her damage is high, like it was around her release and for awhile afterwards, she becomes a power pick because she is somewhat of a generalist, much like Vi, Jarvan, and Lee Sin; However if she has lower damage, she's a walking stun bot more or less. Her kit is somewhat feast or famine in my opinion. To this end, I've created a rework proposal, keeping many of the same abilities that Elise already has and tweaking a few things, check it out if you're intrested! Black Widow or Beefy Tarantula?
I think the problem with Elise's damage being too high has always came from the fact that a lot of her damage is innate in her kit and requires no commitment (via AP). If they would nerf her bases and give good boosts to her ratios I feel like she'd be a lot healthier. Then again people don't seem to complain about full tank Mundo doing damage so I don't know.
This is exactly the case in my opinion. Elise is not rewarded very much for building damage, so building tanky becomes more effective by allowing her to stick around longer to deal more damage. Reducing base/Increasing ratios would be a good step.
Complaining about "tank" mundo dealing damage is so silly... If he didn't deal damage... then what does he do? All he has of CC is a slow... so he needs damage to be a threat
If this is the case then after nerfing all of her damage why did they nerf her stun's width?... which is utility.
I'm not sure, you'd have to ask a dev. about that. It's not something I would do personally
Because her kit is kinda stupid and they're worried if they buff her she'll become the competitive god jungler she was for so long back when she was released.
I think she's up for a rework.
Yeah, she was made during the period when characters could change between 2 kits willy-nilly, and have since learned that is a tough thing to balance. With the way she's currently setup, it's going to be pretty tough to put her in a better spot while keeping both of her forms valuable.
She's in a bit of a weird spot. Right now she has both a stun and a targetted leap, a tankier + quicker form and a stronger + smaller hitbox form that she can change on an instant, so she's some kind of an assassin pseudo-tank with adequate cc, mobility, and the ability to whittle away tanky targets with her % damage. She's halfway between a jungle generalist and Irelia (better nerf).
I think one way Riot could add not only more power-budget to her kit, but also more uniqueness and a bonus layer of difficulty (separating the inexperienced from the masters), would be to give her transformation a short (1 second?) channel. Doing so would ease the burden Riot currently has of trying to make her ability to switch at will with no costs not be a universal/on a dime change and gaining the benefits from it accordingly. Gnar's inability to directly control his transformations is what made room for more power in his kit and I think Elise could take a note from that too. The channel shouldn't be so long that it's debilitating, but enough to make it so that she should commit to a single form for a gank/duel unless she's able to buy herself the second of safety needed to switch.
An alternative way of transforming that keeps the same general idea I was going for: A Twitch-stealth like mechanic where she can move just fine for the duration and take damage, but she can't cast abilities until the 1 second transformation is complete.
Because I imagine there are plenty of veteran Elise players that hate the idea I just pitched, Riot could always do the standard "make this targetted ability a skillshot so we can add range/damage/counterplay to her kit" since admittedly a large portion of what damage she does deal is targetted. Or they could try to make her less of a generalist, making her human form more of the damage based assassin and the spider form more of the mobility/farming side, adjusting her numbers accordingly. Even then though, the ability to switch between those 2 suddenly seems like it's problematic.
Honestly, my main complaint about Elise's kit is the fact that they gave her %current and %missing health. This means she can build a magic pen item and then build straight tank and still have a bunch of damage from every occasion, which combined with her innate lifesteal and grapple mechanic, means she's really hard to kill.
Elise is a major contributor for my hatred of %hp damage.
Because Riot hates Elise. Look at her patch history. Straight nerfs. Luden's is pretty nice to up her burst IMO, I'm having fun with it at least. Did you know her spider Q was originally a slow? Or that her Rappel was supposed to stun people that walked under it while she was mid-air? She needs more innate tank or CC honestly. That way she can BUILD more damage. There needs to be a bonus for having all of your spiderlings alive (bonus resists, fear on next SQ, etc. I'd really like to see a fear worked in there since spiders are like the number one phobia it makes sense. But as an elise main, I know better than to expect a buff, ever. Elise isn't popular so she isn't important and she never will be. Even when she was good no one played her.
Because Riot hates Elise. Look at her patch history. Straight nerfs.
She was also like 90% pick/ban in LCS in S3 and the first half of S4.
She needs more innate tank or CC honestly.
She used to have bonus armor/MR on herself when she was in spider form. It was viewed as too good with the rest of her kit. If she builds a lot of AP she can chunk you down with her spells and then execute you with spider Q; if she can dive without needing to actually build tanky she's VERY strong.
She was also like 90% pick/ban in LCS in S3 and the first half of S4.
She used to have bonus armor/MR on herself when she was in spider form. It was viewed as too good with the rest of her kit. If she builds a lot of AP she can chunk you down with her spells and then execute you with spider Q; if she can dive without needing to actually build tanky she's VERY strong.
Popular in LCS=/=popular champion. Regular people don't play her so they dont buy skins so why would riot care? Same goes with Galio and Urgot except Urgot just got a buff which should show you just how low on the totem pole Elise is.
And it's more of a conditional tankiness. If one spiderling dies she would lose it until she had max on the field again. With her spells being relative high cost 2-2.5 MR/AR per spider seems fair.
Because if they buff her, she'll become picked in competitive a lot. And pubs in this game like to play what they saw the pro players doing; see also Lee sin.
Oh, trust me, she was popular in solo que too.
Yeah, I'm kind of sad about this too. She doesn't even really benefit from Cinderhulk since she's not constantly in melee range.
Maybe they're still trying to figure out what to do with her?
Yeah, I'm kind of sad about this too. She doesn't even really benefit from Cinderhulk since she's not constantly in melee range.
Maybe they're still trying to figure out what to do with her?
Losing juggernaut is actually a nerf for Elise.
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Losing juggernaut is actually a nerf for Elise.
Agreed. She really benefited from the CDR.
Revert her E nerfs and either slightly buff the tankiness of her spiderlings or increase the Frenzy heal. Done.
It's because they have things like the majority of the league community complaining to worry about. (Lee sin, zed, etc)
I have hope. Strong or not, I really enjoy playing as Elise, and I know she has to be on Riot's radar. We just have to hold out. =\
Ya, she needs to be buffed, but first I'd like to see her identity be more focused, rather than be some mage/tank/assassin/poke mage thingy. She needs to have a defined role and have her kit revolve around that.
She needs some bonus innate tankyness, that will help her lot with making her broken
im sure they have something soon, cant shove everything into a single patch :P
revert E nerf
she doesn't have a one-point wonder
If she'd was to be viable mean she'd counter lee sin
Rito can't have her destroying the champion of "LCSBIGPLAYS"
No Elise buffs because we don't want her to be OP again. She does need work, but direct buffs are a no no.
A Buff suggesting: Could you make it where you can control the spiderlings with her alt key, the way you would control Annie's Tibbers, or Shoco's clone?? It may not much, but who knows.